MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/43: Difference between revisions
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===Change the way rule number 9 of the proposal system works=== | ===Change the way rule number 9 of the proposal system works=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
So, another proposal to remove this rule was made that was just now vetoed by an administrator. | So, another proposal to remove this rule was made that was just now vetoed by an administrator. | ||
<b>The idea in this proposal is not to remove the rule but instead change the way it works to make it more fair and less objectionable.</b> | <b>The idea in this proposal is not to remove the rule but instead change the way it works to make it more fair and less objectionable.</b> | ||
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===Lessen Crossover Coverage=== | ===Lessen Crossover Coverage=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
According to the current [[MarioWiki:Coverage|Coverage rule]], crossover games like Super Smash Bros. and Mario & Sonic have full coverage. However, this means that we have to cover all of the content from Super Smash Bros., which can cause us to compete with our NIWA Affiliate Smash Wiki. Look at all the Smash content. Shouldn't we focus more on Mario? So I have a proposal: | According to the current [[MarioWiki:Coverage|Coverage rule]], crossover games like Super Smash Bros. and Mario & Sonic have full coverage. However, this means that we have to cover all of the content from Super Smash Bros., which can cause us to compete with our NIWA Affiliate Smash Wiki. Look at all the Smash content. Shouldn't we focus more on Mario? So I have a proposal: | ||
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===Change intro standards for mainspace ex-subpages=== | ===Change intro standards for mainspace ex-subpages=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|1-7|Don't change}} | ||
[http://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/34#Intro_standards_for_subpages See this proposal for some background]. | [http://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/34#Intro_standards_for_subpages See this proposal for some background]. | ||
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===Make a page for Rhythm Tengoku: The Best +=== | ===Make a page for Rhythm Tengoku: The Best +=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|passed|12-0|Create}} | ||
[[MarioWiki:Coverage]] states that pages for "Guest Appearance" games need to be voted on before being created. That rule was broken for the [[Punch-Out!!]] page, but revisiting that is kind of a waste so w/e. | [[MarioWiki:Coverage]] states that pages for "Guest Appearance" games need to be voted on before being created. That rule was broken for the [[Punch-Out!!]] page, but revisiting that is kind of a waste so w/e. | ||
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===Add direct links on star icons for 64/Galaxy/Galaxy 2=== | ===Add direct links on star icons for 64/Galaxy/Galaxy 2=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
I random'd to a SMG galaxy page earlier today, and rolled over the star icon; clicking would have led me to the file page. So, I got an idea: add direct links to their respective stars. This idea came from the map that exists on pages [[Neo Bowser Castle|like this]] which provide a direct page link to that location. What I mean is that clicking on a star icon in the "summary box," as I call it, would take the reader to the section they are looking for, making the need for excessive scrolling nonexistent. | I random'd to a SMG galaxy page earlier today, and rolled over the star icon; clicking would have led me to the file page. So, I got an idea: add direct links to their respective stars. This idea came from the map that exists on pages [[Neo Bowser Castle|like this]] which provide a direct page link to that location. What I mean is that clicking on a star icon in the "summary box," as I call it, would take the reader to the section they are looking for, making the need for excessive scrolling nonexistent. | ||
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===Add 'Edit' Button To Navigation Templates=== | ===Add 'Edit' Button To Navigation Templates=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|passed|19-0}} | ||
Yes, I know, [[MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/32#Add_a_Navbar_to_all_Navigation_Templates|we've already had a proposal about this]], but my views on the subject have changed. Sometimes, when I want to improve on a navigation template, like adding a link or fixing a redirect link, I first need to hit edit of the page I find the navigation template at, find the name of the template, then find the name of that template in the list of templates listed when you're editing the page, and that's just plain tedious. The reason it failed was because "you should have multiple steps away from editing a Navitagion Template", and wording which generally reflected on assuming bad faith in edits. | Yes, I know, [[MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/32#Add_a_Navbar_to_all_Navigation_Templates|we've already had a proposal about this]], but my views on the subject have changed. Sometimes, when I want to improve on a navigation template, like adding a link or fixing a redirect link, I first need to hit edit of the page I find the navigation template at, find the name of the template, then find the name of that template in the list of templates listed when you're editing the page, and that's just plain tedious. The reason it failed was because "you should have multiple steps away from editing a Navitagion Template", and wording which generally reflected on assuming bad faith in edits. | ||
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===Replace "NTSC/PAL version" with "American/European/Australian/Japanese version"=== | ===Replace "NTSC/PAL version" with "American/European/Australian/Japanese version"=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
It has come to my attention that the current terminology we use for regional differences in Mario games (NTSC/PAL) is obsolete. NTSC and PAL are outdated TV standards. It puzzles me even more when people call, say, the European version of a handheld game the "PAL version", because that doesn't even make sense since it's not on a TV. Also, there could be differences between the American and Japanese "NTSC versions" beyond language, and our current terms would be non-indicative. Same with European and Australian "PAL versions". The Australian version isn't always a direct import of the European "PAL version" anyways. Sometimes it's the US version. Sometimes it's different from both of them. I know this might be confusing, but using more region-specific terminology will curb all this confusion.<br> | It has come to my attention that the current terminology we use for regional differences in Mario games (NTSC/PAL) is obsolete. NTSC and PAL are outdated TV standards. It puzzles me even more when people call, say, the European version of a handheld game the "PAL version", because that doesn't even make sense since it's not on a TV. Also, there could be differences between the American and Japanese "NTSC versions" beyond language, and our current terms would be non-indicative. Same with European and Australian "PAL versions". The Australian version isn't always a direct import of the European "PAL version" anyways. Sometimes it's the US version. Sometimes it's different from both of them. I know this might be confusing, but using more region-specific terminology will curb all this confusion.<br> | ||
'''Proposer''': {{User|YoshiCookie}}<br> | '''Proposer''': {{User|YoshiCookie}}<br> | ||
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===Delete Meaningless Quotes=== | ===Delete Meaningless Quotes=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
Yeah I know we went through this before but it was different because it was going to delete entire pages. I'm tweaking that to say keep the pages, but delete meaningless quotes. For example: | Yeah I know we went through this before but it was different because it was going to delete entire pages. I'm tweaking that to say keep the pages, but delete meaningless quotes. For example: | ||
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===Restrict (if not remove) ImageMaps=== | ===Restrict (if not remove) ImageMaps=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|passed|8-1|Restrict usage and rewrite the policy page}} | ||
*Draft: [[User:Bazooka Mario/sandbox# 3]] (check [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=User:Bazooka_Mario/sandbox&oldid=1885921 this revision] for any future reference if you ever need it). | *Draft: [[User:Bazooka Mario/sandbox# 3]] (check [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=User:Bazooka_Mario/sandbox&oldid=1885921 this revision] for any future reference if you ever need it). | ||
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*{{tem|LM lab map}} (see LM mansion map. While LM mansion map might be a navigational aid for those in the middle of a game (although the Mansion isn't exactly a maze either), this one makes even less sense since the Lab is a small place) | *{{tem|LM lab map}} (see LM mansion map. While LM mansion map might be a navigational aid for those in the middle of a game (although the Mansion isn't exactly a maze either), this one makes even less sense since the Lab is a small place) | ||
*{{tem|PDSMBE-map}} (this one is already covered by navigational template. Implementing this into the navigational template would just take up space) | *{{tem|PDSMBE-map}} (this one is already covered by navigational template. Implementing this into the navigational template would just take up space) | ||
*{{tem|NSMB | *{{tem|NSMB World 1 map}} (it might have use, but it's very difficult to implement this template in any other spot in the article, and it looks bad the way it is) | ||
*{{tem|NSMB | *{{tem|NSMB World 3 map}} (see NSMB World 1 map. That ImageTemplates are far from complete is troublesome (for the merits of Image Maps, which are already dubious anyway) but it might be good to restrict usage now before it gets out of hand) | ||
*{{tem|NSMB | *{{tem|NSMB World 5 map}} (see NSMB World 3 map) | ||
*{{tem|NSMB2map}} (see PDSMBE-map) | *{{tem|NSMB2map}} (see PDSMBE-map) | ||
