MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive/23: Difference between revisions

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{| align="center" style="width: 95%; background-color: #f1f1de; border: 2px solid #996; padding: 5px; color:black"
|Any proposal decided and past is archived here. Use the scroll box to see votes and comments. This page is protected to maintain the discussion as was. Please add archived proposals to the '''bottom''' of the page.
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{{MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive Template}}
===Remove Fake Bans/Warnings===
{{Proposal outcome|passed|30-0|remove fake bans/warnings}}
OK, now that I royally screwed up my last proposal, let's try this again:<br>
On more than a few userpages, I have seen ban notices saying a user has been blocked by ruling of Wario's Butt or something of that sort.  These are immature, a waste of space, and can cause you to do a double-take before reading on and finding out that the user wasn't banned, they are just being extremely immature.  So now that I've done this properly, let's get rid of this crap.


<div style="font-size:95%">__TOC__</div>
'''Proposer''': {{User|Ralphfan}}<br>
 
'''Voting start''': September 1, 2010, 24:00 GMT<br>
===Change categories such as "[[:Category:Beta elements]]" to "{{fakelink|Category:Articles with beta elements}}".===
'''Voting closes''': September 8, 2010, 24:00 GMT
<span style="color:blue;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">DELETED &mdash; Proposer was banned</span>
 
From what I hear, the beta elements pages were created because it was too difficult for the reader to find beta elements unless they were split out. This way, articles can be meatier and less forked, and readers can still find the relevant content. This proposal would affect all related categories and articles related to those categories such as [[:Category:Glitches]], and would result in the subpages being merged, such as [[Mario's Tennis/Beta elements]].
{{scroll box|content=
'''Proposer''': {{User|NARCE}}<br>
'''Voting start''': 12 July, 2010 21:16<br>
'''Deadline''': 19 July, 2010 21:16


====Support====
====Support====
#{{User|NARCE}} As the proposal creator.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per proposal.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - *sigh*, here we go again. Anyways, those templates are annoying. They are warnings and are not to be toyed with.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - These make sysops job much more difficult.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} - Per all
#{{User|New Super Mario}} get in my way. Per Proposal
#{{User|Turtwig A}} I agree. They are official templates and even if the wording and terms are changed, it could still easily confuse new users if they get one of those templates.
#{{User|CosmicBlueToad}} &ndash; Per Tucayo, and Marioguy1.
#{{User|Mr bones}} Well, if it's about warnings and bans, then per all!
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Per all.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well; reminders, warnings, and bans are not playthings, if you play with them, it could result in several users thinking they are Banned. Some people simply look, they do not always read the content of the template. Also, they are very immature due to the problems I said previously, and that their content contains utter gibberish in templates that are supposed to be very serious.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} I say per all.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Per all and I recommend MCD to stop assuming.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I disagree on your definition of "immature", but I'm still supporting. SYSOPs do not need to spend unnecessary amounts of time searching for warnings.
#{{User|Mario jc}} <s>No more Wario's butt nonsense.</s> Per all.
#{{User|Young Master Luma}} Per everybody. Yes, everybody.
#{{User|MATEOELBACAN}} - Per all.
#{{User|M&SG}} - Ditto here.
#{{User|GalacticPetey}} Per all.
#{{User|CosmicRedToad}} Per Lefty Green Mario.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} - Per all.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Per all, let's try not to make life miserable for the Sysops.
#{{User|Sgt.Boo}} - Per all.
#{{User|Papermario97}} I agree.
#{{User|Sacorguy79}} Per all. Stupid people spamming with templates. I really agree with the immature part, obviously, too.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{User|DaisyRox02}} - Those are annoying and when you actually do have a block template up it confuses you.
#{{User|Beecanoe}} - I agree, I feel all bad for that user that they were blocked, and then I read and think, ohhhh... jerks.
#{{User|Smasher 101}}People that do that are jerks.Per all.


====Oppose====
====Oppose====
#{{User|Booderdash}} Useless. How can an article have beta elements?
#{{User|4DJONG}} Well, there is no point in changing the name by two letters, and merging the "subpages" would cause some pages to double in length with information that works well in separate articles. Also, it would take a good amount of time to move the information, the current setup has worked with new and old users, that is why this proposal lacks a point.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Pointless.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all. The current set-up works just fine.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} It'll just make it longer to tye in. Basically useless
#{{User|KS3}} Per Baby Mario Bloops' comment.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all.
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} - This would be completely pointless. Per all.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Very pointless and per all. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Mario Fan 123}} - Per all.
#{{User|Pseudo-dino}} - We decided in an earlier proposal that they would have their own pages.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|Not Bugsy}}-Merging the pages is useless. The way the pages are now makes everything more organized and easy to browse through. Per all.
#{{User|Dry dry king}} - If this had been here when I first got my account, i would support. Now i know more, i've learned enough to know the answer should be no,it works fine. Per Pseudo-Dino, Not Bugsy, and 4DJONG.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} - Per all. If we made that it would be just history of pages we made.


====Comments====
====Comments====
Why? {{User|KS3}}
Now that I've realized the full effects of my other one, let's just get on with this. {{User|Ralphfan}}
:This is one of the times I can easily say "Good Point" to you, KS3. We don't need the '''Articles with''' part as it is just extra and we don't need the extra. {{unsigned|Baby Mario Bloops}}
 
:I'm not sure navboxes are covered under this either, since they aren't an imitation of any real template. Actually, what exactly is the definition of a fake template? That doesn't seem to be clarified anywhere in this proposal. {{user|Twentytwofiftyseven}}
 
This only covers ban notices and warning notices.  Navboxes are OK. {{User|Ralphfan}}


Well, I concur with you both because the first two words in the proposed name are pointless.{{User|4DJONG}}
:Yeah, I tried to write that in the original version of this and it didn't work right >_>  {{user|Twentytwofiftyseven}}
:Looking at [[Mario]], size doesn't seem to be a problem with MarioWiki articles. To say that there is no point in creating a more concise article is absurd - it would factually improve them, and whatever ones aren't improved by the measure can easily remain split out on a case-by-case basis. The whole reason the split-off sections exist was to more easily categorize them. This, factually, solves the problem of categorization. Is it a problem if a category doesn't sport some amaazingly flashy name? - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 04:24, 14 July 2010 (UTC)


Well, I have made your assertion invalid.{{User|4DJONG}}
So, will the other one get deleted? {{user|Tucayo}}
:Actually, it didn't, at all. The assertion was that we had to split these articles out because it was difficult to find such beta content/glitches/etc. This is an acceptable, logical fix to that problem. The proposal is to make articles like Yoshi's Island into a little more than a bunch of lists, which it currently is. Beta elements and glitches are two of the things that, if added, could make that article WAY more interesting. But as it stands, people have to navigate away from the page constantly in order to get a full experience. Splitting these articles out in the first place was pointless - changing categories and merging articles doesn't have to be done overnight, and can be done by multiple people. To the person who said that it would take longer to type in, that's simply not true. As it stands, if one searches for Glitches, they go to Category:Glitches. If one searches for Beta elements, they go to Category:Beta elements. Why would it have to change? If someone searches for Glitches, they can still go to the category. It would be no more difficult than if it stayed at the current title. Basically, the proposal seeks to have more concise articles, rather than have all of the sections forked off. And again, to the point that it would make them too big: I've never seen anywhere where someone would suggest forking an article off because of size. [[Mario]] is incredibly large, but no one has said anything. SMW2 is surprisingly small, and could be made larger if relevant content were moved back. However, there is no way to move it back, because of a proposal that argues that because the category is worded that way, content related to glitches or beta elements may not be in the main articles. As opposed to having a strong article, we have a weak article with two subarticles. It's silly. If the amount of effort required is a problem, I can do it all myself. It shouldn't matter if it's pointless if it doesn't affect anyone else, and the amount of time doesn't matter because I'm fine doing it over time. It is not as if the new proposal would confuse readers - they would surely adapt immediately. The only contention is the page length problem, and again, such a thing may be handled on a case-by-case basis. If it does indeed make the article too long, agreed, it should be split out. But for some content where it is just a few sentences, especially when the main article is small, then we ought to definitely merge it back in. As it stands, opposing the measure feels like opposition for the sake of opposition. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 20:52, 14 July 2010 (UTC)


Once enough admins agree, I guess. {{User|Ralphfan}}


Wait a second. That doesn't sound right at all... Seriously, ARTICLES can't have beta elements. Name one that does. {{User|Booderdash}}
@2257: To answer your question, a fake template is when a user uses the HTML code for the template rather than the template itself. That way, you don't see the list of pages that links to it on the bottom. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
:[[Mario's Tennis/Beta elements]]


Well NARCE, there are no short game articles, and the situation with SMG2 could be fixed with adding more content, doesn't have to be Beta elements. Also, this would affect all game pages and glitches, if you merge the beta elements of one game with the games page, you have to do it with all game pages, some of which are rather long pages, and merging long pages with long pages makes monitoring the article a nightmare for Patrollers and Admins. Plus you say "it shouldn't matter if its pointless" but, it does, if you make a moderate article long through pointless measures, it is not necessary. If something is pointless it is not logical. {{User|4DJONG}}
Can this include fake maintenance templates too? {{User|Booderdash}}
:No, we don't HAVE to do it with ALL of them. That is broken logic that has NO place in an argument. If it negatively affects the quality of an article, then it can be avoided. Do you people not have guidelines? Policies and guidelines are two different things. Policies are to be enforced at all times, while guidelines are to be enforced when the situation calls for it. If a guideline would be detrimental to the quality of an article, it is to be ignored. But your stance is that because of the exception of articles, not the majority of them, that it should not be enforced on any articles. [[Mario's Tennis]] can use as much content as it gets, and yet we're forking the information off for no reason. And as for your argument that SMW2 [not G2] is not small, yes, it's not small by stub standards. But why is it shorter than the Wikipedia article? Logically, Wikipedia should have less content for its articles than a website that is focused on the related subject, true? - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 02:23, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
:Except the Under Construction, because users usually don't finish everything at once. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}


Well NARCE, we have to do it with all articles because it is one of our policies, ask Steve, and it would be very hard for anyone check for vandalism. Also, we do have guidelines but they are different from what you seem to think they are, I advise you to check over our policies. We can not simply ignore our policies, we have to follow them, and you say that it is "broken logic," then why is it a policy. I can not make this clearer, check over our policies again. {{User|4DJONG}}}}
@MrConcreteDonkey: <nowiki>{{construction}}</nowiki> isn't allowed in userpace. {{User|Ralphfan}}
:BLOF: No, nothing uses HTML code on a wiki, it all uses wikicode. HTML code is kind of the same yet very different. Anyways, yes, that is a fake template. No, that does not include userboxes due to {{tem|Userbox}} which is a real template with parameters. However it does include all fake construction templates, fake infobox templates and fake warnings. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::Oh, and I thought this wiki uses HTML the ENTIRE time x_X {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}


===Stricter featured article standards.===
@MG1: Construction templates aren't fake, they just aren't allowed in userspace. {{User|Ralphfan}}
<span style="color:blue;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">DELETED &mdash; Proposer was banned</span>
:"However it does include all '''fake''' construction templates". *sigh* {{User|Marioguy1}}


From looking through some of the FACs, as well as some of the articles already featured, I've seen that not one article actually passes the criteria presented in MarioWiki's FA standards. Let's examine them, and let's use the most recent article - Mario Power Tennis - as an example.
@Ralphfan: I'll support if you add fake maintenance templates on since they have as much significanse as the fake warnings and tal pages. Also, can fake talk page proposals on user talks be banned too? {{User|Booderdash}}


