MarioWiki:Proposals: Difference between revisions

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==Writing guidelines==
{| align="center" style="width: 85%; background-color: #f1f1de; border: 2px solid #996; padding: 5px; color:black"
''None at the moment.''
|'''Proposals''' can be new features (such as an extension), removal of a previously added feature that has tired out, or new policies that must be approved via [[Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Consensus|consensus]] before any action(s) are done.
*Any user can support or oppose, but must have a strong reason for doing so, not, e.g., "I like this idea!"
*"Vote" periods last for one week.
*All past proposals are [[/Archive|archived]].
|}
A proposal section works like a discussion page: comments are brought up and replied to using indents (colons, such as : or ::::) and all edits are signed using the code <nowiki>{{user|</nowiki>''User name''<nowiki>}}</nowiki>.


This page observes the [[MarioWiki:No-Signature Policy|No-Signature Policy]].
==New features==
''None at the moment.''


<h2 style="color:black">How To</h2>
==Removals==
#Actions that users feel are appropriate to have community approval first can be added by anyone, but they must have a strong argument.
''None at the moment.''
#Users then vote and discuss on the issue during that week. The "deadline" for the proposal is one week from posting at:
#*Monday to Thursday: 17:00 (5pm)
#*Friday and Saturday: 20:00 (8pm)
#*Sunday: 15:00 (3pm)
#Every vote should have a reason accompanying it.
#Users who feel that certain votes were cast in bad faith or which truly have no merit can address the votes in the Comments section. Users can ask a voter to clarify their position, point out mistakes or flaws in their arguments, or call for the outright removal of the vote if it lacks sufficient reasoning. Users may '''not''' remove or alter the content of anyone else's votes. The voter can remove or rewrite their own vote at any time, but the final decision to remove another User's vote lies solely with the [[MarioWiki:Administrators|Administrators]].
#"<nowiki>#&nbsp;</nowiki>" should be added under the last vote of each support/oppose section to show another blank line.
#All proposals that end up in a tie will be extended for another week.
#If a proposal has more than ten votes, it can only pass or fail by a margin of '''three''' votes. If a proposal reaches the deadline and the total number of votes for each option differ by two or less votes, the deadline will be extended for another week.
#Any proposal that has three votes or less at deadline will automatically be listed as "[[Wikipedia:Quorum|NO QUORUM]]." The original proposer then has the option to relist said proposal to generate more discussion.
#No proposal can overturn the decision of a previous proposal that is less than '''4 weeks''' ('''28 days''') old.
#Proposals can only be rewritten or deleted by their proposer within the first three days of their creation. However, the proposer can request that their proposal be deleted by a [[MarioWiki:Administrators|Sysop]] at any time, provided they have a valid reason for it.
#All proposals are archived. The original proposer must '''''take action''''' accordingly if the outcome of the proposal dictates it. If it requires the help of a Sysop, the proposer can ask for that help.
#There shouldn't be proposals about creating articles on a underrepresented or completely absent subject, unless there is major disagreement about whether the content should be included. To organize efforts about completing articles on missing subjects, try creating a [[MarioWiki:PipeProject|PipeProject]].
#Proposals can not be made about [[MarioWiki:Administrators|System Operator]] promotions and demotions. Sysops can only be promoted and demoted by the will of [[MarioWiki:Bureaucrats|Bureaucrats]].
#If the Sysops deem a proposal unnecessary or potentially detrimental to the upkeep of the Super Mario Wiki, they have the right to remove it at any time.
#No joke proposals. Proposals are serious wiki matters, and should be handled professionally. Joke proposals will be deleted on sight.


The times are in EDT (UTC -4:00), and are set so that the user is more likely to be online at those times (after work/school, weekend nights). If a proposal is added on Saturday night at 11:59 PM EDT, the deadline is the next Saturday night at 8:00 PM. If it is a minute later, the deadline is a day plus 15 hours (Sunday), as opposed to a day minus 4 hours.
==Changes==
===Include italics for category page titles for media that normally uses it===
Shouldn't category pages for media that uses italics (such as games, shows, movies, etc.) use italics for their category pages? I did start adding it to some pages already, but I thought it was worth proposing about it, possibly to make it policy. I feel like italics should be used though, as it is used everywhere else. For example, the page titled [[:Category:Donkey Kong 64]] should be [[:Category:Donkey Kong 64|Category:''Donkey Kong 64'']].


__TOC__
'''Proposer''': {{User|Kaptain Skurvy}}<br>'''Deadline''': February 20, 2025, 23:59 GMT


<center><span style="font-size:200%">CURRENTLY: '''{{LOCALTIME}}, {{LOCALDAY}} {{LOCALMONTHNAME}} {{LOCALYEAR}} (EDT)'''</span></center>
====Support====
#{{User|Kaptain Skurvy}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Wait, this isn't already policy??? We think this lack of parity speaks a lot to how neglected categories can be in some regards. While yes, the category description isn't really meant to be the main point, we don't think ''slightly slanted text'' is distracting from the actual list of articles in the category, and just because categories are more utility than text doesn't excuse the text that ''is'' there looking below the standard of a usual article for being "lesser".
#{{User|Super Mario RPG}} Nothing wrong with having more consistency around the wiki.
#{{User|GuntherBayBeee}} Per all.
#{{User|Salmancer}} It is easier to figure out what the standards are from context alone when the standards are applied in every instance.


==New Features==
====Oppose====
===Rules and Regulations for Specific-Article Proposals===
#{{User|Nintendo101}} Categories are supposed to provide simple, direct, and utilitarian functions, not something to be read or presented to readers. I don't think italicizing them is necessary and would detract from their simplicity.
Since {{user|Redstar}} has (perhaps unintentionally) brought up the issue of proposals on specific pages (see [[Talk:Earth Crystal]] or [[Talk:Straw]]) and {{user|Walkazo}} has said that "talk page 'proposals' do have a habit of going unnoticed for months," I thought that a specific set of rules and regulations pertaining to talk page proposals. I'll give you a few ideas of what we could do, my solution, and then multiple options for voting.
#{{User|Sparks}} Per Nintendo101. It doesn't feel necessary.
#{{User|OmegaRuby}} What is this supposed to change, exactly? Yes, it's in line with how pages about games are to have the subject italicized, but the change feels unneeded and especially arduous to implement for pretty much no reason. Per Nintendo101.
#{{User|SolemnStormcloud}} Per all.
#{{User|Rykitu}} Per Nintendo101


We need a specific name for these proposals. I propose (no pun intended... really) "talk page proposals." I am open to other suggestions, but this is the name that I will use.
====Comments====
@Nintendo101: In that case, why do we italicise game titles in category descriptions? (Genuine question, I'm undecided on this proposal.) {{User:Hewer/sig}} 08:58, February 7, 2025 (EST)
:Because that is a proper sentence. It is not the tool itself. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 20:15, February 7, 2025 (EST)
::We mean... Wiki policy is to italicize game titles on their articles' names using <nowiki>{{Italic title}}</nowiki>, too, and those aren't proper sentences. They're article names. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 19:00, February 8, 2025 (EST)
:::That's not the same situation in my eyes because the articles are what the site is for. That is what we are writing and presenting to the public. Of course we would italicize those. The categories are a tool, chiefly for site editors, not readers. We do not really gain anything from italicizing their titles. If anything, I worry this would lead to a lot of work to implement, either burdening site editors, porplemontage, or both. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 16:05, February 9, 2025 (EST)
::::So category names are just tools not meant for readers, but category descriptions aren't? {{User:Hewer/sig}} 18:08, February 9, 2025 (EST)
:::::The descriptions are just sentences, and I feel inclined to render those they way we would a sentence anywhere else on the site, be it on articles or in the description for image files. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 19:49, February 9, 2025 (EST)
::::We disagree with the notion categories are more for editors and not readers; while yes, all of the categories on the front page are maintenance categories from the to-do list, the sheer quantity of proposals for categories wouldn't make sense if they were moreso for editors, rather than your average reader; moves such as the reforms for the Look-alikes categories or the Thieves category wouldn't make sense if these weren't meant to be public-facing. And of course, there are the various categories that exist for users, but do ''not'' serve a utility purpose, such as the [[:Category:User es|various "users that know a given language" categories]].<br>As for difficulty implementing, considering the recent success stories with images without descriptions and categories without descriptions having gone from 4000+ and ≈100, to 0 and 0 respectively, we have it in good faith that this wouldn't be ''that'' hard to implement. Monotonous? Yes. But difficult? It's nothing a bit of caffeine and music can't solve. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 18:22, February 9, 2025 (EST)
:::::Not only for editors, but chiefly for them. I don't exclude the idea of more curious readers utilizing them, but I suspect they are exceptions. I maintain that their ease of implementation is more important to the site than the formatting inconsistency. Like, are we to be expected to format category ourselves as "<nowiki>[[Category:Super Mario World screenshots|Category:''Super Mario World'' screenshots]]</nowiki>" instead of just "<nowiki>[[Category:Super Mario World screenshots]]</nowiki>" going forward? Would we do this for the articles that are in dozens of categories? Why? I would not want to do that, and I don't find the inconsistency a good enough reason to roll something like that out, and only brings downsides. It makes the tool where one types "<nowiki>[[Category:</nowiki>" almost entirely moot because we would still need to write out the whole name just to format it this way. Others are welcomed to think differently, but I personally think the way we format these names now in categories is perfectly fine. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 19:49, February 9, 2025 (EST)
even if this proposal doesn't pass, i think we should use [[Template:Italic title]] in the category pages. {{User:EvieMaybe/sig}} 10:16, February 12, 2025 (EST)
:I thought that was the whole proposal. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 03:32, February 13, 2025 (EST)


I believe that these talk page proposals should get at least some mention to the whole userbase via this article (MarioWiki:Proposals) or a page linked to it (possibly MarioWiki:Proposals/Talk Page Proposals). This page will link to all pending talk page proposals and explain the rules of talk page proposals.
===Split the image quality category===
'''Issue 1:''' [[:Category:Images to be reuploaded with higher quality]] is a very big category, with nearly 4,000 images in it right now. Even if it's something you can help with, it's very difficult to actually find anything in here. '''Issue 2:''' All other things being equal, some types of images require specific methods or skills to get that all users may not have or be comfortable with. To aid in the overall usability of this category and make it easier for skilled users to find things they can help with, I'm proposing the following two subcategories:
*'''Screenshots to be uploaded with higher quality''' - Most Nintendo consoles don't have the ability to take native screenshots. That's all I'll say about that.
*'''Assets to be uploaded with higher quality''' - Sites like The Spriters Resource are helpful, but they don't have everything. Getting higher quality images requires being able to extract them from the game files and/or the ability to manipulate them afterwards. This will also include images that are currently screenshots meant to demonstrate an asset, such as [[:File:DKCTF Donkey Icon.png]].
Additionally, [[Template:Image-quality]] will be modified with an extra parameter to mark the image as a screenshot or asset and categorize them appropriately. Considering we already have the rewrite and stub categories organized for better navigation, I don't see this as an issue.


Which leads to the most important part of this proposal: the rules. Now, I will give you all my rules for these pages; in my opinion they are fair and better for their purpose. Here they are:
'''Proposer''': {{User|Waluigi Time}}<br>
#All rules for talk page proposals are kept the same as mainspace proposals, with the exceptions made by Rules 2 & 3.
'''Deadline''': February 20, 2025, 23:59 GMT
#Voting in talk page proposals will be open for two weeks, not one.
#Talk page proposals may closed by the proposer if both the support ''and'' the oppose sides have fewer than five votes.
#The talk page proposal '''must''' pertain to the article it is posted on. (Sounds like a dumb rule, but it's best not to have loopholes.)
#After two weeks, a clear majority of three votes is required. Without the majority, the talk page proposal will be listed as "NO QUORUM."