*{{tem|NSMBmap}} (see PDSMBE-map) | *{{tem|NSMBmap}} (see PDSMBE-map) | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|NSMBU map}} (this one is even more confusing, and it has to be ultra-low res for it to look barely presentable, which makes distinguishing between worlds very difficult; very user-hostile image-map that should be removed) | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|P&DSMBE World 1 map}} (already covered in its [[World 1 (Puzzle & Dragons: Super Mario Bros. Edition)|respective article]]. Moreover, its location inside the level infobox makes it impossible to discern it from a normal image without hovering over its specific link points) | ||
*{{tem|M&LBIS Bowser map}} (not great, especially for those who haven't played the game. It might work for [[Bowser's body]], but ideally, it should have labels, but the low-res nature thanks for AlphaDream makes it not worth it. It's still difficult pinpointing each location; case point, it took me, who hasn't played the game (and for those who are in the midst of playing the game, the game already provides labels to each location, if I'm correct) longer than it should to locate Trash Pit. Otherwise, it should be removed from area-specific articles due to its bad placements in those articles.) | *{{tem|M&LBIS Bowser map}} (not great, especially for those who haven't played the game. It might work for [[Bowser's body]], but ideally, it should have labels, but the low-res nature thanks for AlphaDream makes it not worth it. It's still difficult pinpointing each location; case point, it took me, who hasn't played the game (and for those who are in the midst of playing the game, the game already provides labels to each location, if I'm correct) longer than it should to locate Trash Pit. Otherwise, it should be removed from area-specific articles due to its bad placements in those articles.) | ||
*{{tem|M&LBIS map}} (at best, it should stick to only to the game article, [[Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story]]. Even then, it looks inconspicuous and not very useful, and the in-game map probably already has those labels.) | *{{tem|M&LBIS map}} (at best, it should stick to only to the game article, [[Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story]]. Even then, it looks inconspicuous and not very useful, and the in-game map probably already has those labels.) | ||
*{{tem|M&LDT map}} (this one is bad. The low resolution makes it difficult to distinguish between each area, so I think we should just nix this one.) | *{{tem|M&LDT map}} (this one is bad. The low resolution makes it difficult to distinguish between each area, so I think we should just nix this one.) | ||
*{{tem|M&LPIT map}} (it's not horrible, but I question its usefulness the same way I question M&L BIS Overworld Map's utility. I'm aware that in-game, the map itself already provides pointers to where you are, making it even more useless for those in the midst of playing the game.) | *{{tem|M&LPIT map}} (it's not horrible, but I question its usefulness the same way I question M&L BIS Overworld Map's utility. I'm aware that in-game, the map itself already provides pointers to where you are, making it even more useless for those in the midst of playing the game.) | ||
*{{tem|M& | *{{tem|M&LSS map}} (see M&LPIT map. Its in-game map also has labels and makes this one useless when it comes to wiki coverage. This one is particularly difficult to use due to its low-res nature and that certain major areas including [[Beanbean Castle Town]] are difficult to locate. Also, [[Beanbean Outskirts]] is located in a specific spot when it should surround Beanbean Castle, but I suppose that's impossible with this system. So, remove it.) | ||
*{{tem|PM | *{{tem|PM map}} (Not good. Its low-res nature makes it difficult to use, as with most Image Map templates. It would work if it were bigger and had labels. Its placement in articles is just as miserable as in most Image Map templates. | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|PMTTYD map}} (again, it's very difficult to distinguish between places without squinting) | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|SMRPG map}} It would probably work for general overhead articles, but only if it actually looks different from other images. It's still difficult to use since some places are bordering microscopic. | ||
*{{tem|SMW2YI Map}} Utterly pointless (not to mention gaudy in ''[[Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island]]'', and when you have screenshots that have this stuff in it, like in [[World 6 (Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island)]], it's also confusing. | *{{tem|SMW2YI Map}} Utterly pointless (not to mention gaudy in ''[[Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island]]'', and when you have screenshots that have this stuff in it, like in [[World 6 (Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island)]], it's also confusing. | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|SMW map}} It might work, but its current implementation is difficult to use and requires a microscope. It still needs to be confined to overview articles rather than area-specific articles. | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|SMW map2}} See SMW map; this one looks identical. | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|SPP map}} It might work, but confine it to general overview articles ([[Vibe Island]] in this case) rather than slapping it everywhere. It still needs to be placed in a better spot, but the low-res nature of it makes it difficult for me to think of a method where it doesn't resemble a plain image. | ||
*{{tem|WL4 | *{{tem|WL4 map}} Pointless. Names are a good indicator of each place. Actually, this applies to most areas in most games. | ||
*{{tem|YIDS Map}} Utterly pointless. | *{{tem|YIDS Map}} Utterly pointless. | ||
*{{tem|YISMA3 Map}} Utterly pointless. | *{{tem|YISMA3 Map}} Utterly pointless. | ||
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*{{tem|LM mansion map}} - '''Keep''': it'd be good for [[Luigi's Mansion (location)]] and ''[[Luigi's Mansion]]''. But I'd suggest redesigning it to that all 5 levels are vertically arranged (rather than two columns), with a bit of blank space between each as buffers so that it's clearer that they're different floors. | *{{tem|LM mansion map}} - '''Keep''': it'd be good for [[Luigi's Mansion (location)]] and ''[[Luigi's Mansion]]''. But I'd suggest redesigning it to that all 5 levels are vertically arranged (rather than two columns), with a bit of blank space between each as buffers so that it's clearer that they're different floors. | ||
*{{tem|LM lab map}}, {{tem|WL4 | *{{tem|LM lab map}}, {{tem|WL4 map}} - '''Scrap''': too small to be worth-while. | ||
*{{tem|PDSMBE-map}}}}, {{tem|NSMB2map}}, {{tem|NSMBmap}}, {{tem|SMW2YI Map}}, {{tem|YIDS Map}}, {{tem|YISMA3 Map}} - '''Scrap''': the labels are in the images already; just have the regular images on the pages rather than all the trouble of a template. | *{{tem|PDSMBE-map}}}}, {{tem|NSMB2map}}, {{tem|NSMBmap}}, {{tem|SMW2YI Map}}, {{tem|YIDS Map}}, {{tem|YISMA3 Map}} - '''Scrap''': the labels are in the images already; just have the regular images on the pages rather than all the trouble of a template. | ||
*{{tem|NSMB | *{{tem|NSMB World 1 map}}, {{tem|NSMB World 3 map}}, {{tem|P&DSMBE World 1 map}} - '''Keep''': since there's branching pathways it's not ''completely'' intuitive what the numbers always are, and provided all the worlds get them, they could be used in both those articles in the infoboxes (''P&D'' is fine but the ''NSMB'' infobox needs to be wider to be legible) and the game pages (i.e. stacked in the "Worlds" sections next to the descriptions, rather than just single world examples). | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|NSMBU map}}, {{tem|M&LBIS map}}, {{tem|M&LDT map}}, {{tem|M&LPIT map}}, {{tem|M&LSS map}}, {{tem|PM map}}, {{tem|PMTTYD map}}, {{tem|SMRPG map}}, {{tem|SMW map}}, {{tem|SPP map}} - '''Keep''': not all the area names are intuitive, and the maps will fit on the game and location pages well enough (in place of mere images, and at large-enough sizes, not scaled down). The only issue is that larger areas should have more than one tiny clickable area (e.g. add multiple link sites for Beanbean Outskirts, and all the ''NSMBU'' areas, etc.). | ||
*{{tem|M&LBIS Bowser map}} - '''Keep''': it's good for [[Bowser's body]] and the ''M&L3'' game article since then you can match up the locations to the nodes (otherwise long windy directions are needed since it's not intuitive at all a lot of the time; that'd be fine for individual location articles, but it'd be too much all in one place). | *{{tem|M&LBIS Bowser map}} - '''Keep''': it's good for [[Bowser's body]] and the ''M&L3'' game article since then you can match up the locations to the nodes (otherwise long windy directions are needed since it's not intuitive at all a lot of the time; that'd be fine for individual location articles, but it'd be too much all in one place). | ||
*{{tem| | *{{tem|SMW map2}} - '''Scrap''': duplicate of {{tem|SMW map}} | ||
'''Overall thoughts''': The overworld maps are good for game and place articles ([[Beanbean Kingdom]], etc.), and the world-specific maps are good for the world articles and the game articles, as long as all the worlds have them. When a template is used on an article, it should be used in place of a mere image of the map; this will often mean putting the template in the infobox, which should be fine as long as the infoboxes aren't obscenely wide (but most templates are only about 400 px or less wide, which would be fine for an infobox, and should be clear enough to be readable and useable). If the names of the places are right there in the level/world select screens, no template's necessary to tell readers what place is what. - {{User|Walkazo}} 16:45, 7 September 2015 (EDT) | '''Overall thoughts''': The overworld maps are good for game and place articles ([[Beanbean Kingdom]], etc.), and the world-specific maps are good for the world articles and the game articles, as long as all the worlds have them. When a template is used on an article, it should be used in place of a mere image of the map; this will often mean putting the template in the infobox, which should be fine as long as the infoboxes aren't obscenely wide (but most templates are only about 400 px or less wide, which would be fine for an infobox, and should be clear enough to be readable and useable). If the names of the places are right there in the level/world select screens, no template's necessary to tell readers what place is what. - {{User|Walkazo}} 16:45, 7 September 2015 (EDT) | ||
