Talk:Mario/Archive 2

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Mario Talk
Archive 1 (1-51)

PAIRreview for Mario/Archive 2 by Hello, I'm Time Turner.
Accuracy	3.5	So now I'm critizing Mr. Nintendo's article. Huh. Anyways, about the accuracy. Like a lot of articles, it's mostly accurate, but screws up in a few parts. Like in the Super Mario Bros. section, where it said that it was the first Mario platformer, when in fact it was the game Mario Bros.
Depth	2.0	Lots of games are missing in this article. Some of them are spin-offs, some of them are obscure games. Either way, they belong here.
Grammar	3.5	Thankfully, there are few grammatical errors, but as always, they still make an appearance.
Images	3.0	This is one of the few articles where I don't need to place a MoreImages template. But since there are missing sections, there are missing images.
Formatting	4.0	All the images and templates are A-OK.
Final Rating:	16	This article is better than most of the articles that I've seen, but it still isn't FA material.
Reviewer:	Hello, I'm Time Turner. doc

Un-canon elements

The elements coming from the cartoons doesn't count in the video game timeline, so should I delete the part where it's said that something's happenning between Super Mario Bros. and its sequel ? Koopalmier 07:11, 1 June 2009 (EDT)

Actually, there is no "video game timeline". The whole article should be reorganized according to this. Time Questions 07:28, 1 June 2009 (EDT)

But, seriousely, it's obvious that there are multiples Marios in differents universes. The one from the video games, the one from the DIC cartoon trilogy, the one from the Mario anime, the one from the educative games, ect... Or else Bowser would be dead already, Mario would not have hairs, and Mario & Peach wouldn't have a romantic relationship. We should separe the vdieo games part from the cartoon part in the biography, at least, no ?

Koopalmier 08:47, 1 June 2009 (EDT)

Of course there are many inconsistencies between the various appearances (not only in different media). That's why the section shouldn't be called "Biography" anymore, but rather "History". In this section, we can list every of Mario's appearances, no matter which form of media. Video games aren't any more canon than cartoons. Time Questions 09:27, 1 June 2009 (EDT)

Biography section.

The biography section is a mess. It treats the different forms of Mario media as though they all occur in the same continuity. Why is this? Shouldn't there be a section detailing the video game continuity, a section detailing the TV cartoon continuity, a section detailing the movie continuity, and a section detailing any other continuities? I mean, I doubt any Superman wiki page jumbles the different Superman continuities together like this, for instance. It's just sloppy. - Buddy Christ

The organization is correct according to our guidelines. It's not a biography section, but rather a history section, and as such it should list all appearances of a character in history, no matter in which media. There's no way of making a proper "Biography" section, because even in the video game "continuity", there are dozens of inconsistencies. Plus, who says that video game appearances are part of a character's "biography", but cartoon appearances aren't? For our motivation to adopt this organization standard, please see here. Time Questions 05:41, 8 June 2009 (EDT)

Paper Mario

Should that be considered canon or is it more of a spin off?
The preceding unsigned comment was added by Huh (talk).

If you mean "Part of the video games timeline", then yes. It's in fact a rather important game, as it's starting from here that Bowser will start to try world domination. Koopalmier 01:32, 16 August 2009 (EDT)

There is no "canon". The game was officially released by Nintendo, so there's no reason it's less "canon" than other games. Time Questions 17:35, 20 July 2009 (EDT)

Well the Mario RPG's are a bit different from the platformers but I get what your saying.
The preceding unsigned comment was added by Huh (talk).

Every Mario game is different. Mario can do 300 ft high jumps in Mario Strikers Charged when he can't jump higher than 5 ft in Paper Mario 2. But those are gameplay elements. Koopalmier 01:32, 16 August 2009 (EDT)

Misplaced Picture

There is a picture from Mario Vs. Donkey Kong next to the Wrecking Crew '98 section in the article. It doesn't belong there and someone needs to fix it!--fawfulfury65 18:18, 29 July 2009 (EDT)fawfulfury65

Name Wrong!