The format for the listing of talk page proposals should be as {{user|Walkazo}}'s example below.
====Split both====
#{{User|Waluigi Time}} Category:Votes to be reuploaded with a better reason
#{{User|Technetium}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} We're a little surprised a split like this hasn't happened sooner, honestly; if for no other reason than it would be nice to have it organized. Per proposal.
#{{User|ThePowerPlayer}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Nintendo101}} Per proposal.
#{{User|LadySophie17}} Per all, which is mostly "per proposal"s anyway
#{{User|EvieMaybe}} makes perfect sense


If you vote to create a specific place for talk page proposals, you are also supporting the following three things:
====Only split screenshots====
#Eliminate "Splits & Merges" section on [[MarioWiki:Proposals|this page]].
#Use "talk page proposals" to split and merge articles.
#Have the templates {{tem|Mergeto}}, {{tem|Mergefrom}} and <nowiki>{{Split}}</nowiki> used on the articles to display a talk page proposal on the article.


As you can see in the voting section, I have given you a few options. Each should be explained sufficiently, but, if it is not, I will try my best to help you understand. 
====Only split assets====


Note: Only if Part 1 passes will Part 2 be viable.
====Leave image quality alone====


'''Proposer:''' {{User|Bloc Partier}} with additions from {{user|Walkazo}}, {{user|Redstar}}, and {{user|Marioguy1}}<br>
====Comments on image quality proposal====
'''Deadline:''' December 25, 2009, 20:00
Silly question; will images that are of neither screenshots nor assets that have the image-quality tag, like scans, character art/renders, or merchandise, just remain as-is? There are already a few examples of those that are all presently tagged with image-quality, like so:
<gallery>
File:Mk64mario.png|Scan of 3D render, colors are washed out.
File:BIS Fawflopper Prima.png|Muddy scan of 2D illustration, and background cropped.
File:Mariocrouch2Dshade.png|Photoshop upscaled 2D promo art.
File:BulletBillTSHIRT.jpg|Too small image of merchandise.
</gallery>{{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 15:30, February 6, 2025 (EST)
:Yes, anything that doesn't fall into either of the two subcategories will stay in the main one for now. I suppose we can look into splitting it further down the road, but I singled these two out because of the higher barrier to entry and also that they seem to be the bulk of the category's contents right now. --{{User:Waluigi Time/sig}} 15:37, February 6, 2025 (EST)
::I think this category should also be split by the media that it appears in (e.g: {{fake link|Category:Game screenshots to be reuploaded with higher quality}}. Something similar should also be done for the [[:Category:Articles with unsourced foreign names|Articles with unsourced foreign names category]]. [[User:Apikachu68|Apikachu68]] ([[User talk:Apikachu68|talk]]) 19:50, February 6, 2025 (EST)
:::Almost all of the screenshots in the category right now are from games so I don't think it needs to be narrowed down further just yet. --{{User:Waluigi Time/sig}} 20:09, February 6, 2025 (EST)


====Part 1: Link to Talk Page Proposals====
===Change "(game)" identifier to "(arcade)" on the articles of ''[[Donkey Kong (game)|Donkey Kong]]'', ''[[Donkey Kong Jr. (game)|Donkey Kong Jr.]]'' and ''[[Mario Bros. (game)|Mario Bros.]]''===
=====Do Not Link to Talk Page Proposals on Any Specific Page=====
I wouldn't consider "game" to be the best identifier for the arcade games ''Donkey Kong'', ''Donkey Kong Jr.'' and ''Mario Bros''. There's already a [[Donkey Kong (Game & Watch)|Game]] [[Donkey Kong Jr. (Game & Watch)|and]] [[Mario Bros. (Game & Watch)|Watch]] game that shares its title with each of the arcade games, but "''Donkey Kong''" is the name of various other games too! There's [[Donkey Kong (tabletop arcade game)|the tabletop game]], [[Donkey Kong (Game Boy)|the Game Boy game]], [[Donkey Kong (Nelsonic Game Watch)|the Nelsonic Game Watch game]] and [[Donkey Kong (slot machine)|the slot machine]]. I know the slot machine is technically an arcade game, but it's not a standard cabinet like the 1981 arcade game. "Game" is a broad identifier, especially for ''Donkey Kong''. Shouldn't a "game" identifier only be used if there's no other game with the same name? That's why we use consoles for identifiers instead, such as [[Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (Wii)|''Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games'' (Wii)]] and [[Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (Nintendo DS)|''Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games'' (Nintendo DS)]].
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Changed vote, I won't like the rule that all splits and merges proposals must be made in talks pages, many people will prefer to have them here, all together, where they can be easily noticed.
=====Link to Talk Page Proposals on MarioWiki:Proposals=====
#{{User|Walkazo}} - It seems excessive to create a whole sub-page for a handful of rules and a bulleted list of links and small descriptions (assuming we format the list similar to the way I showcased in the General Comments below). It'd be easier to just create a new "Talk Page Proposals" section after "How To" with two sub-sections: one for the rules and one for the list. Also, people don't always bother with sub-pages, so this would ensure the list does get seen.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Per Walkazo.
#{{user|Bloc Partier}} - Per Walkazo, as long as MG1's addition is agreed to be added at some point.
#{{User|Supermariofan14}} - Per Walkazo, too.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - Per BP :P
#{{user|Redstar}} - Wonderful proposal. Supports everything I'm trying to do here.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.


=====Link to Talk Page Proposals on a Sub-page: "MarioWiki:Proposals/Talk Page Proposals"=====
'''Proposer''': {{User|Kaptain Skurvy}}<br>'''Deadline''': February 22, 2025, 23:59 GMT


=====Part 1 Comments=====
====Support====
@Walkazo: I'm not sure if it would be a sub-page at all. The proposal is still new, so perhaps we could discuss it and Bloc could add a third option? New page, sub-page, and right here on this page... I would prefer the first option, since it would give equal attention to this general proposal page, though you're right. If the list were formatted as you've done (which I think is the best means of presenting the information), it probably wouldn't merit a page of its own, though I'm still wary of how and where it would be placed here without being ignored or taking up too much room. Discussion, I suppose. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 22:07, 18 December 2009 (EST)
#{{User|Kaptain Skurvy}} Per proposal.
:"MarioWiki:Proposals/Talk Page Proposals" is a sub-page. Also, we don't want to create too many options - that spreads the support votes rather thinly, whereas the outright opposers only have one option and could defeat the proposal even if the ''total'' number of supporters is greater. - {{User|Walkazo}}
::Good point. I'll wait until Bloc puts in his thoughts, see if he revises anything. May change my vote over then. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 23:20, 18 December 2009 (EST)
:::Yeah, it would be a sub-page. Marioguy1 gave me a great idea on my talk page; I'll copy and paste it here.
#Eliminate "Splits & Merges" section on [[MarioWiki:Proposals|this page]].
#Use "talk page proposals" to split and merge articles.
#Have the templates {{tem|Mergeto}}, {{tem|Mergefrom}} and <nowiki>{{Split}}</nowiki> used on the articles to display a talk page proposal on the article.
#I can wire something up that will automatically update the proposals page where you list all of this (no matter where you list it) with all the new talk page proposals.
:::This would format it perfectly. We could replace the Splits & Merges header with either of the options above (Link to "MarioWiki:Proposals/Talk Page Proposals" or put the list right under the header), and it would regulate the practice of S&M's much more. With all this discussion, I'll revise the proposal while I still can. I'd just like to see your thoughts on MG1's stuff first. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
::::I like MG1's stuff for some reason :P {{User|Marioguy1}}
As you can see [[User:Twentytwofiftyseven/Test|here]], 2257 has wired up a list of all things with {{tem|Mergeto}} and what they are to be merged to {{User|Marioguy1}}


====Part 2: Rules====
====Oppose====
=====Use Bloc Partier's Rules=====
#{{User|Nintendo101}} Those articles also cover the game's release on Famicom, NES, Atari, etc., so "arcade" would not be a holistically accurate identifier.
#{{user|Bloc Partier}} - Per me.
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Per Nintendo101; "arcade" is kind of a misnomer when the non-arcade ports are covered on them.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per BP
#{{User|ThePowerPlayer}} Per Nintendo101.
#{{user|Redstar}} - Per BP
#{{User|PaperSplash}} Per ThePowerPlayer's comment.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per BP.
#{{User|Rykitu}} Per all


=====Use MarioWiki:Proposals' Rules (No amendments)=====
====Comments====
Maybe "arcade game" would be a decent compromise? [[User:PaperSplash|PaperSplash]] ([[User talk:PaperSplash|talk]]) 18:02, February 8, 2025 (EST)


=====Part 2 Comments=====
What about [[Dr. Mario (game)|''Dr. Mario'']]? That game also has a [[Dr. Mario (Gamewatch Boy)|separate release also called ''Dr. Mario'']].--[[User:PopitTart|PopitTart]] ([[User talk:PopitTart|talk]]) 18:24, February 8, 2025 (EST)
Can you elaborate on your second rule? [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 19:40, 18 December 2009 (EST)
::The reason why the games ''Donkey Kong'' and ''Dr. Mario'' should keep their identifier of "(game)" is because those are by far the most popular and commonly thought-of games under their respective titles; the other articles (aside from ''Donkey Kong'' on the Game Boy) are on much more obscure devices while being clearly separate from the original game. To put it another way, "''Dr. Mario'' (game)" is what people are looking for when they think about "the game featuring Dr. Mario"; meanwhile, you'd be forgiven for not knowing that the Gamewatch Boy game even exists at all. {{User:ThePowerPlayer/sig}} 22:15, February 8, 2025 (EST)
:No putting a proposal to merge Mario with Luigi (don't ask me why I chose these two) on the Bowser page {{User|Marioguy1}}
::That's the third rule, I believe. I should clarify: I meant the rule headed under the third bullet (the first bullet doesn't seem to be describing a rule, so not sure why it's there). [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 19:50, 18 December 2009 (EST)
:::To clear up confusion, I numbered them and removed the specific bit. And now to answer your question: actually, the addition was somewhat arbitrary on my part. I sort of thought that since the proposer may change their mind or give up, they should have the power to delete their proposal. I dunno, just my thought process. What if I added a bit that says "...may delete their proposal if both the support and the oppose sides have fewer than five votes"? Oh, and I feel like I should add that if you (or any other users reading this) have a different suggestion for rules, just post them on my talk page and I'll put them right into the proposal with a new option for voting. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
::::I would prefer that amendment. If a proposal was per only an individual user's whim or personal taste, than it probably doesn't hold any merit. Even if they don't agree with it anymore, that doesn't change the fact it still garnered discussion and votes. If, however, the votes are fewer than five (three sounds better to me), then the proposal probably is something worth ignoring and not an important issue, so I would say the proposer should be allowed to delete, or, better yet, "close" the proposal. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 20:13, 18 December 2009 (EST)
:::::Great suggestion. I'll go add it right now. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
I may be too late to ask for an addition, but perhaps a rule on "clear majority rule"? If the given two weeks have passed, and no attention has been given to an individual article's proposal save the proposer's vote, that should not be counted as "majority in favor", and the proposer should '''not''' be allowed to act under that impression. While I'm not sure how many votes are fair enough to be counted for "significant attention to implement the proposal", three sounds fair because it's the lowest amount of votes needed to arrive at a majority-difference (two-to-one for either support or oppose). Thoughts? [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 02:28, 20 December 2009 (EST)
:::::::Hmmm... Yes, good idea. I think I should be allowed to add it, it hasn't been three days since posting it yet. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
Just create <nowiki>{{User:Bloc Partier/Proposal}}</nowiki> and then use that; it's an easy way to edit forever :P {{User|Marioguy1}}
:True... But it wouldn't be official lol. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
::What I mean is, make that page and then on this page type <nowiki>{{User:Block Partier/Proposal}}</nowiki>  - when they want to archive it they just have to copy/paste the coding from that page and you can edit it all the time (loopholes for all rules :P) {{User|Marioguy1}}
:::Wow... That's pretty tricky. I kinda like it. But... I could potentially lose votes because of it. {{user|Bloc Partier}}


====General Comments====
what about Donkey Kong (1981)? {{User:EvieMaybe/sig}} 18:39, February 9, 2025 (EST)
Hmmm... This is a bit confusing. Oh well. If anyone needs help, I'd love to assist. Just ask. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
:That would work for ''Donkey Kong'', but the original ''Mario Bros.'' and the arcade game of the same title were both released in 1983. {{User:JanMisali/sig}} 12:49, February 12, 2025 (EST)
:This proposal is allowed...{{User|Marioguy1}}


Since Redstar's proposal is gone, here's a version of his list of pages that need attention. It's organized so that all the pages concerned have a bit of background info (except the Merging pages, since we've talked about them to death already and I'm feeling lazy right now; I don't understand the Yoshi baby one, so I couldn't talk about that one either). All the pages concerned are linked to, with the page who's page contains the proposal in bold. In the future, I think it would be best if the proposals were staged on a common page (i.e. [[Culex]] instead of one of the Crystals, seeing as they're all going into his page; the major articles' talk pages also have a higher likelihood of getting read than the more minor aspects). There should also be a note in the rules that the proposals shouldn't be staged on redirect talk pages, since they'll ''never'' get read in that case (it's a pretty "well, duh" rule, but Bloc Partier was right to make sure we minimize loopholes by stating the obvious as much as possible).
===Standardize the use of "English", "English (United States)" and/or "English (United Kingdom)" as languages in game infoboxes===
So far, the use of "English (United States)" and "English (United Kingdom)" as language identifiers in game infoboxes on this wiki has been rather inconsistent and arbitrary, to say the least. While Nintendo is typically known for providing distinct English localizations for the United States (and other English-speaking territories in the Americas) and the United Kingdom (and other territories where Commonwealth English is standard, apart from Canada), the actual differences between them, if any, have varied over time.