'''  1. …be well-written and detailed.''' - Not the worst writing, but it could be improved significantly in both flow and how it presents itself. But the problem with this point is that it is not detailed. Gameplay and plot-wise? Yes. But it does not educate the reader of how it came into being, nor does it tell readers how much it sold, or how the critics received it.
@MrConcreteDonkey: Yes, yes they are. :) {{User|Bowser's luma}}
:Sorry for being a little harsh, but I get irritated REALLY easily. I can't help it. Please, STOP IT. It makes us look bad. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
::Agreed, putting people down isn't nice. Anyways, I don't really think the fake maintenance templates are that much of a bad thing. They're immature but they don't hurt anyone. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::: I hope MrConcreteDonkey changes his vote. He's the one that look bad right now :P {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}


'''  2. …be unbiased, non-point of view.''' - Not a major problem, but I did notice some instances where the writer[s] give their own POV, such as suggesting that Wario and Waluigi being injured in the commission of their evil scheme was unfortunate [whereas someone may object and say that because they only got injured by their own evil design, they got what they deserved].
I don't know what's the big issue on fake construction templates. They are on user pages. What makes you think a '''USER'''page needs rewrite or more images uploaded? I think the people who put fake templates on their page just have some sense of humor, not a sense of immaturity. Of course, opinions differ for each person. Bottom-line: fake rewrites do no harm at all. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:Mainly because new users tend to place real templates into their pages when they see we had done it and we have to go through the issue of notifying them or removing them. Other than that, there is no harm done. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}


'''   3. …be sourced with all available sources and Mario-related appearances.''' - And here's the kicker. Some may argue that it is sourced in that it has A source, but that's not acceptable. This criteria clearly expects an article to be fully referenced. As it is, almost every article fails this standard, save for some like the "list of Zess T. recipes", whose source is obviously the game.
Alright, sorry LGM and BLOF. I guessed since you opposed the last one immediately, but I guessed wrong and forgot that the 1st one was for '''all''' fake templates. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
:It's ok. I first started shouting at you, but then, I removed my comment because I got over it. I accept your apology. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
Do you think anyone will fall for '''''this?'''?''?:


'''  6. …have a proper lead that gives a good summary of the topic and can be used for the front page featured box.''' - The lead does not mention who created the game [the person, not the company], how well it was received, and mentions the Wii version as an important aspect, when the Wii version should be mentioned at the end, as this article is about the GameCube version.
(Removed, due to its contents altering the scrollbox template)


'''  8. …have significant information from all sources and appearances, especially a biography for character articles.''' - Aside from development and reception info, it is fairly significant, but it fails this criteria in that it doesn't take from any sources.
{{User|CosmicRedToad}}
:No, but it does take up space and ultimately is pointless. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}


Without any criticism of what is there - such as the bloopers, which, as a Wikipedian, I'm not a fan of them being there, but I do understand that this is supposed to be a "complete Wiki", and as such, they should be there - I can say that what isn't there absolutely guarantees that is is not ready for featured status. I think people take it too seriously - first and foremost, writing a quality article is priority over being praised for it. There are rules put in place to prevent people from successfully featuring more than three articles. Seriously - take pride in your work, not the award you get for it.
OH, PLEASE! Who in the right mind would agree with that hacked template? Also, Per MrConcreteDonkey. Takes up space and is worthless. {{User|Sacorguy79}}
:Me, in my left, evil mind, cuz I created them :(. It is pointless, but it does show a little of your personality. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
::Next time, make your own template or ask the person before putting it on comments. Thank you. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
{{User|Papermario97}} I feel stupid but, what does "per all" mean?
:It basically means "I agree with everyone supporting/opposing" (whichever applies), but it's much less effort/time to type. {{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} 18:58, 6 September 2010 (UTC)


{{scroll box|content=
----
'''Proposer''': {{User|NARCE}}<br>
 
'''Voting start''': 12 July, 2010 22:42<br>
===Making Paper Mario Badge Attack Articles===
'''Deadline''': 19 July, 2010 22:42
{{Proposal outcome|failed|9-14|do not create paper mario badge attack articles}}
I think we should make articles on attacks in the first two Paper Marios that you can only use by the use of a badge (i.e. Quake Hammer, Multibounce). It would be necessary to the wiki, since these ARE attacks of Mario's, and even if he needs a badge to use them they still are attacks of his.
 
'''Proposer''': {{User|Mileycyrussoulja}}<br>
'''Voting start''': September 2, 2010, 12:00.<br>
'''Deadline''': September 9, 2010, 23:59 GMT.


====Support====
====Support====
#{{User|NARCE}} As the proposal creator.
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}} I support this proposal and I agree that these attacks should get their own articles.
#{{User|Booderdash}} They're ATTACKS. The partner's attacks like [[Multibonk]] has seperate articles. So we're saying Mario is LESS important than his allies that appear in one game? Also the other badges aren't needed because they only have effects which will be stubs. This is an ATTACK, and will definitly have more info.
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Per Booderdash.
#{{user|Mr bones}} I taught you meant badges. If it's about attacks, then per booderdash.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per all.
#{{User|Yoshi986}} Per all.
#{{User|Waluigi Guy}} Per all.
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Per all.
#{{User|Tomz123}}Per Booderdash.


====Oppose====
====Oppose====
#{{User|Booderdash}}Useless, and thats way too strict. That would make us have to unfeature alot of our previous featured articles.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Oppose to the reasoning of that will be an unprofessional idea to only make all the attack-type badges into articles and not the other badges into articles. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Everything you have proposed just now is basically already in the FA rules. The "problem" here is that FA nominations contain a voting process, and as such, they are subjective. The reason why these articles get featured despite their flaws is because there were, are, and always will be people who just aren't so strict with rules, and as such, are more indulgent with the nominated articles. Your proposal will not change the people's hearts, and therefore, it is pointless.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Too minor to have an article, belong in the badge's article.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Nothing is ever perfect to everyone. That is why we have the voting system. If you do this, then it is like impossible for an FA to become a FA.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per all
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} What they're standards are fine.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, most of the attack badges would not warrant a description longer than a few sentences, they are not more notable than the other badges, just because they are attacks does not mean they have long descriptions. Not to mention, most of the badge attacks are alterations of Mario's pre-badge attacks, thus the do not deserve articles.
#{{User|Mr bones}} Per all
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} Badges =/= Attacks. Many short and crappy articles will be created with this. No, just no.
#{{User|KS3}} Per Booderdash.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Badge attacks are not permanent attacks, unlike the partner attacks. When you get them (if you get them, that is), you can unequip them. Anyway, almost all of them are just souped up versions of Mario's regular attacks, with maybe a different side-effect here and there. Per all.
#{{User|4DJONG}} Well, all of it is already in the the FA rules, and there are many people who are not as strict with the rules as you. Also, the rules are subjective with every article in the Wiki, every article has different problems and strengths, some are minor some major, there is a difference between what really needs to be fixed and what you can fix on your own. If there were only strict people running the process, there would be no featured articles, that is why this proposal is useless.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - I mean with a few of them you could, but this proposal is all of them, and not all of them will be necessary articles. Rather have the badge page longer than have like 30+ stubs.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} The standards are perfectly fine...
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} Per all.
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} Per Edofenrir and Gamefreak75.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Per GF75.
#{{user|Coincollector}} - No featured article is perfect, and just apply these rules only lead that all our articles are horribly made.
#{{User|Castle Toad}} - You can't make a long-worthy article for just a badge, It'll be a lot of space and people could get a harder/complex navigation over the site
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per all.
#{{User|Garlic Stapler}} Imagine all the stubs there would be. Also not enough info to give each badge specific attack an article.
#{{User|Smasher 101}}Per all.


====Comments====
====Comments====
Man, you make too many proposals x.x {{user|Tucayo}}
Wouldn't this be better as a Pipe Project? {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
:You can never have too many legitimate proposals. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 16:45, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
::"Legitimate"? What's wrong with the FA standards now? Have you really seen FA's that actually do not follow at least one rule? And of those articles, which of them are currently or have been nominated for unfeaturing? We don't need to expand the rules, we understand the rules, and we have a excellent rule system for FA's. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
:::The problem with the FA standards is that people use a case-by-case standard that they wish to apply whenever a favourite game or character or element is up for FA. The FA standards are almost never enforced in any meaningful way. And it's "like impossible"? Why is it impossible, when it frequently works on Wikipedia? The nomination process is basically "do you like this character? y/n" for a lot of people who will vote the worst article FA if they like the subject. And to the notion that there is any problem with the defeaturing of the articles... how are articles helped by keeping them featured? Having such a mediocre standard for featuring encourages mediocrity. The voting system is easily fixed by removing it as an outright vote. I see peoples' opinions being removed by opposition because they argue that it has been already addressed or that their point does not matter. The whole process is ruthlessly stacked in favour of featuring an article. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 04:24, 14 July 2010 (UTC)


I've noticed that NARCE has been making a lot of proposals and hasn't actually formatted them right. {{User|Commander Code-8}}
Agreed. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


I concur, and NARCE some votes are like that but, not all of the votes are like that. Most of the time I see a FA nomination it is full of meaningful votes.{{User|4DJONG}}
Couldn't this be done by making an article that contains all the Badge Effects (if such an article doesn't exist already)? {{User|Frostyfireyoshi}}
:Why shouldn't all votes be like that? This isn't a popular vote, it's based on the quality of the article. If we had 100 people vote and say "I sure do like Birdo, she's neat", by the current rules, it would pass, even if the article didn't fulfill any of the criteria once it was examined. The featuring feature will eventually be reformed. Would you rather it happen after we feature many more articles, or would you rather fix it as soon as possible? - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 20:35, 14 July 2010 (UTC)


Well, we have one support reason and a group of people who agree with it, and there are no votes against it saying that they hate the object in question, so this proposal is pointless.{{User|4DJONG}}
Its already done in the [[Badge]] article. But the MOVES need seperate articles because they're MOVES. {{User|Booderdash}}
:Yeah. Good point. If more people are against it, then it cannot be enacted into rules. Because if we let the people vote on interracial marriage, I'm sure that the fact that the popular vote was against it wouldn't prevent it from being legalized. Correct?
:What, so an article describing what happens when you use Move Badges? {{User|Frostyfireyoshi}}
:You have a reason - doesn't mean it's a good one. Why don't I go down the list of what people say and I will gladly explain why they do not work in this.