Mario's full name isn't "Mario Mario" Nintendo NEVER said that,they said that Mario Mario isn't Mario's Name, Understand People!
The preceding unsigned comment was added by MATEOELBACAN (talk).

The Super Mario Bros. movie says his full name is "Mario Mario". The film was made with Nintendo's permission, and so we consider it to be an official source of information. - Walkazo 17:10, 1 September 2009 (EDT)

You're right! MY NAME IS MARIO MARIO! How'd you know that? --Mario4Real 10:38, 6 September 2009 (EDT)

You're strange..., at first you said that the name was correct but now seems that I was right...Weird x3--Mateo (Talk · Contributions) 21:22, 3 December 2009 (EST)

ArtWork

I think Mario's New Super Mario Bros. Wii artwork should be at the start it is the newest.Plus it looks better in my opinion. File:NsmbMario.jpg Luigi3000

Game-unrelated Artwork

Back in the 1980s and 1990s, there were several official artwork pieces of Mario that showed him doing activities such as sports or driving a car. But they are not directly related to a particular game. At the moment I don't have any of these on hand, but I ask because now artwork of Mario and Peach wearing traditional Japanese attire has been revealed by Nintendo due to a recent event in Kyoto (information). The artwork can be seen here (there is also a less-quality photo). Furthermore, there is artwork where Mario draws a rickshaw with Peach and Toad, but I've only seen a photo of it so far. Anyway, I think such artwork should also be covered in the character galleries, even if it doesn't belong to a game, but it is still official. Maybe in a separated section. What do you think? --Grandy02 17:39, 5 October 2009 (EDT)

If it's official... Sure, why not? - Gabumon^(talk) 17:43, 5 October 2009 (EDT)

Seems that Lindsayoris15 uploaded the art, but MeritC thought it is not needed and deleted it. But I still think nothing speaks against making a headline for "Non-Game Artwork." It is official artwork that comes from Nintendo. Hotel Mario and Mario is Missing!, both 3rd party creations not made by Nintendo, aren't more official than this. --Grandy02 06:42, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

If this artwork is acknowledged or even published by Nintendo, then there's no way to doubt that it's official. And the purpose of the wiki is to cover everything official. If we don't accept material not directly connected to a game, then we're going to have to remove many articles about Mario merchandise as well. - Gabumon^(talk) 07:04, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

Agree. I uploaded them again, but I wrote MeritC to ask for opinion, so I put the artwork here until the answer arrives. --Grandy02 13:47, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

• 
• 

The reason I deleted them earlier was that even though they were from the Nintendo Japan site -- since they didn't have any REAL relation to the Mario installments here on this Wiki, it really doesn't belong here. That is, unless if the majority still says that they should still stay and we can find an alternative to tell folks that those two pictures don't have any relation to actal Mario installments (besides, they were mainly done to promote a Nintendo event in Japan). --M. C. - "Mario Gals" Fan! User Page | Talk Page 17:39, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

Well, we are a Mario Wiki, and Mario is Mario. We even cover information about his appearance in a milk commercial. I think this is practically the same thing. - Gabumon^(talk) 17:46, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

Well, here's what I can do - I can create another sub-section in the respective gallery noting that said pictures were done to promote exclusive Nintendo events themselves. Hold on; I'll see if I can achieve this on both Peach's and Mario's galleries. --M. C. - "Mario Gals" Fan! User Page | Talk Page 20:49, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

All right, done for both Mario's and Peach's galleries (along with adding a disclaimer). Is this satisfactory to you all? --M. C. - "Mario Gals" Fan! User Page | Talk Page 21:15, 6 October 2009 (EDT)

Looks nice. The artwork I described in my first paragraph might not fall under "event promotions", though, but as said, I don't have that on hand at the moment. --Grandy02 12:41, 7 October 2009 (EDT)

Time for a New Image at the Begining

There is nothing wrong with the Mario Party 8 piture at the start, but It's just Mario with his hands up! I think he should be more active in the piture at the start. This will show who Mario really is. He's the guy who bashes blocks, and flies through space! The piture should be more than just him standing. So, it's time to vote for a new one! Here are two I like: User: Cberiault

• 

  Super Mario Galaxy artwork
• NsmbMario.jpg

  New Super Mario Bros. Wii artwork

Change the Main Image?