*Merge '''[[Crystal Bit]]''' with [[Crystal King]].
Historically, many Nintendo games have featured minor English text differences between their releases in the Americas and Europe/Oceania; however, these were typically not wholly separate localizations to account for the differences between American and British (or Commonwealth) English – they tended to follow American English conventions for the most part regardless. Rather, they were simple amendments made by Nintendo of Europe to Nintendo of America's existing English scripts, usually either to rectify perceived shortcomings or to modify certain terminology based on internal preferences. These versions were typically stored separately on region-specific cartridges or discs, with occasional differences in how they were labeled in internal data.
*Mere '''[[Straw]]''' with [[Durmite]].
*Merge '''[[Tuff Puff]]''' with [[Huff N' Puff]].
*Merge [[Lava Piranha]] substituents with the parent plant.
**'''[[Lava Bud]]'''
**'''[[Petit Piranha]]'''
*Merge other members of the "Big Bad Brute Bros." Glitzville team with [[Hamma Jamma]].
**'''[[Bamma]]''' (the discussion for both characters is held here)
**[[Flare]]
*Merge '''[[Tubba Blubba's Heart]]''' with [[Tubba Blubba]]
*Convert '''[[Blue Toad]]''' into "Bucken-Berry", concerning only the blue Toad in ''New Super Mario Bros. Wii'', with information concerning any other blue Toads being moved into [[Toad (species)]].
*Convert '''[[Yellow Toad]]''' into "Ala-Gold", concerning only the yellow Toad in ''New Super Mario Bros. Wii'', with information concerning any other yellow Toads being moved into [[Toad (species)]].
*Merge [[Baby Yoshi]] into the [[Yoshi (species)]] article per previous proposal on differences between "baby" and "infant" characters/stages.
*Reorganize Metal pages.
**Merge '''[[Metal Wario]]''' with [[Metal Mario]].
**Split '''[[Metal Mario]]''' into two pages: one concerns Metal forms in general, such as those appearing in the ''Super Smash Bros.'' series and [[Metal Wario]] from ''Super Mario 64 DS''; the other concerns the character, Metal Mario. The final titles of these pages has yet to be determined.


'''''The following proposals have been settled'''''
Later, during the DS, Wii, 3DS and Wii U eras, more distinct localizations specifically for the United States and United Kingdom that also accounted for regional language differences became more commonplace. However, all of the aforementioned practices have largely faded with the advent of the region-free Nintendo Switch, where games now typically release simultaneously worldwide on identical cartridges. As a result, English scripts are now more often than not also identical across regions (or at most contain only very minor differences, such as the date format used; in many cases, the date format is the ''only'' difference), though they are still almost always stored and labeled separately in internal data, typically alongside each other.
*Merge Crystals with [[Culex]] or into a grouped "Elementary Crystals" article.
**'''[[Earth Crystal]]''' (the discussion for all the Crystals is held here)
**[[Fire Crystal]]
**[[Water Crystal]]
**[[Wind Crystal]]


- {{User|Walkazo}}
This proposal aims to determine how we should handle cases of identical or nearly identical (American) English scripts between regions when identifying languages in game infoboxes. Should we list them both as "English (United States)", simply as "English" or adhere to how they are distinguished in internal data, even when actual differences are minimal?
:Would you mind if I expand on the descriptions myself, since I'm aware as to what the purpose of each is? [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 22:00, 18 December 2009 (EST)
::Be my guest =) I still get to fix any wording or gammar I see fit after you make your additions, though. - {{User|Walkazo}}
:::I believe that covers it more specifically. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 23:16, 18 December 2009 (EST)
::::I reorganized the Metal Mario stuff to make it a bit more clear and succinct; between the naming issues and Metal Wario, however, I think that particular situation is muddled enough to merit a full-on proposal. That way, the discussion can be started fresh in a single location, and be sure to garner attention. Talk Page Proposals really should be limited to basic yes/no decisions on matters that are significant enough to require multiple users' approval before any action is taken. - {{User|Walkazo}}
:::::I've been leaning towards that myself. I'll put together a general proposal that trims how muddy that one is, cutting it down to the basic one of Metal Wario being merged into it. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 23:44, 18 December 2009 (EST)


I may be a little late, but I love the format, Walkazo. Also, I edited a new "rule" in. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|PaperSplash}}<br>
'''Deadline''': February 23, 2025, 23:59 GMT


NOTICE TO ALL WHO HAVE ALREADY VOTED: I have added a few things to the body of the proposal. Please review these edits and revise your vote if you wish to do so. Thank you. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
====Option 1: List largely identical American English localizations only as "English (United States)"====
#{{User|PaperSplash}} My third choice. I mean, when it really is just American English, I can see the argument.


===Featured Image Rules===
====Option 2: List largely identical American English localizations as simply "English"====
Many of you may be wondering why I put this in the "New Features" section and that is because we currently have ''no'' rules for Featured Images (except "must be in a mainspace page" and "no fanart". Everything needs rules and FIs are no exceptions. Here is my ruleset:
#{{User|PaperSplash}} My first choice. I think it's the best compromise that makes the most sense, all things considered.
#No re-nominating an article for a month after it has failed.
#{{User|Hewer}} I feel like this way is the most straightforward and accurate.
#You ''can'' vote for an image to be unfeatured in the new "Unfeatured Image Nominations" section.
#{{User|CarlosYoshiBoi}} I mean, if it’s just the same thing and no changes (assuming it doesn’t include dates for save files), then I guess this one makes the most sense.
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Primary option. It's the simplest, it seems reasonable enough, and is applicable across the board; while it isn't exactly in-line with how Nintendo is handling things as of the Switch era, it's reasonable ''enough'' and can easily account for pre-Switch cases very well.
#{{User|Jdtendo}} Per all. Especially if that means that we will stop using "English (United States)" for games that use a variety of English that is not specifically American and weren't even released in America such as ''[[Super Mario Bros.: The Lost Levels|SMBTLL]]'' or ''[[Mario & Wario]]''.


'''Proposer:''' {{User|Marioguy1}}<br>
====Option 3: List both "English (United States)" and "English (United Kingdom)" if distinguished in internal data, otherwise simply list "English"====
'''Deadline:''' December 27, 2009, 17:00
#{{User|PaperSplash}} My second choice. When internal data classifies them that way, it ''could'' make sense to follow suit...
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Secondary choice, as this seems to be Nintendo's official methodology as of the Switch; however, this ''exact'' rationale doesn't account for situations like, say, [[Mario Party 8]] and its infamous recall in the UK, which predates Nintendo's official distinguishing of NA English and UK English from the Switch era, leaving us at a bit of a loss for how to handle it exactly.
#{{User|CarlosYoshiBoi}} This option could also work if date formatting is different despite the game itself using the same script for the US and UK/Australia, like Mario & Luigi: Brothership.


====Use this ruleset====
====Option 4: Do nothing====
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - Per proposal
#{{User|CarlosYoshiBoi}} I’m actually surprised no one put anything in this option kind of like the title mentions “Do nothing.”
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per MG1.
 
====Use current ruleset====
#{{User|Time Q}}: I don't think those rules would be harmful but I don't think they are necessary either. If an image has failed only by a margin of 1 vote, then I see no reason why it shouldn't get nominated again for a month. Also, I really don't think we need to introduce a new Unfeature system for FIs. Once an image was featured, it won't be featured again (which is different from FAs), so no need to worry.


====Comments====
====Comments====
This ruleset should be easy to agree on considering it is composed of rules from the FA system... {{User|Marioguy1}}
For better accuracy, "British English" should probably be "Commonwealth English." [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 22:13, February 8, 2025 (EST)


I dont like rule 3, as it is kinda pointless, why would you remove votes if they dont need to have a valid reason? {{user|Tucayo}}
:Noted. Though I decided to focus mainly on the terminology used in game infoboxes, as I realized this wiki's use of the term "British English" is effectively its own can of worms... [[User:PaperSplash|PaperSplash]] ([[User talk:PaperSplash|talk]]) 15:35, February 9, 2025 (EST)
:You're right, that's redundant and I don't want to create a big ruckus by trying to change the current rules, I have removed it from my proposal. {{User|Marioguy1}}


Sorry if this is kind of off-topic, but I have a different suggestion for a new rule: If the image with the most "positive" votes (i.e. support votes minus oppose votes) has less than 10 positive votes, it should stay nominated and instead one of the previous FIs should be featured again. Just wanted to throw that in. {{User|Time Q}}
I'm a bit confused what this proposal is trying to change. Is it just about terminology used in game infoboxes? {{User:Hewer/sig}} 11:31, February 9, 2025 (EST)
:Good idea but 10 may be a bit too much... {{User|Marioguy1}}


==Removals==
:In hindsight, I realized this proposal was trying to change too many things at once, so I decided to tidy things up and focus on just the game infobox terminology for now. [[User:PaperSplash|PaperSplash]] ([[User talk:PaperSplash|talk]]) 15:35, February 9, 2025 (EST)
===Categories: List of Implied ...===
I propose that the following rategories be removed without replacement:
*[[:Category:List of Implied Characters]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied Entertainment]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied Events]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied Items]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied Locations]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied Organizations]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied People]]
*[[:Category:List of Implied Species]]


Here are my reasons:
Realistically even though Canadian English does use British/Commonwealth spelling most of the time, they just get US English spelling in games as Nintendo groups Canada with North America and their English is pretty similar to English in the US, so Nintendo products in Canada are just the same as in the US.  
#Each of those categories has only one article entry total, the respective [[List of Implied Characters]] etc. It doesn't look like those lists need to have their very own category each. They can just have both [[:Category:Implied]] and [[:Category:Lists]].
#Some have subcategories. Those subcategories are [[:Category:Implied Characters]] etc. I don't see how those can be categorised as "List of ..." because an implied character is not a list. Just remove the List category and add [[:Category:Implied]], as above.
So overall I see no reason for them to exist. They have no possible entries. If you want to categorize the redirects, [[:Category:Implied Characters]] is the way to go, but this is pointless.


