Talk:Mrs. Thwomp
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Should she actually be considered a Thwomp?[edit]
She looks nothing like a Thwomp (unlike her husband) and the JP name doesn't invoke it whatsoever; for all we know, she's only called "Mrs. Thwomp" in Western localizations because she's married to Mr. Thwomp, who is clearly a Thwomp. (On another note, I'm curious if they're husband and wife in the original script or if that's a thing exclusive to translations...) Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 12:25, April 11, 2020 (EDT)
- Also, her face looks more like that one of a Whomp, despite having more teeth, but i think she should be declassified anyways. --
FanOfYoshi at 14:00, April 11, 2020 (EDT)
- In general, I think we should be cautious about cases of possible “transcreation” - meaning instances where the translation is based on an in-progress version of the original script or written concurrently with it in development. In the case of Partners in Time, like its predecessor, we know that the North American release is technically an earlier build than the Japanese release from the numerous revisions the game had (though unlike Superstar Saga, the European release carried many alterations over). It's entirely possible that "Mrs. Thwomp" was named as such because it may have been a localization of an unfinalized name. I'd be interested to know if she is called a Thwomp in guides, though it would make more sense that she is one since the area where she is fought is called Thwomp Volcano. That being said, her facial features do admittedly resemble a Whomp more than a Thwomp. Speculative, but maybe after Whomp was axed, Mrs. Thwomp's design was tweaked so that an aspect of it remained, hence the different Japanese name? (To answer the note, a glance at Japanese footage shows that they are husband and wife there as well.) LinkTheLefty (talk) 17:17, April 11, 2020 (EDT)
- Doesn't remotely resemble Whomp's JP name either, though.... Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 18:53, April 11, 2020 (EDT)
- Page 61 of the Nintendo Power Player's Guide for PiT includes the sentences "The volcano has been extinguished, but not everybody is happy about it. In fact, the two Thwomps at the top are downright enraged, as they enjoyed bathing in the volcano's warm magma during its annual eruption." Mr. Thwomp is only named "her husband." Scrooge200 (talk)
16:17, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
- Suppose that's more conclusive for the first question XD (provided it's not just NP fudging things again....still, better than nothing by a long shot). Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 16:29, April 20, 2020 (EDT)
- In general, I think we should be cautious about cases of possible “transcreation” - meaning instances where the translation is based on an in-progress version of the original script or written concurrently with it in development. In the case of Partners in Time, like its predecessor, we know that the North American release is technically an earlier build than the Japanese release from the numerous revisions the game had (though unlike Superstar Saga, the European release carried many alterations over). It's entirely possible that "Mrs. Thwomp" was named as such because it may have been a localization of an unfinalized name. I'd be interested to know if she is called a Thwomp in guides, though it would make more sense that she is one since the area where she is fought is called Thwomp Volcano. That being said, her facial features do admittedly resemble a Whomp more than a Thwomp. Speculative, but maybe after Whomp was axed, Mrs. Thwomp's design was tweaked so that an aspect of it remained, hence the different Japanese name? (To answer the note, a glance at Japanese footage shows that they are husband and wife there as well.) LinkTheLefty (talk) 17:17, April 11, 2020 (EDT)
"-bō"[edit]
Mrs. Thwomp's Japanese name ends in "-bō". And according to this page, that's simply Japanese for "guy". Personally, I think it's more likely a reference to "Kuribō". Sure, she's not a Goomba, but she has the eyebrows, and she fights alongside mini Goombas, so she is at least associated with them, and it makes more sense to me than a female character being named after a word for "guy". I've edited the page to this effect twice, but both times the change was reverted, so I'm bringing this to the talk page. Thoughts? Blinker (talk) 09:55, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- Honestly, I've been wondering if in the original script they're a married couple at all or if that was invented for the localization. Figuring that out may help clue us in. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 10:22, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- I checked, it seems they're a couple in Japanese too. Specifically, when the English version says "Own up! I mean, look at you! You're obviously all plumbers! Thanks to your meddling, my hubby's in a stone funk!", the Japanese version says 「ウソ いいなさいよ！ 夫婦水いらずの バカンスに よくも 水をさしたわね！ おかげで ウチのダンナが やる気 なくしちゃったじゃない！！」, which seems to mean (I don't speak Japanese, so take this with a grain of salt) "Tell me you didn't..! How dare you throw water on our waterless/private (there's a pun in here somewhere) couple's holiday!? Thanks to you, my husband has lost his motivation!" I didn't look past this point in the cutscene, but I get the impression it's faithfully translated, mostly, aside from having to replace the pun with a new joke. Also, Thwomp and Mrs. Thwomp use the 1st person pronouns "washi" and