Votes for New Super Mario Bros. Wii Piture

1. I like this one the most. But the other one is good too. User: Cberiault
2. Lemmy Koopa Fan (talk) I like this one better than the MP8 one we already have.

Keep it the same

1. Edofenrir (talk) - I don't like either of them very much. Maybe a picture of him doing his victory sign. That would be more... uh... more Mario I guess.
2. Gamefreak75 (talk) - The MP8 pic is fien unless we could a better pic from NsMB Wii or we could wait till Super Mario Galaxy 2.
3. Fawfulfury65 (talk) The SMG one makes Mario's head look big, and the NSMBW just wouldn't look good up there. The current one is the best.

Comments

1. I see your guys point. But the Mario Party 8 artwork that we currently have is just kinda...lame. (Lame for the main artwork anyway) I think we need a more active one. I could try finding another one...but it might be an older artwork (I was considering the Mario Party 6 artwork when I changed my mind) User: Cberiault

I tried to find anouther one...but there really wasn't one that I wanted. Let's try to wrap this up in a few days. We need more votes. If we don't get more votes by Octorbor 16th, then we'll leave it the same.

  Octorbor 13, 2009 User: Cberiault

I don't like either. The MP8 one looks gay, but the NSMBW one hides his face too much. Maybe something else. --Don Pianta 22:43, 5 November 2009 (EST)

They need to be png images, they'd look SO much better! YoshiDaisy fan1

Just Silly

This article seems to have the history section written in a made up chronological order. Of course we can assume when certain games take place but to link everything together the way it is here is speculation and has nothing to backup the way it is written. There's so much assumption in this article it's just plain silly. I am changing it unless someone can provide PROOF of why it is set up this way. FD09

Excuse me

I hope I dont sound like Rudy, but how do we know Mario is not italian? It is kinda obvious, his like for spaghetti, his accent, his name and Luigi's. Please explain me. ™ The 'Shroom

I like spaghetti, but that doesn't make me Italian. Accents and names aren't evidence of national origin, either. "Italian" is more so a national identity rather than an ethnic origin, so it's vague at best. In any case, Mario and Luigi are Italian... But only possibly in the cartoons and film. In the games he has been identified as being born in the Mushroom World, so unless there's an "Italy" in the Mushroom Kingdom, he's not strictly Italian. Redstar 14:32, 2 December 2009 (EST)

Unknown Art

I don't know for sure what game this art is from:

File:EntranceArtPNG.PNG

Panchito

Super Mario Bros. 2. Mario entering the door to Subcon. Redstar 14:34, 2 December 2009 (EST)

More specifically from the remakes (in original art, Mario and Luigi's overalls were red and green respectively). --Grandy02 05:01, 3 December 2009 (EST)

Mario Segali

Shouldn't we do an article about Mario Segali?Mario was named after him, right? Count Bonsula I need blood...

Trivia

Following what Knife did on Talk:Dimentio, I've decided to poll wether or not to keep certain pieces of trivia.

Mario's Super Mario Strikers jersey number is 1. This might actually be a reference to Mario's status in the series, as only goalkeepers wear number 1 jerseys in actual soccer/football.

REMOVE 0-5

Keep Remove It's speculation. Reversinator (talk) Tucayo (talk)- And its not true. Gamefreak75 (talk) Per all. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Per Reversinator. KS3 (talk) Per all.

Mario appeared as the best purchasable character in Nintendo Monopoly. He costs $400, and replaced the Boardwalk.

