MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/2
MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive Template Reformat Featured Articles...again!ADD POLICY 9-0 Featured Articles are an important part of any wiki, and I think it is about time we get users excited about featured articles again. I am propsing we do away with the new PAIR system, and institute a new, simpler system I developed (but heavily based on the successful Wookiepedia FA guidelines). By making the nomination process open to more users, and making it simpler, we will encourage people to get involved in the FA process. This new system will be like the original, but stagnant nominations will be removed after a month of inactivity. That way, we can avoid having huge lists of nominations if no one is working on the articles. All new featured article nominations would have to be recast. If we do not have a featured article by the time the new main page is up, we should invite users to help the Super Mario Wiki find its first featured article. Here is what the featured article nomination page will look like: The featured articles of the wiki are articles that represent the best the Super Mario Wiki has to offer. This is not a way to showcase the articles of your favorite characters, items, or the like. An article must…
First, nominate an article you find is worthy of featured status, putting it at the bottom of the list below; see criteria above. Note that a previously featured article cannot be featured on the Main Page again; however, it can be restored to featured status if there are no other featured articles in queue. Others will object to the nomination if they disagree that the article is good enough; they will then supply reasons for doing so, and ways to improve the article (errors, style, organization, images, notability, sources). Supporters adjust the article until the objectors (with reasonable objections) are satisfied. The article is placed on the featured article list and added to the front page queue. Also, if, at least a week after the article's nomination, that article has five supports and no objections, it will be added to the queue, and will be officially known as a "featured article". How to vote: Before doing anything, be sure to read the article completely, keeping a sharp eye out for mistakes. Afterwards, compare the article to the criteria listed above, and then either support or object the article's nomination. If you object, please supply concrete reasons for doing so, and how it can be improved. Please cite which rule your objection falls under. Failure to do so will result in your objection being considered invalid. As stated above, any objections will be looked upon by the nominator, supporters, and anyone willing to improve the article, and action will be taken to please the objectors. Once all objectors' complaints have been solved (or the article has five supports and no objections after at least a week), the article will be added to the queue and be officially known as a "featured article". Also remember to add nominated at the top of the article you are nominating. Every Sunday the next article in the queue will be highlighted on the Main Page as featured, marked with the featured template and removed from the list of nominations. The beginning of the article then appears on the Main Page via the featured articles template. Nominees that are inactive for a month will be eliminated from the nominations list. Proposer: Son of Suns Use this New System
Use the Old PAIR SystemCommentsTo Cobold: I can keep the templates in existence so people can review freelance. Wa
The system is good, but whatever we decide, we need to get a system and lock it in. As of right now, rules governing FAs have been all over the place. Phoenix Rider
Super Mario Sunshine "Secret" AreasKEEP 2-5 Pages such as The Shell have been created as pages in their own right. I don't think that they are special enough to be credited in their own right simply because they are "Secret" areas. Besides, you actually need them to finish the game. I'm a little put off by the existence of PipeProject: Levels, however, because they are technically levels. Proposer: Phoenix Rider Delete themKeep them
CommentsWalkazo - The Shell is a place, and while the corresponding mission is calles "The Shell's Secret", it's not actually a "Secret Level", which is what I think all the confusion is about here. And while we're on the subject of Super Mario Sunshine places, I think there should be a category for Super Mario Sunshine Places. That way the sub-areas and the normal areas can be viewed along side each other. Unused Image DeadlineALLOW MORE TIME 9-0 Recently, a user uploaded an image at 23:07, 29 August 2007. Said image was marked for deletion as an unused image at 23:13, 29 August 2007, six minutes later. While I believe the tag was placed there in good faith, it was still a case of jumping the gun. A while back, I made a note that an image should be used as soon as it is uploaded and was backed by Wayoshi. Now, however, I feel that I was a bit to hasty. I'm seeing more and more images that are being marked for deletion as unused images very shortly after said images where uploaded. I know from experience (as do a great many of you) that sometimes dropping images into articles doesn't always work out, for various reasons (a bit of wikicode is malformed, said images looks like crap in chosen placement, etc.). For these reasons, I'm thinking we should extend the limit a bit. Lets say one day for personal images and 12 hours for everything else. What say you all? Proposer: Allow More Time
Delete Right AwayComments
Cool User ListsDELETE 12-6-4 Many users have a section on their userpage listing other community members they like. Often there is unnecessary conflict and even (pardon) stupid flaming when a user removes someone from this list. I say we get rid of all of these sections – there's no need to hurt anyone's feelings over any one of these. True friends – online or offline – can't be simply added or removed from your life on a list. We have a good group dynamic overall in our community, so let's not wreck it. Another option is to rename & rephrase all these lists so they are neutral, such as "User Neighbors I Know", though removing users could still bring questions and trouble. Proposer: Wa Delete Them All
Rephrase for Neutrality
Keep As Is
CommentsCould we do something like, users we've come across? or at least something like that. Master Crash
While I agree that we should nuke the cool user list, I have the impression it would create a flame war as bad as the one over the removal of featured article. Thus, I'm kind of neutral on it. Glowsquid I havn't seen a flame war, yet, but its stupid to fight over something like this!