'''Proposer:''' {{User|Cobold}}<br>
In this case why don’t we also just group American English and Canadian English into one and call it "North American English" even if it’s moreso mainly American English? [[User:CarlosYoshiBoi|CarlosYoshiBoi]] ([[User talk:CarlosYoshiBoi|talk]]) 10:45, February 11, 2025 (PST)
'''Deadline:'''  Saturday, December 26th, 2009, 20:00 EST


====Support Removal====
:I'm not quite sure exactly what point you're trying to make here, but per [[Template:Languages/doc|the documentation for the "languages" template]], the reason they're labeled the way they currently are in game infoboxes is because they're the primary markets American English and British/Commonwealth English localizations are made for. And for what it's worth, whenever Nintendo specifically labels "North American English" as a selectable language whether in-game or in internal data, they usually refer to the United States or US specifically, not North America/NA as a whole. [[User:PaperSplash|PaperSplash]] ([[User talk:PaperSplash|talk]]) 16:27, February 11, 2025 (EST)
#{{User|Cobold}} - per above.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Per Cobold. I think I understood what the meaning behind this categories is, but I also think that this sort of organization is not necessary.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Per all stated above!
#{{User|Dry Paratroopa}} - Oh definitely.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per Cobold. Each list does not need a category unto itself, and categorizing the redirects going to that list is equally pointless because the list page's Table of Contents already works as a built-in index to these subjects.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per Cobold.
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} - Per Cobold.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - This is like a merge :D, Per Co-Bald
#{{user|Coincollector}} - since implied elements' info are being gathered into single articles, using these categories is, therefore, unnecessary.
#{{User|Vellidragon}} - Per all.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; These implied things are rarely even mentioned; why do we need them?
#{{User|GigaMetalLuigi}} - Support removal of Implied Characters, Entertainment, Items, Locations, People. Honestly, if the main category already has these already mentioned and covers it in the main article then no need to post it again on another page, just a waste of space.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} PEr Cobold.


====Oppose Removal====
::I think I’m going with the fact that the English (United States) language for Nintendo is also intended for Canada (and it’s also applied onto the "Japan" and "Hong Kong/Taiwan/South Korea" regions on the Switch) despite just using American English. Kinda like with European French where although it’s just moreso referring to Standard French/French from France, it’s intended for all French-speaking regions in Europe (France, Belgium and Switzerland). [[User:CarlosYoshiBoi|CarlosYoshiBoi]] ([[User talk:CarlosYoshiBoi|talk]]) 14:58, February 11, 2025 (PST)


====Comments====
If Nintendo is also still adding English (United Kingdom) for their games despite there being almost no differences from the North American English versions aside from date or other words if needed, why do they keep American spelling? Wouldn’t it make more sense for British English spelling to be used even if it’s one of the only differences between English (United States) and English (United Kingdom)? [[User:CarlosYoshiBoi|CarlosYoshiBoi]] ([[User talk:CarlosYoshiBoi|talk]]) 22:00, February 12, 2025 (PST)
I'll support this as well, but I also feel we should do an overhaul on the categorization system in general. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 00:01, 20 December 2009 (EST)
:I fully agree, but I've been to busy to concept anything about a new category system lately, while the rest of the staff has been focused on overhauling navigation templates and user pages for now. It's definitely on our list. - {{User|Cobold}} 14:05, 20 December 2009 (EST)


==Splits & Merges==
:Less work for something ultimately unimportant, I guess? It's not like American spelling is unintelligible to non-Americans. Anyway, what does this have to do with the proposal? {{User:Hewer/sig}} 03:39, February 13, 2025 (EST)


::Just came up to me somehow on the topic of American English and British English. Not as big of a problem anyways but just hit me. [[User:CarlosYoshiBoi|CarlosYoshiBoi]] ([[User talk:CarlosYoshiBoi|talk]]) 7:37, February 12, 2025 (PST)


===Split the colored enemies===
:I don't work for Nintendo nor do I know anyone personally who does, so I can't exactly say for sure. But my best guess is that they simply don't feel like they need to anymore. The main problem with Nintendo not having separate US and UK English localizations before was that certain words considered offensive in the UK but not the US would show up in Nintendo of America's localizations that were also going to be largely reused in Europe, as seen with ''[[Mario Party 8]]'' and ''[[Super Paper Mario]]''. But now such words appear to get caught and edited out during Nintendo of America's initial English localization pass, like "[[wiktionary:welcher|welcher]]" in ''[[Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga + Bowser's Minions]]'', "[[wiktionary:bugger|bugger]]" in ''[[Super Mario RPG (Nintendo Switch)|Super Mario RPG]]'' and "[[wiktionary:bummer#Noun 3|bummer]]" in ''[[Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door (Nintendo Switch)|Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door]]''. Also, it seems that ever since at least ''[[Paper Mario: Color Splash]]'' or so, Nintendo of America and Nintendo of Europe have been working together more closely on English localizations from the start, as a couple English localization staff at NoE are now often also credited on NoA localizations and vice versa. With any potentially problematic words (regionally or otherwise) now seemingly being addressed much earlier on, there's no longer a really good reason they ''need'' to otherwise address differences between American English and British English during the localization process that would justify the extra time, effort and pay. While I'm sure it was appreciated by some, as Hewer mentioned, most people in the UK are used to reading and hearing US English and can understand it just fine (and the same goes vice versa to a lesser extent). It's not like Spanish where many Latin Americans genuinely struggle with understanding Spaniard slang and sometimes vice versa. As for why they still store UK or “EU” English scripts separately from the US ones in internal data despite being them being almost or outright entirely identical now, I think part of that is a remnant of the previous generation where more distinct localizations stored in folders labeled by both region and language was the standard (and it makes it easier for them to port over the more distinct localizations from older games whenever they bother doing so, like ''[[Mario Kart 8]]'''s for ''[[Mario Kart 8 Deluxe]]''). But I think the other reason is to make it easy just in case something actually still needs changing between regions, most commonly the aforementioned date formats. Because that can be legitimately confusing, since they would essentially be backwards otherwise by the other region’s standards. [[User:PaperSplash|PaperSplash]] ([[User talk:PaperSplash|talk]]) 19:56, February 14, 2025 (EST)
It has come to my attention that while articles for each of the differently colored Yoshis exist, other colored variations of enemies, such as Toads and Shy Guys, do not. I know there's exeptions, but ignore those. Anyways, I ask this one question: why? For the Yoshis, there is very rarely a difference between them, as with the rest, yet they still get articles. If they get articles, so should the other characters.


So I'd like to see some character articles be created.
===Make Dark Mode available to everyone===
Dark Mode is available to users with an account under preferences but it should be a toggle-able option for all users, even if they're not an editor. Wikipedia allows everyone regardless of role to toggle Dark Mode, so I don't see why [[Super Mario Wiki|this wiki]] shouldn't follow suit.


'''Proposer:''' {{User|Reversinator}}<br>
'''Proposer''': {{User|Pizza Master}}<br>
'''Deadline:''' Wednesday, Dec. 23, 2009 (5:00 EST)
'''Deadline''': February 27, 2025, 23:59 GMT


====Create articles for colored characters====
====Support====
#{{User|Reversinator}} What I said above.
#{{User|Pizza Master}} per.
#{{User|Nintendo101}} nice idea, <s>though I would prefer if Light Mode was called "Ground Mode" and Dark Mode was called "Underground Mode" for our site.</s>
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Wait, theme changes are unavailable to users not logged in? Just, at all? It's not just dark mode, it's ''any'' theme, since it's all on Preferences. This feels like something that, if it's possible, it shouldn't even be a proposal, it should just be added outright without vote. This is a very obvious quality-of-life change for users that don't happen to be logged in.
#{{User|Mushroom Head}}Why do we still need to create an account just to not torture your eyes when we use this wiki at night? It literally has zero effect to the users who are always logged in anyways.
#{{User|Rykitu}} Per all
#{{User|ThePowerPlayer}} The fact that this wiki has a Dark Mode and it ''still'' isn't available to everyone who uses the site is a crime.


====Leave as it is====
====Oppose====
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} The Yoshis get their very own artwork and some get their very own, distinguishable stats such as Super Mario World, Mario Super Sluggers, and Yoshi's Story. The Yellow Yoshi article even had a personality section and some colored Yoshis have notable Yoshis. The other colored characters that are not Toad or Yoshi do not have distinguishable traits other than the color.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} In Yoshi's Story the Black and White Yoshi like chilis while the others dont and per BLOF.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - Are there ''significant'' differences between the different color Toads? I don' think so, the Yoshis have many differences, per BLOF.
#{{User|Redstar}} - Each differently-colored Yoshi has a different ability, which implies they are all varieties or sub-species of some sort. Different color for other species rarely means anything, so they shouldn't merit their own article unless they are as different as the Yoshi are. I do, however, while we're on the subject, feel the differently-colored species of other races should be merged within their main article. No difference besides skin color/clothing color, no need for own article.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - We don't have enough information on differently coloured members of other species to create decent articles: all we'd be left with is hundreds of mostly speculatively-named stubs that essentially say the same thing ("X Y is a X coloured Y appearing in Z games."). At least differently coloured Yoshis have slightly different abilities, but then again, so might Birdos (depending on whether or not ''[[Super Mario Bros. 2]]'' featured one recurring, colour-changing Birdo or many individuals - that's not entirely clear in itself), so I can see where this proposal's coming from. However, if a change has to be made, I say merging is the better option.
#{{User|Grandy02}} - Per all. It needs to be decided on a case-by-case basis.
#{{User|Time Q}}: Per all.
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} - Per all.
#{{User|FunkyK38}} - Per you guys. Multicolored Toads and Shyguys don't have much difference from each other (Hope that makes sense), while the Yoshis had a whole game dedicated to them. Those articles would be stubs anyways.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.


====Comments====
====Comments====
@BLOF: In the Baseball games, tons of other colored characters appeared, all with different stats, so that's null and void. With Yellow Yoshi, it describes him as brave, but aren't all of them? All right, the hungriness of them is ok, but how about other Yoshi? You know, the ones that don't have any significant differences between them, such as [[Brown Yoshi]], [[Light Blue Yoshi]], [[Pink Yoshi]], [[Purple Yoshi]] and [[Orange Yoshi]]? Very few differences between them.
My question is: is it possible to enable this feature for non-logged-in visitors? I'm asking this because Dark Mode is considered a "[[Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets|Gadget]]", and not a regular MediaWiki feature. They work with JavaScript though, so I suppose it ''could'' work in some way (given we have [[MediaWiki:Common.js]] and all), but I would still ask {{user|Porplemontage}} if a toggleable, easily accessible Dark Mode for everyone (including non-users) is possible, if I were you. {{User:Arend/sig}} 17:33, February 13, 2025 (EST)
 
@GF75: That information can easily be merged with the article. "All the Yoshis in Yoshi's Story posess the ability to eat the food and enemies in its path, although Black Yoshi and White Yoshi are able to eat Spiky Fruits, Peppers and Black Shy Guys". Of course, it'd be a lot more detailed.
 
@MG1: It varies between games. Also, what about the Yoshis I mentioned above?
 