KEEP 4-0

Keep Worthy enough to keep. Reversinator (talk) Tucayo (talk)-Per Gamefreak75 (talk) Per all. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Per all. Remove

Mario's full name is referred to as "Mario Mario", as set forth by the Super Mario Bros. movie. This appears to apply to all continuities in the series, however, because Mario and Luigi are called the "Mario Bros." The box of the Super Mario Bros. Super Show DVD "Mario's Movie Madness" describes Mario as Mario Skywalker when referring to the episode "Star Koopa". This is enfourced by the Prima Edition of the Mario and Luigi: Superstar Saga Guide book, where, in the character section, Mario is reffered to as Mario Mario and Luigi as Luigi Mario.

REMOVE 0-2

Keep Remove Remove it and move it to a section above. Reversinator (talk) KS3 (talk) Per all.

Mario has also appeared in Tomytec's Dots.

TIE 1-1

Keep Gamefreak75 (talk) Where? Remove Remove it and move it to a section above. Reversinator (talk)

A Mario statue made out of wax stands in the Hollywood Wax Museum. This is currently the only wax-statue of a video game character.

TIE 1-2

Keep Tucayo (talk)- To where? Gamefreak75 (talk) Per Tucayo. Remove Remove it and move it to a section above. Reversinator (talk)

In the recent games, Mario's colors are lighter than his colors in 2002 to 2006.

REMOVE 0-5

Keep Remove I don't see a diference. Reversinator (talk) Tucayo (talk)-Per Gamefreak75 (talk) Per all. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Not important. KS3 (talk) Per all.

The Mario Party 3 instruction booklet claims that Mario's favorite item is the Golden Mushroom.

KEEP 3-1

Keep It perhaps could be moved to a section above, but I think it's better off as a trivia piece. Reversinator (talk) Tucayo (talk)-Per, and i added it :P Gamefreak75 (talk) PEr all. Remove KS3 (talk) Remove it and put it in a section above.

Mario made the first pitch in a Seattle Marines' 2008 season game, as publicity for Mario Super Sluggers.

TIE 2-1

Keep Tucayo (talk) Gamefreak75 (talk) PEr all. Remove Remove it and move it to a section above. Reversinator (talk)

In the Subspace Emissary, if the player chooses to use Kirby to fight Mario at the Midair Stadium, and then rescues Princess Peach during the Petey Piranha battle, Mario would be the character turned into a trophy the most times, being a total of four.

REMOVE 0-4

Keep Remove It really isn't anything special. Reversinator (talk) Tucayo (talk)-Can be moved to SSBB Gamefreak75 (talk) Per all. KS3 (talk) per Tucayo. Comments @Tucayo and Gamefreak: To Appearances outside of electronic media. Hello, I'm Time Turner.

Mario Mario

I'm sure this has been discussed many times, but in the character template it says that Mario's full name is Mario Mario. Now, that's just really stupid. They may say that its his full name in the movie, but it doesn't in any of the games. Therefore, I propose we bring it back to just "Mario". Fawfulfury65

Well, the movie is just as official as the games, so... maybe we could add a reference there to inform our readers where that full name appears? Time Questions 04:11, 19 January 2010 (EST)

It should be at least made clear in the infobox that "Mario Mario" is only his full name in the film. In case of the species, references to the movie have already been removed due to a proposal (e.g. Daisy was called an "evolved dinosaur" in the infobox because of the film). --Grandy02 13:44, 19 January 2010 (EST)

Adding that kind of stuff to the infobox is not needed. Also, the movies and the games hardly are "as official" that's a joke. Also, if I'm not mistaken, it has been confirmed that's not his name. Panchito

Wait a minute his last name must be Mario because in the Dr. Mario Series.Dr.s use their last names.-User:UltraMario3000

Images

The large amount of images removed were actually mostly from the odd powerups section which is not towards the manual of style. Panchito

Nothing in the Manual of Style talks about a rule like that. Hello, I'm Time Turner.