can i do two? 0_o Re-Add Banjo and Conker ArticlesNOT PASSED 8-9 I've been thinking about this for a long time, and this proposal is to gauge how users would react to the re-inclusion of Banjo and Conker info into the wiki. Banjo and Conker first appeared in Diddy Kong Racing, and their series developed out of that game. As such, Donkey Kong, Banjo, and Conker are believed to exist in a greater DK Universe (and an extension of the Marioverse). As we have been redefining our view of remakes, that they are not replacements but supplements to the originals, I feel Banjo and Conker should have a place here. Just because Diddy Kong Racing DS is a remake that removed these two characters does not mean Banjo and Conker don't have their origins in the Donkey Kong series. Ultimately, there are many reasons for their inclusion in this wiki, and many reasons for their exclusion. All are valid. I don't want to start any flame wars, and I do not want make this a big deal. Please keep all discussions about this respectful. I just want to see if a majority of users would like Banjo and Conker content reintegrated at this time, or if they do not. Somehow I feel this info will eventually become a part of the wiki, as they are part of the greater world Nintendo and Rare created out of the Donkey Kong series, but this may not happen for a long time. Here are the details of the proposal that would go into effect:
Proposer: Son of Suns Recreate Banjo and Conker Articles
Leave Banjo and Conker Articles Out of the Wiki
CommentsI agree on everything you have said except two things you may want to take into consideration
As Plumber said, an encyclopedia is for information. Using the "A kid could see it!" logic, any depiction of genitalia in paper encyclopedia should be censored since a kid can read it. Conker? I am kind of neutral on it. However, I'm all for the re-inclusion of banjo content sincee Titup, a minor character in both Banjo Kazzoie and Tooie (I think he was also in pilot, but not too sure.), reappered in DKRDS. Glowsquid Walkazo: Well, actually, Mario could be considered a spin-off of Donkey Kong. Glowsquid
To Plumber, we can import from Rare Wiki, but only Banjo and Conker content of course. We created that wiki, so we have the right to re-import the information. For crossovers, I think it depends on what the crossover features. For example, Super Smash Bros. features Mario, so it's one degree away from the Mario series. However, Wario vs. Bomberman features Wario, who is one degree away, so this crossover would be another degree away. Maybe? Well, we can sort all that out again later, but for now crossovers will be Secondary if this proposal passes. To others, this is an encyclopedia. We don't need to censor information for children. It's all available on Wikipedia anyways, which I am sure many of you frequent. And why should we censor information to children? Don't they have a right like any other person to choose what they want to learn about? And people have already asked if they could include other Zelda information and we simply explain they can't. Problem solved. I think Walkazo has the best reason for opposing: in her opinion, they are too far removed. Users have to decide how far they want to follow the spin-off series, as Banjo and Conker are spin-offs of spin-offs. I am willing to go that far. Well, that's my two cents. -- Son of Suns
SoS, for once, I disagree. Wikipedia, one out of a hgundred users is a kid. Mariowiki, I think you are like one of 3 adults. Why should us kids be penalized because of that? Max2 (talk)
Let me give my opinion... Leaving out of account whether a game like Conker's Bad Fur Day would be appropriate for children - why in the world would an article about that game be not appropriate for children in any way? The article describes the game. I guess the game is M rated because of containing violence? Well... so what? The article won't contain any violence! I don't understand why you seem to confuse promotion for a game with information about a game. Or do you think history lessons in school should be abolished in order to protect children from information about wars? Would be quite dumb, right? / Time Q 13:09, 15 September 2007 (EDT)
You both make some very good points. We will not be writing articles promoting the game or any behaviours in the game, but merely describe them academically, and respectably (if this proposal passes that is; it's something I believe in, but will not force upon people). It's not like we won't be sensitive to children in regards to certain material, but it doesn't need to be censored. These articles will be purely informative, and avoid raunchiness (we will use academic terms, instead of lower language). That's what Mario Wiki is all about - writing objective, informative articles. =) -- Son of Suns I wonder... Why we couldn't create a template that would warn the reader about offensive/innapropriate content and put it on the Conker Bad fur day-related page? Glowsquid
I think people are blowing this "sensory issue" way out of proportion. As Son of Suns said, we'd be using academic terms to describe the more mature subject matter, and since this is an encyclopedia and should contain all the information pertaining to Mario as we writers can find. It's not our fault if people find one thing or another offensive, as long as we write about it in good taste we're just writing the truth. Also, as SoS pointed out, there's no telling what people are going to get fussy over: I know people (myself included) who disapprove of Mario slaughteing thousands of Goombas on his way to save Peach - that's pretty violent. Then again, so's Bowser forcing his children to fight Mario, or Ash forcing his pet electric mouse to fight firebreathing dragons in Pokémon (and the Super Smash Bros. series)... The point is, there's a lot more than Conker's Bad Fur Day that will get (some) people mad on this site, and we can't help that. If worst comes to worst, we can put up a general warning on the main page. That way we can be sure no parents are gonna come busting our chops, and not have to worry about what subject matter would warrent the use of a "warning template" on an individual article. - Walkazo Max2, if they made a Mario First Person Shooter rated M, would we cover info in that? ~Uniju(T-C-E)