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::::Cool. I [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=User%3AWalkazo%2FEssays&diff=1886936&oldid=1885458 updated my page to better explain the default link stuff]), and also made the "no fan images" part of the main point rather than a subpoint unto itself (but I think it should still be explicitly said to make absolutely sure people get the point). As for the size/clarity one, the subpoint gives examples already, so more aren't necessary. EDIT: I also made a few grammar tweaks on top of your changes, [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=User%3AWalkazo%2FEssays&diff=1886945&oldid=1886941 shown here]. - {{User|Walkazo}} 17:06, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | ::::Cool. I [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=User%3AWalkazo%2FEssays&diff=1886936&oldid=1885458 updated my page to better explain the default link stuff]), and also made the "no fan images" part of the main point rather than a subpoint unto itself (but I think it should still be explicitly said to make absolutely sure people get the point). As for the size/clarity one, the subpoint gives examples already, so more aren't necessary. EDIT: I also made a few grammar tweaks on top of your changes, [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=User%3AWalkazo%2FEssays&diff=1886945&oldid=1886941 shown here]. - {{User|Walkazo}} 17:06, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | ||
:::::That's what I thought the extra bullet point was meant to hammer in readers, but I think how you merged it is a better idea. One more statement that isn't made very clear to me is the one that starts with "Locations that are widespread in the map[...]". I'm not sure why I haven't commented on this earlier, but later reading it, I kind of go "huh?". {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 17:43, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | :::::That's what I thought the extra bullet point was meant to hammer in readers, but I think how you merged it is a better idea. One more statement that isn't made very clear to me is the one that starts with "Locations that are widespread in the map[...]". I'm not sure why I haven't commented on this earlier, but later reading it, I kind of go "huh?". {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 17:43, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | ||
::::::Like how in {{tem| | ::::::Like how in {{tem|NSMBU map}}, all the areas are pretty large, yet once the text disappears after you hover-over part of the area, it doesn't appear again as you waver the mouse around the rest of the large area - so I feel like in these cases, it'd be good to break the areas into smaller chunks so the text can come up more than once and show it's all the same place. Plus, as been mentioned before, places like the Beanbean Outskirts are all around the castle, but only have a link underneath in {{tem|M&LSS map}}, so multiple links would be good for those as well. - {{User|Walkazo}} 18:05, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | ||
:::::::Beanbean Outskirts is a good example to provide for this then. I couldn't find the link for it myself, so I speak from personal experience. Thanks for the clarification! {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 18:26, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | :::::::Beanbean Outskirts is a good example to provide for this then. I couldn't find the link for it myself, so I speak from personal experience. Thanks for the clarification! {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 18:26, 12 September 2015 (EDT) | ||
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===Add "bugs and" or "and bugs" to "List of glitches in"=== | ===Add "bugs and" or "and bugs" to "List of glitches in"=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|1-0-5|Don't change}} | ||
First, my reasoning is '''bugs and glitches are not the same.''' A bug is a minor glitch (like a short-lived audio glitch, which would be considered a bug according to this proposal), whereas a full-blown glitch is something that is longterm, causes a game to freeze, and so on and so forth. For example: [[List of Super Mario 64 DS glitches#Magnetic Forces|this is what would be considered a bug,]] but [[List of Super Mario Sunshine glitches#Game Resets Itself|this would be a full-blown glitch.]] | First, my reasoning is '''bugs and glitches are not the same.''' A bug is a minor glitch (like a short-lived audio glitch, which would be considered a bug according to this proposal), whereas a full-blown glitch is something that is longterm, causes a game to freeze, and so on and so forth. For example: [[List of Super Mario 64 DS glitches#Magnetic Forces|this is what would be considered a bug,]] but [[List of Super Mario Sunshine glitches#Game Resets Itself|this would be a full-blown glitch.]] | ||
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===MarioWiki:Quotes=== | ===MarioWiki:Quotes=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
[[User:Roy Koopa/Draft|Everything is explained here.]] | [[User:Roy Koopa/Draft|Everything is explained here.]] | ||
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===Add a 3D render licensing template=== | ===Add a 3D render licensing template=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|passed|9-0|create}} | ||
[http://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/36#Make_game-model_template We have this proposal] for earlier reference. It failed mainly because of legal redundancy. I understand that {{tem|game-sprite}} already covers this issue. Currently, however, 3D renders such as [[:File:Fiery Metal Mario Model.png|this]], [[:File:Giga Bowser SSBB Model.png|this]], [[:File:BitsizeDaisyMP8.png|this]], [[:File:BabyMarioBabyLuigiDifferences.png|this]], [[:File:SMGdiskflower.png|this]] and [[:File:MLNPC.PNG|this]] are lumped with sprites in [[:Category:Game sprites|this category]]. This is not good when [[MarioWiki:Good writing#Frequently misused terms|one of our wiki policies]] already took pains to distinguish between what's a sprite (including pre-rendered sprites) and a live rendered model. So, the legal argument is not a valid point against creating a template and a category, and it fails to address a more immediate problem, which is an organizational one, in this wiki. This proposal aims to remove this disparity by including a licensing template called {{tem|game-3Drender}} and its content will look like this (embedded categories excluded): | [http://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/36#Make_game-model_template We have this proposal] for earlier reference. It failed mainly because of legal redundancy. I understand that {{tem|game-sprite}} already covers this issue. Currently, however, 3D renders such as [[:File:Fiery Metal Mario Model.png|this]], [[:File:Giga Bowser SSBB Model.png|this]], [[:File:BitsizeDaisyMP8.png|this]], [[:File:BabyMarioBabyLuigiDifferences.png|this]], [[:File:SMGdiskflower.png|this]] and [[:File:MLNPC.PNG|this]] are lumped with sprites in [[:Category:Game sprites|this category]]. This is not good when [[MarioWiki:Good writing#Frequently misused terms|one of our wiki policies]] already took pains to distinguish between what's a sprite (including pre-rendered sprites) and a live rendered model. So, the legal argument is not a valid point against creating a template and a category, and it fails to address a more immediate problem, which is an organizational one, in this wiki. This proposal aims to remove this disparity by including a licensing template called {{tem|game-3Drender}} and its content will look like this (embedded categories excluded): | ||
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===Make location infoboxes more appropriate for buildings as well=== | ===Make location infoboxes more appropriate for buildings as well=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|3-7|Don't change}} | ||
I propose us to make [[Template:Location infobox|location infoboxes]] more fitting to articles on buildings. That is because the current one uses the terms ''greater location'', ''ruler'' and ''inhabitants'', which seem more suitable/common for regions. We could create a switch to a "building" option, that would switch: | I propose us to make [[Template:Location infobox|location infoboxes]] more fitting to articles on buildings. That is because the current one uses the terms ''greater location'', ''ruler'' and ''inhabitants'', which seem more suitable/common for regions. We could create a switch to a "building" option, that would switch: | ||
*''Greater location'' to ''Location''; | *''Greater location'' to ''Location''; | ||
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===Allow IPs to mark minor edits=== | ===Allow IPs to mark minor edits=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|vetoed}} | ||
Lately IPs like the one that comes around and fixes headers (I cant think of the numbers off the top of my head) have been making edits that we would consider minor, but there is no minor edits button for IPs. I think we should add one. | Lately IPs like the one that comes around and fixes headers (I cant think of the numbers off the top of my head) have been making edits that we would consider minor, but there is no minor edits button for IPs. I think we should add one. | ||
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===Create Template: Unfinished=== | ===Create Template: Unfinished=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
While going through a few random pages recently, I noticed that many unfinished pages have the Construction template, so I decided to check the page history on them. Oddly enough, many of these supposedly "under construction" pages haven't been edited for ''years.'' | While going through a few random pages recently, I noticed that many unfinished pages have the Construction template, so I decided to check the page history on them. Oddly enough, many of these supposedly "under construction" pages haven't been edited for ''years.'' | ||
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<div class="notice-template" style="text-align:justify;background:#FC5;margin:.5em 2%;padding:0 1em;border:1px solid #f22;color:black"> | <div class="notice-template" style="text-align:justify;background:#FC5;margin:.5em 2%;padding:0 1em;border:1px solid #f22;color:black"> | ||
This {{#if: {{{section|}}}|section|article}} is '''unfinished'''. Please try adding as much {{{1|information}}} as you can to complete this page. | This {{#if: {{{section|}}}|section|article}} is '''unfinished'''. Please try adding as much {{{1|information}}} as you can to complete this page. | ||
</div><includeonly>[[Category:Articles under construction | </div><includeonly>[[Category:Articles under construction]]</includeonly><noinclude> | ||