:#"Useless, and thats way too strict. That would make us have to unfeature alot of our previous featured articles." - An emotional response, not a logical one. It is not too strict. It's adhering to the rules of the MarioWiki. This doesn't even need a proposal - it's already how the Wiki is supposed to work. However, because popularity determines quality nowadays, people ignore the rules to see that their favourite article gets featured. As it stands, it's not too strict because the way things are, it's WAY too lenient. To enforce these rules would make the situation exactly how it should be.
@Booderdash: Do you realize how many stubs we're gonna have here? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:#"Everything you have proposed just now is basically already in the FA rules. The "problem" here is that FA nominations contain a voting process, and as such, they are subjective. The reason why these articles get featured despite their flaws is because there were, are, and always will be people who just aren't so strict with rules, and as such, are more indulgent with the nominated articles. Your proposal will not change the people's hearts, and therefore, it is pointless." - Basically agreeing that the policies are taken into account. The proposal is not pointless, as clearly, if the rules aren't enforced, they aren't rules. All that would have to be done is for the people in charge to say "Hey, this article fails [so and so] rule, it cannot be featured despite votes." In doing so, the proposal is given point.
:#"Nothing is ever perfect to everyone. That is why we have the voting system. If you do this, then it is like impossible for an FA to become a FA." - This is clearly not true. There needs to be more effort in featuring articles. Heck, in looking at the lead for [[Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story]], I notice some immediate flaws with the lead. And it's clearly not impossible by the fact that the MUCH stricter Wikipedia has thousands of featured articles.
:#"What they're standards are fine." - I'm not sure what this means, but I assume it means "What? Their standards are fine." To which I respond with no. I've done a bevy of examining, and I frequently see people defend themselves from criticisms of grammar. People get far too sensitive to criticism, and really should be tougher.
:#"Well, all of it is already in the the FA rules, and there are many people who are not as strict with the rules as you. Also, the rules are subjective with every article in the Wiki, every article has different problems and strengths, some are minor some major, there is a difference between what really needs to be fixed and what you can fix on your own. If there were only strict people running the process, there would be no featured articles, that is why this proposal is useless." - Perhaps there would be some awkwardness in the changeover, but your acts attempt to keep the quality of the articles down. With such low standards for quality - frequently I will see a vast majority of support from people based on the sheer size or number of images, and I will go through and notice typos, grammatical errors, etc. I understand that the editors are young - not to sound critical, as when I used to edit here I remembered there being a lot of people in their tweens/early teens. If we keep with lenient rules, without being more strict about quality, we encourage mediocrity. The harder we are on editors to provide quality in order to achieve something - especially something considered a high honour - the more people will work to improve. Really, in the end, it's the person expecting hard work and not the person protecting them from it that is helping. Improvement can only come from effort. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 02:45, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
::Narce, once again, you're mixing Wikipedia up with Mariowiki. The standards are fine for MARIOWIKI. The standards on wikipedia has to be higher because more people edit it so of course its going to need alot stricter standards. Not Mariowiki, and we don't even have 1/1000th of Wikipedia articles anyways. Our pages are usually shorter. Its like the Kirby wikia. They're featured article standard are MUCH smaller than even ours. Its relative{{User|Booderdash}}
:::Our standards our excellent here. The problem is that we don't enforce them, at all. In allowing a system that focuses on votes, not actual statements, as well as the popular vote being able to oust the opposition if they so choose, it denies the ability to make a quality article. There is no encouragement to be found for people to improve themselves, merely celebrating mediocrity. Not to suggest that the articles are mediocre, but the fact of the matter is that they are far weaker than they can and should be. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 06:54, 15 July 2010 (UTC)


"sigh" The popular vote thing. Yeah, thats life. You think I don't know about it? But the good think is that it rarely happens here. Yes it DOES happen but rarely. {{User|Booderdash}}
@Frosty, no like how [[Multibonk]] has an article, we make articles for [[Tornado Jump]], [[Power Jump]], [[Power Smash]], [[Ice Smash]] etc. @FF65, I don't see how we're going to have that many stubs. I mean they're as important as the special moves for Mario Power Tennis. And the moves can be explained in detail. They're also better than [[Plane Mario]]. {{User|Booderdash}}


I concur, and NARCE, give me an example of a bad FA nomination that didn't take place years ago. {{User|4DJONG}}
Well, if all attack badges are given their own articles, shouldn't ALL badges have separate articles? {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
:Half of the FAs that are going on? I went through the M&LBiS article, and found numerous errors in the first two paragraphs. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 21:27, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
::You edited the part that came directly from the instruction book, that's why. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:::And there was even a typo in that content.
:::Oh, thank you for reminding me. In the first two paragraphs of an article that was very likely to become featured was a copyright violation. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 21:32, 15 July 2010 (UTC)


:Actually Booderdash, the Kirby Wikia is going to have much higher standards, but probably a little looser than those of the MarioWiki since we are a smaller wiki. {{User|Gamefreak75}}
Why? All other badges only give effects that can be explained with one line. In attacks, many sentences can be written, and it won't be a stub All the other badges will be stubs. {{User|Booderdash}}


Really you mean this?: [http://kirby.wikia.com this]? That is WAY smaller than the Mariowiki! Or this- [http://www.wikirby.com wikirby] which is SMALLER than the wikia version! {{User|Booderdash}}
Well, you can not always "write many sentences" for every attack badge, most of them do things that warrant only a sentence or two. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


:Yup, there haven't been many Kirby games, so it's definitely smaller in size. And the first one. --{{User|Gamefreak75}}
Not the attack BADGE, but the ATTACK. Like Power Bounce. I don't see how thats less of an importance than Multibonk. {{User|Booderdash}}


" And it's clearly not impossible by the fact that the MUCH stricter Wikipedia has thousands of featured articles."
Well, I fail to see how that would work with any positive affects. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


It also is way older, has a much broader scope,  is read by about 180+ millions people daily, and has about a million of users. Not exactly the best comparison. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] 21:48, 16 July 2010 (UTC)}}
Then explain why [[Multibonk]], [[Kiss Thief]], [[Power Lift]] etc. has articles, because they're just attacks too. {{User|Booderdash}}


===Remove the fake "New Messages" boxes.===
Um..., Gamefreak,  I think you're misunderstanding us. We DON'T want to create articles for BADGES, we want to create articles for ATTACKS like [[Tornado Jump]], [[Ice Smash]], and [[Power Bounce]]. {{User|Booderdash}}
<span style="color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Passed 22-2</span>


Yes, I know this was said before, but it was never inforced. You know how sometimes onuserpages there are fake "new messages" boxes? Well, they annoy me, and ot just me. Like once, we had to babysit our neighbor, and, when i clicked on the link on {{User|Hatena Kid}}'s page, a loud, annoying video popped up, resulting in the baby crying from its nap, and having a fit. Another one had a disturbing picture of a camel that was innapropriatte for little kids. Since nobody did anything about, and for the other stuff I said, i think we should take some action.
Well, two of those three you said should not have articles, If a certain type of badge has an article, they all must, it is one of are policies. Making an article on a badge attack but not the badge itself, that would simply not work. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


{{scroll box|content=
Look, you probablt don't even have the game. The badge only ALLOWS you to use the attack, but we want to make an article ON the attack. Like [[Kiss Thief]], and [[Power Lift]]. So that is ok. {{User|Booderdash}}
'''Proposer:''' {{User|BluePikminKong497}}<br>
'''Voting Start:''' 21:11, 10 July 2010<br>
'''Deadline:''' 23:59, 16 July 2010<br>


====Support====
Well, me having the game has nothing to do with this wiki, the badge is functionally what you need to use the attack, thus if the attack deserves a page, the Badge does too. What I mean is, the badge page is created, with the attack in it, if it is created at all, wich it should not. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
#{{User|BluePikminKong497}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - I think the proposal description explains perfectly why this is not just a stupid joke. It tricks users by messing with basic wiki mechanics. These pranks can break people's trust in the page mechanics, and this is where it stops being funny, and just becoes a nuisance. Per the proposal.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Per all.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all. Per the old proposal.
#{{User|Mr bones}} Althrough I don't get angry when I get tricked and rick rolled, if this makes most users angry, then it's a wise thing to support. Also, per Edo, using the wiki tools for pranks is kinda destrubing.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all. It's very annoying. If they want to include them, then they should put it somewhere else on the page.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Fake messages are easy to identify (never got tricked), but it's annoying. If someone must have a fake message box, at least he/she should alter it so people can easily distinguish it. (I.e. You DO NOT have a new message) or something like that.
#{{User|Its-a-me Yoshi!}}Per LeftyGreenMario.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Per LGM with the differences. I mean, some people might be awaiting a message, and they are searching through user's pages, and they find the fake message box. They click it not realizing it is fake as it is worded the same as a message box, and they are rick-rolled. They are annoying, immature, stupid, a waste of a user's time..............
#{{User|KS3}} I know some [[User:Tucayo|users]] who have them, and it's pretty annoying. (I used to have one, but [[User:BabyLuigiOnFire|someone]] made me delete it.) Per all.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} This rule should be enforced. I HATE those boxes. I get excited when I see them, but then, I just realize, oh my god, it's just another of those fake boxes. Rawr. You can't fool me. It's just ANNOYING. So I say we KILL, EXPLODE, and EAT those boxes. Every one of them. No survivors.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} At first I thought this wasn't necessary but after another look I see how annoying it is. Per all
#{{User|Canama}} Per all.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|Arend}} Per all. And, um, Tucayo, it might be true that WE could recognize them, but a completely new user NOT.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} If your like me you'll click on it anyway. Curiosity killed the user... Per all.
#{{user|Dry dry king}} Per all. Yes, ''all''. Every single one of them. '''ALL''' of them! '''PER ''ALL''!!!'''
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} - Per all.
#{{User|Killer Axe}}Per all.
#{{User|Iramatak}}Per all.
#{{User|Coincollector}} - Never used that, but this would justify the odd purpose for those boxes. Per All.
#{{User|Mario Fan 123}} - There is no reason for this template to exist. Per all.


====Oppose====
No, the BADGE name is the EXACT same as the attack so [[Tornado Jump]] the badge would be the same thing as the attack. You would need the game to understand, thats why I mentioned it. {{User|Booderdash}}
#{{User|NARCE}} - Stupid, annoying, pointless. But that's never been a great reason to remove something.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Your case is one in a million. If you are smart enough you can see they are fake. They are a joke, have some sense of humor.


====Comments====
Well, I can not under stand you reasoning, what I meant to say was to make a page of the BADGE not the ATTACK, if make the pages at all. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
I just went under the the tedious procedure of digging through all our proposal archives to find the proposal that addressed this issue earlier. It can be found [http://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive_15#More_Than_A_Joke here]. This new proposal might be a good way to double-check if the points made in the past still are valid in the eyes of today's userbase. - {{User|Edofenrir}}


It should be called "Enforce the Rule" proposal, like how there is the "Enforce the No-Sig policy" proposal. Anyway, it's easy to tell between a fake message box and real ones, but fake message boxes are annoying still. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
The proposal is about making the attack! Not the badge! Badges only invoke the attacks.{{User|Mr bones}}


I saw a TON of sysops with them though. Tucayo for one, but there was alot more "contributive" people who had them.
Well, I know that, the pages badge or Attack should not be created, they would cause many stubs, just because they are attacks does not mean they are notable enough for a page. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
{{User|Booderdash}}
::'''@Booderdash''': Sorry to say this, but try to get your facts straight before saying that. First of all, Tucayo is not a Sysop anymore. Second, not a single Sysop or Patroller has that up on their User Page, as I just went through the list. And, I mean, the more contributive people that have it, it goes to like "Special:Mypage" to where it is not as bad as other things it could be. BTW: My opinions are made clear in the proposal before that Edo linked. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}


:::Baby Mario Bloops, he had it when he was STILL a sysop though. ANd I remember some other people who had it. {{User|Booderdash}}
Any badge attack is notable like any other one. That's why Booderdash said that you should have the game!{{User|Mr bones}}
::::'''@Booderdash''': Yeah, I realized that. Also, I made it clear that you point out '''had'''. Many users have removed it after the first proposal, and yet some still keep theirs. This proposal is a enforcement to make sure that all those fake message boxes get removed. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
:::::Most of the users didn't hear about the proposal, especially the new ones. I was inactive during the time. Also Ks3, how could Blof make you remove it? You didn't ''have'' to, at least yet, but she asked you to. {{User|Booderdash}}
:::::: Meh, I kinda liked those boxes. Its mostly just a rickroll but much more harmless. Its a sophisticated kind of humor. {{User|Booderdash}}
:::::::You have a rather uncommon definition of "sophisticated humor". - {{User|Edofenrir}}
::::::::Probably, yet then why is rickrolling such a popular fad on most websites? {{User|Booderdash}}
::::::@Booderdash: I remembered she gave me a reminder or warning of some sort. {{User|KS3}}
:::::::Nooope. I just told you to remove it. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
Sophistication is in no way proportional to popularity. Those two things are entirely different values. On the contrary, actually; Sophisticated humor tends to reject the majority of people. Therefore, most popular jokes are those that are more rudimentary. But this isn't subject of this proposal. - {{User|Edofenrir}}
:::::::I still don't see whats so bad about it. I mean especially if you just changed it to Special:Random or something like that. I would get how getting transferred to another website might irritate you, but if you just stay on this site, I would think its ok. Besides some of you guys are taking it way too seriously. Its just a harmless joke especially if it doesn't lead you away from this site. The deleted page archive in MY opinion is much more unfunny than the fake message box.