Well, Conker's Bad Fur Day is rated M for a reason. But we would not be promoting the rated M material, we would be describing academically, as Wikipedia does. I do believe Banjo and Conker are related to Mario, as they went on adventures with Donkey Kong and Diddy Kong prior to the events of Diddy Kong Racing, as stated by the instruction manual. They were all buddies before the events of the game. -- Son of Suns
I must also note there is a moral to Conker's Bad Fur Day. It's not just empty jokes - it all leads to a very dramatic and emotional climax, where a real lesson is taught to the players. -- Son of Suns
Just for the record, if a Mario First Person Shooter was made, we would cover it. It being a Mario game and this being a Mario wiki. -- I don't think the maturity thing is a valid oppose, as nothing should get in our way of contributing to the wiki and making more articles. If some really have a problem with a content, we could put {{mature}} on the top of the page. Also, Vruet, none of those series originated from the Smash series, so we wouldn't make any further articles about them. RXCUSE ME MR. DP!!! KIDS ARE OBNOXIOUS THESE DAYS!!! Forgive me, but what the H*** is THAT supposed to mean. We have hundreds of kids on hear already..... a couple weeks ago, I was one. And for the record, do you know how easy it is for a 11-12 yr. old to go onto sights based upon mature content? A MARIO WIKI will be the LAST thing Parents worry about. - Ultimatetoad
1. Sorry, mornings are always a bad time for me. Two. I was'nt actually FLAMIJNG him i don;t think, but his comment did insult half the users here. 3. In my opinion, they WOULDNT CARE. There's worse stuff out there then a game with a bit of gore, and little sexual innuendo in it. - Ultimatetoad
And, i've seen my cousin playing it, thats all there really is. I've seen worse stuff on average on any one episode of family guy, which children without cable can watch every sunday..... As for the too far removed stuff just how too far CAN it be? The DKC series is often considered a seperate series from the Mario one, and it obviously provides a different flavor then most mario games, but it's here. What about the Donkey Konga series? It's a spin-off of a Spin-off, but we cover that. - Ultimatetoad 1. Yes I know, again sorry. 2. the users here arent insulted by being called obnoxious? O.K, maybe half the users here arent kids, but I know at least two below the per-teen level. 3. I've seen sexual innuendo, in my cartoon watching days. on Cartoon Network and Nickolodeon. WORSE STUFF then this wiki wil convey. The Conker games, I'll admit, may not be appropriate for a 7 or 8 year old to play, but the wiki articles will be appropriate for them to read. - Ultimatetoad
I did not say we should take DKC out because it's too unique. I Meant we should leave it in. Again, it all comes down to how far wer're willing to go for a spin-off.... and heres another interesting thought: Was Rare planning the Banjo and Conker games BEFORE or AFTER Diddy Kong Racing? If before, they may have made the games even if DKR was cancelled.... which would have made all the difference, as therw would have been no connection to the marioverse. - Ultimatetoad Another thought: if we allow Banjo and Conker in here, and one day Bottles gets his own series, will we let that series in? - Ultimatetoad
A Banjo caharacter... that would be a spin-spin-spin-off. But, as far as i'm concerned, all things in mario's universe should be covered, and TipTup proves that banjo is indeed in Mario's universe. Conker, has no such proof that I know of, so whatever, but of Banjo we have facts that show his homeland is located in the same world as Mario and Donkey Kong's is... otherwise, how could TipTup have gotten there.? - Ultimatetoad
Maybe we should make a third category... and, for the record, Tiptup's appearence in BK and BT was'nt just a cameo, he was a tangible character that gave you rewards. - Ultimatetoad
Ummm... put the info on here? this is'nt a nintendo only wiki, we have info on games like Hotel MArio, even though there not Nintendo developed. Heck, we could even make an article on Microsoft and the XB360, if this passes through. - Ultimatetoad Conker's a bit harder to place, i'll admit... - Ultimatetoad And, heres a fun fact: There HAS been a MArio FPS. - Ultimatetoad I would agree to add Banjo but leave Conker out, not because of "It's too mature!. stuff (Which for me, is total b****ck.) but rather because there is no tie to the Marioverse past his appearance in Diddy Kong Racing. - Glowsquid, I reallty thinkthis need a 3rd option. There... two new options. - Ultimatetoad
Cobold Max2 & Xzelion: Since an option to add Banjo content but leave Conker out have been added, and your reasons for opposing are against Conker, could you please change your votes, or the reasons behind them? Glowsquid SOS, have you read ANY of these reasons? why did you take the two new things out. - Ultimatetoad