'''Proposer''': {{User|Andymii}}<br> | '''Proposer''': {{User|Andymii}}<br> | ||
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===Do not consider ports for an article's most recent name=== | ===Do not consider ports for an article's most recent name=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|canceled}} | ||
At the moment, there are a few articles that have had their names changed due to rereleases, including ''[[Super Mario Bros. 3]]''{{'}}s worlds, which was put into place due to [[Talk:Dark_Land#Revert_the_SMB3_worlds_to_their_.22Land.22_names|a proposal held on a single talk page]], and [[Spiky Gloomba]] (to Spiked Gloomba), which was put into place after citing SMB3 as precedence (there are likely other examples, but I can't recall them at the moment). To use the Gloomba as an example, it was "Spiked" in ''[[Paper Mario]]'', but was renamed to "Spik'''''y'''''" in ''[[Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door]]'', and the article followed suite. However, with the [[Virtual Console]] release of ''Paper Mario'', the article changed names once again. The logic behind it is that, since the re-release is technically the most recent game, the names of our articles should reflect that. I don't agree with that. | At the moment, there are a few articles that have had their names changed due to rereleases, including ''[[Super Mario Bros. 3]]''{{'}}s worlds, which was put into place due to [[Talk:Dark_Land#Revert_the_SMB3_worlds_to_their_.22Land.22_names|a proposal held on a single talk page]], and [[Spiky Gloomba]] (to Spiked Gloomba), which was put into place after citing SMB3 as precedence (there are likely other examples, but I can't recall them at the moment). To use the Gloomba as an example, it was "Spiked" in ''[[Paper Mario]]'', but was renamed to "Spik'''''y'''''" in ''[[Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door]]'', and the article followed suite. However, with the [[Virtual Console]] release of ''Paper Mario'', the article changed names once again. The logic behind it is that, since the re-release is technically the most recent game, the names of our articles should reflect that. I don't agree with that. | ||
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::::So maybe the proposal's title should change a bit just for easier reference in the future? Because I think it confused me for a bit. {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 16:29, 23 October 2015 (EDT) | ::::So maybe the proposal's title should change a bit just for easier reference in the future? Because I think it confused me for a bit. {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 16:29, 23 October 2015 (EDT) | ||
:Honestly, this is probably the sort of thing that should be done case-by-case rather than indiscriminately across the board. The ''Super Mario Land'' enemy names on Virtual Console would be preferable to the average English-speaker over the original ones since the opportunity was taken to actually localize. However, I'd raise concerns over the other examples mentioned in this proposal: for [[Spiked Gloomba|Spik''y'' G'''l'''oomba]], [[Spiked Goomba|Spik''ed'' Goomba]] ([[Hyper Spiky Goomba|plus]] [[Dark Spiked Goomba|derivatives]]) would simply be the more recurring/consistent spelling overall, having so far been used in two of the ''Paper Mario'' games over the odd mid one out, so it can be easily predicted that "Spiked" will be used over "Spiky" if it makes another appearance. Regarding the ''Super Mario Bros. 3'' Land names: 1) Pipe Land is referenced over Pipe Maze in both the North American and European versions of the ''Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS'' / ''Wii U'' [http://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_SSB4_trophies_%28Super_Mario_Bros._series%29#Pipes Pipe trophy] (and keep in mind that a few were adjusted between releases such as [http://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_SSB4_trophies_(Super_Mario_Bros._series)#Larry Larry]), so the idea that they are outright ignored in modern titles solely due to preservation purposes doesn't quite work, 2) the fact of the matter is, the Land names were (and continue to be) the most common versions for more generations of ''Mario'' fans since any re-releases of ''All-Stars'' & ''Advance 4'' are noticeably rarer than the originals, and has a more "universal" appeal over the unique names since they were used throughout a broader range of various media and supplemental materials, and 3) to go off on that - and I realize this might just be personal preference - but "[[Bowser's Castle (World)]]" and "[[Castle of Koopa]]" were always incredibly ill-fitting names, especially considering most of the stages take place outside the ''actual'' final castle and it's supposed to be applied to an entire kingdom, so it would be awkward to, say, direct ''The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3'' readers to another "Bowser's Castle" article. In the end, it shouldn't really matter which names are used for the article titles as long as everything is still fully acknowledged within the article itself, but I'd argue that the "newer" names for these particular cases will most likely form a strange disconnect or confusion with certain subjects more than the current arrangement. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 12:00, 25 October 2015 (EDT) | :Honestly, this is probably the sort of thing that should be done case-by-case rather than indiscriminately across the board. The ''Super Mario Land'' enemy names on Virtual Console would be preferable to the average English-speaker over the original ones since the opportunity was taken to actually localize. However, I'd raise concerns over the other examples mentioned in this proposal: for [[Spiked Gloomba|Spik''y'' G'''l'''oomba]], [[Spiked Goomba|Spik''ed'' Goomba]] ([[Hyper Spiky Goomba|plus]] [[Dark Spiked Goomba|derivatives]]) would simply be the more recurring/consistent spelling overall, having so far been used in two of the ''Paper Mario'' games over the odd mid one out, so it can be easily predicted that "Spiked" will be used over "Spiky" if it makes another appearance. Regarding the ''Super Mario Bros. 3'' Land names: 1) Pipe Land is referenced over Pipe Maze in both the North American and European versions of the ''Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS'' / ''Wii U'' [http://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_SSB4_trophies_%28Super_Mario_Bros._series%29#Pipes Pipe trophy] (and keep in mind that a few were adjusted between releases such as [http://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_SSB4_trophies_(Super_Mario_Bros._series)#Larry Larry]), so the idea that they are outright ignored in modern titles solely due to preservation purposes doesn't quite work, 2) the fact of the matter is, the Land names were (and continue to be) the most common versions for more generations of ''Mario'' fans since any re-releases of ''All-Stars'' & ''Advance 4'' are noticeably rarer than the originals, and has a more "universal" appeal over the unique names since they were used throughout a broader range of various media and supplemental materials, and 3) to go off on that - and I realize this might just be personal preference - but "[[Bowser's Castle (World)]]" and "[[Castle of Koopa]]" were always incredibly ill-fitting names, especially considering most of the stages take place outside the ''actual'' final castle and it's supposed to be applied to an entire kingdom, so it would be awkward to, say, direct ''The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3'' readers to another "Bowser's Castle" article. In the end, it shouldn't really matter which names are used for the article titles as long as everything is still fully acknowledged within the article itself, but I'd argue that the "newer" names for these particular cases will most likely form a strange disconnect or confusion with certain subjects more than the current arrangement. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 12:00, 25 October 2015 (EDT) | ||
::Although I still stand by the idea that we shouldn't mindlessly rename our pages based on the latest remake names, having looked at the horrible name history a bit more, I actually agree that it'd make more sense to leave the ''SMB3'' pages where they are... Both the "__ Land" and "creative" names [[Super_Mario_Bros._3#Textual_changes|occurred in different versions]] [https://tcrf.net/Super_Mario_Bros._3/Version_differences#Area_names of the NES game itself] - "creative" names in the first Japanese/NA versions, "Land" in the second NA and International versions, and "Land" consistently in all the manuals. ''SMAS'' changed them back to the "creative" names and ''SMA4'' (and ''SMASLE'' afaik) copied ''SMAS'', none of them having place names mentioned in the manuals, whereas the VC release copied the second, "Land", version of the NES game. The cartoon also used the "Land" names except "Desert Hill", for some reason, and finally, the use of "Pipe Land" in ''SSB4'' furthermore lends strength to the call to use the "Land" names, since this is out ''only'' modern non-remake mention of any of the names afaik (pity there's only the one name out of eight - it'd make our lives so much easier otherwise). While I still think it makes sense to exclude antiquated names in remakes that are preserved solely for authenticity, seeing as the ''SMB3'' names' history are so muddled, to the point where even the original game had two versions, I'd say the choice to use the 2nd version's "Land" names for the VC release over the 1st version's "creative" names is arguably an active one worth reflecting, especially considering the ''SSB4'' "Pipe Land" name drop (whereas ''SMASLE'' '''can''' be ignored as a carbon copy, which actually takes ammo away from the "creative" name camp). Furthermore, in the main how-to section of [[MarioWiki:Naming#Naming_an_article| | ::Although I still stand by the idea that we shouldn't mindlessly rename our pages based on the latest remake names, having looked at the horrible name history a bit more, I actually agree that it'd make more sense to leave the ''SMB3'' pages where they are... Both the "__ Land" and "creative" names [[Super_Mario_Bros._3#Textual_changes|occurred in different versions]] [https://tcrf.net/Super_Mario_Bros._3/Version_differences#Area_names of the NES game itself] - "creative" names in the first Japanese/NA versions, "Land" in the second NA and International versions, and "Land" consistently in all the manuals. ''SMAS'' changed them back to the "creative" names and ''SMA4'' (and ''SMASLE'' afaik) copied ''SMAS'', none of them having place names mentioned in the manuals, whereas