Reversinator is right. There isn't a rule in the Manual of Style that even comes remotely close to such a regulation. - Gabumon^(talk) 08:00, 5 February 2010 (EST)

Interactions

Wasn't there a proposal a while back that said only characters who had major interactions with the character or something along those lines made a while back? Also, I would've removed Toad and Yoshi because of their size, but I'm thinking someone can write more there. As for the characters in other right now, there's not much else to say. As for Daisy, there's so many other characters already in his interactions section, she seems much less relevant when compared like that. I'll probably mention the smaller sections on the nimination for featured page. Panchito

You should at least verify first to see if there really was a proposal. Hello, I'm Time Turner.

Changes

Whats with all this weird changes to the article? --™ The 'Shroom 21:48, 17 February 2010 (EST)

LGM is trying to rearrange everything. Sorry, but can you ask her? I don't have the exact answers. Ray Trace^(T|C)

I suck at organizing articles :P. I thought the Yoshi series section looked out of place and there shouldn't be a "Mario Bros." and a "Super Mario Bros." series. I decided to change the "Mario Bros." header into "Super Mario Bros." and move the games so they are in release order. I removed the Super Mario Super Show section because I couldn't find a spot for that (PLEASE PLACE IT BACK SOMEWHERE!). Right now, I'm in a dilemma whether I should split the Paper Mario, Mario vs. DK, and Mario and Luigi series.

If I did anything absolutely wrong, just tell me.

It's me, Mario! (Talk / Stalk) 21:59, 17 February 2010 (EST)

Well, as long as all the content remains there, no one opposes this, and its organized, I see no problem in it :) --™ The 'Shroom 22:08, 17 February 2010 (EST)

Organization

Orginazation has been a huge problem for this article, so I decided to take it opne step at a time, starting with the History. If any one has an issue, go ahead and tell me.

1 - History

1.1 - Super Mario Series
 1.1.1 - Mario Bros.
 1.1.2 - Super Mario Bros.
 1.1.3 - Super Mario Bros.: The Lost Levels
 1.1.4 - Super Mario Bros. 2
 1.1.5 - Super Mario Bros. 3
 1.1.6 - Super Mario World
 1.1.7 - Super Mario 64
 1.1.8 - Super Mario Sunshine
 1.1.9 - Super Mario 64 DS
 1.1.10 - Super Princess Peach
 1.1.11 - New Super Maro Bros.
 1.1.12 - Super Mario Galaxy
 1.1.13 - New Super Mario Bros. Wii
 1.1.14 - Super Mario Galaxy 2

This is the what I plan on doing so far, unless there are any objections? - Random User

Super Princess Peach should not be included in the Super Mario series. Time Questions 10:47, 2 March 2010 (EST)

It looks better to me, all 'Super Mario Series' within this section - sure, Super Princess Peach goes aside.

¢oincoll€ctor

Does Super Mario World 2 get excluded in this case? --Marcelagus (T • C • E)

I think it's usually treated as a Yoshi series game. Time Questions 06:14, 4 March 2010 (EST)

You forgot to put in Super Mario Land and Super Mario Land 2: 6 Golden Coins. KS3 (talk · contribute)

Yoshi's been moved?

I found that the Donkey Kong series has been placed at the top of the history section. I thought it should have been the Yoshi series up top, as it tells of the Mario Bros. childhood. Commander Code-8 (talk) 08:30 8 March 2010

I think we go by the release dates of the games, not the chronological order in which the games might take place if there was anything like an official canon. Going by release date, Donkey Kong was the first game Mario appeared in. Though I'm puzzled why the Yoshi series is listed before the Mario series here personally; shouldn't it be the other way around, since Mario (obviously) appeared in the Mario series before appearing in the Yoshi series?--vellidragon 16:53, 7 March 2010 (EST)

Well, I guess this is resolved now.--vellidragon 19:34, 7 March 2010 (EST)

Re:Trivia

Template:SettledTPP NO QUORUM

The above section called Trivia has some debate, but everyone voted to remove the one about Mario's colors. I went onto the article and it says that it is not removed. I decided to do that again, only the ones I think that should be taken out of the Trivia and either delete it or put it in a section above. -KS3 (talk · contribute)