BJ is a stuffed head and Kazooie's an umbrella, THATS a cameo. But You can TALK to Tiptup, and he gives you items. Thats not a cameo. And also, is'nt this supposed to be a democracy? three users agree with this idea, but you don't so you can remove it? Did'nt you leave a few months back because another user was doing the same thing?!. - Ultimatetoad From an edit summaries: "It's either both or neither, as Banjo, Conker, Donkey Kong, and Diddy Kong are friends" + :You can't change the proposal like that. Banjo and Conker are friends. Their series emerged from Diddy Kong Racing, neither had a franchise before. Tiptup is not a Banjo character per-se, he can be considered a cameo character. I moved all votes to oppose, so you may have to change your comments or votes. Just pick yes Banjo and Kazooie appear in the Conker series, so those two series are connected that way. -- Son of Suns to both or no to both. If you accepte one you have to accept the other, as Tiptup is a cameo character. Also, The fact than they are "friends" is irrevalant (plus, it sound retarded.), Conker is completly absent Diddy Kong Racing DS, a remake of the original, some (including me) think that remake are of an higher level of canon than the original game, however, even if Banjo himself is not present, he still somehow have tie to the Marioverse since Titup, a minor Banjo character made an appearance in DKRDS, if they are not in the same world, how he managed to get there? However, the same can't be said for Conker, who has nothing to conect him to the Marioverse appart for his (rectconed) appearance in Diddy Kong Racing. Sincerely - Glowsquid You have to wait for this proposal to expire before creating a completely different one. This is the proposal. Users can't just go around changing every proposal, adding millions of options. I gave these two options, pick one or neither. Also, Slippas appear in Conker's Pocket Tales. -- Son of Suns
When did Donkey Kong go "adventuring with Conker"? and Actually, Glowsquid has a point. A certain type of fish may exist in both North America and Australia, but that deosnt mean it had to start out on either. A man named joe coolex, though can only be in one place at one thime: There can only be one of him. The same is true with the Slippas and tippy. - Ultimatetoad I just did some research - Armies could not be in CPT because it was released BEFORE DK64 ever came out. - Ultimatetoad
Still, the fact than some creatures in Conker Tales are simmilar to other DK creatures is for me, irevalant. Creature that looked, acted and (Not sure) named exactly after the Chain-Chomps appeared in a few Zelda games as enemies. Should we star doing Zelda article because of that? Glowsquid Armies are in Donkey Kong Country. Banjo: Even before the start of his future partnership with Kazooie, Banjo isn't one to turn down the chance of an adventure. So when Squawks brings the message from his pal Diddy Kong, the Honey Bear stuffs a few things into his trusty backpack and takes to his heels. Conker: Another friend made by Diddy Kong on one of his endless adventures with Donkey Kong, Conker is also an exploration nut who'll jump at any chance to break free of a squirrel's less than exciting daily routine. He's eager to join with Banjo as the bear passes through. + This proves a connection between Diddy Kong, Donkey Kong, Conker, and Banjo. Plus Squawks the Parrot delivers letters to Conker and Banjo, as stated in the story. The parrot does not deliver a letter to Timber or Tiptup or any other character, as the rest besides Krunch live on Timber's Island. Diddy Kong wants extra help, so he sends Squawks to the homes of Banjo and Conker, who do not live on Timber's Island. The Banjo and Conker series emerged from the Donkey Kong series. If DKR was a flop, the Banjo and Conker series may have not been created. It's not all about characters, it's about where franchises come from. The WarioWare series comes from the Wario and Mario series, but no WarioWare characters have ever appeared in a Mario game. Does that mean we don't include those characters? No Conker characters have appeared in a Donkey Kong game. It's the same thing. And the same species cannot emerge in two different places. Law of natural selection prevents that. -- Son of Suns How does that little selection prove anything? Donkey is'nt even MENTIONED in Banjo's profile. and snakes are a very common basis for enemies, CPT and DKC have very different graphical styles, I see no way for you to conclude that these snames in Conker's Pocket Tales are Slippas. - Ultimatetoad
Should the WarioWare series be removed from the wiki as Wario is the only major connection? -- Son of Suns For what we know, Banjo and COnker games may have been in making before Diddy Kong Racing, wheter Diddy Kong Racing may have allowed these two guys to have a game is pure speculation. Unlike Conker, The Wario Ware character didn't get removed in a remake of thhe original game. Glowsquid
I'm not really arguing with you, SOS, but while the link between Banjo and DK is a Character, Conker's link is practically nothing. - Ultimatetoad Think in terms of franchises. Say Mona got a game that took place in a new world, with all new characters, with no references to Wario or anything else from the WarioWare series, we would cover that series, right? Also, I think I am upset that my proposal was changed. I have no hard feelings against anyone, but you can't just subvert the whole proposal. If you just want Banjo, you'll have to oppose this proposal then start a new one later. -- Son of Suns
Right. I'm NOT disagreeing, again (you'll notice my vote is still in the C&B section). The reason those other options were created were to suit some users who felt that way. (Many other proposals, I will point out, have more than one option) I still agree with putting Banjo & Conker in the wiki. - Ultimatetoad I know. Again, this is the proposal I wanted. If you want something different, wait until this proposal expires. Okay. New start. -- Son of Suns Mario was briefly mentioned in Banjo & Kazzoie, just wanted to point that out. Glowsquid
