Talk:Fireworks

Generic

Does anyone else think this article seems a little generic? I think it should focus only on the fireworks from the flagpole, and references to them in later games, rather than just any instance of a firework in a Mario game. It's like how Spaghetti is specific to the Paper Mario item and not any appearance of spaghetti in the series. Scrooge200 (talk) 17:00, July 28, 2020 (EDT)

Fireworks are also items in Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars, I think that should be pioritised over flagpole fireworks. Nightwicked Bowser

Ah, that's probably a better idea to prioritize. Still, I think the first goal should be to remove generic instances. Scrooge200 (talk) 17:07, July 28, 2020 (EDT)

This article also includes fireworks from non-mainline games, so we could make this a disambig page and split the non-mainline game areas from this article. --DarkNight 17:11, July 28, 2020 (EDT)

I agree that this article needs to be trimmed, most of the appearances are just "Firework appears in this level. It does exactly what a normal firework would do". I like Swallow's idea best. Somethingone (talk) 14:36, January 4, 2022 (EST)

Trim this Article

This talk page section contains an unresolved talk page proposal. Please try to help and resolve the issue by voting or leaving a comment.

Current time: Friday, November 29, 2024, 07:55 GMT

Rather than bore you with an eyesore of bland, boring text, I decided to state my reasonings and points in this little "Proposal-in-a-box":

white

Fireworks, in the real world, are often used as a celebratory background aesthetic that rises into the sky and explodes into a wave of colorful bursts. Due to this, fireworks are often used in media as a celebratory background aesthetic, which is exactly how they're used in real-life. The Mario series does this multiple times when it wishes to send a "Congrats on doing _______!" element in the game, meaning the current state of this page infringes on the generic subjects policy for a number of appearances, with notability ranging from "item related to story/gameplay progression" to "generic background element". Let's put this article through the test with the 5 Non-Generic-Subject criteria, shall we?

• The subject must have a function which is different from the real-world counterpart. If the differences are extremely minor, the subject may not meet this requirement.

As I said before, fireworks are decorative bombs that people light up so it can rise into the sky and explode into a cool spectacle. In the Mario series, it's essentially the same thing, just with minor more "specific" explosions for some appearances.

• The player can consume or collect the subject for use. This does not apply to sports games.

Fireworks are bombs that are inedible. The only time it's collectible is 2 appearances(SMRPG and MTM), leaving much of this page covering generic background-aesthetic fireworks.

• The subject is significant to the media's storyline.

• The subject is significant to the gameplay. This does not apply to sports games.

Well, time for the bulk of this proposal. I will use this color key for all the sections of this article:

• gold, for things that are worth saving.
• orange, for areas where I am unsure if we should leave alone or blow up.
• red, for things that are nothing more than a generic background element, or have some other reason to remove them.

Mario Mainliners

• Super Mario Bros.: gold It's a cute little easter egg that awards the player points, and only happens when the timer ends in 1, 3, or 6.
• Super Mario Bros. The Lost Levels: gold Same as above, but even more specific.
• Super Mario World: red While one of them makes a unique heart shape, they are just background elements and have no noticeable features for gameplay/story.
• Super Mario Bros. Deluxe: gold Same as Super Mario Bros.
• New Super Mario Bros.: gold Similar to Super Mario Bros., but now functions when a timer has the last two digits a multiple of 11 and gives as many fireworks as the last number(ex. 188 would give 8 fireworks). Also gives item houses depending on the value so yeaaaa.
• New Super Mario Bros. Wii: orange Same as NSMB, with fireworks being an indicator of which toad house appears, but this time they don't award any points and are just an indicator. As I am unsure how indicators are handled on the wiki I'm marking this as borderline.
• Super Mario Galaxy 2: red It's a generic "You beat this game! Amazing!" background aesthetic(I'll be saying this phrase a lot) that provides nothing noteworthy to the table.
• New Super Mario Bros. 2: orange Same as NSMBW, but with rainbow courses instead of toad houses.
• New Super Mario Bros. U: orange Same as NSMBW, but with items instead of toad houses.
• Super Mario 3D World: gold The fireworks function as they do in SMB, so it's worth saving.
• Super Mario Maker(Wii U, 3DS, and Switch): gold It's a sound effect you can place down when you build courses, so it's fine.
• Super Mario Run: orange They're just a generic "You did something important! Amazing!" aesthetic, but the existence of the Fireworks Cannon and how tapping it produces them makes me unsure if it qualifies or not.
• Super Mario Odyssey: red They are shaped like the Broodals sometimes, but they just seem to be for the "Something comedically blew up high-in-the-sky" trope used quite often in media.

Mario's Time Machine: gold It's an interactive item needed for story progression.

Super Mario RPG: gold It's an item you can buy from one guy in one town for a specific set of money and not only changes the credits, but also gives you items if you buy enough.

Luigi's Mansion series

• Luigi's Mansion(pictured): red While it is specific to the # of ghosts you suck up in a room, it's nothing more than a generic celebratory aesthetic beyond that small, insignificant specification.
• Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon: red It's just a generic "You beat this boss! Amazing!" background aesthetic and there's not even a lot of them here, just one.