Many people have even said my fake template is really funny. And it is unoffensive. One link leads to a funny, UNOFFENSIVE page, and the ptehr one to [[Game Over]]. I don't see any harm in that. {{user|Tucayo}}
Well, any badge is as important as it's own attack are each other. Also, The fact about me not having has no say in the matter. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


Exactly what Tucayo said. There is absolutly no harm in this. Plus, it teaches a valuable lesson:Don't get too excited and click random things. That can get you viruses. Also, if you're running away from a giant boulder and you see a wallet on the floor, are you going to get it? besides if you were already on someones USERPAGE, you would probably be in a very social mood, which I would think tolerate fake message boxes.
Yes it does. It means you don't understand the concept of the attack. You NEED the game to understand or maybe just the original Paper Mario. And the badge isn't important, which you'll clearly know if you have the game, its the ATTACK that is. {{User|Booderdash}}
{{User|Booderdash}}


Those fake messages do not cause harm, just some people can't take a joke. However, if the link leads to a screamer or a scary picture, or some meture contents, or something that harms your computer. It'll be a good thing to remove those. I only supported becuse it's a wiki tool.{{User|Mr bones}}
Well, the badge and the attack it causes have functionally the same notability, the attacks are are slightly altered versions of Mario's normal attacks. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


It's a joke all right. It's funny the first time you see it. But once it starts pooping (haha) up everywhere, it starts getting terribly UNFUNNY and UNCOOL. And it NEVER makes me laugh or tricks me. I came to people's userpages to learn about the user, not to get "tricked". And "many people" is not "all people." If the message leads to somewhere funny, so be it. I don't care. I just hate to see that stupid, fake, orange box when I expect a new message.  
Is it? Multibonk is the exact same as Headbonk, but repeated alot of times, and Power Bounce is a jump repeated alot of times. {{User|Booderdash}}
{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}


Well, its ok if it doesn't make you laugh, its just a thing. You don't have to think its funny. You just have to leave it. Like your pooping joke wasn't funny, but I can still take it. The message can just lead to Special:Random for all I care. I just think its a bit childish to have a proposal to remove fake message boxes just because they annoy a few people. And i still can't get how its annoying. Is it like some people think babies are annoying? Anyways, I don't see how anyone could fall for it. Its just interesting to see whats on the other side of the link.  {{User|Booderdash}}
Booderdash, It sounds like you are agreeing with me, the pages you want to be made should not be made because they are not notable enough. The attack badges attacks simply alter Mario's (or his partner's) by adding an effect. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


:A few people? A lot of people get annoyed by it. And I intentionally meant "popping", but I had a typo and decided to leave it like that. And, like Edofenrir said, it's a way to mess with the wiki mechanisms, which makes us lose trust. And who doesn't like new messages? A lot don't like seeing the link go to another place when they expect a new message. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
Aha! But you see thing thing is they DO have articles, and for THIS consistency to work, we need to make articles for this, since I doubt many people will agree on deleting those articles anways. {{User|Booderdash}}
::As I said, it is REALLY EASY to find out fake boxes. {{user|Tucayo}}
:::True, but it still annoys me. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
::::I know you did, but it was kind of a joke right? Anyways, i doubt anyone will lose their interest over wiki mechanisms from fake message boxes. besides if there is a real message, there would be two boxes on the screen and that is hysterical. {{User|Booderdash}}
:::::Oh yes, two boxes. So hysterical. Maybe later there will be three. {{User|Bowser's luma}}
::::::I doubt it. What person would be dumb enough to put 2 fake messages on their page?{{User|Booderdash}}
:::::::Sarcasm, Booderdash. {{User|Bowser's luma}}


If the links are so bad, well, I saw this thing called a fake-link, and if you just put a fake link, would that be as bad? That way, when you click it, nothing happens, which wouldn't lead you to another page or anything, because it does ''nothing''! Am I right? :)
Booderdash, the badges nor their effects do not have articles, they are not notable enough for their own articles. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
{{user|Dry dry king}}


Well, that would piss people off, becuse they'd get all excited and go and click it... but nothing happens! Some people might think they're computers are malfunctioning and take it to the repairs and lose money. {{User|Booderdash}}
All, the badges are merged together, so why on earth can't we just merge all the attacks? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:Seriously, who would do that? To think their computer is malfunctioning because they cannot click on a link? {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
::Proves my point, who would get angry at a fake message box that apparently doesn't even work? {{User|Booderdash}}


Does this affect any other templates which are tampered with (Other then the character infoboxes), like the fake stub templates and the fake rewrite templates? {{User|KS3}}
Agreed, but the badge attacks are already merged. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
}}


===Wiki welcome template===
I guess we could just merge them all. But I just have a feeling not man people would agree on it. I don't know, I guess we can try. (We need to mae a proposal about it first though.) But another thing to note, none of the moves like Multibonk are stubs, so I don't see how Power Bounce will be a stub either. {{User|Booderdash}}
<span style="color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">{{User|MarioWiki Bot}} 16-0</span>


I noticed some users (including me) having welcome templates with links to the help section, rules, etc... New users are supposed to get those. However, only some of them do. You see, some new users get reminders for not reading the rules. But if they're new, how are they supposed to know where the rules are without a welcome template. I don't know if this is possible, but I propose we make a wiki welcome template, that will be automatically on the new user's talk page. Like the one in zeldawiki, just with more details. This may reduce the reminders and all the misunderstandings.
Baby Mario Bloops, there are only 10ish attacks in Ttyd, and I doubt all of them are going to be stubs. {{User|Booderdash}}


{{scroll box|content=
Well, there is not sufficient proof that the pages would be long enough not to be stubs, not to mention, the badges(and/or their effects) are not notable enough anyway for pages. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
'''Proposer:''' {{User|Mr bones}}<br>
'''Voting Start:''' 08:58, 10 July 2010<br>
'''Deadline:''' 23:59, 16 July 2010<br>


==== Support ====
They wouldn't be stubs because [[Multibonk]] isn't a stub, and Power Bounce is practically the same thing. Plus things like [[Ice Smash]] has even MORE detail (like [[Freeze]]ing) to be put into the article. {{User|Booderdash}}
#{{User|Mr bones}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} This seems a much better idea than having a bunch of users going round and only welcoming certain users, as this will make sure every new user knows the rules and has useful links for whenever they may become confused.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all. I didn't get one - :'(
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Everyone should get these. I mean, I'm in the same boat as MrConcreteDonkey! One downside might be the lack of unique welcome templates created by users, though.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} I got one only because I'd done something wrong and needed a reminder. Per all.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Now everyone can get a welcome message whether they like it or not. Per all.
#{{User|Booderdash}} There are absolutly no downsides to this (at least not that I can think of at the moment. I never really saw the point of user made welcomes anyways since they practically say the same thing except for different colored templates and a different image.
#{{User|KS3}} per all.
#{{User|Dry dry king}} Per all. I got one, but another friend of mine gave me a second one because he couldn't be sure if I'd gotten one or not. This way, we can be sure.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all. I don't see anything wrong with this.
#{{User|Killer Axe}} Per all. I did not recieve a welcome from anyone until about a week after I joined.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! I would miss doing it the old fashoin way, but it's for the better. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Mario Fan 123}} A very good proposal! I liked it!
#{{User|Pseudo-dino}} Per all, per proposal.
#{{User|Windspyro}} Per all. We don't want any confused wiki members who don't know what they're doing.


==== Oppose ====
Well, Multibonk is not a badge attack, and powerbounce equals Multibonk, Ice smash has little information that could be produced about it. The badge attacks are only the effects the badge has on Mario's (or his partner's) attacks. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


====Comments====
Thats my POINT. How comes MULTIBONK gets an article, while Power Bounce doesn't? Its basically just Partner's attacks VS Mario's attacks. {{User|Booderdash}}
That would probably work if new users were actually reading their welcome templates. Practice has shown that most of them just skip and delete them. Doing this will just result in additional work for almost no gain at all. - {{User|Edofenrir}}
:If a welcome template appears on new users' talkpages automatically, wouldn't that mean user-made welcome templates like [[User:Fawfulfury65/Welcome]] would have to be deleted? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


@Edofenrir  You're right, some users don't read their welcome templates, and they face the consequences. However, some other users do not have a welcome template, so they can't read one.
Why does everyone keep on thinking we're making the article about the badge? We're making it about the ATTACK. {{User|Booderdash}}


@FF65 Yes, they'll be deleted, however, like FFY said, this is the only way to make sure every user has his/her welcome template. We can use some examples like your editing tips though.{{User|Mr bones}}
Well, how many time do I have to tell you; the badge causes the "attack," and the "attacks" are simply effects on Mario's (or his partner's) attacks, nothing more nothing less. This is why the do well as a list, they do not have that much information about them that is different from the normal attacks. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


I didn't have a welcome template and yet, my sister had one. :( Had to resort to the Help page. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
I don't care about that, I mean practically everyone else thinks that we're making it ON the badge. {{User|Booderdash}}


Will this be like how Wikia welomes everyone after they make one edit? {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
Well, You do not care, not they do not, they think (hopefully) that the badge is equal to the attack, neither of them deserves an article. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


Nipe, if you were on zeldawiki. You should've noticed a user named TheStoneWatcher. However, it is not a real user, but some sort of a...I can't find the right word to describe him. However, I think it's this[http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:NewUserMessage] that we need. I am not good at those...{{User|Mr bones}}
Well, if they have the game, they would know that it wasn't. Btw, I think MCS made the description rather misleading and I bet is confusing people... {{User|Booderdash}}


Mmmmmm, we don't even know if its possible or not. We'll have to ask Steve.
You are getting of topic, enough about having the game, it does not always matter, in terms of what you are trying to do. I do not have the game and I understand completely what you are trying to do. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
{{User|Booderdash}}


@Mr bones: Yeah, I also suggest we add some editing tips to the welcome messages like on my welcome message. I actually got the idea from [[User:YellowYoshi398/w]], which probably has some better tips. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
No, you don't understand. Its because you don't have the game. I mean so according to your logic, if FPS fanboys say Mario is for kiddy wimps and that they understand that, that means they're right. Its because they never played the game! You always need to either watch the movie, read the book, or play the game before you understand things about it. {{User|Booderdash}}


Steve won't allow a bot. {{user|Tucayo}}
I can understand giving a few of the badge specific attack their own articles but there probably won't be enough there to make a good article. A couple probably might if they appeared in more than just one of the Paper Mario games. {{User|Garlic Stapler}}


@Tucayo Heu...What is a bot? Also, since it's possible on zeldawiki and wikirby, I'm pretty sure it'll fit here...I think...{{User|Mr bones}}
Well Booderdash, lets get back on topic, what do you mean "It's because they never played the game," you can understand the game if you read it's own article on this wiki. Also Stapler, we can not give just give a few of them pages, we have to give all of them pages or none of them, it is one of our policies. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


Okay, then check [[User:MarioWiki Bot|this]] out! Steve made the bot...before the proposal passes...{{User|Mr bones}}
All your doing is nitpicking an issue if your going to create seperat articles for attacks then you need to make seperate articles for everything {{User|mrblob1012}}
:Yes, and the bot seems to already be working. A new user just got a welcome template automatically. But yeah, we should put editing tips into the message, I'm sure it could help a lot of users. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


@FF65 You're right, this way, they'll learn basic editing rules. We're gonna discuss about what we're gonna put later.{{User|Mr bones}}
Well, Read what I said again, you obviously do not know what I mean, and it is one of our policies, not a guideline. Read our policies again and come back after you do so. Also, please speak more clearly. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


Ok, is this on yet? Since I just found about 3 new users who didn't have the template. {{User|Booderdash}}
----


No, it does work actually.--[[User:Mr bones|Mr bones]] 18:19, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
===Make a "No Spam" Usertalk Page Policy===
{{Proposal outcome|passed|22-0|make a no spam usertalk page policy}}
Recently, a bunch of friends of mine (you know who you are) placed a lot of images in my talk page. Though it was funny at first, it considerably stretched my userpage and extended it, so it gave me really bad loading times. Same goes for copying text from certain articles and placing them into my talk page, which also extends it until the loading server lags extensively just to load up my talk page in case it has new messages.