@Redstar: Again, what about the Yoshis I mentioned above? {{User|Reversinator}}
:I'm sorry, but I don't know how I'm supposed to vote. Your proposal is about two things: merging the Yoshi pages and/or creating individual articles for differently-colored species. I think you should revise your proposal so I know if I'm voting for one thing or two things. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 09:33, 17 December 2009 (EST)
::All right. {{User|Reversinator}}
:::I almost want to support merging all the different Yoshi colors to the [[Yoshi (species)]] article, but there's just so much much information that I couldn't bear cutting it to make it fit. I'm going to have to continue opposing unless you can provide a specific example of a differently-colored species that has enough differences between them attributable to their color that would warrant splitting. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 10:37, 17 December 2009 (EST)
 
This proposal is pretty vague. If you give specific examples, it would be much more clear as to which exact articles you want split. {{user|Bloc Partier}}
 
Reversinator: Yes, the different colored enemies did have different stats, but it's only in the baseball games. Same thing goes for Pink and Light Blue Yoshi, because they have distinguishable stats only in the baseball games as well. However, Red, Blue, and Yellow Yoshi have different stats in other games such as Super Mario World, and all Yoshis have likes and dislikes of fruit in Yoshi's Story. We can't merge just Pink, Brown, Orange, Purple and Light Blue Yoshi because this breaks consistency. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
 
:There's a million different Shy Guy colors and some only appear once. For example, here's an article that will be created if the proposal were to pass:


'''Cyan Shy Guy'''
:I've asked [[User:Porplemontage|Porple]] on his talk page, so we'll see when he answers. [[User:Pizza Master|Pizza Master]] ([[User talk:Pizza Master|talk]]) 17:40, February 13, 2025 (EST)


The Cyan Shy Guy is a cyan colored [[Shy Guy]] (obviously) that only appears in ''[[Mario Kart Wii]]'' as an audience member.
::Porple's response on his talk page seems to imply that it might be possible. [[User:Pizza Master|Pizza Master]] ([[User talk:Pizza Master|talk]])


Then the stub template will be placed here.
===Make about templates on ''New Super Mario Bros. U'' courses and ''New Super Luigi U'' courses link to each other instead of a disambiguation page, but keep the disambiguation page===
"Where is that Star Coin in [[Jungle of the Giants]]? Oh, I’ll use Super Mario Wiki. Wait, I’m playing ''[[New Super Luigi U]]'' so it’s the counterpart [[Giant Swing-Along]]. How do I get from the Jungle’s page to Swing Along’s page? The about template should take me to… a [[Soda Jungle-1|disambig]]?"


It doesn't make sense.
What the hypothetical person above said. There’s only two courses with the code [[Soda Jungle-1]], and since Nintendo does not reuse worlds in other games in the same role as worlds, the odds of there ever being a third Soda Jungle-1 are 0%. Given this is the case, if a user does go to a [[New Super Mario Bros. U|Mario U]] course when they meant a Luigi U course, having the about template point to a disambiguation page for a whopping two articles means the user has to click two times to reach the corresponding article for Luigi U. While this is a minor issue, there's a whole [[MarioWiki:Naming#Shared titles|paragraph]] in [[MarioWiki:Naming]] dedicated to saving readers the clicks when searching for the most obvious topic of a group of topics that share a name. I think that philosophy should be extended to this curiosity.
{{User|Gamefreak75}}


==Changes==
We should carve out a special exception regarding the About template for this pair of games. About templates for levels from ''[[New Super Mario Bros. U]]'' and ''New Super Luigi U'' simply link to the other article, even though the articles in question do not share a name. The disambiguation page remains, because neither Soda Jungle-1 is more prominent than the other. (It also matches the relationship between ''Donkey Kong Country'' levels to ''Donkey Kong Land'' levels) As a result, this:
===Change naming convention for power-up form articles===
*"This article is about Jungle of the Giants, a level in ''New Super Mario Bros. U''. For other uses, see Soda Jungle-1."
Currently, we define the articles for various forms of characters upon power-up with the title of "Form Mario". This is ultimately misleading because many characters besides Mario have been shown to make use of different power-ups and wear the same form, yet we choose to use Mario as the catch-all despite him not being the official name for such a form, only the original user and most widely-known transformer.
becomes this:
*"This article is about Jungle of the Giants, a level in ''New Super Mario Bros. U''. For its ''New Super Luigi U'' counterpart, see Giant Swing-Along."


While this practice isn't necessarily ''bad'', it has resulted in some confusion on how exactly to merge and split the articles relating to the [[Metal Cap|metal]] [[Power Flower|form]]. For example, [[Metal Wario]] is currently being proposed to merge with [[Metal Mario]] due to the shared nature of those characters under that form. However, the Metal Mario page is also being proposed to be split with information on Metal Mario ''the character'' (as seen in the ''Super Smash Bros.'' series and other media as a playable character). The problem resulting from this is that there would be two "Metal Mario" articles, or at least two very similarly named ones, with one being "Metal Mario" and covering the form, and the other being "Metal Mario (character)", which are both too similar to avoid confusion.
And so on and so forth for all... 90 or so courses.


Another problem arising from this standard in naming convention is the placement of alternate name tags at the top of the page. While these tags certainly serve their purpose, they are also an eye-sore. Seeing boxy tags of ''any'' kind at any point on a page makes me think the article is incomplete or under construction of some kind. It just pulls me out of the right mindframe of reading and ''enjoying'' an article.
'''Proposer''': {{User|Salmancer}}<br>
'''Deadline''': February 28, 2025, 23:59 GMT


What this proposal is hoping to achieve is to change the current naming standard to one that more clearly and generally explains the contents of an article, as well as remove the need for the above explained tag. Any form a character can become upon use of a power-up, such as [[Frog Mario]], [[Metal Mario]], [[Fire Mario]], etc. will be re-named to "X Form".
====Support: Link the corresponding courses together with the about template====
#{{User|Salmancer}} I only have 100 seconds to beat the Luigi courses, for the love of hammers save me the click when I put in a Mario course by accident!
#{{User|ThePowerPlayer}} If there are two and only two levels that correspond to the same world name and level number (e.g. "Soda Jungle-1"), then one should just immediately link to the other, just like pages that use the <nowiki>{{distinguish}}</nowiki> template such as [[Slug]] and [[Vine Slime]]. Seeing the disambiguation page should only be necessary if someone thinks to visit "Soda Jungle-1" first without remembering the level's exact name.
#{{User|EvieMaybe}} one of those changes so obvious you question why they weren't done that way in the first place. per proposal!
#{{User|Rykitu}} Per all
#{{User|Ahemtoday}} Very sensible change to make.


'''Proposer:''' {{User|Redstar}}<br>
====Oppose: Status quo, about templates go to disambiguations.====
'''Deadline:''' December 26, 2009, 20:00


====Change Naming Convention for Forms====
====Comments (Use <nowiki>{{about}}</nowiki> to cross-link Mario/Luigi U courses)====
#{{User|Redstar}} - Per proposal
I know I'm on about swapping from "level" to "course". That's for another day, which is why the example doesn't change the word choice. [[User:Salmancer|Salmancer]] ([[User talk:Salmancer|talk]]) 18:54, February 14, 2025 (EST)
 
====Leave Naming Convention as it is====
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} To be honest, I'd rather have it all x Mario, instead of x Form. I really never minded the templates on the page. Mario is the main character, so he should be the main names of the form. At least in my opinion.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - As vellidragon mentioned in the comments, the games default to "X Mario" even if Luigi (or other characters) can power-up too, and going with actual names is much better than making stuff up ourselves, as would be the case with "X Forms". At least the duality templates don't look as bad as speculation templates gracing our articles. Also, in the ''Wario'' games, only Wario powers-up, so changing those to "X Forms" would be folly, but leaving them as "X Wario" while "X Mario" gets converted would look inconsistent.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} Meh, it sounds weird. How would Fire Form or Fat Form (LOL) sound. Bomb Form, Snowball Form, Burning Form, there's millions.
#{{User|Vellidragon}} Per my comment below. The way it's currently done is the most official.
 
====Comments====
What about merging the forms with the items that cause them? That way, we can avoid the unofficial "X Form" names. The only possible problem with this is if different items are used to make the same form in different games. The only example I could think of off the top of my head, however, is [[Dragon Wario]], and I think ''Wario''-series forms should remain unchanged anyway, seeing as those powerups aren't exactly the same as in the core ''Mario'' series (and they're always unique to Wario, so the arguments about duality don't apply to them). - {{User|Walkazo}}
:Mario becomes Metal Mario upon use of a [[Metal Cap]], while Wario does so through use of a [[Power Flower]]... While I do support the idea, and have thought about it myself before, I'm not sure if that type of merge would sit well with the majority of people. It does make sense, however to have a single comprehensive on a power-up, followed by a second half detailing its use in different media. Not the most controversial merge-idea, but I'm sure some people wouldn't like it. Discussion, as always, and we'll see. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 00:58, 19 December 2009 (EST)
:I disagree with merging them with the power-ups; like Redstar pointed out, the forms can sometimes be caused by different power-ups. IIRC, the Fire/Super Mario transformation in the cartoons could be triggered by a [[Starman]] or even pasta. Not sure what to think about the renaming atm; it would get rid of the "alternative title" template thingy, but I'm not sure I like the "... Form" title very much. As far as I'm aware, manuals and strategy guides (at least older ones) have always used the "... Mario" naming scheme which we have on the Wiki right now (and if they didn't, they still used "... [character name]"); I'm not sure if "... Form" has ever been used in official sources. Imo, official terms should be used wherever they are known.--[[User:Vellidragon|vellidragon]] 10:44, 19 December 2009 (EST)
::@Vellidragon: I don't like the term Form that much either, but it carries far more general areas than "X Mario", when clearly any number of characters can hold such forms. In any case, we already categorize the forms under [Category:Forms], under sub-category [Category:Mario's Transformations]. The main category at least acknowledges that they're forms, but the sub-category is pretty narrow. Again, Mario isn't the only one to use these forms. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 16:31, 19 December 2009 (EST)
::@Walkazo: The thing is, saying that "Fire Mario" is the proper term is just as much "made-up" as "Fire Form" would be... Fire Mario, Frog Mario, Cape Mario, etc. were never names for the ''form'' itself, but for Mario himself when using the power-up. Assuming the name applies to the form as well is just stretching it too far. If we're going to "make-up" a term, I'd rather it be "form" so we can avoid confusion and using a tag that says "also known as" five times. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 22:27, 19 December 2009 (EST)
:::I disagree: since things like "Fire Mario" appear in games and manuals, I think people will remember that term more easily and use it when they browse the Internet long before "Fire Form" occurs to them. Perhaps regular Users of the Super Mario Wiki will learn to use "X Form", but random guests probably won't, and they're the people we're trying to reach most of all. To the uninitiated, which is more welcoming, the familiar "Fire Mario" or an ambiguous "Fire Form"? That's what I mean my making stuff up: "Fire Mario" is straight from Nintendo, whereas "Fire Form" is taking a step beyond where they have gone, and if it's not canon, it's speculation, which is to be avoided at all costs. Nintendo is fine with using "X Mario" as a catch-all, and so should we. As for the [[template:Diff|Diff template]], I think it's merely a matter of personal opinion on how it impacts the pages; myself, I've always thought it was a nifty way to handle these issues, and if anything, they make me more interested in the following information and its duality. - {{User|Walkazo}}
::::Well, I agree with "Form" being less official. Personally, I'm fine with the naming convention as it is now, but I was suggested to make this proposal just to get the issue settled so we can continue on with the proposals concerning [[Metal Mario]] and [[Metal Wario]]. I'm just playing Devil's advocate, you realize. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 23:50, 19 December 2009 (EST)
 
===Change Gate Keeper back to Piranha Plant in the Generator===
Somehow, Piranha Plant in the Generator is not the name of the creatures because apparently one person read in some unnamed guide that their name was Gate Keeper so that obviously was their name. This Proposal was made to see if people think the name is Piranha Plant in the Generator or Gate Keeper.
 
'''Proposer:''' {{User|Dry Paratroopa}}<br>
'''Deadline:''' Saturday, December 26th, 20:00 (8:00 pm)
 
====Change back to Piranha Plant in the Generator====
#{{User|Dry Paratroopa}} - Per Proposal.
====Keep as Gate Keeper====
 
====Comments====
If it doesn't cover a general issue, only a singular one, I think this proposal would make more sense on the actual article's Discussion page. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 19:51, 19 December 2009 (EST)


==Miscellaneous==
==Miscellaneous==
''None at the moment.''
''None at the moment.''
<!-- Please do not remove, archive or place comments below this message. -->
&nbsp;

Latest revision as of 00:48, February 15, 2025

Image used as a banner for the Proposals page
Current time:
Saturday, February 15th, 07:58 GMT
Proposals can be new features, the removal of previously-added features that have tired out, or new policies that must be approved via consensus before any action is taken.
  • Voting periods last for two weeks, but can close early or be extended (see below).
  • Any autoconfirmed user can support or oppose, but must have a strong reason for doing so.
  • All proposals must be approved by a majority of voters, including proposals with more than two options.
  • For past proposals, see the proposal archive and the talk page proposal archive.