A poster of Berri can be found in Banjo-Tooie. -- Sir Grodus I'd just like to address some earlier statements: WarioWare isn't really a spin-off of the Wario series, since it still stars Wario. I think of it as a sorta sub-series, like Donkey Konga is for Donkey Kong. Wario and Donkey Kong are clearly main characters in the Marioverse, so there should be no question about whether or not these sub-series should be included. - Walkazo I find kind of funny how everyone is complaining about the possibly offensive content on the Conker-related page, and yet, the Bob Hoskins page is not censored. Glowsquid Hey, kids? All this talk about who was in what is irrelevent. OMG, Chain Chomp-like characters in a Zelda game? That's called a cameo, put it in the trivia section for Chain Chomp. This is getting out of hand. The proposal is for Conker and Donkey Kong, focus on the simple part of that for now. If it comes to pass that all is readded, we can debate about the inclusion of mature content and Tiptup then. -- New Subject ArticlesREGULATE 6-0 This proposal would put a bit stricter standards on what articles can be created on new subjects (i.e. those with the Newsubject template). While most are fine, such as the Super Smash Bros. Brawl articles, some are not. I am mostly referring to the mass of fan conjecturally named Super Mario Galaxy articles. Many creatures and planets are given conjectural names, despite the fact they may disappear entirely, or may never be officially named (the planets may just be a part of greater officially named galaxies, and should just be described in the galaxy article in the first place). This proposal would not delete all these articles. They will stay until they can be organized when Super Mario Galaxy and other games are released. However, if this proposal passes, all new subject articles will be regulated from that point on. The criteria would be that the subject must be officially named by some means. Although these names are still considered conjecture until the game is released, they are still officially conjectured names, and will have a name (even if it's changed) when the game is released. All other conjectural information that is not officially named should go in the unreleased game's article (or in the articles of species, characters, places, etc.). The information is fine, but it's not article worthy. Proposer: Son of Suns Regulate the Creation of New Subject Articles
Allow the Creation of Fan Named New Subject ArticlesCommentsAgain, I will note this proposal will not delete all these articles in one fell swoop. You can argue on individual talk pages if you think a certain article should be merged, and take action if there is a consensus. Or you can just wait for the game to come out before making changes. But if this proposal passes, we won't allow something like this Super Mario Galaxy article fiasco happen again. -- Son of Suns Add Banjo-Kazooie ArtcilesDO NOT ADD BANJO CONTENT 2-7 The RecentAdd Banjo - Conker Articles proposer was denied, mainly because of Conker. People thought that he was either too mature, or too hfar removed. Banjo however, has no such problems. His games have all been rated E so far, and the inclusion of Tiptup in Diddy Kong Racing, Diddy Kong Racing DS, Banjo-Kazooie, and Banjo-Tooie, Seems to me worthy to merit Babjo for inclusion on this wiki. As previously stated, Tiptup's appearence in BK - BT was not a cameo- he was alive , and tangible. Nor was it a simple cross-over: Banjo's first appearence was DKR, making the series a SPINOFF of Mario. Other series that included Mario characters/enemies (LoZ,F-Zero, Tetris....) were made with there title characters first appearing in one of there own games. Sooo... vote, and all. Proposer: UltimateToad Add Banjo Articles
Keep Them Out
CommentsWalkthrougth-style level article.ALLOW WALKTHROUGH ARTICLES 7-8 Most article about level's are fine, however a few (BLIZZARD!!! is a big offender.) read like something out of a player guide. Level articles should state:
This is an encyclopedia, an article shouldn't tell where to find that last Flower or how to defeat Koin. If I want that kind of information, I'll go on Gamefaq. Proposer: Glowsquid Prevent the creation of that kind of article and rewrite those already here.
Allow the creation of this style of article.
CommentsSoS: There is a distinction betweeen describing what happen in a level and telling the reader what to do. Describing how the level jump from a fortress theme to a lava theme, forest theme... ect and what happen in each portion is interessing and encyclopedic. However, telling the reader how to get the DK Coin hiden by the Zinger in Castle Crush isn't encyclopedic. How is the fact that the fith Red Coin can only be accessed by geting the key and killing the Coin Bandit behind the door encyclopedic and revalent to the Marioverse? I agree we should describe in-depth, but we shouldn't go overboard. Sincerely, Glowsquid
Also, if we just ignore this, the Wiki will be scrap full because of some levels not like this, while a bunch are, making it a mess! We must get rid of all walkthrough to make it seem more perfersonal, like Wikipedia itself. File:MiniMario.pngMinimariolover10 TALK TO ME ABOUT MINIES!! Lario: Not really, a level article can be detailed without having to read like a walkthrought. I think I'll do an example. Detailled Style (Note, all of this is amde up.): "Grab these Coins!" is the sixth level of World 2 in Yoshi's Revenge. The level initially start out in a castle filled with lava, however, the subsequent section take place in a cave full of Bandits." ect. Walthrought-style: "Yoshi should jump on the raillift paltfrom above to gain acces to a bunch of red-coins, try to avoid the jumping sparky and try to defeat all the Fly-Guys holding the red-coins. Then, jump on all the Para-Troopa to get the flower..." ect. (I think you get the idea.) See? You can have plenty of info without making it seem like a walkthrought. - Glowsquid I am striking my vote through, so it won't count in the end, but I want my original reasonings to stay. Also, others agree with my original assessment, that a walkthrough style article is fine, and their votes are still valid. As Glowsquid stated, articles like this won't be deleted on sight, so I don't mind what the wiki decides on how these articles are written. I doesn't matter to me whether they are walkthrough style or not, just as long as they are not deleted. -- Son of Suns Moogle and Stumper: Yes, what happen in the levels is canon. But there is a problem, for what we know, Yoshi might not have got the fourth flower in Make Eggs, Throw Eggs, Donkey Kong might not have found the Bonus Barrel in Reptile Rumble, an article about a level should describe what happen in this level, not tell the player how to do this level. Knowing that X level is the only appearance of the Ghost Barrel is encyclopedic, telling the reader how to get the third flower in Watch Out Below! isn't. as I said earlier, Mushroom Way is a great example on how a level article can be detailled without falling into walkthrought-style writting. Glowsquid