Thats good. {{User|Booderdash}}
What I'm proposing is a new policy to prevent "spamming" user talk pages with images or text (this also includes friendly encounters). "Spamming" the talk pages with a load of images and text not only gives it a big deal to load up a page and stretches it horizontally, it also gives users like me a hard time to navigate through them to find any new messages a user might put. Plus, we are forced to make another archive as soon as this occurs. I know I can just remove them myself, but it is much easier if the "spamming" is prevented in the first place. Any "spamming" of the past will be kept, but any future "spamming" will get immediately deleted in user talk pages. I do not think that spamming" improves talk pages in any way. Talk pages are supposed to be used for chatting with other users, rather than fill it up with useless content. It also makes it harder for the administration and others to work through the pages if they want to drop a comment or something.


Having experience with it, I'll share, it's not really a bot. It's a mediawiki extension. So it's a whole lot easier as it needs no maintenance or configuration. Wiki bots generally have to be told to go, except for TheStoneWatcher, I sorta begged Adam to look into codes to make it automatic since it didn't work when he took one of his famous long vacations. So now it's fully automatic, every hour, on the hour. The drawback to the extension is that it does not welcome anyone who signs up using OpenID, if you have that. You'll be able to see New User creations by an IP in the Recent Changes, but immediately after it creates a user page for that person, and we have to manually get them a welcome message.[[User:Axiomist|Axiomist]] 06:11, 17 July 2010 (UTC)
I'm also proposing this to be enforced, just in case it happens to any unwary user, ignorant user, or a user who just wants to play around with his/her friends.
}}


===Change Our Wiki Logo===
'''Proposer''': {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}<br>
<span style="color:blue;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">DELETED</span>
'''Voting start''': September 6, 2010, 20:33 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': September 12, 2010, 23:59 GMT


Yes, chances are, you have already seen that previous proposal of changing the logo. However, most opposers of the previous proposal thought the logo was going to change into the Wikipedia-like picture. Actually, the proposal was changing the logo in general, not replacing it with that image.
====Support====
#{{User|DaisyRox02}} - It was really annoying how you had to scroll to the side in order to read the messages and it did take more time to load with all that crap on it.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} No more giant user talkpages.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} When I look at my comment, it streched longer than my screen.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - I mean it looks nice at first, but then you scroll down forever! Per all.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! I don't even need to read the proposal, spam on the talk page, no, support, per all. Zero signing out.
#{{User|CosmicRedToad}} - When I first saw all that Wario Spam, I decided that the spamming users were "Wario Weirdos". I then tried to avoid their talkpages as much as possible; '''not''' because they love Wario, but because those giant talkpages are annoying nuisances.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|Sgt.Boo}} Yeah, everyone's completely right, and specifically Wario spam covers up talk pages. One or two images? Whatever. Enough to make the server lag and stretch a talk page? No.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - SPAM is defined as '''S'''tupid '''P'''ointless '''A'''nnoying '''M'''essages; what is going on the talk pages is stupid, pointless and annoying so I think it falls under that category.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Per proposal.
#{{User|Mr bones}} Goodbye spammed FF65 and BLOF's pages, good bye good old wario, good...ahem, per alll.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I have to say per all. Takes forever to load a talk page on my netbook and a while to load on my PC. Wonder what would happen if something like Walkazo's computer or a DSi had to load up a 60,000 bytes+ page. It probably would explode. It's not annoying (in the "spammers" perspective) because the people "spamming" the pages were doing this to each other for fun. Why would ANY computer would want to load a page full of disgusting Warios anyway?
#{{User|Booderdash}} BLOF's talk page literally broke my cell phone.
#{{User|Mechayoshi}} I agree. Not everyone uses high speed internet ya know!
#{{User|Garlic Stapler}} Because spam is usually not good.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Imagine this scenario: You're going to reply to a friend's comment. You click the link to their talkpage that has a dubious fluorescent green background. For some reason it takes over 10 minutes to load. When it finally loads, you are confronted with literally '''thousands''' of giant Wario images repeated over and over and over... Eventually you scroll away from that hideous monstrosity into the comfort of your section. Oh dear, Wario spam has stretched the page all the way across the Atlantic. And then the damn advertisement to the right blocks the Edit tab. Then your computer promptly gives up and explodes before you can lose the will to live due to Wario spam. End Scenario. Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Yup. Good idea - Per y'all (did I actually just say that?)
#{{User|Beecanoe}} I don't get a whole lotta messages, but I don't want it to happen to me later. Ever.
#{{User|Young Master Luma}}Yup, it gets annoying to try to read those pages. Per all, except Marioguy1. It originally came from a Monty Python sketch about spam, '''Sp'''iced h'''am'''.
#{{User|Homestar Runner}} Per all.
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per all.
#{{User|Cosmic Blue Toad}} <small>(''Ah, I finally received permission to create a new account, due to my lost password. I can vote again! This is just in time, too...'')</small> '''Oops!''' err...''ahem'': Per CosmicRedToad, Mr bones, Booderdash, Marioguy1, DaisyRox02, Zero777, Frostyfireyoshi, Beecanoe, Mechayoshi, Sgt. Boo, and ''especially'' CosmicRedToad.


Why would I want to change the logo? I am personally getting tired of that logo. Sure it looks nice with Mario in the foreground the history of his games in the background, but it doesn't look original. I saw one created logo in the previous proposal and a lot of people said it looked better than the one we have now. Another reason I want to change the logo because our current logo doesn't mesh well with the other logos.
====Oppose====


Besides, Steve [http://www.niwanetwork.org/ changed our logo] in the site. I suggest the main site should do the same.
====Comments====
Wouldn't it be much easier if you just added a rule about this in your talk page? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:Yes, that's better{{User|Mr bones}}
:::I concur. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


{{scroll box|content=
The problem is, people tend to ignore rules. I want to enforce that specific rule about spamming. Besides, when people do that anyway, it just takes up server stress and it's harder for other users to leave a message, or the owner of the talk page to find his/her message {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}<br>
'''Voting start''': July 18, 2010. 20:13 UTC<br>
'''Deadline''': July 24, 2010, 23:59 GMT.


====Change Our Logo!====
:If people ignore your rules, then notify it in their talk page. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} We should change the logo just like the one in the website.
::No, I'm going to ENFORCE the rule, so it can be prevented. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} LeftyGreenMario does have a point. If our logo is different on NIWA then we should use that logo.
:::Aww you don't like my beautiful gifts of Wario? I can't oppose then. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Kill that boring square in the corner!!!
::::Yeah, I do like them, but after a while, I was forced to archive, and forced to view my talk page using "last change" instead of viewing it. It also caused a lot of hassle to load everything up. I do like it when you do that, but sometimes, fun does screw things up :( That's why I'm proposing this. Yes, I do regret it, but I'm doing it for what's good. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
#[[User:Lu-igi board|Lu-igi board]] DO IT!!!! seriously though, the current logo is neither attractive or memorable. I like the one NIWA use for us.
#{{User|KS3}} Our SMG logo looks ugly and the other logo looks much better.
#{{User|GalacticPetey}} Yes we should change it to our NIWA logo!
#{{User|Mario Fan 123}} - Much better! Put this logo there!
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! This proposal is '''NOT''' to change our logo to the cap one, but it is if we want to change our logo right? Well you are right LGM the current square one doesn't mesh in correctly with the others, so I agree that we change it, but not to the cap one, my reason is my large comment below to per, so do read it and comment on the idea. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Its-a-me Yoshi!}} Per perposal.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Per all (PS KS3, what Super Mario Galaxy logo?)
#{{User|Alexfusco5}} Per my previous suggestion that a broader logo process is necessary.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Wikipedia-like logo was definitely a fail, but the one on that page is simple, elegant, and it really fits on our wiki than the current (sorry current logo :( ). Pictures are just not the style anymore.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}}Per all.


====Leave it the Same!====
IMO this classifies as common sense, do not spam. If people don't follow it, they should get warned. {{user|Tucayo}}
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - I know I won't get far with this vote, and the logo will be changed. Still, I'd like to express this way that I like our logo like it is, even if it's just for the record.
:That's what I thought too, but some people also want to play around with their friends by adding a horrendous amount of pictures. This also causes server stress and huge loading times. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}


====COMMENTS====
::I do think that all those Wario pics were annoying(even though I pasted some on), but why would they be considered spam?{{User|DaisyRox02}}
I am Zero! You're right about it doesn't mesh in together. On another topic, why in the bloody hell did NIWA change our logo, did they have our approval? Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
:::They're not spam as long someone who receives them likes them. I said "spamming", it's not actual spamming :D {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
:Don't yell at them; it's probably a misunderstanding. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}


I concur, and they shouldn't have changed their version of our logo without our permission, we are the only ones allowed to change our logo. Also Zero777, don't swear on this site, there are children on this site. {{User|4DJONG}}
----


: Hell is just a place, though :/ {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
===Expand Main Page to contain all content===
:And they made a smart move, IMO. That new logo looks a bajillion times better than the boxed one. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
{{Proposal outcome|failed|1-24|oppose}}
::It's not "they", it's Steve. He did it. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
What I liked about the main page was I could discuss featured images and vote on polls and all that stuff. The polls left, I was disapointed. However, they brought the polls back, but my other spot the featured images, was gone. It seems that, for stuff to come in, others must go. The way to solve that problem, expand the main page! We want to fit all the stuff everyone loves onto the first page they see when they enter the wiki.
:::How do you know? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
::::I was <s>snooping around</s> curiously checking out his talk page and he said it looked good on the thingy. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
:::::It was my idea. I went to Niwa with the logo and told all the people the SMW is going to change the logo and they all agreed. {{User|KS3}}
::::::With Tucayo and Steve's help.
Since my brother made the new logo, I know a little bit more about this subject. Steve gave permission to use to use the new Mario Wiki logo on the NIWA page. However he wants to keep the logo on our wiki the same. He says Zelda Wiki.org also has two different logo's, so why can't the Super Mario Wiki have two logo's as well? {{User|Arend}}
:I like this one better. {{User|KS3}}
:PS: Why doesn't your brother create an account instead of using yours?