If you would like to get feedback on an idea before formally proposing it here, you may do so on the proposals talk. For talk page proposals, you can discuss the changes on the talk page itself before creating the TPP there.

How to

If someone has an idea about improving the wiki or managing its community, but feel that they need community approval before acting upon that idea, they may make a proposal about it. They must have a strong argument supporting their idea and be willing to discuss it in detail with other users, who will then vote on whether or not they think the idea should be implemented. Proposals should include links to all relevant pages and writing guidelines. Proposals must include a link to the draft page. Any pages that would be largely affected by the proposal should be marked with {{proposal notice}}.

Rules

  1. Only autoconfirmed users may create or vote on proposals. Proposals can be created by one user or co-authored by two users.
  2. Anyone is free to comment on proposals (provided that the page's protection level allows them to edit).
  3. Proposals conclude at the end of the day (23:59) two weeks after voting starts (all times GMT).
    • For example, if a proposal is added at any time on Monday, August 1, 2011, the voting starts immediately and the deadline is two weeks later on Monday, August 15, at 23:59 GMT.
  4. Users may vote for more than one option, but they may not vote for every option available.
  5. Every vote should have a strong, sensible reason accompanying it. Agreeing with a previously mentioned reason given by another user is acceptable (including "per" votes), but tangential comments, heavy sarcasm, and other misleading or irrelevant quips are just as invalid as providing no reason at all.
  6. Users who feel that certain votes were cast in bad faith or which truly have no merit can address the votes in the comments section. Users can ask a voter to clarify their position, point out mistakes or flaws in their arguments, or call for the outright removal of the vote if it lacks sufficient reasoning. Users may not remove or alter the content of anyone else's votes. Voters can remove or rewrite their own vote(s) at any time, but the final decision to remove another user's vote lies solely with the wiki staff.
    • Users can also use the comments section to bring up any concerns or mistakes in regards to the proposal itself. In such cases, it's important the proposer addresses any concerns raised as soon as possible. Even if the supporting side might be winning by a wide margin, that should be no reason for such questions to be left unanswered. They may point out any missing details that might have been overlooked by the proposer, so it's a good idea as the proposer to check them frequently to achieve the most accurate outcome possible.
  7. If a user makes a vote and is subsequently blocked for any amount of time, their vote is removed. However, if the block ends before the proposal ends, then the user in question holds the right to re-cast their vote. If a proposer is blocked, their vote is removed and "(blocked)" is added next to their name in the "Proposer:" line of the proposal, which runs until its deadline as normal. If the proposal passes, it falls to the supporters of the idea to enact any changes in a timely manner.
  8. Proposals cannot contradict an already ongoing proposal or overturn the decision of a previous proposal that concluded less than four weeks (28 days) ago.
  9. If one week before a proposal's initial deadline, the first place option is ahead of the second place option by eight or more votes and the first place option has at least 80% approval, then the proposal concludes early. Wiki staff may tag a proposal with "Do not close early" at any time to prevent an early close, if needed.
    • Tag the proposal with {{early notice}} if it is on track for an early close. Use {{proposal check|early=yes}} to perform the check.
  10. Any proposal where none of the options have at least four votes will be extended for another week. If after three extensions, no options have at least four votes, the proposal will be listed as "NO QUORUM." The original proposer then has the option to relist said proposal to generate more discussion.
  11. If a proposal reaches its deadline and there is a tie for first place, then the proposal is extended for another week.
  12. If a proposal reaches its deadline and the first place option is ahead of the second place option by three or more votes, then the first place option must have over 50% approval to win. If the margin is only one or two votes, then the first place option must have at least 60% approval to win. If the required approval threshold is not met, then the proposal is extended for another week.
    • Use {{proposal check}} to automate this calculation; see the template page for usage instructions and examples.
  13. Proposals can be extended a maximum of three times. If a consensus has not been reached by the fourth deadline, then the proposal fails and cannot be re-proposed until at least four weeks after the last deadline.
  14. All proposals are archived. The original proposer must take action accordingly if the outcome of the proposal dictates it. If it requires the help of an administrator, the proposer can ask for that help.
  15. After a proposal passes, it is added to the appropriate list of "unimplemented proposals" below and is removed once it has been sufficiently implemented.
  16. If the wiki staff deem a proposal unnecessary or potentially detrimental to the upkeep of the Super Mario Wiki, they have the right to cancel it at any time.
  17. Proposals can only be rewritten or canceled by their proposer within the first four days of their creation. However, proposers can request that their proposal be canceled by a staff member at any time, provided they have a valid reason for it. Please note that canceled proposals must also be archived.
  18. Unless there is major disagreement about whether certain content should be included, there should not be proposals about creating, expanding, rewriting, or otherwise fixing up pages. To organize efforts about improving articles on neglected or completely missing subjects, try setting up a collaboration thread on the forums.
  19. Proposals cannot be made about promotions and demotions. Staff changes are discussed internally and handled by the bureaucrats.
  20. No joke proposals. Proposals are serious wiki matters and should be handled professionally. Joke proposals will be deleted on sight.
  21. Proposals must have a status quo option (e.g. Oppose, Do nothing) unless the status quo itself violates policy.

Basic proposal formatting

Copy and paste the formatting below to get started; your username and the proposal deadline will automatically be substituted when you save the page. Update the bracketed variables with actual information, and be sure to replace the whole variable including the square brackets, so "[insert info here]" becomes "This is the inserted information" and not "[This is the inserted information]". Proposals presenting multiple alternative courses of action can have more than two voting options, but the objective(s) of each voting option must be clearly defined. Such options should also be kept to a minimum, and if something comes up in the comments, the proposal can be amended as necessary. 

===[insert a title for your proposal here]===
[describe what issue this proposal is about and what changes you think should be made to improve how the wiki handles that issue]

'''Proposer''': {{User|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}}<br>
'''Deadline''': {{subst:#time:F j, Y|+2 weeks}}, 23:59 GMT

====[option title (e.g. Support, Option 1)]: [brief summary of option]====
#{{User|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}} Per proposal.

====[option title (e.g. Oppose, Option 2)]: [brief summary of option]====

====Comments ([brief proposal title])====

Autoconfirmed users will now be able to vote on your proposal. Remember that you can vote on your own proposal just like the others.

To vote for an option, just insert #{{User|[your username here]}} at the bottom of the section of your choice. Just don't forget to add a valid reason for your vote behind that tag if you are voting on another user's proposal. If you are voting on your own proposal, you can simply say "Per proposal."

Poll proposal formatting

As an alternative to the basic proposal format, users may choose to create a poll proposal when one larger issue can be broken down into multiple sub-issues that can be resolved independently of each other. In a poll proposal, each option is its own mini-proposal with a deadline and Support/Oppose subheadings. The rules above apply to each option as if it were a its own two-option proposal: users may vote Support or Oppose on any number of options they wish, and individual options may close early or be extended separately from the rest. If an option fails to achieve quorum or reach a consensus after three extensions, then "Oppose" wins for that option by default. A poll proposal closes after all of its options have been settled, and no action is taken until then. If all options fail, then nothing will be done.

To create a poll proposal, copy and paste the formatting below to get started; your username and the option deadlines will automatically be substituted when you save the page. Update the bracketed variables with actual information, and be sure to replace the whole variable including the square brackets, so "[insert info here]" becomes "This is the inserted information" and not "[This is the inserted information]". 

===[insert a title for your proposal here]===
[describe what issue this proposal is about and what changes you think should be made to improve how the wiki handles that issue]

'''Proposer''': {{User|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}}

====[option title (e.g. Option 1)]: [brief summary of option]====
'''Deadline''': {{subst:#time:F j, Y|+2 weeks}}, 23:59 GMT

=====Support=====
#{{User|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}} Per proposal.

=====Oppose=====

====[option title (e.g. Option 2)]: [brief summary of option]====
'''Deadline''': {{subst:#time:F j, Y|+2 weeks}}, 23:59 GMT

=====Support=====
#{{User|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}} Per proposal.

=====Oppose=====

====[option title (e.g. Option 3)]: [brief summary of option]====
'''Deadline''': {{subst:#time:F j, Y|+2 weeks}}, 23:59 GMT

=====Support=====
#{{User|{{subst:REVISIONUSER}}}} Per proposal.

=====Oppose=====

====Comments ([brief proposal title])====

Talk page proposals

Proposals concerning a single page or a limited group of pages are held on the most relevant talk page regarding the matter. All of the above proposal rules also apply to talk page proposals. Place {{TPP}} under the section's heading, and once the proposal is over, replace the template with {{settled TPP}}. Proposals dealing with a large amount of splits, merges, or deletions across the wiki should still be held on this page.

All active talk page proposals must be listed below in chronological order (new proposals go at the bottom) using {{ongoing TPP}}. Include a brief description of the proposal while also mentioning any pages affected by it, a link to the talk page housing the discussion, and the deadline. If the proposal involves a page that is not yet made, use {{fake link}} to communicate its title in the description. Linking to pages not directly involved in the talk page proposal is not recommended, as it clutters the list with unnecessary links.

List of ongoing talk page proposals

Unimplemented proposals

Proposals

Break alphabetical order in enemy lists to list enemy variants below their base form, EvieMaybe (ended May 21, 2024)
Standardize sectioning for Super Mario series game articles, Nintendo101 (ended July 3, 2024)
^ NOTE: Not yet integrated for the Super Mario Maker titles and Super Mario Run.
Create new sections for gallery pages to cover "unused/pre-release/prototype/etc." graphics separate from the ones that appear in the finalized games, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended September 2, 2024)
Add film and television ratings to Template:Ratings, TheUndescribableGhost (ended October 1, 2024)
Use the classic and classic link templates when discussing classic courses in Mario Kart Tour, YoYo (ended October 2, 2024)
Clarify coverage of the Super Smash Bros. series, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended October 17, 2024)
Remove all subpage and redirect links from all navigational templates, JanMisali (ended October 31, 2024)
Prioritize MESEN/NEStopia palette for NES sprites and screenshots, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended November 3, 2024)
Allow English names from closed captions, Koopa con Carne (ended November 12, 2024)
^ NOTE: A number of names coming from closed captions are listed here.
Split off the Mario Kart Tour template(s), MightyMario (ended November 24, 2024)
Split major RPG appearances of recurring locations, EvieMaybe (ended December 16, 2024)
Organize "List of implied" articles, EvieMaybe (ended January 12, 2025)
Split Mario & Luigi badges and remaining accessories, Camwoodstock (ended February 1, 2025)
Merge Chef Torte and Apprentice (Torte), Camwoodstock (ended February 3, 2025)
Merge the Ancient Beanbean Civilizations to List of implied species, Camwoodstock (ended February 13, 2025)

Talk page proposals

Split all the clothing, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended September 12, 2021)
Split machine parts, Robo-Rabbit, and flag from Super Duel Mode, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended September 30, 2022)
Make bestiary list pages for the Minion Quest and Bowser Jr.'s Journey modes, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended January 11, 2024)
Allow separate articles for Diddy Kong Pilot (2003)'s subjects, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended August 3, 2024)
Create articles for specified special buildings in Super Mario Run, Salmancer (ended November 15, 2024)
Expand and rename List of characters by game to List of characters by first appearance, Hewer (ended November 20, 2024)
Merge False Character and Fighting Polygon/Wireframe/Alloy/Mii Teams into List of Super Smash Bros. series bosses, Doc von Schmeltwick (ended December 2, 2024)
Merge Wiggler Family to Dimble Wood, Camwoodstock (ended January 11, 2025)
Split the Ink Bomb, Camwoodstock (ended January 12, 2025)
Create a catch-all Poltergust article, Blinker (ended January 21, 2025)
Merge the two Clawing for More articles, Salmancer (ended January 27, 2025)
Merge Dangan Mario to Invincible Mario, PrincessPeachFan (ended January 30, 2025)
Give the Cluck-A-Pop Prizes articles, Camwoodstock (ended January 31, 2025)
Reverse the proposal to trim White Shy Guy, Waluigi Time (ended February 8, 2025)
Split Animal Crossing (game), Kaptain Skurvy (ended February 12, 2025)

Writing guidelines

None at the moment.