the VC release copied the second, "Land", version of the NES game. The cartoon also used the "Land" names except "Desert Hill", for some reason, and finally, the use of "Pipe Land" in ''SSB4'' furthermore lends strength to the call to use the "Land" names, since this is out ''only'' modern non-remake mention of any of the names afaik (pity there's only the one name out of eight - it'd make our lives so much easier otherwise). While I still think it makes sense to exclude antiquated names in remakes that are preserved solely for authenticity, seeing as the ''SMB3'' names' history are so muddled, to the point where even the original game had two versions, I'd say the choice to use the 2nd version's "Land" names for the VC release over the 1st version's "creative" names is arguably an active one worth reflecting, especially considering the ''SSB4'' "Pipe Land" name drop (whereas ''SMASLE'' '''can''' be ignored as a carbon copy, which actually takes ammo away from the "creative" name camp). Furthermore, in the main how-to section of [[MarioWiki:Naming#Naming_an_article|SMW:Naming]], it emphasizes, twice, that the "''most commonly used''" name is what we go with, and the "Land" names are arguably the more common ones (even without the VC release), when considering regional differences, manuals, and other details like the inconsistencies of the non-"Dark Land" and non-"Water Land" names undermining the "creative" name front. And even going by a "latest name" strategy alone, "Pipe Land" would have to stay put no matter what thanks to ''SSB4'', so for consistency, it'd be better to leave the rest alone too (same reason why we wouldn't rename "Desert Land" to "Desert Hill" despite the cartoon name tipping the scales more in that name's favour: it should be a package deal if we can help it, and we can). Aaaaand as for the Goomba stuff, no matter what we do, there will be inconsistencies thanks to the TTYD-only "Spiky" enemies and PM/SPM "Spiked" ones, so I'd say the latest original game names ''should'' take precedence over the remakes, whatever those names may be, as per the proposal. But yeah, as with pretty much all name bsns, one size rarely fits everything, so downplaying remakes should only be one element in the overall discussion. But hopefully, most situations won't be as convoluted as ''SMB3'' world names... - {{User|Walkazo}} | ||
:::I'll admit to disagreeing with some of the points both of you have brought up, but the overall logic is valid enough. It's a bit too late for me to modify the proposal, however, and it's unlikely that enough of the supporters will notice this before the deadline. Due to just how muddled the whole issue is, I'd be in favor of cancelling the proposal and setting up shop on the forums in order to analyse everything on a case-by-case basis. Would that be possible? {{User:Time Turner/sig}} | :::I'll admit to disagreeing with some of the points both of you have brought up, but the overall logic is valid enough. It's a bit too late for me to modify the proposal, however, and it's unlikely that enough of the supporters will notice this before the deadline. Due to just how muddled the whole issue is, I'd be in favor of cancelling the proposal and setting up shop on the forums in order to analyse everything on a case-by-case basis. Would that be possible? {{User:Time Turner/sig}} | ||
::::Yep, that works, and I think it's the right decision. Something being added to [[MarioWiki:Naming#Name_changes]] about old named reappearing in remakes not getting automatically considered the "newest name" and overruling names released in the interim would still be a good idea, I think. But that can be discussed and agreed upon on the forums too. - {{User|Walkazo}} | ::::Yep, that works, and I think it's the right decision. Something being added to [[MarioWiki:Naming#Name_changes]] about old named reappearing in remakes not getting automatically considered the "newest name" and overruling names released in the interim would still be a good idea, I think. But that can be discussed and agreed upon on the forums too. - {{User|Walkazo}} | ||
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===Template:TooManyImages=== | ===Template:TooManyImages=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|1-8|Don't create template}} | ||
Long story short, this is for galleries that are stuffed full of redundant pix that need a lot of trimming. I have two possible wordings in mind: <br> | Long story short, this is for galleries that are stuffed full of redundant pix that need a lot of trimming. I have two possible wordings in mind: <br> | ||
<div class="notice-template" style="text-align:justify;background:#FC5;margin:.5em 2%;padding:0 1em;border:1px solid #f22;color:black"> | <div class="notice-template" style="text-align:justify;background:#FC5;margin:.5em 2%;padding:0 1em;border:1px solid #f22;color:black"> | ||
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===Names in Other Languages organization for ''Mario'' episodes=== | ===Names in Other Languages organization for ''Mario'' episodes=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|1-6|Keep template as it is}} | ||
I've been getting a little tired of seeing the Latin American and Spanish names of ''Mario'' episodes in one row, like this: | I've been getting a little tired of seeing the Latin American and Spanish names of ''Mario'' episodes in one row, like this: | ||
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===Replace ''Remix'' with ''Remake'' on Level Articles=== | ===Replace ''Remix'' with ''Remake'' on Level Articles=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|1-6|Do not swap terms}} | ||
Ive been using this for all the Green Stars and stamps on my Mario 3D World, and I've noticed a lot of the World Mushroom/Flower levels have notes that say "a remix of Level X-Y: Z." For example, [[Towering Sunshine Seaside|this article]] has a note that says "A remix of World 5-1: [[Sunshine Seaside]]." The thing is, dictionary.com says the definition of remix as a noun is "A remixed recording." Are levels recordings? No. Therefore, we are using it the wrong way. Because of this, I believe we should change all uses of ''remix'' (which will mostly be in 3D Land/World articles) to ''remake''. If you have another idea for wording, let me know. | Ive been using this for all the Green Stars and stamps on my Mario 3D World, and I've noticed a lot of the World Mushroom/Flower levels have notes that say "a remix of Level X-Y: Z." For example, [[Towering Sunshine Seaside|this article]] has a note that says "A remix of World 5-1: [[Sunshine Seaside]]." The thing is, dictionary.com says the definition of remix as a noun is "A remixed recording." Are levels recordings? No. Therefore, we are using it the wrong way. Because of this, I believe we should change all uses of ''remix'' (which will mostly be in 3D Land/World articles) to ''remake''. If you have another idea for wording, let me know. | ||
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===Create a suggestion template=== | ===Create a suggestion template=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|3-7|Do not create a suggestion template}} | ||
I propose the creation of a suggestion template, which would serve to prevent the creation of unnecessary proposal (like make a edit change, add something to the wiki), which is not essentially required to go through the proposal systems. With the addition of this template, users who want to add a suggestion of adding something to the wiki without necessarily go through a proposal could use it and make a general request to the users and it could prevent formatting a proposal via the proposal system that frankly serve no purpose. What do you think about it? | I propose the creation of a suggestion template, which would serve to prevent the creation of unnecessary proposal (like make a edit change, add something to the wiki), which is not essentially required to go through the proposal systems. With the addition of this template, users who want to add a suggestion of adding something to the wiki without necessarily go through a proposal could use it and make a general request to the users and it could prevent formatting a proposal via the proposal system that frankly serve no purpose. What do you think about it? | ||
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===Create an "Experienced User" panel=== | ===Create an "Experienced User" panel=== | ||
{{ | {{Proposal outcome|failed|13-1}} | ||
This is an idea I've wanted to carry out for a while: New users tend to ask a lot of questions, so I thought there should be an experienced user rank. So I PMed Steve, and he said it would be better as a panel in which people nominate themselves (or others) for this panel. There would be some requirements: | This is an idea I've wanted to carry out for a while: New users tend to ask a lot of questions, so I thought there should be an experienced user rank. So I PMed Steve, and he said it would be better as a panel in which people nominate themselves (or others) for this panel. There would be some requirements: | ||
#The user must have been a user for at least three years. | #The user must have been a user for at least three years. |
Latest revision as of 16:30, May 31, 2024
Change the way rule number 9 of the proposal system workscanceled by proposer
I think that the rule could use a few changes that could keep much of its original intent intact while making it more accurate towards what the majority of users want. So I propose we replace that rule with this new rule:
I think the changed rule would be better than both the original rule and just flat out deleting the rule for the following reasons:
