Editing Talk:Worlds A-C human

==What to do about the unresolved identity of Worlds A-C human==
{{Settled TPP}}
{{Proposal outcome|failed|2-5-0-6|Do not add <nowiki>{{Lost}}</nowiki> and do not mention Goro Itoi}}
The identity of the caricature at the end of Worlds A, B, and C of ''[[All Night Nippon: Super Mario Bros.]]'' has been a pretty long-standing mystery, before we even split them to their own page. Presently, the article only mentions the hypothesis that it's Tsuruko Shofukutei, who was also the host of a Saturday night show (the phrasing on the current article is unclear if it was All Night Nippon, and due to the source's language barrier, we can't tell which one it is); however, we've seen [http://sydlexia.com/all_night_nippon_smb.htm another source] instead hypothesize one Goro Itoi, a former host of All Night Nippon who passed away back in 1984. Given the eyebrows and nose, as well as the secretive nature of his presence/the fact he is confirmed to be a former host, we can believe it personally, even though it also lacks any confirmation.

Short of contacting All Night Nippon staff and ''asking'' who it's supposed to be--an action that only works if they themselves even remember, mind you--we can only really speculate for the time being. So, uh, with two distinct hypotheses and a lack of answers, what do we do in the meantime? We'd like to pitch 2 distinct things:
* Adding the Goro Itoi hypothesis to the article: Self-explanatory. Either in tandem with, or replacing, the Tsuruko Shofukutei hypothesis.
* Adding the new <nowiki>{{Lost}}</nowiki> template: At more of a stretch, given we know this has to be, ''a'' person, but we don't know who, we think this is suitable for considering "lost" for the time being.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Camwoodstock}}<br>
'''Deadline''': February 10, 2025, 23:59 GMT

===Acknowledge both the Tsuruko Shofukutei and Goro Itoi hypotheses, append <nowiki>{{Lost}}</nowiki>===
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Secondary option, but it's listed first as it's the maximal case. While it feels weird to call the identity of a person "lost media" in the traditional sense, the term "lost media" ''has'' been a term used before when describing other such "know what it is, but missing the identity" cases, such as the origin of the Backrooms image, or more relevant, the "Celebrity No. 6" case.
#{{User|Rykitu}} Per proposal.
#{{User|EvieMaybe}} seems reasonable!
<s>#{{User|SolemnStormcloud}} The Backrooms and Celebrity No. 6 comparisons seem fair to me. Per proposal.</s>

===Same as above, do NOT append <nowiki>{{Lost}}</nowiki>===
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} Primary option, and to be honest, we don't even think this is particularly controversial. The only reason we're putting this to proposal is because we could see the addition/exclusion of the <nowiki>{{Lost}}</nowiki> template as being controversial.
#{{User|Hewer}} This is admittedly the first I'm hearing of the "Lost" template, but based on its text it seems to be for works that are unavailable rather than [[Template:Conjecture|characters we don't know the name of]].
#{{User|Jdtendo}} I would not refer to missing information about a character as "lost media". It's not like there ever was an official confirmation of the character's identity that has been lost to time. Other than that, both hypotheses seem credible enough to be in the article.
#{{User|Ahemtoday}} I'd definitely consider this more similar to a conjectural name than lost media.
#{{User|Axii}} Per all.
#{{User|EvieMaybe}} secondary choice, per Jdtendo and Waluigi Time
<s>#{{User|SolemnStormcloud}} Secondary choice; per all.</s>

<s>#{{User|Waluigi Time}} Per all, there's a difference between lost media and information we just don't have.</s>

===Mention Goro Itoi hypothesis, remove Tsuruko Shofukutei hypothesis===

===Status Quo (Do not mention Goro Itoi hypothesis, keep Tsuruko Shofukutei hypothesis)===
#{{User|Platform}} - [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%AC%91%E7%A6%8F%E4%BA%AD%E9%B6%B4%E5%85%89 Tsuruko Shofukutei] was by far the most popular host for All Night Nippon at the time of his departure. The sprite clearly matches his haircut and nose. [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%B3%B8%E5%B1%85%E4%BA%94%E9%83%8E Goro Itoi] left the show five years before the release of the game. [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%B3%B8%E5%B1%85%E4%BA%94%E9%83%8E%E3%81%AE%E3%82%AA%E3%83%BC%E3%83%AB%E3%83%8A%E3%82%A4%E3%83%88%E3%83%8B%E3%83%83%E3%83%9D%E3%83%B3 Itoi's show] was pure music, there was very little talking or any other content. Listeners didn't get to know him much. [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%AC%91%E7%A6%8F%E4%BA%AD%E9%B6%B4%E5%85%89%E3%81%AE%E3%82%AA%E3%83%BC%E3%83%AB%E3%83%8A%E3%82%A4%E3%83%88%E3%83%8B%E3%83%83%E3%83%9D%E3%83%B3 Tsuruko's show] was filled with dirty jokes and listeners got to know his personality. His show was also the longest lasting until he left. Sydlexia's webpage is the source of all the Itoi hypothesis but there's nothing to back it up. It even advocates Tamori as the inspiration for the [[Pakkun OkaP]], because he clearly did not have access to [https://www.gamingalexandria.com/highquality/fds/All%20Night%20Nippon%20Super%20Mario%20Brothers/All%20Night%20Nippon%20Super%20Mario%20Brothers.pdf the manual] and was just guessing.
#{{User|SolemnStormcloud}} Per Platform.
#{{User|Waluigi Time}} Per Platform.