New features

None at the moment.

Removals

None at the moment.

Changes

Include italics for category page titles for media that normally uses it

Shouldn't category pages for media that uses italics (such as games, shows, movies, etc.) use italics for their category pages? I did start adding it to some pages already, but I thought it was worth proposing about it, possibly to make it policy. I feel like italics should be used though, as it is used everywhere else. For example, the page titled Category:Donkey Kong 64 should be Category:Donkey Kong 64.

Proposer: Kaptain Skurvy (talk)
Deadline: February 20, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Support

  1. Kaptain Skurvy (talk) Per proposal.
  2. Camwoodstock (talk) Wait, this isn't already policy??? We think this lack of parity speaks a lot to how neglected categories can be in some regards. While yes, the category description isn't really meant to be the main point, we don't think slightly slanted text is distracting from the actual list of articles in the category, and just because categories are more utility than text doesn't excuse the text that is there looking below the standard of a usual article for being "lesser".
  3. Super Mario RPG (talk) Nothing wrong with having more consistency around the wiki.
  4. GuntherBayBeee (talk) Per all.
  5. Salmancer (talk) It is easier to figure out what the standards are from context alone when the standards are applied in every instance.

Oppose

  1. Nintendo101 (talk) Categories are supposed to provide simple, direct, and utilitarian functions, not something to be read or presented to readers. I don't think italicizing them is necessary and would detract from their simplicity.
  2. Sparks (talk) Per Nintendo101. It doesn't feel necessary.
  3. OmegaRuby (talk) What is this supposed to change, exactly? Yes, it's in line with how pages about games are to have the subject italicized, but the change feels unneeded and especially arduous to implement for pretty much no reason. Per Nintendo101.
  4. SolemnStormcloud (talk) Per all.
  5. Rykitu (talk) Per Nintendo101

Comments

@Nintendo101: In that case, why do we italicise game titles in category descriptions? (Genuine question, I'm undecided on this proposal.) Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 08:58, February 7, 2025 (EST)

Because that is a proper sentence. It is not the tool itself. - Nintendo101 (talk) 20:15, February 7, 2025 (EST)
We mean... Wiki policy is to italicize game titles on their articles' names using {{Italic title}}, too, and those aren't proper sentences. They're article names. Camwoodstock-sigicon.png~Camwoodstock (talk) 19:00, February 8, 2025 (EST)
That's not the same situation in my eyes because the articles are what the site is for. That is what we are writing and presenting to the public. Of course we would italicize those. The categories are a tool, chiefly for site editors, not readers. We do not really gain anything from italicizing their titles. If anything, I worry this would lead to a lot of work to implement, either burdening site editors, porplemontage, or both. - Nintendo101 (talk) 16:05, February 9, 2025 (EST)
So category names are just tools not meant for readers, but category descriptions aren't? Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 18:08, February 9, 2025 (EST)
The descriptions are just sentences, and I feel inclined to render those they way we would a sentence anywhere else on the site, be it on articles or in the description for image files. - Nintendo101 (talk) 19:49, February 9, 2025 (EST)
We disagree with the notion categories are more for editors and not readers; while yes, all of the categories on the front page are maintenance categories from the to-do list, the sheer quantity of proposals for categories wouldn't make sense if they were moreso for editors, rather than your average reader; moves such as the reforms for the Look-alikes categories or the Thieves category wouldn't make sense if these weren't meant to be public-facing. And of course, there are the various categories that exist for users, but do not serve a utility purpose, such as the various "users that know a given language" categories.
As for difficulty implementing, considering the recent success stories with images without descriptions and categories without descriptions having gone from 4000+ and ≈100, to 0 and 0 respectively, we have it in good faith that this wouldn't be that hard to implement. Monotonous? Yes. But difficult? It's nothing a bit of caffeine and music can't solve. Camwoodstock-sigicon.png~Camwoodstock (talk) 18:22, February 9, 2025 (EST)
Not only for editors, but chiefly for them. I don't exclude the idea of more curious readers utilizing them, but I suspect they are exceptions. I maintain that their ease of implementation is more important to the site than the formatting inconsistency. Like, are we to be expected to format category ourselves as "[[Category:Super Mario World screenshots|Category:''Super Mario World'' screenshots]]" instead of just "[[Category:Super Mario World screenshots]]" going forward? Would we do this for the articles that are in dozens of categories? Why? I would not want to do that, and I don't find the inconsistency a good enough reason to roll something like that out, and only brings downsides. It makes the tool where one types "[[Category:" almost entirely moot because we would still need to write out the whole name just to format it this way. Others are welcomed to think differently, but I personally think the way we format these names now in categories is perfectly fine. - Nintendo101 (talk) 19:49, February 9, 2025 (EST)

even if this proposal doesn't pass, i think we should use Template:Italic title in the category pages. — Super Leaf stamp from Super Mario 3D World + Bowser's Fury.eviemaybe (talk / contributions) 10:16, February 12, 2025 (EST)

I thought that was the whole proposal. Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 03:32, February 13, 2025 (EST)

Split the image quality category

Issue 1: Category:Images to be reuploaded with higher quality is a very big category, with nearly 4,000 images in it right now. Even if it's something you can help with, it's very difficult to actually find anything in here. Issue 2: All other things being equal, some types of images require specific methods or skills to get that all users may not have or be comfortable with. To aid in the overall usability of this category and make it easier for skilled users to find things they can help with, I'm proposing the following two subcategories:

  • Screenshots to be uploaded with higher quality - Most Nintendo consoles don't have the ability to take native screenshots. That's all I'll say about that.
  • Assets to be uploaded with higher quality - Sites like The Spriters Resource are helpful, but they don't have everything. Getting higher quality images requires being able to extract them from the game files and/or the ability to manipulate them afterwards. This will also include images that are currently screenshots meant to demonstrate an asset, such as File:DKCTF Donkey Icon.png.

Additionally, Template:Image-quality will be modified with an extra parameter to mark the image as a screenshot or asset and categorize them appropriately. Considering we already have the rewrite and stub categories organized for better navigation, I don't see this as an issue.

Proposer: Waluigi Time (talk)
Deadline: February 20, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Split both

  1. Waluigi Time (talk) Category:Votes to be reuploaded with a better reason
  2. Technetium (talk) Per proposal.
  3. Camwoodstock (talk) We're a little surprised a split like this hasn't happened sooner, honestly; if for no other reason than it would be nice to have it organized. Per proposal.
  4. ThePowerPlayer (talk) Per proposal.
  5. Nintendo101 (talk) Per proposal.
  6. LadySophie17 (talk) Per all, which is mostly "per proposal"s anyway
  7. EvieMaybe (talk) makes perfect sense

Only split screenshots

Only split assets

Leave image quality alone

Comments on image quality proposal

Silly question; will images that are of neither screenshots nor assets that have the image-quality tag, like scans, character art/renders, or merchandise, just remain as-is? There are already a few examples of those that are all presently tagged with image-quality, like so:

  • Scan of 3D render, colors are washed out.

    Scan of 3D render, colors are washed out.

  • Muddy scan of 2D illustration, and background cropped.

    Muddy scan of 2D illustration, and background cropped.

  • Photoshop upscaled 2D promo art.

    Photoshop upscaled 2D promo art.

  • Too small image of merchandise.

    Too small image of merchandise.

Camwoodstock-sigicon.png~Camwoodstock (talk) 15:30, February 6, 2025 (EST)

Yes, anything that doesn't fall into either of the two subcategories will stay in the main one for now. I suppose we can look into splitting it further down the road, but I singled these two out because of the higher barrier to entry and also that they seem to be the bulk of the category's contents right now. --Waluigi's head icon in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. Too Bad! Waluigi Time! 15:37, February 6, 2025 (EST)
I think this category should also be split by the media that it appears in (e.g: Category:Game screenshots to be reuploaded with higher quality. Something similar should also be done for the Articles with unsourced foreign names category. Apikachu68 (talk) 19:50, February 6, 2025 (EST)
Almost all of the screenshots in the category right now are from games so I don't think it needs to be narrowed down further just yet. --Waluigi's head icon in Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. Too Bad! Waluigi Time! 20:09, February 6, 2025 (EST)

Change "(game)" identifier to "(arcade)" on the articles of Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong Jr. and Mario Bros.

I wouldn't consider "game" to be the best identifier for the arcade games Donkey Kong, Donkey Kong Jr. and Mario Bros. There's already a Game and Watch game that shares its title with each of the arcade games, but "Donkey Kong" is the name of various other games too! There's the tabletop game, the Game Boy game, the Nelsonic Game Watch game and the slot machine. I know the slot machine is technically an arcade game, but it's not a standard cabinet like the 1981 arcade game. "Game" is a broad identifier, especially for Donkey Kong. Shouldn't a "game" identifier only be used if there's no other game with the same name? That's why we use consoles for identifiers instead, such as Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (Wii) and Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (Nintendo DS).

Proposer: Kaptain Skurvy (talk)
Deadline: February 22, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Support

  1. Kaptain Skurvy (talk) Per proposal.

Oppose

  1. Nintendo101 (talk) Those articles also cover the game's release on Famicom, NES, Atari, etc., so "arcade" would not be a holistically accurate identifier.
  2. Camwoodstock (talk) Per Nintendo101; "arcade" is kind of a misnomer when the non-arcade ports are covered on them.
  3. ThePowerPlayer (talk) Per Nintendo101.
  4. PaperSplash (talk) Per ThePowerPlayer's comment.
  5. Rykitu (talk) Per all

Comments

Maybe "arcade game" would be a decent compromise? PaperSplash (talk) 18:02, February 8, 2025 (EST)

What about Dr. Mario? That game also has a separate release also called Dr. Mario.--PopitTart (talk) 18:24, February 8, 2025 (EST)

The reason why the games Donkey Kong and Dr. Mario should keep their identifier of "(game)" is because those are by far the most popular and commonly thought-of games under their respective titles; the other articles (aside from Donkey Kong on the Game Boy) are on much more obscure devices while being clearly separate from the original game. To put it another way, "Dr. Mario (game)" is what people are looking for when they think about "the game featuring Dr. Mario"; meanwhile, you'd be forgiven for not knowing that the Gamewatch Boy game even exists at all. ThePowerPlayer Slug.png ThePowerPlayer 22:15, February 8, 2025 (EST)

what about Donkey Kong (1981)? — Super Leaf stamp from Super Mario 3D World + Bowser's Fury.eviemaybe (talk / contributions) 18:39, February 9, 2025 (EST)

That would work for Donkey Kong, but the original Mario Bros. and the arcade game of the same title were both released in 1983. jan Misali (talk · contributions) 12:49, February 12, 2025 (EST)

Standardize the use of "English", "English (United States)" and/or "English (United Kingdom)" as languages in game infoboxes

So far, the use of "English (United States)" and "English (United Kingdom)" as language identifiers in game infoboxes on this wiki has been rather inconsistent and arbitrary, to say the least. While Nintendo is typically known for providing distinct English localizations for the United States (and other English-speaking territories in the Americas) and the United Kingdom (and other territories where Commonwealth English is standard, apart from Canada), the actual differences between them, if any, have varied over time.

Historically, many Nintendo games have featured minor English text differences between their releases in the Americas and Europe/Oceania; however, these were typically not wholly separate localizations to account for the differences between American and British (or Commonwealth) English – they tended to follow American English conventions for the most part regardless. Rather, they were simple amendments made by Nintendo of Europe to Nintendo of America's existing English scripts, usually either to rectify perceived shortcomings or to modify certain terminology based on internal preferences. These versions were typically stored separately on region-specific cartridges or discs, with occasional differences in how they were labeled in internal data.