Paper Mario series

• Paper Mario 64: red Generic "You beat this game! Amazing!" background aesthetic that loops forever.
• Paper Mario: Color Splash: red Generic "You reached a checkpoint! Amazing!" background aesthetic. The one hitting the airship is cute and funny, but Color Splash is loaded with comedic jokes like that.

Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga: orange Generic background element for the most part, but I am unsure about what to do with the Super Mario Bros. reference.

Mario Golf series

• Family Computer Golf: Japan Course: red "Fireworks briefly appear after selecting a game mode on the main menu." - Wow, this is enough info to convince me this section is definitely and objectively important enough to save! /j /lh
• Mario Golf: Toadstool Tour: red The part in the article mentioning they can "distract the player" is just flowery wording, they're just generic background elements as a quick video search for "Mario golf toadstool tour peach's castle grounds" will reveal.
• Mario Golf: World Tour: red I'll let the section speak for itself: "In Mario Golf: World Tour, fireworks appear when the Mii gets a birdie or better."

Mario Baseball series: gold They're the star of Bob-omb Derby (which itself is known as "Firework" in Japan), which is from this series.

Mario Party series

• Mario Party 3: orange They seem to be more unique background elements with the whole "character's head" thing, and I'm unsure if they're worth saving or blowing up.
• Mario Party 4: orange Same as Mario Party 4.
• Mario Party 7: red "When a player or a team wins a game on a Party Cruise in Mario Party 7, they will appear atop Peach's Castle; fireworks are going off in the background." - Not only is this sentence awkward and reads like a cut-n-paste of something from the main MP7 article, it also confirms these are generic "You won! Amazing!" background aesthetic objects.
  
• Mario Party 8: red They only appear in Crank to Rank as a generic "You won! Amazing!" background aesthetic.
• Mario Party: Island Tour: red Generic "You won! Amazing!" background aesthetic.

Warioware: Touched!(pictured): gold It's the main premise of Big Bang.

Donkey Kong Jungle Beat: red Generic "You won! Amazing!" background aesthetic.

Mario Kart series

• Mario Kart Wii: red Generic "You won! Amazing!" background aesthetic.
• Mario Kart 8: red Generic background aesthetic.
• Mario Kart Tour: red Generic background aesthetic.

Yoshi's New Island: red "In Yoshi's New Island, fireworks appear at the ending." - Very helpful and informative section yes yes.

Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS / Wii U: orange It seems to change based on the % cleared in the staff credits, so I don't know if we should keep it or toss it.

Television series

• The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3: gold It's tied to a part of the story via the bob-omb bag.
• Donkey Kong Country animated series:
  • Speed: red Seems to just be a generic "Firework performance in the distance" background aesthetic thing.
  • The Kongo Bongo Festival of Lights: gold It's an integral part of this episode's story, with the fireworks being part of the festival.

---

Okay, with that out of the way, it's time to see if the "The subject is determined by the users to be notable." part is true with this proposal.

So there's quite a few different ways we can handle this spectacle:

1. Ignite the orange and red categories. Leaving the ones with important gameplay functions alone while removing both the ambiguously generic and definitely generic subjects. This is what I'd prefer to do.
2. Ignite only the red category. Similar to the above, but we keep the borderline sections in the article. I'd prefer we do either this or the above option.

# Ignite all except for the green. You could make the argument that the fireworks used everywhere else are just "glorified background aesthetics", and don't deserve an article. While I'd personally wouldn't mind this too much, I strongly advise we don't do it because of what it implies for many other articles.

# Split the green items into its own page and ignite the orange and red categories. An unconventional method, sure, but I think splitting the SMRPG section into its own article can work, most notably due to the unique function and the unique name "Ducati" given to it on the artwork(pictured). I'd be fine with this as well. # Split the green items into its own page and ignite the red category. Same as above, but keeps the orange category on the page.

Scratch the above 3 options, "Ducati" apparently just means Moleville.

3. Do nothing. The status quo is maintained, and this page stays infringing on the border of generic subject.

If you have any changes or comments to how I placed the categories, please let me know.

Proposer: Somethingone (talk)
Deadline: March 19, 2022, 23:59 GMT

Option 1

1. Somethingone (talk) Preferred Choice.

Option 2

1. Somethingone (talk) Second Choice.
2. WildWario (talk) Per proposal.
3. Tails777 (talk) Per proposal. While I initially thought of the fourth option, the Firework item does function basically like a standard firework by the end of the game, so I think it's fine to stay here.
4. Archivist Toadette (talk) This option is fine with me.
5. DannyTheDingo (talk) Per proposal. Considered Option 5, but the item has very little info so it's fine where it is.
6. BBQ Turtle (talk) Per proposal.
7. Niiue (talk) Per all.

Comments

In case anyone asks, "ignite" and "blow up" in the context of this proposal is just a fancy way of saying "remove" Somethingone (talk) 21:30, March 4, 2022 (EST)

Side note, this article needs images of each firework display from the Super Mario RPG credits. DingoHazel [00526] 20:14, March 7, 2022 (EST)

Just a heads-up, "Ducati" is Moleville. LinkTheLefty (talk) 05:25, March 10, 2022 (EST)

dang it of course it's something like that Somethingone (talk) 06:12, March 10, 2022 (EST)