Proposer: Kart Player 2011 (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsWait, in proposals with three choices or more, if their deadlines are extended, do you propose removing the option with the least amount of votes? That sounds so convoluted. Even the wording in that is hard to read. The bolded part is one sentence! Anyhow, if there are two change options clashing and rivaling each other in terms of votes, proceeding with one change or the other will displease a sizeable group and that's not democratic. Having the proposal fail after breaking through several extended deadlines definitely means "no consensus has been reached, so no changes will be made". It's a failsafe measure at this point, and it gives the opportunity for further discussion and refining the proposal further. Not to mention, it wears on people's patience to see a proposal get extended, like, three times, so casting it off is good, elaborated previously. In super drawn-out proposals, it's safer to kill them eventually than to take questionable and controversial action even if the outcome is dead tied. It's the reason FAs have a time limit, too. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 14:17, 21 June 2015 (EDT) @Ghost Jam: I tried my best to remove the objectionable pieces of the other proposal that caused it to be vetoed and take into consideration things said by Walkazo in my discussion with her in the other proposal to make it not fall into any objections that she made there. @Bazooka Mario, I specifically said in the proposal that the do nothing option would stay to the final two no matter what and before then, only options suggesting change could be removed so if there is a case of two change options clashing and rivaling each other in terms of votes, and people voting for one of the changes would rather have nothing done, they will always have the chance to just move their votes towards doing nothing. - Kart Player 2011 (talk) @Walkazo, just veto it now then in this case to get it over with. I tried my best to fix the problems that got the other proposal vetoed but I guess in this case, I didn't do enough so I guess you should just veto this proposal now. I'll talk about it more with you in user talk page if I feel the need to. I'm sorry for my mistake. - Kart Player 2011 (talk)
Lessen Crossover Coveragecanceled by proposer
Proposer: SeanWheeler (talk) Support
Oppose
Revise another wayCommentsSo how do you suggest those percentages are calculated..? --Glowsquid (talk) 23:22, 22 June 2015 (EDT)
@SeanWheeler, SmashWiki also is very technical about the Smash content. They have tier lists, tourneys, professional smash players, project m, advanced techniques, how viable a character is...etc. If like to learn what wave-dashing, star kos, wall of pains, etc. are, then SmashWiki covers it very well. We don't go that far. We cover like only the official thingamabobs. Ray Trace(T|C) 03:37, 23 June 2015 (EDT)
"Shouldn't we focus more on Mario?" is a moot point. 5 Smash Bros. games and 9 Mario & Sonic games out of the hundreds of other pure Mario games. -- Too Bad! Waluigi Time! 16:06, 23 June 2015 (EDT)
Change intro standards for mainspace ex-subpagesDon't change 1-7 This proposal seems a bit minor, but as a Mario Wiki, we strive to inform, not point out the obvious. That being said, the intros for the gallery space and other subpages are very unprofessional, as their only purpose, aside from stating the obvious, serves as filler text (seriously, one big reason we have such text is that "blank space is kind of an eyesore"). The most useful thing it does is provide a link to its main article. Now, I recall proposing replacing the intro text and turning gallery space into subspace, but I wasn't aware that it would violate our subpages policy, and I'm not willing to drastically alter an established policy just for the sake of changing the intro text a bit. One solution is to replace the current intros with a simple {{main}}. As for related ex-subpages, we can use {{about}}. about, however, is less than ideal, but there's nothing in the way of creating a new template that link to related ex-subpages without saying that a page of images of Mario is a page of images of Mario. Not only does it seem more professional, it simplifies our introductions so users don't have to continuously refer to a policy that specifically outlines how each intro should be worded. Besides, our Subpages Policy is outdated, since galleries now include a few media files (see Baby Mario). Anyway, another solution is to create an entirely new template which focuses on ex-subpages and links to related ex-subpages only when the related parameters are used. This would make it a combination of {{main}} and {{about}}, but altering it to make it more presentable. The new template would be something like this: Main article: Mario Further suggestions and alterations to this template would be appreciated, as it's only a prototype and I suppose more seasoned template makers can have a hand on this, provided they support, of course. So, to sum it up, the advantages of using a template would be replacing filler text with a more useful and simple link, and it would simplify our Subpages Policy, the intro aspect. Finally, this applies to mainly the mainspace ex-subpages, which is what this whole Subspaces Policy is about in the first place. Of course, exceptions apply, but if they're rare and not intrusive, the proposed changes wouldn't undermine the wiki. Proposer: Bazooka Mario (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsHuh, I'd expect someone to say "there's no problem with it, so no change". I think a little change goes some way, though, and my proposal is changing just for the sake of concision and trimming out filler text. As for the copy-paste thing, it's still more of a hassle to access these pages to copy-paste them than inputting a template that generates automated text anyhow. I really don't find those intro texts necessary other than providing a link to the main page, hence this proposal. It's not "fixing what isn't broken", it's improving/refining what we have right now, even if "readers won't care anyway". It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 22:02, 23 June 2015 (EDT) Make a page for Rhythm Tengoku: The Best +Create 12-0 Anyway, Rhythm Tengoku: The Best+, the latest game in the Rhythm Heaven series, has two hidden levels that feature all the main characters from the warioware series. I think the game deserves a page for the following reasons.
Proposer: Glowsquid (talk) Support
OpposeCommentsAdd direct links on star icons for 64/Galaxy/Galaxy 2canceled by proposer Proposer: ZonkMario64 (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsI'm withdrawing; please archive. Thanks! ZonkMario64 (talk) passed 19-0 "But if we add this, then there will be too much vandalism to fight."
This line of reasoning is nonsensical on so many layers it's not even funny. If we assume there is going to be vandalism just because we make something easier to access, then are we really assuming edits are made in good faith? It's downright disgusting that this is even something that's being thought of. Yes, this is something that other Wikis do. It's something other Wikis do better than the Super Mario Wiki does at this moment. Therefore, we need to step our game up, and upgrade past this "if we make things easier to access then everyone will edit stuff and this is bad"-kind of think that ultimately assumes editing in bad faith. Besides, if someone vandalises a navigation template, and there is an 'edit' button when you view the template as part of a page, it's going to be slightly easier to access the template and revert any vandalism done to the template, even without going to the recent changes. I think that's kind of neat. Proposer: RandomYoshi (talk) Support
OpposeComments@Bazooka Mario: Don't you mean "websites should be designed for their readers rather than their editors"? You've got that mixed up. Anyway, adding an "edit" template there benefits readers, as it could help point them to the template that needs to be fixed/updated at a convenient time. Ray Trace(T|C) 23:23, 18 August 2015 (EDT) I'm mixed on this. On one hand, I think that we should add something on these templates. On the other hand, I'd rather it be a view link button rather than an edit button. 3D Player 2010 20:21, 19 August 2015 (EDT)
Replace "NTSC/PAL version" with "American/European/Australian/Japanese version"canceled by proposer Support
Oppose
CommentsI think however it is important to note when that term refers to actual 50/59.94 Hz versions of the games, which can be relevant in games such as the Mario Kart series games.--Mister Wu (talk) 13:27, 2 September 2015 (EDT)
But what about handheld games? YoshiCookie (talk) 17:33, 2 September 2015 (EDT) Delete Meaningless Quotescanceled by proposer
In essence, quotes that are only used by one character (Peach and Waluigi, respectively) will stay. Generic quotes (So many Mario characters say "Yes!" in Mario Party and Mario Kart) will be deleted. Proposer: ZonkMario64 (talk) Support
OpposeCommentsI'm pretty sure there already was a proposal enacted to curb these things? Or I swear there already is a guideline that specifically advocates removal of "YES WHOOOOHOOOO" quotes. Ray Trace(T|C) 16:15, 2 September 2015 (EDT)
This proposal is not needed whatsoever since it should, on paper, be enforced already as cited by previous proposals above. We can go ahead and delete those "all rights" and "yes" crap but I can imagine people going back and readding those quotes because they're actual words, I guess. If you want to hear character interjections, go to other sites, such as The Sounds Resource, a far better resource than MarioWiki. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 20:59, 2 September 2015 (EDT) @Walkazo: Since I predict that this won't get 2 more votes by tomorrow, I've decided to delete it. Don't Get Zonked! (blabbing · what i do) 09:40, 8 September 2015 (EDT)
Restrict (if not remove) ImageMapsRestrict usage and rewrite the policy page 8-1
ImageMap templates are images you find on articles such as in World 1 (New Super Mario Bros.) that are filled with links, where you click on a specific part of the image to go to a particular article. They're intended to help visual readers navigate the wiki and relevant games more easily, but I find their usage and implementation less than ideal. They qualify as mystery meat navigation, flashy, but user-hostile forms of linking. While the imagemaps in MarioWiki aren't as cryptic as the moon image example in the Wikipedia page, their designs are still confusing for the average reader for several reasons: they are awkwardly placed in articles and look identical to thumbnail images and their low-resolution quality (needed to fit inside the page) and lack of labels or clear borders make distinguishing between places difficult. As Wikipedia put it, "it may not be readily apparent that the image is a clickable map instead of a simple picture". They are even more difficult to use for mobile users since image maps heavily rely on hovering for labeling locations, which mobile users cannot do. The World 1 example I listed is, unfortunately, typical of most imagemap templates: gaudy, gimmicky, and ultimately useless. This proposal aims to address the following problems of each individual imagemaps. Deletion is usually preferred, but if you disagree for a particular ImageMap and have reasons to keep them, please state so. It is also imperative to see comments below as well before you vote since these are not set in stone, and they can be changed even after the proposal has passed.