I am Zero! I HAVE AN IDEA!!! Ok it is settled off a popular vote you want to change the logo right, well why only select for/from one? Why don't we have a contest! Users make their own logos and submit it, the Sysops will then start eliminating ones for only one sole or some good reason, but there are still going to be a lot to choose from. After that the voting begins, users can '''ONLY VOTE ON ONE LOGO''' they like. After a set long period of time the votes will be counted an there will be a winner. Where will this contest be held, ....well it is too late to have it in or part of the awards, so I suggest to put it in The Shroom', this way the issues can show us who is winning so far, and on the last month they won't show us who's winning as that will be a suprise for the next month of who won. I say this vote will last a little more then 3 months uless the polls are inactive for a while then the time will cut short. Now who's in!? Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
Alright, so that idea sucked hard, but would anyone be against adding content that wasn't put on their before? We could have character of the week, user of the week, and new pages on the main page. Plus, we could improve the polls a little bit, I think it changes less often than it used to, as well as not including past polls from the last time they did the polls thing.
:I actually like your idea :3 Also, to the angry people, Steve as MW Owner, and me as MW Representative in NIWA changed the logo. Don't get angry. {{user|Tucayo}}
:: Great, idea, Zero777, now we will have several logos to choose from. Any entering logos will look better than the one we have... {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:::Um...didn't porple say this proposal was too late a few comments down? {{User|Marioguy1}}


@BLOF: The current logo is the SMG/MKDS logo.<br>
'''Proposer''': {{User|Beecanoe}}<br>
@Tucayo: I thought that I was the one who brought the topic over to NIWA (but yes, you were the one who changed it). <br>
'''Voting start''': September 9, 2010, 00:00 GMT<br>
@Other people: Please read [[MarioWiki:Nintendo Independent Wiki Alliance]]<br>
'''Voting closes''': September 16, 2010, 00:00 GMT<br>
-{{User|KS3}}
:Wait, I thought this proposal wasn't allowed until the first of August. From the rules: No proposal can overturn the decision of a previous proposal that is less than 4 weeks (28 days) old. The last proposal was started on July 4 (2 weeks and 2 days or 16 days) and the decision was keep current logo, which is the opposite of change the logo. {{User|Turtwig A}}
::So, which proposal is this overturning? {{User|Marioguy1}}
:::@Turtwig A I'm confident the proposal that decided to keep the logo the same is simply a rejection of the logo suggested in that proposal. {{User|Alexfusco5}}


Go to [[Special:Mypage/monobook.css|your custom monobook.css]] and add the following line of code to use this logo:
====Support====
<pre>#p-logo a { background: url(http://www.mariowiki.com/images/mariowiki_logo.png) 35% 50% no-repeat !important; }</pre>
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Per proposal.
This issue was already settled and the proposal is too late. {{User|Porplemontage}}


Didn't know that until it was mentioned recently. Now, if those people really want the logo, they should edit their monobook. Now, can this proposal get deleted? I AM the proposer, and I want Porplemontage's wishes fulfilled. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}}}
====Oppose====
#{{User|LuigiMania}} The reason the FI was gone was gone was because IT WAS USELESS. We replaced it with the polls for more of a participation feel! FI's was a waste of space!
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - The main page is meant to be a quick introduction to the wiki. There's some general information, links, important announcements, a place showing our best content, a place showing the important changes to the wiki, a place for recent news, a place for interesting additions, a poll to make it more interactive, a box for the 'shroom because the 'shroom is awesome like that and a NIWA box. We don't need the quote of the day, it's just a random quote, 5% of the time it's actually funny and the other 95% it's stupid. The FI process was also shut down so I don't see how anyone could add a box for that considering it doesn't exist but, assuming you're planning to restart the system, there are enough images on the main page as is. Granted once in a blue moon the FIs actually produce an image that looks good but there's a very small chance of that happening (as was demonstrated before we shut it down) so the pictures in the FA and Nintendo news sections pretty much represent the image quality of the wiki. The main page is supposed to be brief and have only the most important things, let's keep it that way.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Woah...Per MG1's gargantaun lecture...
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per MG1.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per The One & Only MG1.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per MG1.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} FIs are worthless, the main page is fine as it is.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per MG1, MCD, and my comments below. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, the FIs were rather bad, and their voting system was absolutely terrible. No to mention, the Quote of the day was a pointless process, as the quotes that made it there were not always good, because The Mario series does not have many excellent quotes that could go there.
#{{User|Mr bones}} Per all!
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per MG1. Also, LuigiMania: LUMA <3 the FI.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Although the main page looks a little plain to me, I do not want the Featured Images to return. Plenty of crap got featured due to fan voting. The quote of the day was just a filler. If you want more stuff on the main page, what do you want to add?
#{{User|DaisyRox02}} I disagree with everything that is on the propsal ''exept'' the FI part. I was extremely upset when they were taken off. Poll of the day should'nt be there. Neither should "Did You Know?" That's my opinion.
#{{User|GalacticPetey}} Per Marioguy1, FF65, and Emperor Yoshi
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} Main page overload and computer crashes galore. Per all.
#{{User|Supershroom}} While FIs could be occasionaly good, there are only so many quality pics that Nintendo have produced- sure, they make new games, but not as often as we uploaded new images. I like the polls, per all.
#{{User|M&SG}} - There aren't a lot of images that deserve the feature image status, which is likely the reason why featured images were discontinued.
#{{User|Mechayoshi}} I don't miss what ever's gone- per oh so all!
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} I miss FIs HEAPS, but this proposal doesn't sound like a good idea. Per all
#{{User|Paper Yoshi}} - Per MG1.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - All information = overload = more failures to get to sight = problems for all of us.


===Set limit of proposals by a certain user===
====Comments====
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Failed 1-9</span>
The problem is not space, the problem is the system behind the FI's, it was a total fail. {{user|Tucayo}}
:Yeah, although we could bring back the community template, we'd have to also bring back FIs to balance the main page. The FIs should stay gone, since the whole voting system was terrible. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:::I am Zero! ....For some reason I would sort of consider this a joke proposal since it's just what he wants. He's not really thinking of the space and memory it will take up and download time. Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
Well, maybe this should just be for the 'Projects Seeking Contributors' and maybe a 'Quote of the Day'. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
:Quote of the Day was stupid, it was just a random quote chosen. And Projects Seeking Contributors is a section of the Pipe Plaza. Read that instead. {{User|Marioguy1}}
yeah and the polls are useless to since they really dont do anything by take up space {{User|mrblob1012}}
:The polls are a good extra to the main page. They are as pointful as the DYK, and a bit of fun.. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
:: The polls take up space, yes, but what do you want to replace it with? Sometimes, taking up space is a good thing. <sarcasm>video games are pointless and take up space; let's prohibit them.</sarcasm> {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:::I am Zero! You're just thinking for yourself, what about the people who can't access the main page as quick as you. Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
::::I'm not selfish, it's just that empty space sometimes needs to be filled in with something. I'm not saying that taking space is always a good thing. Unnecessary space leads to server slowdown, but we won't allow a main page with blank gaps. Besides, I use a Netbook, which is a very lightweight laptop, which means it's not as fast as most PCs. The page might load quite quickly, but that's because my Firefox blocked the ads. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:::::Character of the week? Seriously? That's practically what FA is just narrowed down onto the characters! Who needs that? They can just go on the Charcter's page and look at it there, and what if the "Chatacter of the Week" is a stub?{{User|DaisyRox02}}
::::::Why don't we just leave it as is? Nobody will ever agree on one thing, if we did, what would this page be for? The sysops and such have decided on the way the page currently is. We should respect their decisions. {{User|Bowser's luma}}
Gargantuan lecture...sorry, I'm not accusing you of anything but should I make my future arguments shorter? I don't know if you prefer a more detailed version which will be very long or a short simple overview of my points...I personally like the longer paragraphs because they cover every (or almost every) objection that anyone could make but more people are likely to read something short and sweet...anyways, which do you (in general) like better? {{User|Marioguy1}}
:I, personally, prefer the long ones. Long votes are the best; they make me want to consider all the possibilities and vote (whether I vote for or against, it makes me want to vote.){{User|Cosmic Blue Toad}}
Personally, would like a page or two just visible to users. I may not be edited as frequently, but that would matter. It would just be people who can change it. I'm not saying bring back featured images, but we could have things like progress on things like pipe projects or something. Maybe even come up with a better way to show good pictures. Some stuff that we as users need/want to see and doesn't concern others. And if that stuff belongs on the forum, I certainly can't find anything. (You can discuss this bunny trail more on my talk page.) Back to the point. I am fine with the main page as it is. Just suggesting a different approach to add more content. {{User|Geniusguy445}}
::Pages not visible to the general public is a bad idea. All of our pages should be viewable by everyone. If it's even possible to do that, it's still a bad idea. Other than that, we don't need to show people "good" pictures - aesthetics is a matter of opinion. We have no standards of what makes a "good" image as seen by the old FI process where you did not require a reason to vote. Some people like pictures, some don't, we can't classify pictures as good and bad. And "progress on PipeProjects" can be noted in an article for the Pipe Project. If the creator of the project does not wish to do that, it's no big deal. {{User|Marioguy1}}


Well, first of all, we have this for FA's, so why don't have it here? I now that will not convince you all, so I will detail it even more.<br>
----
Please, take this in count, this is nothing personal against anyone.<br>


So, many of the proposals made are rather pointless, impossible, unprobable, or simply useless, so why not set a 2 proposal per person limit in order to avoid this? When one proposal passes/fails, then the proposer can propose another one. Simple.
===Main Page Dilemma===
{{Proposal outcome|canceled}}
Lately, we have gotten many proposals dealing with none other than the main page. "Remove FI's.", "Bring back the Polls.", "Fit all content on Main Page." and so on and so forth. Why can't we just settle that and try to please all of them? 
 
FI's and the calendar that told of interesting facts of that month was personally one of my favorite MP templates, but now they are deleted. We have Polls and now the 'Shroom template, which is also good, yet I really missed some of them that have faded into obscurity. What I propose is that we feature all those templates we all love and enjoy their presence on the main page! Before you go thinking that I am the fit all content on MP proposal, well read on. 
 
We don't need to have all of them on all at once, or else an overload of data would constantly cause a big list of problems. My proposal here is to make a schedule and trade places with the Main Page! To help you understand what I am aiming at, let me describe it for you. 
 
Week 1 - 
* '''FA template''' 
* '''Did You Know''' 
* ''''Shroom''' 
* '''Latest Proposals''' 
* '''M/Nin News''' 
* '''Polls''' 
 
Week 2 - This is just an example of what we could change. Not saying this would be the exact change. 
* FA - to - '''FI template''' 
* Did You Know - to - '''Quotes (Hand-written into seperate template like the DYK.)''' 
* ''''Shroom''' 
* '''Latest Proposals''' 
* '''M/Nin News''' 
* Polls - to - '''Monthly Calendar''' 
 
Week 3 - Back to Week 1. 
 
It would be a MAJOR change for us all, and I wouldn't doubt that it would be hard, but at least picture of such quality and awesomeness we would have for the main page! If we just timed each template correctly, from my calculations, then it should work out perfectly! I know that you all have your opinions about this, so I think I will wrap up this proposal. Just remember that even though it would be some difficult work getting everything started, we could be able to make an outstanding Main Page to satify all!!! 
 