To all who say thaat what happen in the level is canon: Yes, you are right. But the problem is, we don't know what happened exactly in this level! Nintendo never told "Yoshi jumped on X and then collected X thingie." For what we know, Yoshi might never have bothered to collect these coins and might have accesed the Extra level by other means. Plus, how is the fact tht X flower is in X location in X levels revelant to the Marioverse? Should we tell the location of every ? Block? Glowsquid
I am not saying BLIZZARD!!! is the best article, but even if it is re-written, it should state the location of important items, just as the Mushroom Way article does (regardless if the article says "Yoshi had to go under the snow to get a Flower" or "a Flower is located under a pile of snow in the second section of the level"). -- Son of Suns
Improvement Drive IdeaADD THE DRIVE 9-2 I think we should have a project similar to Featured Articles and the Pipe Plaza, where, instead of pointing out the best articles, we point out the ones that need Work, so users can all work on one project, instead of everyone editing the "featured article" status ones, and leaving articles like Doopliss un-edited. The process would be similar to Featured Articles. We make a new page about the project, where we come together and list the articles we think are shortest, but have potential. Then, we might make a box on the main page to show what the article is. Each article will get one week on the main page, again, similar to Featured Articles. I know no-one may say yes cause I'm not someone who edits, but I think this would help users, ecspecially new users, who may be nervous making an article. This does not mean we will have stub articles, and I frankly think this project will prevent them. Proposer: Max2 Give it a Try
Nah
CommentsAre you thinking about something like MarioWiki: PAIR; or an Improvement Drive, where we pick one article a week or month, feature it somewhere and encourage all users to work on it? Or are you thinking something else? It would be nice to get a better sense of what you are thinking, cause I am all for helping users getting active and making improvements. -- Son of Suns Yeah, an Improvement Drive. That's exactly what I mean! Max2 (talk) Okay. I think you need to clarify some points. You should state above what this would entaiil exactly. For starters, you can answer these questions and put them in the proposal itself. Would users vote for an article to be improved (the one with the most votes gets featured)? Would the article be featured for a week, a month, etc.? And would the article be featured on the main page (like, This Week (or month)'s Collaboration is: so and so) with a link to that page? -- Son of Suns Ok. Is this clarified enough? Max2 (talk) I added descriptions of the aspects of the project, how to set it up, and why I think it would work.
Well, as most users say, the goal for every article would be to become an FA. i'm ont saying we only improve articles that can be FA articles, this is mainly just to cut back on stubs and short articles. Max2 (talk)
It seems to be sort of popular with the crowd. Except Plumber. Max2 (talk)
I wish more people knew about MarioWiki at MFGG, then we'd sure get a lot of new users! Though I hope kingmetroid doesn't come. File:MiniMario.pngMinimariolover10 TALK TO ME ABOUT MINIES!! While many simillar idea have all been tried (and failed miserably.), this one seem to actually have a decent following, why not give it a try? Glowsquid I guess I would. or let someone else take over it if they want. And, Xz, this wouldn't fail. We might not get every article up to like FA Status, but people will work on it. I also know me being in charge was likely a "no" factor, and I'm not saying to change your vote, only that the whole thing is actually well thought out and simple enough that anybody could join in on it. Max2 (talk) "Representing"KEEP AS IS 6-1 Many articles say they look similar or represent when just because they are the same representing species. For an example, Sidestepper's trivia says that they resemble Dovo, however they don't. Dovos do not like anything like a Sidestepper, and they probably weren't even remembering Sidesteppers when making the game. Sure, some represent other things, but not most of them. I'm saying to remove the trivia that says that they represent these that aren't truly representing. Proposper: Minimariolover10 Support
Oppose
CommentsYes, I know, but in some cases it isn't connecting. File:MiniMario.pngMinimariolover10 TALK TO ME ABOUT MINIES!!And about it not being worthy, I want other users to know SOME don't look similar so they could clear it if another doing this job is missing it.
Subsized CategorysKEEP AS IS 1-1 Every once in a while, a category that can have too few enteries shows up. Such as Category:X-Naut's Weapons (Though it's deleted), so I think that those should be prevented like stub articles. Proposer: Lario Prevent Them
Keep Them
CommentsI think we should just do a case by case basis, like new articles. We ask: "Is there enough for its inclusion?" There's no way to prevent someone from creating categories - we just have to decide if they are needed when it happens. I don't think this proposal can do much, so I am not voting either way. -- Son of Suns
FA SupportNO QUORUM 1-2 The FA system was replaced numerous times, only to go back to the same flawed system. No mistake has been corrected that a supporter must give a reason to support, and I have seen many users support saying "I like character he should be an FA". Well, no longer.