Common issues:
This is a writing guidelines proposal because there is a policy page dedicated to this under the writing guidelines category. Again, some ImageMaps may be worthy of keeping (I have doubts though), but if so, then it must caution users when making ImageMaps and they need to be implemented in a manner that doesn't highly resemble normal images, perhaps a special border around the image with the label "image map", no thumbnail framing, and located in a more conspicuous spot in the article. Either way, all Image Maps have their issues and I can't say I like they way they're implemented here. I prefer if they were deleted and at least placed back in the drawing board so it doesn't look at bad as it is now, but all-out-deletion may be too much, so I'm open for suggestions and objections. Proposer: Bazooka Mario (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsNot that I disagree with what's being proposed, but if you're going to make a writing guidelines proposal, don't you need to make a draft? Hello, I'm Time Turner.
These are kind of useful. What will we do if they get removed or restricted? (talk|contribs) Kamek Power! 00:23, 5 September 2015 (EDT)
Andymii: This proposal is not wholly about removing Image Maps, it's simply restricting their usage at best if in case there are reasons to keep one or two. As I said, "I prefer if they were deleted and at least placed back in the drawing board so it doesn't look at bad as it is now, but all-out-deletion may be too much, so I'm open for suggestions and objections." I'm saying that even at best, we should send Image Maps back to the drawing board to allow them to get improved so we can readd them when needed. Image Maps as they are are abused and look terrible in most articles they are in, mostly scrunched below the infobox, hidden at the bottom of the article, or being redundantly placed directly next to the list of levels. They're the gaudiest part of our wiki and thus, they don't improve our credibility. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 15:35, 5 September 2015 (EDT)
Good points, but I don't think we really know what we will do next. You've listes some image maps with comments, but most of them are just "this is useless" (okay, more detailed than that, but, ya know.) I'm always open for change, but I don't think this has been completely thought through. Not that I'm saying all our changes should be black and white, but I'm genuinelly unsure here what's going to happen next. --Andymii (talk) 00:13, 6 September 2015 (EDT)
(talk|contribs) Kamek Power! 10:08, 6 September 2015 (EDT)
Overall thoughts: The overworld maps are good for game and place articles (Beanbean Kingdom, etc.), and the world-specific maps are good for the world articles and the game articles, as long as all the worlds have them. When a template is used on an article, it should be used in place of a mere image of the map; this will often mean putting the template in the infobox, which should be fine as long as the infoboxes aren't obscenely wide (but most templates are only about 400 px or less wide, which would be fine for an infobox, and should be clear enough to be readable and useable). If the names of the places are right there in the level/world select screens, no template's necessary to tell readers what place is what. - Walkazo (talk) 16:45, 7 September 2015 (EDT)
Wow, I didn't realize how terrible MarioWiki:Image maps is... Anyway, I looked over the draft, but there's so many problems with the source material, I gave up on trying to succinctly comment and just did a whole new draft for the policy parts, based on some of your comments on your draft page, and also things that I said here, and extra bits that occurred to me as I was working. Let me know what you think. - Walkazo (talk) 21:55, 8 September 2015 (EDT)
Okay, so I went ahead and rewrote the bottom half of MarioWiki:Image Maps too - to the best of my abilities, anyway, but I'm pretty sure all the coding stuff is right. - Walkazo (talk) 20:51, 15 September 2015 (EDT)
Add "bugs and" or "and bugs" to "List of glitches in"Don't change 1-0-5 Proposer: Roy Koopa (talk) ChangeRedirect searches for bugs to glitch pagesLeave as is
CommentsI'm on the edge with this, but your description is wrong. The term of a bug and glitches is not defined on how damaging of a scale they are (both can cause game-breaking things, it depends on what component of the game experiences that or that), but the processes that caused them. Glitches, I believe, are things that the game developers did not intend/over-looked that are performed by the player, while a bug is a problem in the coding of the software itself. But since we do use "pre-release and unused" for that, I don't see why we can't add "bugs" to the title description. However, most people say those two interchangeably, so I do think it's verging in pedantry. Ray Trace(T|C) 16:52, 13 September 2015 (EDT)
I don't think there is a need to split the vote between "bugs and" and "and bugs". Just a simple support would suffice so determining outcomes would be simpler. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 17:14, 13 September 2015 (EDT)
@Walkazo Adding two syllables is not a mouthful imo. Six syllables (I counted) is though. File:RoyNSMBU.png Roy Koopa 17:28, 13 September 2015 (EDT)
MarioWiki:Quotescanceled by proposer I think, so that people don't come along and say "Well, he said it that makes it a quote" we should have a guideline page to explain real quotes and pseudo-quotes. Proposer: Roy Koopa (talk) SupportOppose
CommentsWhy create a policy page when we can simply use good judgement to decide whenever a quote is meaningful or not? Also, some parts of your policy is vague. "Let's go" is technically a complete sentence (subject is invisible "you", verb is "let") with logical words and phrases, but it's a super generic quote. What do you mean by "Is this quote used by multiple other characters?"? Is the answer supposed to be "no" for a quote to qualify? Also, I think the best question to ask is if the quote illustrates the character. Besides, some quotes that do illustrate a character properly would technically not qualify, such as Mario's "Mama mia" since it is generic and not a complete sentence, and Metal Mario's "Mia mama" because it is not a coherent sentence. The first illustrates Mario since it's iconic while the latter illustrates Metal Mario for being a parody of Mario's quote. Also, "Let's-a go!" would also be omitted despite being an iconic quote as well. I think the "gibberish" and "screaming" sections can be integrated into a more umbrella "onomatopoeia and interjections" section (at least that sounds more technical), but again, those two are easily identifiable, so I don't think policy is needed for this. Even if the policy is needed, it probably needs to be better written. I know it's your first crack at something like this, but the draft strikes me as very incomplete, and the proposal by content itself feels very... brisk and rushed, as if you didn't put a whole lot of thought into this, frankly. For starters, in the draft, you've provided only examples without explaining them. I suggest you actually explain first and provide examples as support rather than making them stand alone. It seems like you really want to push it, but I suggest just jump in the quote pages now rather than use the draggy proposal process. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 17:44, 22 September 2015 (EDT) I would argue that Baby Luigi imitating engine noises does add to his personality unlike the WAAAAAHHHHHs and the HEEEHEEEHEEEES, but eh, can someone else not named Baby Luigi make that argument? Ray Trace(T|C) 17:46, 22 September 2015 (EDT)
You guys are missing the point. I meant for this to proposal to be aimed at new users and anons who think "Mario says 'Mamma Mia' so it's a quote it should be here." As for us experienced users, we use common sense, but the anons and new users may not know. File:RoyNSMBU.png Roy Koopa 14:37, 24 September 2015 (EDT)
Add a 3D render licensing templatecreate 9-0
Again, the legal issue is not the main point I'm going for; we need this so we can organize such images into a convenient category rather than awkwardly lumping them with our sprites. Our current way of doing this violates the policy I've mentioned earlier, so taking a step to include a separate category (which will have more than enough entries) would benefit our wiki. One possible alternate option would be to rename the category, but it would be an unnecessary hassle to rename all of those categories, and it wouldn't help with our organization at all. Again, we're supposed to treat sprites and renders as two separate and distinct entities as outlined by MarioWiki:Good Writing. Otherwise, you might as well just lump everything under {{game-screenshot}} like it used to be before {{game-sprite}} was created in 2011. I think just creating a new one to cover the renders is a far better and consistent option. There is also another option to simply add a new category but that doesn't solve the licensing by itself, so you have to edit the licensing template to accommodate 3D renders, making it more convoluted than what's being proposed. We can also go with "3D model" rather than "3D render", but "3D render" is much more precise and not too jargon-y. If there is a sudden call to change from "render" to "model", please let me know. If this proposal passes, it will overturn the previous proposal and will give us one more drop-down option under licensing when you upload an image. Proposer: Bazooka Mario (talk) Support
OpposeCommentsMegadardery: "Even though the trouble that will arise from this is not little[...]". Elaborate? I don't think this will cause any problems other than a little reorganization, but it's not like we haven't done this before. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 15:24, 27 September 2015 (EDT)
Make location infoboxes more appropriate for buildings as wellDon't change 3-7
Proposer: Mr. Ice Bro. (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsChanging "greater location" to "location" would make sense either way, but "inhabitants" already works for buildings, so I think that one should be left alone. Also, while "ruler" indeed doesn't work for buildings, "owner" would sound awkward for countries and whatnot, so why not just make both variables usable? "Ruler" is already optional, so just add "owner" as a different optional variable, and then both types of situations are covered. - Walkazo (talk) Roy Koopa: If it's too vague, then what parts of the proposal do you think needs elaboration? Also, I agree with Walkazo, just add more if parameters into the infoboxes. This probably doesn't even need a proposal for such an inconsequential change. We don't need a new infobox, just add it to "location". It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 15:27, 27 September 2015 (EDT)
I don't know. Some things work in this proposal, others don't. I personally think Walkazo's idea is the best. I'm not voting yet either way as of now. Magikrazy (talk) Allow IPs to mark minor editsvetoed by the administrators Proposer: Roy Koopa (talk) SupportOpposeCommentsFirst, is it really necessary? You can hide the edits of I.P.s as you would to minor edits. Second, is it really possible? Because no other wiki, not even Wikipedia, allows anonymous editors to mark edits as minor. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 19:57, 8 October 2015 (EDT)
Create Template: Unfinishedcanceled by proposer In these cases, the pages aren't under construction (at least not anymore, if the page was under construction at some point. You can't just trust the original "constructors" to come back and complete the page suddenly after three years.) Therefore, such a template doesn't make sense. We need a separate template to tell editors that the page is unfinished, and that help is needed to help complete the page to a satisfactory level. Just to make the distinction, something "under construction" is incomplete, but actively being edited towards completion. Something "unfinished" is incomplete, but not being actively edited towards completion. In other words, it's unfinished and forgotten. Here is what the template can look like. I deliberately made it look similar to the construction template, since they are relatively similar: This article is unfinished. Please try adding as much information as you can to complete this page. Proposer: Andymii (talk) SupportOppose
CommentsSo... basically {{stub}} and/or {{rewrite-expand}}? They're both used to signify articles that are in need of more information. Hello, I'm Time Turner.