'''Proposer''': {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}<br> 
'''Voting start''': September 17, 2010, 24:00 GMT<br> 
'''Proposed voting close''': September 24, 2010, 24:00 GMT<br>
'''Date Withdrawn:''' September 18, 2010, 01:31 GMT 
 
====Support==== 
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Per MY proposal. 
 
====Oppose==== 
 
====Comments==== 
No. Having a differentiating main page is a bad idea. When someone comes to look for FAs, they'll find FIs. When someone looks for the calendar, they will find the polls. The calendar has to be a month-long thing if it is there at all, stuff doesn't just stop because we remove it from the main page. Furthermore, the FI template was removed from the main page because the process was shut down <u>for a reason</u>. Not to clear up the main page; the FI process is not good enough. And quotes will have the same problems. This proposal is just too inconsistent, we need to have some of those things for a month-long period or not at all. Other things will have bad nomination processes because they are matters of opinions. Sorry but this proposal is not a good idea in my opinion. {{User|Marioguy1}} 
::It is just an idea, and let me see if I can reason with your logic. The Quotes would be made in the same format as the Did You Know? so that we don't have that problem. The calendar we could make it for weekly so that we could show what happens for two weeks (the week it being on and the week it won't be on). FI's did have so trouble with the process and all, so I decide that we should re-cycle the ones we have for the FI if this passes <s>of pure luck</s>. Also, what I have shown above was just a random example of what could be, just to help better image the idea I am creating. I need to make a test page and show everyone what I plan could work out, so give me time to do that and then I will post the links for you to further see my plans. Also, it was just an idea for solving the dilemma of "I want this" and "I want that", so it will either be a win or lose, majority wise. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} 
:::Well, if the idea is destined to become a reality and I object the idea, I must show why. Now let me explain further. Quotes would be updated once weekly but what would be considered a good quote? We just find a random quote and post it? How is that any different than the quote of the day from a while ago? Nobody cares enough to want to see a quote and if they want to, the old template is much more useful. The did you know is actually entertaining to read. The calendar can not be there half the time and not there the other half, a calendar has to be there 24/7. Recycling FIs will also get boring, it is much better to just have a constantly shifting article on the main page. I don't think a test page could really show the theory behind the disorganization of a temporary calendar or the redundancy of reusing Featured Images. A test page can't show all of those things, it'll look good, I'm sure, but it won't be a good concept for the above reasons. {{User|Marioguy1}} 
This will just end in a chaotic mess. The inconsistency will reflect badly on our website. Sorry, but no. - {{User|Edofenrir}} 
::Maybe creating this proposal was not such a good idea, but I still want to see what people think of this. I don't think I will delete it, as I really do want to see the outcome (even if 1-30). It is an idea that is possible, and if done correctly and organized just right would be amazing. But of course, all that there is in need is the inconsistency to fix. I understand that, and I need to figure out how to overcome that, but with some time and previews, I will try to find a way to make my proposal worth it. All we really need is users willing to keep track of all that and be able to consistently swap templates. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} 
::::Okay, [[User:Baby Mario Bloops/Test|Test 1]] and [[User:Baby Mario Bloops/Test 2|Test 2]] are given right here in those links. Test 2 will be edited a lot to tinker with what should and shouldn't be where. The Quote shall now be updated every day (and I can easily help keep track of that) if this passes. Of course we still have to deal with the dilemma about the Calendar, as that is the main problem I need to figure out, but I think with time I can come up with something. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} 
:::::It's just plain crazy how you did it. I don't understand how you just copied the entire Main Page. But...wasn't the Mario Calender mainly useless, and was that why it was deleted? {{User|LuigiMania}} 
::::::I never really found out the reason, but whatever it is we would have to change it so that it wouldn't be like that. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} 
:::::::I agree with Edo, the site will have to have the same front page, with the same content, instead of changing it "randomly" (of course, it's not randomly, but it will seem so). Don't remove the stuff that's already there, I find the DYK interesting, the FAs are (of course) interesting, the poll is awesome, the news are mandatory, the 'Shroom news are great and the latest proposal is important for the members of the site. It's good as it currently is. {{User|Young Master Luma}} 
::Yes, but I was simply throwing out the idea of trying to resolve a lot of problems with the Main Page. I'm not saying removing things like the DYK and the FA, but interchanging them would be possible. I mean, polls are for 2 weeks, so that could work out. All I will say now is that it has a lot of pros and a lot of cons. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} 
:::No, DYK is better than quote of the day, month, week, whatever, it's better than a quote period. Featured Articles are better than featured images; featured articles show our content, featured image just show a picture that 50% of the people that actually voted on them deem "pretty". Polls and the Calendar both have to be there for ever or not at all. Sorry, this just won't work. {{User|Marioguy1}} 
:::Here, why don't I just figure out some other stuff and see if I can make a way for people to like it. I have a feeling that a lot of tests are going to be made... {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
Well it's obvious this one isn't working so would you consider it deleting? {{User|Marioguy1}} 
::::....I guess you're right, maybe I should not embarrass myself any further. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}


{{scroll box|content=
----
'''Proposer''': {{User|Tucayo}}<br>
'''Voting start''': 14 July, 2010 18:00 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': 21 July, 2010 18:00 GMT


====Set proposal limit====
===Making Articles for Keys===
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per me
{{Proposal outcome|failed|0-15|don't make articles for keys}}
I think we should make articles on different keys in the Mario series. The reason this came to me is because I found an article, [[Station Key]], on a key in Paper Mario: TTYD. Then I thought that if this key article can be made, then we can make a whole bunch of key articles, for example, Pit Key (found in the Pit of 100 Trials) and Dimension Key (found in the Whoa Zone) from Super Paper Mario. I made those redirects to Key for now.


====Allow infinite number of proposals by a certain proposer====
There are 27 key articles.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Sorry Tucky, but this really doesn't seem necessary. Users may have a few good ideas at a time that they wish to propose. They could be restricted by the limit. I understand that they could wait, but limiting proposals wouldn't stop people from making fake/pointless ones. Also, if it is fake/pointless, it should be removed, and if a user continually makes bad proposals, they can be warned or banned or something. From what I see here, you are just fed up with a certain user who made a few "bad" proposals above. Also whether or not a proposal is bad depends on the opinion of the person viewing/making it. Sorry, no way. 
#{{User|Booderdash}} Thats not really fair or nesccary. 
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Please don't compare proposals to Featured Articles. Proposals are an idea. Just because you think it's terrible doesn't mean that others think the same (such as the proposer of those). Besides, what's the point in setting the limit? It's bound to fail anyway. Besides, several people can think up of several well-thought out proposals that they don't want to forget and so they state that idea and see the opinions of the others.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Proposals and Featured Articles are two different things, sorry. Per all.
#{{User|KS3}} Sorry, but I have to admit you're overreacting. Per all.
#{{User|Super Mario Bros.}} And I feel it's just a horrible idea. It won't solve any problem. Your comparison of Featured Articles to Proposals, first off, is a mistake in itself&ndash; "Featured Article" is pretty much just a status for an article that is well-written (it's also technically a sort of "Cheers!" to the users who helped the article rise up to F.A. status). Proposals are not some sort of status thing, and directly comparing it to FAs makes it seem like a status thing. What if a user comes up with an outburst of revolutionary, wonderful, magnificent, overbearingly awesome, spectacular ideas that they just to get out there? FAs serve for recognition. Proposals serve to make the general community come to make decisions in a more organized manner. If there are any bad proposals that are coming in, well, they'll probably fail. If not, then the Administrators can have one good look at it and make a decision. Seeing as we deal with quality of proposals already, there is no need to limit the quantity.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} The more proposals the better, we can't limit them.
#{{User|Superboo922}} FAs don't "help" the wiki as much as propasals. Per Super Mario Bors.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Proposals are far more important than FA's and shouldn't be limited, per all.


====Comments====
'''Proposer''': {{User|Mileycyrussoulja}}<br>
Using the FA rule as an example is terrible because the FA rule reinforces the notion that it is important to be acknowledged for your work with a gold star. - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 17:38, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
'''Voting start''': September 19, 2010, 9:00 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': September 26, 2010, 23:59 GMT<br>


Hmm...shorten the proposals per user? Do you mean, when '''his/her''' proposal passes/fails, he/she can add a new one right? In that case, I'm with this. Some proposals are pointless. But FAs aren't the good thing to compare with this. Cause' there are millions of articles!{{User|Mr bones}}
====Support====
:Exactly :) Also, NARCE, your comment makes no sense. {{user|Tucayo}}
::Good then, I'll wait til' tomorrow to vote!--[[User:Mr bones|Mr bones]] 18:18, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
::It makes no sense? Well, here's a q - what good reason exists to limit the number of FAs a person may have under their belt to three? - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 18:26, 13 July 2010 (UTC)


Okay, here is the answer. There are so many articles here. If a user creates 10 articles a day. Wouldn't that be a disaster?{{User|Mr bones}}
====Oppose====
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} This will result in many un-needed stubs which will take up space. I don't even know why the Station Key article is there. The information is definitely covered somewhere else. Why else do you think your previous Paper Mario proposal failed?
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Yet again, unneeded articles which will end up as stubs. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, the keys do not have sufficient information about them to make good articles, also they are not notable enough for it.
#{{User|JF}} They're just the same thing with a different name.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} "List of Keys" would be a good article. The "Station Key" should be merged into "Key".
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Keys are keys, why give them all their own articles? They are too minor and simply belong in the Key article.
#{{User|YourBuddyBill}} List of keys should be made, or better yet, just put it all in the keys article. Make sure to merge in all the pics as well, though, as otherwise it's somewhat pointless.
#{{User|Smasher 101}}List of Keys is a good idea.Seperate Key articles?Absolutely not.We don't need a lot of useless stubs.
#{{User|Mechayoshi}} They would just be stubs. Okay idea but not for that.
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}} Changed my mind. Will make list of keys.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all. I'd even like to merge some of the existing key articles into a list (that's been proposed at least once before, though it didn't pass).
#{{User|WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135}} Per all.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per all.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} There should just be an article containing a list of keys.
#{{User|Mathew10}} Per all.


YOu don't understand, is the number of FA's you can nominate. Not "have under your belt", as they are not yours. {{user|Tucayo}}
====Comments====
Shouldn't this be a TPP on [[Talk:Key]]?{{User|Knife}}


Do TPPs count? {{User|KS3}}
Another Paper Mario pointless item page creation proposal? Why don't we just make a List of Keys or something? {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
:Nope. {{user|Tucayo}}
}}


===Whose Point of View is it Anyway?===
I concur, this proposal should be a Talk Page Proposal, as this obviously does not involve the the Wiki itself. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Continue Using Them 0-0-16</span>
:A TPP on Station Key would be concerning the Key article itself, this one is about creating articles that are keys. The badge one is very similar, it would have been a TPP on Badges if we went by what you were saying. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}


It caught my attention that some level walkthroughs, bosses, etc. articles have it said in the players point of view (Then the player will need to.....), but on the [[Congazuma]] article it has it in the character's point of view (.....then Donkey Kong has to hit him in the head). So it comes down to this issue should we have all the articles at the character's or the player's point of view, or should we leave them alone, or do we do both?
@Mileycyrussoulja: You oppose your own proposal? Surely this is eligible for deletion. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
:No. Just because he doesn't support doesn't mean the idea no longer has merit; someone, somewhere might think it's a good idea. Lack of support isn't a good enough reason to delete a proposal, and it's actually better if proposals reach the deadline whenever possible - it gives us solid decisions to refer back to if policies or articles are called into question later on. Plus, the archives look better if they're mostly pass/fails, and not a bunch of cancellations. - {{User|Walkazo}}


{{scroll box|content=
----
'''Proposer''': {{User|Zero777}}<br>
'''Voting start''': 15 July, 2010, 14:00<br>
'''Deadline''': 22 July, 2010, 14:00


====Character's point of view====
===The Science of Video Games===
====Player's point of view====
{{Proposal outcome|failed|2-15|don't make such user subpages}}
====Leave them alone====
I believe that user sub-pages relating to theories and the like should be exempt from the Userspace 'guidelines', as they ought to be put somewhere. If not on sub-pages, then maybe in the talk page or the article itself. See my example on [[Talk:Ztar]]. PLEASE LIST WHERE THEY SHOULD GO!
#{{User|KS3}} Per Walkazo's comment.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I'll choose this vote because there are less people. (Aren't the two options basically the same thing?)