Support
Oppose
CommentsSo I'm clear, your's proposing that users have better reasons for voting on FAs, right? -- You are not clear enough, if you mean that support vote for FA should have a better reason, I deffinatelly agree. Glowsquid
X's right let's take down those votes User:Mr. Guy It's not just AmericaNO NEED FOR CHANGE 3-5 This is something that upsets me greatly almost everywhere, not just on this site; people seem to assume that the only place where games are released in English is America. In most of the profiles here, things are said to have happened in "the American version." I want this stopped; it's not fair on other English-speaking countries. It should be refferred to as the "English version," or at the very least, "the American and European version." Proposer: Davidk92 Support
Pers, I agrees...NO NEED FOR CHANGE 1-11 Okay every time I go on here I noticed several users say "Per ___" "I agree" or "___ is right" but I think these shouldn't be said all the time because whoever say those are to lazy to think of something. Proposer: Mr. Guy Prevent constant these
Just let them
FanvotesSPLIT VOTE; NO QUORUM 3-3 Okay on several featured article pages there are fan votes, however due to a recent fight this is getting nowhere so let's just have a proposal on it. Prevent them
Keep Them
"Creative" headerKEEP CREATIVE HEADERS 4-6 Some lenghty article are broke up in section, each section having it own header. Some article, such as Yoshi have section-header that differ from the plain (Insert name of the game here.) formula. The problem is, those header make the wiki look informal and amateurish ("Humble Beginnings " is not something that I would qualify as profesionnal, really.), also, the fact than there is two style of headers might confuse the new users. This can really get confusing if the section don't mention the name of the game (Which is quite often.), the proposal is to get rid of all these "creative" header and replace them with more professional-sounding one. Proposer: Glowsquid Crush 'em
Let them be
CommentsSOS: By "confusing", I meant it might confuse the new user on hwo to write those headers, what to do, a creative header or a plain one? Glowsquid
One of the problems with this proposal is that some articles, such as Goomba, group many games under one header. It would be foolish to split the header into multiple headers listing each game, especially when there is not a lot of information. Also, a long header listing every game in that section would not make sense. And, according to MarioWiki: Chronology, headers should be listed in a relative chronological order. If we just stick to game names as headers, we would have two Mario & Luigi: Partners in Time sections in certain articles. I guess I am confused what a "creative" header is or not. That is a very relative term. What would this proposal do exactly? What is a "professional" header? I do believe the header needs to give reference to the events of the game and the name of the game needs to be mentioned in the section, but I don't believe a header needs to simply say the name of the game. Sections are supposed to name the game they are talking about - that's the source of the information. It's wiki policy, but some users may have forgot to put the name of the game in. We simply need to correct those errors. So.....what would this proposal change? -- Son of Suns
I don't think splitting up an header in each is "foolish, like you say. They appear in a game, it's notable. There's not a lot of information? Add some more! As for the Goomba appeatring in both past and presents in PIT... well, I can't say anything about that.
To Fixitup: The thing about "Prince On the Rise" is that no one's going to understand what it's talking about. If I was looking for a section in an article on Mario Superstar Baseball how would I know to look for it under "Prince on the Rise". I'd have to scroll down the entire article looking for the right section, and if it is a large article like Bowser or Mario that'd take a while. I'd rather be able to navigate the site quickly and efficiently than have interesting headers. Besides, the information itself is interesting enough as far as I'm concerned, it's about Mario after all! - Walkazo
Move Chat Exclusively to ForumDO NOT MOVE 4-8 The Super Mario Wiki has two primary functions: one – create the greatest database of Mario knowledge in the world, and two – unite a community of Mario fans to a common place. The wiki has been successful in both areas, although at times these two areas interfere with each other. Users interested in the community have used the encyclopedia as a playground for fun. Issues in the chat have flamed wars in the wiki, etc. This could turn off potential new users, users who could be great writers and know a lot about the Mario series. I think we need to make the distinction between the two functions clearer. Therefore, I am proposing that we move the Chat exclusively to the forum. Since the forum is a seperate website from the main wiki, new users will not encounter all the fighting in the chat, which is easily accessible from the wiki right now. As such, most community related content will be located off the main wiki. The wiki is first and foremost an encyclopedia, and should be treated professionally (but with fun). However, this would not deny community-focused members a forum and chat for their ideas and randomness. The areas will just be more distinct. User sub-pages will still be allowed, so users can still collaborate on comics and stories. I am just tired of problems in the chat affecting the main wiki, when I feel they should be dealt with on the forum where more community related content is located. Sysops can work on the encyclopedia, while moderators can monitor the forum and chat. As such, sysops can hopefully work on the wiki without having to manage community-related problems. Don't get me wrong. Both parts of the wiki are important - but they should not interfere with each other. Right now, I think the chat is one of the main interferences that can be remedied by moving it to the community-based forum. Proposer: Son of Suns Move Chat to Forum
Leave Chat on Wiki
CommentsOnly problem about this, is not everyone has an email address (needed to access chat on the forums) and wish to chat are at a crossroads. wel, it'll prevent spam, and also silver mario! :P
It might create a bad impression, the forum is a sub-section of the wiki. And if you have to register to do it it might put off those who just want to see what the place is like.
REGULATE ISSUES ON MAIN PAGE 6-2 After talking a bit with Son of Suns, I think that community-related issue should'nt be brought up on the Main page talk. Why? First, the constant drama make us look like a bunch of idiots, remmember when Max2 threatened to leave for the first time, or when Wayoshi was revealed to be a spammer on the chat? Those ridiculous events very likely turned a lot of potential users off. You hate a guy and want to ramble on how much of a waste of carbon he is? Fine, but do it on the forum, geez. Second: This site is an encyclopedia, something most seem to forgot. You can chat with anyone at any time via the chat or the User talkpage, you can create sub-page that are not even related to editing such as sprite comic or fan-fiction archive, you can upload fours personnal image of your and waste our precious image space, this is being very generous. Some may being more inclinated toward the community side, I understand this choice. But please, don't mess with the editing space! This can be very annoying for users that don't want to be involved in more social-activities. Proposer: Glowsquid Prevent community-stuff from being brought up on the Main Page Talk.
No, let it stay the same.