===Comments (I'm having an identity crisis!!)===
I think you forgot to label this as a proposal. {{User:Rykitu/sig}}
:Whoops. Added that! {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 20:35, January 27, 2025 (EST)

I find it interesting that this same page also attributes [[Pakkun OkaP]] to be a cameo of this ANN host called Tamori, rather than Sunplaza Nakano like our wiki states. The page also states that everyone but Goro Itoi is listed in the manual, so that means Tamori ''has'' to be listed in the manual as well, right? Can anyone verify that, or is this a mistake? {{User:Arend/sig}} 12:33, January 28, 2025 (EST)
:considering the Nakano enemy is named [[OkaP]], i think it's fair to assume both OkaPs are Sunplaza. i have no idea where the linked page got the idea that the piranha plants are Tamori. {{User:EvieMaybe/sig}} 16:14, January 28, 2025 (EST)
::I think they were likening the white bits on top of Pakkun OkaP's head to Tamori's short hair, even though the sprite shows no white on the sides of the head, and overall matches closer to [[:File:ANN OkaP manual artwork.jpg|Sunplaza's artwork]] than the OkaP sprite does. {{User:Arend/sig}} 05:25, January 29, 2025 (EST)
:::Tamori is not in [https://www.gamingalexandria.com/highquality/fds/All%20Night%20Nippon%20Super%20Mario%20Brothers/All%20Night%20Nippon%20Super%20Mario%20Brothers.pdf the manual]. It clearly states that it is Sunplaza Nakano, which led me to doubt Sydlexia's Itoi conjecture. [https://youtu.be/yTX-DYF6I3E?t=240 Kikai], who holds the world's largest collection of Mario memorabilia and contributes articles for ''[[Nintendo DREAM]]'', was the first to suggest Tsuruko and I have to agree. Tsuruko is a shock jock in the mold of Nakano and Howard Stern. He has recurring segments, bits, and guests come on his show. Itoi's program was the opposite. Itoi simply announce the title of the next song he would play and then air the vinyl. There was no other content to his show. It seems ridiculous that the programmers of the game would skip the most popular host in ANN's history up to that point to give tribute to a more obscure host that retired five years earlier.--[[User:Platform|Platform]] ([[User talk:Platform|talk]]) 07:55, January 29, 2025 (EST)
::::Out of curiosity, can you vouch if Tsuruko Shofukutei was on All Night Nippon at any point? A large portion of our skepticism for that hypothesis admittedly comes from the fact that the sources are unclear if he was part of the cast thanks to the inherit language barrier. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 14:06, January 29, 2025 (EST)
:::::Tsuruko was the longest serving host of ANN at the time of departure. He was so popular that he was nicknamed '''"Mr. All Night Nippon"''', thus wedding the identity of the entire programming block to him despite appearing only once a week. You can google translate his [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%AC%91%E7%A6%8F%E4%BA%AD%E9%B6%B4%E5%85%89 Japanese wiki page] and [https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E7%AC%91%E7%A6%8F%E4%BA%AD%E9%B6%B4%E5%85%89%E3%81%AE%E3%82%AA%E3%83%BC%E3%83%AB%E3%83%8A%E3%82%A4%E3%83%88%E3%83%8B%E3%83%83%E3%83%9D%E3%83%B3 his show]. The sprite shows a man in a wacky position, which suggests he is a comedian. Tsuruko is in fact a comedian who has done that pose as seen on the [https://aa1064168.hatenablog.com/entry/2023/02/05/013751 vinyl cover]. Itoi is much older than Tsuruko (by 27 years) and not as "hip" with the youth. Itoi is not a comedian; his program was minimalist and focused on introducing foreign songs to Japan.--[[User:Platform|Platform]] ([[User talk:Platform|talk]]) 19:51, January 29, 2025 (EST)
::::::That makes a lot more sense, thank you very much! We still think the Goro Itoi hypothesis is worth noting on the off-chance it's him (the face still suggests to us Goro, though the pose is ''definitely'' more Tsuruko, especially if that vinyl cover is to be believed), so we're not canning the proposal or nothing unless some Act Of God causes the All Night Nippon crew to confirm an identity for this dude, but we definitely understand the Tsuruko hypothesis a ''lot'' more than we previously did. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 20:13, January 29, 2025 (EST)
:::::::I don't think Itoi looks like the sprite. While both men have a 70/30 cut, Itoi's [https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR0RHOCMyGKtJq5sAPclsLLhPz1GJ7cld_Rtg&s haircut is too short]. Tsuruko has that 70's style long hair where his bangs reaches his ears. Tsuruko also has a much larger nose. Most importantly, I don't think the programmers would choose anyone else other than "Mr. All Night Nippon" to be the secret character of ''All Night Nippon:SMB''.--[[User:Platform|Platform]] ([[User talk:Platform|talk]]) 21:10, January 29, 2025 (EST)
::::::::You make a pretty good case for Tsuroko Shofukutei, Platform, that I almost want to add the Goro Itoi and Tamori identities to the list of rumors and urban legends if the status quo option passes...except I could've sworn I've read that there's an apparent ANN broadcast confirming Goro Itoi as the identity. Maybe I'm misremembering... [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 21:41, January 29, 2025 (EST)