Proposer: KS3 (talk) Deadline: March 23 2010, 24:00 April 16 2010, 24:00 May 3 2010, 24:00 Mario has also appeared in Tomytec's Dots. Remove KS3 (talk) Remove and put it in the Appearances outside of electronic media section. Keep Comments A Mario statue made out of wax stands in the Hollywood Wax Museum. This is currently the only wax-statue of a video game character. Remove KS3 (talk) Remove and put it in the Appearances outside of electronic media section. Keep Comments

Relationships

Why is Sonic in the Relationships?? He never was really Mario's friend. There was this period of time where they fought. KS3 (talk)

Relationships? You mean the Interactions with Other Characters section? Why wouldn't Sonic be listed there? There is interaction between him an Mario in a few games, he wouldn't have to be Mario's "friend"; I wouldn't consider Koopa and Wario that either, but they're still listed there. If you meant something different, I'm sorry, that's just the only thing on relationships I could find in the article. And when was this "period of time where they fought"? I don't recall that happening in official games besides potentially in Super Smash Bros. Brawl.--vellidragon 20:07, 14 March 2010 (EDT)

7th June 2010

$Insertformulahere$

Every time I click on to the link to the Mario and Sonic series articles, it brings me to this one. Tell me why.

ED120

Thanks for bringing this up; it should be fixed now. --Steve (talk) 10:02, 7 June 2010 (UTC)

On what games is Mario fought against? Or what games have Mario as a Boss?

Hi! I'm new here!

I see in the categories that Mario is a Boss. I have a few questions, which I hope don't sound.... noobish.

1. Which games is he fought as a Boss?

2. The categories also say he's a Final Boss? What game's that? I'd like to see that.

3. Also, it says he's a Villain? On what occasion is he a Villain?

I hope I don't sound noobish at all. I just need those 3 questions answered. Thanks. --SMWFan 22:43, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

I've read the article, and I still can't see anywhere where he is fought as a Boss, or seen as a Villain. If anyone knows the answers, it would be appreciated if I got a response. Thank you. Either as a reply here, or on my talk page. Thanks, again. --SMWFan 23:09, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Mario is the main villain in Donkey Kong Jr., where he imprisons Donkey Kong. The player controls Donkey Kong's son, who has to free him, making Mario the antagonist.--vellidragon 17:49, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

Article is excessively lengthy

This article is extremely lengthy, almost comically so, and the actual information pertaining to Mario, as a character, is buried under piles of game and plot summaries that, more or less, have no bearing on his actual character. Since these things are better explained on their own pages, is it really necessary to go into full detail about Mario's exploits in every single game on this page? It seems like this article is trying to be the entire Wiki all by itself.

For example, nearly half of the article is a laundry list of every game Mario has ever appeared in, and then a not-so-brief summary of the entire game's concept and Mario's role in it. Is this really necessary? All of these games have their own respective articles. Wouldn't it be simpler and more concise to do something like a table of games he has appeared in, along with their respective release dates, and links to the specific pages on those games?

It seems silly that the entire plot of Super Mario Galaxy is detailed on the Mario article, when Super Mario Galaxy has its own article that fulfills this function. The same can be said for, well, the other several dozen TV shows, games, and things Mario has appeared in.

In short if it has its own article, does it really need to be re-posted on the Mario article? I don't see any purpose it serves to have Mario's article cluttered up with redundant information except to confuse readers and obfuscate actual information about Mario as a character.
The preceding unsigned comment was added by Mrreow (talk).

No, that why there is a rewrite template on the history section. That whole section describes the plots to the games more than Mario's role. Fawfulfury65

We actually discussed this on the Sysop board a while back, and we all agreed the current characters articles are pretty abominable as is. But of course, we kind of forgot about it.

For what it's worth, Cobold has made a draft for a page that doesn't suck. You can preview it by removing the preview tags. --Glowsquid 12:47, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

If you really want to see an article that is excessively lenghty, go look at Tabuu. Hello, I'm Time Turner.