CommentsWayoshi's event had significant effect on the wiki itself, as he resigned from his administrative rights. It's a somehow bad example. - Cobold (talk · contribs) 12:37, 1 October 2007 (EDT)
Willy on Wheel = The guy who made an enormemous amount of sockpuppet and vandalised the wiki. Hope to have helped. Glowsquid Wayoshi/Willy also hacked into Hk's account and vandalized the main page. First: When you came to the wiki, was the main page talk the first place you went to? Didn't think so. And second: User talk disscusions are hard to follow, as they cover multiple pages and if you don't know exactly what your looking for, you'll never come accross it randomly. Third: Suppose you are a guest visiting the forums and here about march of the Willys, you've got no clue what it is and it dousn't tell you anywhere, you don't wan't to register just to ask the question, so would probobly you try the main page. Fourth: Please don't say things like; "this probobly stoped a lot of users from registering" you need proof before you say thing like that, and I'm sick of it. And don't bash the comunity side of the wiki, it's rude, and just because you don't like it, doesn't mean it's harming the wiki.
Peachy:
Glowsquid has a point, Peachy... ~Uniju(T-C-E) About what?
I think you two (Glowsquid and Peachycakes 3.14) are handling this pretty well so far. It's nice to debate. However, I do want to say that I don't think Glowsquid is "bashing" the Mario Wiki community by creating this proposal. Sure he has different values when it comes to the wiki (as do I), but I don't think he hates the community. The fact that he created a proposal to let the community decide shows he values what the community as a whole has to say. If this proposal does not go through, I'm sure Glowsquid will be content knowing the community decided what should happen. And that's all I have to say about that. -- Son of Suns Please don't mention what happened about me earlier. It still bothers me. Also, I think we should just monitor worthless sections about comics & user stuff and leave it to wiki issues. Wa
We shouldn't limmit stuff we can talk about. Sure, things like "Super mario world is the ROXORZ" shouldn't be written, but we shouldn't outright ban all stuff to do with the comunity on the main page. Ermmm... at the limit, thing involving both the community AND the encyclopedia could be accepted (Such as someone hacking into another user account and messing with it.), however thing like "That guy said something mean on the chat and he hate us all!" shouldn't be brought up on the Main Page talk, we have a forum for this kind of thing. Glowsquid Articles on WebsitesREMOVE ARTICLES ON WEBSITES 9-3 A while ago, the Smash Bros. DOJO!! article was created. It's, up to now, undecided whether we should create articles on websites. Proposer: Cobold (talk · contribs) Delete articles on Websites
Create articles on Websites
CommentsTo Uniju: Websites are not part of the Marioverse, but neither are most of the games themselves. Mario and Luigi don't have a copy of Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga at their house. Should we get rid of video game articles then? Websites are sources of canonical information, just like video games are. -- Son of Suns
I was only referring to official sites of course. You should know me by now. =P All I am saying is that we have articles about the official "sources" of the fictional universe, such as games, comics, and movies. Why should that be different for websites? -- Son of Suns
Okay, what are we? We're a Wiki about the Super Mario Bros. series that goes very in depth. Sources that are not from video games are considered non-canon. No other specifications given that will say anything about websites. So, we're not going to find our answer in that definition. Let's look further: definition of Mario video games -- labors of the developers that provide us with in-universe information. Other mediums, such as TV, are considered non-canon. BINGO! Check it: other mediums -- TV, movies, comics, toys, commercials, magazine articles regarding game storylines, conclusions made and names given in unofficial strategy guides. Wouldn't websites be considered another medium? OH, SNAP! That brings in lots of gray area, don't it? What I would do if I were you is to look at each website and consider: can this be put as a section on a game article (like the zillion websites from Nintendo.com)? Should it be placed as a secondary source on the links page (ie IGN, etc)? Should it get it's own article? Anyway, my opinion about DOJO is that it should be put under the game's article. But I don't favor making a policy for everything! Stumpers! 12:07, 8 October 2007 (EDT)
Deleting stubsDO NOT DELETE STUBS 9-5 It seems we have a rule that any new Stub articles are to be deleted. However I think that instead the rewrite template should be placed on the article, and if it isn't rewritten in a certain amount of time, it will be deleted, as simply deleting new Stub articles may discourage some newer users, also having SOME info should be better then having NONE, right?
Support
Oppose
CommentsDP, what if its something small that doesn't have a lot of info to put? Should we make some kind of list, "Articles that aren't big enough to be articles"? ~Uniju(T-C-E)
I'm just pointing out what I have observed after over a year at this wiki. For example, a lot of Super Paper Mario article stubs are still stubs. No one has expanded them. And I do know a lot of users feel special when they create an article. It becomes like a child. You made that before anyone else could! All this shouldn't be the case on the wiki. It's sad that is how people act - any article should be expanded because of an expand tag. But I think a lot of users are attracted to the prospect of creating an article without actually putting the effort into expanding it. Therefore, by deleting new stubs, users will be forced to actually put effort into creating a new article and find a new appreciation for the research needed to create a new article, not the opiate of simply creating a new article. -- Son of Suns
For me, the problem is not the concept of delleting the stub itself, but rather the "standart" for a stub size. For example, Do-Drop describe the appearance of the creature, it's behavior and where it's found, and yet, it's tagged as a stub. I saw quite a few good article delleted because they were shorter than the average size. However, I agree that one-liner like "Pirate Goomba is a pirate Goomba" or "Elder is a character in Super Mario Rpg: Legend of the Sevens Stars" should be delleted. Glowsquid
Just wondering, why do we delete new stubs and not old ones? There's no real difference.
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-I'll just descibe if I met/talked to them and how I helped them or how they helped me.
I think it's a great idea, and could work.