You know what, I completely forgot about stubs. (I guess I was sleepy; I made this quickly.) Thanks for pointing that out. I'll cancel this proposal in a few minutes, as there's really no need for it. --Andymii (talk) 11:15, 24 October 2015 (EDT) Do not consider ports for an article's most recent namecanceled by proposer First of all, it'd be incredibly off to only apply this to names, and there are quite a few other aspects that would have to be changed, namely the general order of the games in history sections and every article's latest appearance. It's seems odd to arbitrary exclude everything but the names in our changes. Also, how surreal would it be to see an article with their first appearance listed as "Super Mario Bros. 2 (1988)" and then its latest appearance listed as "Super Mario Bros. 2 (2012)"? It presents the idea that there's a whole new game called SMB2, but it's really the exact same game with minimal differences (I'm not exaggerating). This idea of being misleading is another reason I dislike the idea: having a game carry the same name as it did twenty years ago is not a change; it's an example of preservation. If a museum was commissioning a replica of the Mona Lisa, with the intent of presenting it as it was originally depicted, would you want them to paint a giant clown nose on it? While it'd be a bit funny, it'd completely lose the intent and disappoint a large amount of people looking forward to it. With that said, preserving something is not the same thing as presenting it as something new. Attitudes at Nintendo have not changed by re-releasing an old game, and the wiki's attitude should likewise not change. It's not even as if they're a "new" game; for all intents and purposes, these games are the same games that were once available a few years ago, just for a different platform. In the case of the Super Mario Land enemies whose names were changed in the Virtual Console, those are different to what's being discussed here. Those names were changed with the re-release itself; it's not a matter of the same name popping up again and clashing with a later game, it's a matter of the same game containing different names than it did previously. One is about staying true to the source, while the other is about a clear change in though. Basically, per what was said by me and Walkazo on the forums. This proposal intends to revert the Lands proposal and the Gloomba move (and any other ones that may be out there), as well as set a precedent for the future. Proposer: Time Turner (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsI think it's dumb a name from a re-release of a predecessor has replaced the sequel's name, but I'm not extremely sure about standalone games, so I'm still iffy on applying a blanket standard to disregard all ports. It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 16:23, 22 October 2015 (EDT)
Template:TooManyImagesDon't create template 1-8 This article has too many images. Please help by removing some unneeded images from this article. Or (since the two templates doesn't work for me): There are too many images in this article. Please help by removing some of the unnedded or useless images. I am open to suggestions on wording and coloration.
SupportOppose
CommentsIf there's too many images, why doesn't whoever's there just remove some? It's not like trying to add images, which involved hunting stuff down and uploading them, and is even easier than dealing with long Trivia sections or overly crufty prose, which both generally require effortful rewriting (e.g. some Trivia needs to be incorporated, rather than simply removed). And for galleries, the main problems are superfluous screenshots, so already, where to chop is narrowed down for folks to make it easy (shoot, maybe we could just axe those sections entirely and leave it to the game and subject articles to showcase strategic screenshots of gameplay, with only overview-type things like maps or package-deal stuff like cutscene slideshows left in the galleries). It just seems a bit lazy to make a whole template to pass the buck on such a simple issue; if someone really just wants to flag and dash, they can use {{rewrite}} anyway. Plus, if this is mainly for galleries, ideally, once we finally get rid of the everything-but-the-kitchen-sink approach to screenshots that's bloating them up for the most part, then wouldn't the temple be mostly unnecessary? Finally, even if we were gonna make this template, it should be called "Template:LessImages" and be yellow, for consistency with {{Image}} and {{more images}} - {{construction}} is completely unrelated to problems occurring in long-established pages. - Walkazo (talk)
This article needs fewer images. Please help by removing some unneeded images from this article. J-Luigi (talk) 20:34, 25 October 2015 (EDT) This seems like a subjective editorial issue that is better served by being brought up on a talk page or the collaboration forum than just inventing a new label slap on. -- Ghost Jam 20:06, 27 October 2015 (EDT) Names in Other Languages organization for Mario episodesKeep template as it is 1-6
The same goes for Portuguese names. This also counts for rows like this:
In case of that one, I would edit it in a way that makes it result in this:
So one of the decisions I made about it is to separate the Spanish/Portuguese language rows from one another, in a way that looks like this:
I already did this to most, if not all, of the Mario episode articles. But you can help contribute to this. Proposer: MeerkatMario (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsBut NOA stands for Nintendo of America and NOE stands for Nintendo of Europe,both which are localization and promotion branches for Nintendo. Are you sure they played a part in localizing languages outside of English (since the show is American)? It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 13:10, 4 November 2015 (EST)
So it's past the deadline then? Magikrazy (talk)
Replace Remix with Remake on Level ArticlesDo not swap terms 1-6 Proposer: Roy Koopa (talk) SupportOppose
CommentsI changed the terminology so that it is not "ban," but rather "replace with." J-Luigi (talk) 14:46, 9 November 2015 (EST)
I think the reasoning for this proposal is wrong all based on the denotation of "remix". Words are flexible and can be used outside its dictionary definition. Making a strict rule on that isn't really a good decision. That being said, I don't like "remix" being abused like this, so I suggest changing it to less vague and ambiguous terms like "variation", "alteration", "similar". Finally, just a side note: "remix" is more often than not used incorrectly not only in this wiki but even in professional games such as Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS / Wii U, which only aggravates the abuse of "remix". It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 15:40, 9 November 2015 (EST) To be honest, "remix" and "remake" both are poor word choices. It most definitely isn't a remix, but it's more of a "reprise" than a "remake." My gut says "reprise" isn't the right word either, though. --Andymii (talk) 00:47, 18 November 2015 (EST) Create a suggestion templateDo not create a suggestion template 3-7 Proposer: LudwigVon (talk) Support
Oppose
CommentsThis template could serve to prevent to make a proposal for every propose of recipes merge in the Paper Mario (series), since some users just think its a little boring to do this all the time. LudwigVon (talk)
Create an "Experienced User" panelfailed 13-1
This panel would mostly be for two purposes: 1) Give new users a place to go to ask a question. 2) Give the admins some knowledge of the best candidates for patroller (there wouldn't be any admins on the panel). In case you're wondering, Steve said he is ok with this. Proposer: Roy Koopa (talk) SupportOppose
CommentsWe could also design the autopatrol rank to differentiate which user is trusted/experienced or not (as it was before, I still wonder why it was changed in the first place). I myself find it kind of pointless; I don't know if it's immediately apparent that I'm considered "experienced", but I don't know if a panel is going to let users know or not, and newer users are probably still going to ask the
3D Player: Because admins are already admins. An admin doesn't really need to be considered a candidate for admin. What I meant for this was a group of normal users (meaning non-admins) that are very knowledgeable about syntax, rules and policies, etc. J-Luigi (talk) 15:01, 21 November 2015 (EST) Seems to me that if a new user needs more help than our on-wiki help guide provides, they should be directed to either the forums (for discussion and helpful topics) or chat (for live responses). -- Ghost Jam 15:07, 21 November 2015 (EST)
I'd like to add that experienced users (and I know the definition of an experienced user considering I'm erhm, one myself) already tend to answer questions left by users like those in MarioWiki talk:FAQ, so this is pretty much redundant? Ray Trace(T|C) 15:43, 21 November 2015 (EST) Even though I'm opposed to this, I'm interested in what this so-called test would consist of.Magikrazy (talk) |