Later, during the DS, Wii, 3DS and Wii U eras, more distinct localizations specifically for the United States and United Kingdom that also accounted for regional language differences became more commonplace. However, all of the aforementioned practices have largely faded with the advent of the region-free Nintendo Switch, where games now typically release simultaneously worldwide on identical cartridges. As a result, English scripts are now more often than not also identical across regions (or at most contain only very minor differences, such as the date format used; in many cases, the date format is the only difference), though they are still almost always stored and labeled separately in internal data, typically alongside each other.

This proposal aims to determine how we should handle cases of identical or nearly identical (American) English scripts between regions when identifying languages in game infoboxes. Should we list them both as "English (United States)", simply as "English" or adhere to how they are distinguished in internal data, even when actual differences are minimal?

Proposer: PaperSplash (talk)
Deadline: February 23, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Option 1: List largely identical American English localizations only as "English (United States)"

  1. PaperSplash (talk) My third choice. I mean, when it really is just American English, I can see the argument.

Option 2: List largely identical American English localizations as simply "English"

  1. PaperSplash (talk) My first choice. I think it's the best compromise that makes the most sense, all things considered.
  2. Hewer (talk) I feel like this way is the most straightforward and accurate.
  3. CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) I mean, if it’s just the same thing and no changes (assuming it doesn’t include dates for save files), then I guess this one makes the most sense.
  4. Camwoodstock (talk) Primary option. It's the simplest, it seems reasonable enough, and is applicable across the board; while it isn't exactly in-line with how Nintendo is handling things as of the Switch era, it's reasonable enough and can easily account for pre-Switch cases very well.
  5. Jdtendo (talk) Per all. Especially if that means that we will stop using "English (United States)" for games that use a variety of English that is not specifically American and weren't even released in America such as SMBTLL or Mario & Wario.

Option 3: List both "English (United States)" and "English (United Kingdom)" if distinguished in internal data, otherwise simply list "English"

  1. PaperSplash (talk) My second choice. When internal data classifies them that way, it could make sense to follow suit...
  2. Camwoodstock (talk) Secondary choice, as this seems to be Nintendo's official methodology as of the Switch; however, this exact rationale doesn't account for situations like, say, Mario Party 8 and its infamous recall in the UK, which predates Nintendo's official distinguishing of NA English and UK English from the Switch era, leaving us at a bit of a loss for how to handle it exactly.
  3. CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) This option could also work if date formatting is different despite the game itself using the same script for the US and UK/Australia, like Mario & Luigi: Brothership.

Option 4: Do nothing

  1. CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) I’m actually surprised no one put anything in this option kind of like the title mentions “Do nothing.”

Comments

For better accuracy, "British English" should probably be "Commonwealth English." Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:13, February 8, 2025 (EST)

Noted. Though I decided to focus mainly on the terminology used in game infoboxes, as I realized this wiki's use of the term "British English" is effectively its own can of worms... PaperSplash (talk) 15:35, February 9, 2025 (EST)

I'm a bit confused what this proposal is trying to change. Is it just about terminology used in game infoboxes? Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 11:31, February 9, 2025 (EST)

In hindsight, I realized this proposal was trying to change too many things at once, so I decided to tidy things up and focus on just the game infobox terminology for now. PaperSplash (talk) 15:35, February 9, 2025 (EST)

Realistically even though Canadian English does use British/Commonwealth spelling most of the time, they just get US English spelling in games as Nintendo groups Canada with North America and their English is pretty similar to English in the US, so Nintendo products in Canada are just the same as in the US.

In this case why don’t we also just group American English and Canadian English into one and call it "North American English" even if it’s moreso mainly American English? CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) 10:45, February 11, 2025 (PST)

I'm not quite sure exactly what point you're trying to make here, but per the documentation for the "languages" template, the reason they're labeled the way they currently are in game infoboxes is because they're the primary markets American English and British/Commonwealth English localizations are made for. And for what it's worth, whenever Nintendo specifically labels "North American English" as a selectable language whether in-game or in internal data, they usually refer to the United States or US specifically, not North America/NA as a whole. PaperSplash (talk) 16:27, February 11, 2025 (EST)
I think I’m going with the fact that the English (United States) language for Nintendo is also intended for Canada (and it’s also applied onto the "Japan" and "Hong Kong/Taiwan/South Korea" regions on the Switch) despite just using American English. Kinda like with European French where although it’s just moreso referring to Standard French/French from France, it’s intended for all French-speaking regions in Europe (France, Belgium and Switzerland). CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) 14:58, February 11, 2025 (PST)

If Nintendo is also still adding English (United Kingdom) for their games despite there being almost no differences from the North American English versions aside from date or other words if needed, why do they keep American spelling? Wouldn’t it make more sense for British English spelling to be used even if it’s one of the only differences between English (United States) and English (United Kingdom)? CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) 22:00, February 12, 2025 (PST)

Less work for something ultimately unimportant, I guess? It's not like American spelling is unintelligible to non-Americans. Anyway, what does this have to do with the proposal? Hewer (talk · contributions · edit count) 03:39, February 13, 2025 (EST)
Just came up to me somehow on the topic of American English and British English. Not as big of a problem anyways but just hit me. CarlosYoshiBoi (talk) 7:37, February 12, 2025 (PST)
I don't work for Nintendo nor do I know anyone personally who does, so I can't exactly say for sure. But my best guess is that they simply don't feel like they need to anymore. The main problem with Nintendo not having separate US and UK English localizations before was that certain words considered offensive in the UK but not the US would show up in Nintendo of America's localizations that were also going to be largely reused in Europe, as seen with Mario Party 8 and Super Paper Mario. But now such words appear to get caught and edited out during Nintendo of America's initial English localization pass, like "welcher" in Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga + Bowser's Minions, "bugger" in Super Mario RPG and "bummer" in Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door. Also, it seems that ever since at least Paper Mario: Color Splash or so, Nintendo of America and Nintendo of Europe have been working together more closely on English localizations from the start, as a couple English localization staff at NoE are now often also credited on NoA localizations and vice versa. With any potentially problematic words (regionally or otherwise) now seemingly being addressed much earlier on, there's no longer a really good reason they need to otherwise address differences between American English and British English during the localization process that would justify the extra time, effort and pay. While I'm sure it was appreciated by some, as Hewer mentioned, most people in the UK are used to reading and hearing US English and can understand it just fine (and the same goes vice versa to a lesser extent). It's not like Spanish where many Latin Americans genuinely struggle with understanding Spaniard slang and sometimes vice versa. As for why they still store UK or “EU” English scripts separately from the US ones in internal data despite being them being almost or outright entirely identical now, I think part of that is a remnant of the previous generation where more distinct localizations stored in folders labeled by both region and language was the standard (and it makes it easier for them to port over the more distinct localizations from older games whenever they bother doing so, like Mario Kart 8's for Mario Kart 8 Deluxe). But I think the other reason is to make it easy just in case something actually still needs changing between regions, most commonly the aforementioned date formats. Because that can be legitimately confusing, since they would essentially be backwards otherwise by the other region’s standards. PaperSplash (talk) 19:56, February 14, 2025 (EST)

Make Dark Mode available to everyone

Dark Mode is available to users with an account under preferences but it should be a toggle-able option for all users, even if they're not an editor. Wikipedia allows everyone regardless of role to toggle Dark Mode, so I don't see why this wiki shouldn't follow suit.

Proposer: Pizza Master (talk)
Deadline: February 27, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Support

  1. Pizza Master (talk) per.
  2. Nintendo101 (talk) nice idea, though I would prefer if Light Mode was called "Ground Mode" and Dark Mode was called "Underground Mode" for our site.
  3. Camwoodstock (talk) Wait, theme changes are unavailable to users not logged in? Just, at all? It's not just dark mode, it's any theme, since it's all on Preferences. This feels like something that, if it's possible, it shouldn't even be a proposal, it should just be added outright without vote. This is a very obvious quality-of-life change for users that don't happen to be logged in.
  4. Mushroom Head (talk)Why do we still need to create an account just to not torture your eyes when we use this wiki at night? It literally has zero effect to the users who are always logged in anyways.
  5. Rykitu (talk) Per all
  6. ThePowerPlayer (talk) The fact that this wiki has a Dark Mode and it still isn't available to everyone who uses the site is a crime.

Oppose

Comments

My question is: is it possible to enable this feature for non-logged-in visitors? I'm asking this because Dark Mode is considered a "Gadget", and not a regular MediaWiki feature. They work with JavaScript though, so I suppose it could work in some way (given we have MediaWiki:Common.js and all), but I would still ask Porplemontage (talk) if a toggleable, easily accessible Dark Mode for everyone (including non-users) is possible, if I were you. ArendLogoTransparent.pngrend (talk) (edits) 17:33, February 13, 2025 (EST)

I've asked Porple on his talk page, so we'll see when he answers. Pizza Master (talk) 17:40, February 13, 2025 (EST)
Porple's response on his talk page seems to imply that it might be possible. Pizza Master (talk)

Make about templates on New Super Mario Bros. U courses and New Super Luigi U courses link to each other instead of a disambiguation page, but keep the disambiguation page

"Where is that Star Coin in Jungle of the Giants? Oh, I’ll use Super Mario Wiki. Wait, I’m playing New Super Luigi U so it’s the counterpart Giant Swing-Along. How do I get from the Jungle’s page to Swing Along’s page? The about template should take me to… a disambig?"

What the hypothetical person above said. There’s only two courses with the code Soda Jungle-1, and since Nintendo does not reuse worlds in other games in the same role as worlds, the odds of there ever being a third Soda Jungle-1 are 0%. Given this is the case, if a user does go to a Mario U course when they meant a Luigi U course, having the about template point to a disambiguation page for a whopping two articles means the user has to click two times to reach the corresponding article for Luigi U. While this is a minor issue, there's a whole paragraph in MarioWiki:Naming dedicated to saving readers the clicks when searching for the most obvious topic of a group of topics that share a name. I think that philosophy should be extended to this curiosity.

We should carve out a special exception regarding the About template for this pair of games. About templates for levels from New Super Mario Bros. U and New Super Luigi U simply link to the other article, even though the articles in question do not share a name. The disambiguation page remains, because neither Soda Jungle-1 is more prominent than the other. (It also matches the relationship between Donkey Kong Country levels to Donkey Kong Land levels) As a result, this:

  • "This article is about Jungle of the Giants, a level in New Super Mario Bros. U. For other uses, see Soda Jungle-1."

becomes this:

  • "This article is about Jungle of the Giants, a level in New Super Mario Bros. U. For its New Super Luigi U counterpart, see Giant Swing-Along."

And so on and so forth for all... 90 or so courses.

Proposer: Salmancer (talk)
Deadline: February 28, 2025, 23:59 GMT

Support: Link the corresponding courses together with the about template

  1. Salmancer (talk) I only have 100 seconds to beat the Luigi courses, for the love of hammers save me the click when I put in a Mario course by accident!
  2. ThePowerPlayer (talk) If there are two and only two levels that correspond to the same world name and level number (e.g. "Soda Jungle-1"), then one should just immediately link to the other, just like pages that use the {{distinguish}} template such as Slug and Vine Slime. Seeing the disambiguation page should only be necessary if someone thinks to visit "Soda Jungle-1" first without remembering the level's exact name.
  3. EvieMaybe (talk) one of those changes so obvious you question why they weren't done that way in the first place. per proposal!
  4. Rykitu (talk) Per all
  5. Ahemtoday (talk) Very sensible change to make.

Oppose: Status quo, about templates go to disambiguations.

Comments (Use {{about}} to cross-link Mario/Luigi U courses)

I know I'm on about swapping from "level" to "course". That's for another day, which is why the example doesn't change the word choice. Salmancer (talk) 18:54, February 14, 2025 (EST)

Miscellaneous

None at the moment.

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