"uchi""atashi" respectively, which as far as I understand, means they're probably the same genders as in English. Blinker (talk) 12:40, November 10, 2023 (EST)- Very well. Anything indicating that she is also considered a "Thwomp" in that dialogue? That'd probably better determine where the relation to Thwomp/Whomp/Goombas lays. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:26, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- Nope. In fact, throughout both cutscenes with the couple, not once are Thwomps even mentioned, let alone Whomps or Goombas. Not even in reference to the husband, who got a bunch of Thwomp-based pet names in English. Seriously, the two scripts are very similar (aside from another replaced pun). Blinker (talk) 17:49, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- Okay, I got something new. On one hand, the save block summary for after entering Thwomp Volcano says "That Thwomp couple made things interesting, but you made it into the volcano! It's burning up in here! Keep your cool and rescue Princess Peach!", so at least the English translation seems to consider her a Thwomp as well. However, the Japanese version of the line, 「へんな ふうふに あしどめを されたけど なんとか あなのなかに はいれたぞ！ アツイ！ だけどガマンして ピーチひめを たすけだそう！」, just calls them a "strange couple". Blinker (talk) 12:07, June 30, 2024 (EDT)
- Nope. In fact, throughout both cutscenes with the couple, not once are Thwomps even mentioned, let alone Whomps or Goombas. Not even in reference to the husband, who got a bunch of Thwomp-based pet names in English. Seriously, the two scripts are very similar (aside from another replaced pun). Blinker (talk) 17:49, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- Very well. Anything indicating that she is also considered a "Thwomp" in that dialogue? That'd probably better determine where the relation to Thwomp/Whomp/Goombas lays. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 15:26, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- I checked, it seems they're a couple in Japanese too. Specifically, when the English version says "Own up! I mean, look at you! You're obviously all plumbers! Thanks to your meddling, my hubby's in a stone funk!", the Japanese version says 「ウソ いいなさいよ！ 夫婦水いらずの バカンスに よくも 水をさしたわね！ おかげで ウチのダンナが やる気 なくしちゃったじゃない！！」, which seems to mean (I don't speak Japanese, so take this with a grain of salt) "Tell me you didn't..! How dare you throw water on our waterless/private (there's a pun in here somewhere) couple's holiday!? Thanks to you, my husband has lost his motivation!" I didn't look past this point in the cutscene, but I get the impression it's faithfully translated, mostly, aside from having to replace the pun with a new joke. Also, Thwomp and Mrs. Thwomp use the 1st person pronouns "washi" and
Returning to the initial question, Rrrumbas, who share the same Japanese name, appear to have been translated in a way that maintains the Goomba connection in the form of the "-mba" suffix. I think this supports the idea that the Japanese name is also derived from Goomba/Kuribo. That said, Kuribo itself is just "chestnut guy", so the current mention of it being a suffix meaning "guy" is not entirely inaccurate. But I do think a reference to Kuribo is justified here. 73.171.104.211 15:44, November 10, 2023 (EST)
- I mean, it's not entirely inaccurate, but there's still a difference between her being named after Goombas who are in turn named after the suffix, and her being directly named after the suffix. Blinker (talk) 17:49, November 10, 2023 (EST)
Decide on Japanese name etymology[edit]
|
This talk page proposal has already been settled. Please do not edit this section or its subsections. If you wish to discuss the article, please do so in a new section below the proposal. |
canceled by proposer
I know this sounds like a really silly reason for a proposal, but this is something that has been edited back and forth quite a few times, so I thought it was best to settle it like this.
Mrs. Thwomp's Japanese name is Gorobō. The first part, goro, is simply derived from an onomatopoeia. This proposal concerns the second part, bō. The simplest explanation is that, like in various other names such as Goomba's Kuribō, it's simply the Japanese word 坊 (bō), meaning "boy". Of course, this raises the question of why a female character would be named after a word for "boy".
The other explanation is that the bō is actually taken from Kuribō itself. After all, Mrs. Thwomp's eyebrows do resemble those of a Goomba, and while the rest of her design doesn't have much in common with them, the same can be said about the previous game's Beanies. Additionally, her fight happens to feature Mini Goombas, giving her another connection to Goombas.
If this proposal passes, the NioL section will be changed accordingly, alongside a comment to prevent this from being reverted again.
Proposer: Blinker (talk)
Deadline: April 8, 2025, 23:59 GMT
Support: Rolling + Goomba[edit]
Oppose: Rolling + boy[edit]
Comments (bō)[edit]
Looks like IP(s) kept changing it for no apparent reason, then it sort of fell by the wayside after the Rrrumba and Gromba connections were added. That was a while ago, though. I doubt IP(s) still hawks this page. I've never seen etymology being proposal-enforced. When in doubt, I like to compare the other languages to look for other commonalities, but it seems pretty much everything is based on the English name. I believe the Goomba explanation, though - it's in the battle. That can just be added to the meaning to make it more obvious. Maybe throw in a "possibly" there since there seems to be some contention. LinkTheLefty (talk) 18:45, March 25, 2025 (EDT)
- So, I could just cancel the proposal and do the thing? Blinker (talk) 07:58, March 26, 2025 (EDT)
- Honestly, I think so. Put the page in your watch list just in case, and if it happens again, let's take it from there. An etymology proposal might set a strange precedent later on, but that's just my opinion. LinkTheLefty (talk) 08:16, March 26, 2025 (EDT)
...which idea does "support" favor? I assume the latter, but the proposal as it is written as of this comment doesn't make that clear. Doc von Schmeltwick (talk) 22:34, March 25, 2025 (EDT)