====Keep Using Both====
'''Proposer''': {{User|YourBuddyBill}}<br>
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per Walkazo's comment, if you don't get "Keep Using Both" term then look at Walkazo's comment. And do you like my reference on the title! Zero signing out.
'''Voting start''': 22 September 22, 2010, 17:11<br>
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} Walkazo makes a great point. We only can use the character's name for articles such as any levels on Donkey Kong, But in articles on multiplayer games such as Mario Kart, we can use "the player"
'''Deadline''': 29 September 29, 2010 , 23:59
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Either way works fine. Per all.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - If it's an action the player is doing (pressing buttons, deciding to go somewhere, etc.) you use "player". If it's something the controlled character is doing (hitting an enemy in the head, climbing up somewhere, getting hit, etc.) you use the character's name.
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} - Per Edo.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Let's say you have the option to be either Mario or Luigi. You say "the player" which is easier than saying "Mario or Luigi." If there is no option (such as if you must play as Donkey Kong) use the player's specific name.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - As long as using "you" is not in this act. ;)
#{{User|M&SG}} - If you have the option to choose who you're using in a boss fight, use the term, "the player"; examples include bosses from ''Donkey Kong Country'' and ''Paper Mario''.  Of course, you use the name of the character if only he/she is used in the fight; you can only use DK in the ''Donkey Kong: Jungle Beat'' boss fights.
#{{User|Nerfman2227}} - Per All.\
#{{User|MeritC}} - Per all; and as long as we're not referring to the reader directly, it's fine.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per my comment below.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Paper Yoshi}} - Per Walkazo.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.


====Comments====
====Support====
I think the games where there ARE alot of ranged gender character we can use "the player" but when its solely male or female we use the character. {{User|Booderdash}}
#{{User|YourBuddyBill}} Please say which space this stuff ought to go in. I think that the science of video games is very underappreciated, and could start much thought-provoking discussion over matters.
#{{User|Mechayoshi}} Okay now that I can vote. per all.


I think a mix of the two is fine: multiplayer games need the option to talk about the player. For example, when you've got something like ''Mario Kart'' or ''Mario Party'', you can't list off ''all'' the playable characters the text could apply to, and simply saying "the character" all the time would sound really bad. However, when you're talking about more conventional games like ''Yoshi's Island'' or ''Super Mario Galaxy'', always saying "the player has to do this, and that, and then they face Bowser" starts sounding a bit too walkthrough-ish, whereas talking about it all using "Mario" as the vehicle sounds more like an in-game perspective, like the character articles (you definitely can't say "the player" when you're talking about what happened to Mario during ''Super Paper Mario'', for example). So, by necessity the wiki will always have some articles saying "Mario/whoever" and others saying "the player", so for the pages where either would work, I think having the option to use both would be the best course of action. For one thing, it'll add variety to the writing: I've always found the presence of both "Mario" and "the player" in the same paragraphs much less repetitive, and therefore easier to read, than passages with only one or the other. And even if some people ''do'' find the duality distracting, as I said before, the wiki ''needs'' both styles, so really, having common ground utilizing both of them isn't inconsistent, but merely knitting the two halves of the wiki together. A voting option to '''keep using both''' should be added. - {{User|Walkazo}}
====Oppose====
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} It's opinion and speculation so doesn't belong on the Wiki. Plus, do you think people will read all of that on Talk:Ztar, especially when it's just speculation?
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Speculation. If you can't share it on the forums, just keep it to yourself. We don't need theories cluttering up talkpages.
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per Fawfulfury and MCD.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, speculation does not belong on this wiki, this wiki tells factual information about the Mario series, thus we can not have wild theories about Mario, I advise you to go to the Mario fanon wiki to make pages about your theories
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} I like science and all, but it is speculation and it doesn't fit this wiki.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per all. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per 22's comment
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Mario lives in a different universe from us, so it would be nearly impossible to explain what is happening. All physics, all elements, all matter, everything is different. Per all.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} - Anyone can pull a theory out of their butt and place it on the page, making us look really unprofessional. Per all.
#{{User|Reversinator}} Per all.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I could say that Luigi isn't a human at all! The nose could be a mysterious appendage used to generate electricity and sense where Mario is! No. Most of this would be speculation.
#{{User|Booderdash}} Mario has NO science in it. WHat are you talking about? Its a game series about MUSHROOMS making people grow larger. You want science, look in a chemistry book. You want fun, play Mario. Also, if you really want sciencecal video games, Resident Evil has it the most, and so does those "virus" games.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per all.
#{{User|Mr bones}} BLOF, Mario isn't real...anyways, the point is, you can't explain how a maple leaf turns mario into a raccoon. In other words, if we does that, everyone will say his theory is the best and it will be a wikitastrophy. Per all.


If we use "the player", then we have this pronoun problem of he/she. Case right here: "The player has to do this and that, and then '''they''' face Bowser." If we use Mario, we can always use ''he''. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
====Comments====
Well, you need to give a time for the voting to start and end. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}


Zero: ''Anyways'' is not a word. Change it to ''anyway''. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
See [http://kamikazekoopa.proboards38.com/index.cgi Mariology], one of our affiliates. It is expressly dedicated to this sort of content. {{user|Twentytwofiftyseven}}
:Or go to the forums and make a topic called "The Theory of Mario"; that would actually be a pretty funny topic :P {{User|Marioguy1}}
Forums tend to glitch up for me, not showing dates of topics or posts, so I usually get in lots of trouble for necroposting. {{User|YourBuddyBill}}


That's why I use "players" on Wikipedia. ie: "Players have to do this and that, and then they face Bowser." - [[User:NARCE|NARCE]] 03:03, 15 July 2010 (UTC)
Votes that were made before the voting period started remain invalid even after it starts. If we allowed anything else, it would defeat the entire purpose of having a "voting period". {{User|Twentytwofiftyseven}}


I am Zero! @LGM oh whoops, I tried to make a reference to Whose Line is it Anyway? and probably thought it said "Anyways". Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
----


One thing we'll have to be careful about is that some mainstream games such as Super Mario Bros. have different characters the player can choose. {{User|Commander Code-8}}
===Making a Power Glove article===
{{Proposal outcome|failed|2-12|don't make power glove article}}
I think we should make a article for the failed accessorie, the power glove. We have a article for the Atari 2600 and the Virtual boy, so why not make a power glove article. I will put in codes the players need to use to play the games.


'''LeftyGreenMario''': It actually ''is'' acceptable to use "they" when talking about a singular player (or another gender indeterminate title). There was a discussion about it last year when we decided to stop using "he/she", after a sockpuppeting troll suggested we simply use "he" to refer to players (but obviously, that didn't go over well). You can see the cancellation of the proposal [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=MarioWiki:Proposals&diff=next&oldid=567857 here], but the idea to use "they" did become policy. (However, I'm not sure if we ''unofficially'' decided to do that as a result of what the proposal brought to light, or if there was another proposal about it at a later date - it was too long ago...) - {{User|Walkazo}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Fuzzipede27}}<br>
:I know "they" is becoming more acceptable in everyday writing and speech, but I feel that we should steer clear of the word when it refers to one unspecified person. It's not correct in everyone's eyes. My teachers don't accept it and I don't accept it. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
'''Voting start''': September 25, 2010, 10:00 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': October 2, 2010, 10:00 GMT<br>


====Support====
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per proposal
#{{User|Tomz123}} What would a Super Mario Wiki without those kinds of stuff?


Wait, this brings up something. If we do The Player, shouldn't that be consistent throughout it? Not saying He/She unless its a ranged gender game? Since both Mario and Luigi are male it should just be The Player the entire time through. Same with Princess Peach, shes only female.  
====Oppose====
#{{User|Reversinator}} Atari 2600 and Virtual Boy are consoles that had Mario titles. The Power Glove is an accessory that didn't have any Mario games specifically made for it.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Unless the power glove have any sort of Mario stuff on it, we are supposed to cover Mario-related content, not Nintendo content in general.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per all. Zero signing out.
#{{user|Basurao Pokabu Waribiaru Zeburaika Zuruguu A}} At Tomz123, it would be the Super Mario Wiki. Not making an appearance in any Mario game (besides cameo) or Super Smash Bros. game makes it not notable.
#{{User|Smasher 101}}Per all.
#{{User|Booderdash}} Per all
#{{User|JF}} Mario has, like, nothing to do with the Power Glove.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} "I LOVE THE POWER GLOVE!! IT'S SO ...totally non-Mario." The only connections are Nintendo & that awesome film, ''The Wizard''.
#{{User|Mechayoshi}}per all. It's not mario at all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} About as Mario-related as Snooki. Per all.
#{{User|Nerfman2227}} Per all.


Case in point sometimes things will look like this:[[MarioWiki:BJAODN/Other#Cosmic Cove Galaxy]]{{User|Booderdash}}
====Comments====
Did the Power Glove have any Mario games made for it period? I don't care about new ones, were any games made for the power glove that featured Mario or one of the Mario characters? {{User|Marioguy1}}
:The Wikipedia article doesn't say anything about Mario at all, so no. {{User|Reversinator}}
::Were there any Mario games that had used the power glove as an item/feature/cameo/etc? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:::No. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
::::I am Zero! @LGM Fail. Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
:::::@LGM I think there's a cameo of it in a WarioWare game, but that alone doesn't merit an article. {{User|Reversinator}}


My opinion would be '''to use neither'''. The walkthroughts are just that -walkthrought, trying to peper them with this kind of faux-narrative is cheesy and unnecessarily wordy.... but I'm sure not many will agree with me. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] 12:07, 16 July 2010 (UTC)
I don't even know hat a Power Glove is. Can someone explain it to me? {{User|Commander Code-8}}
:@CC-8: I'm sure that nobody here can explain better than [[wikipedia:Power Glove|wikipedia does]]. {{User|Marioguy1}}


?So then what do we write if we use neither? {{User|Booderdash}}
----


Err, now that I reread the proposal, I'd say the character pov should be used for Boss articles. Buuuut, levels which have walkthrough in them (ex [[Hooktail Castle]]) should just state the action directly ("Hit the switch, then enter the room"). Things like "From X character point of view" are just baddly-writen word cruft. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] 16:25, 16 July 2010 (UTC)
===And You are.....?===
{{Proposal outcome|passed|16-7|use full names}}
I just notice in some sections of articles, they refer to the game by an abbreviation (''SSBB'' is an example) or by another name usually just a shorten version of the game title (''Brawl'' another example). So we should have this settled once and for all, should we refer to Video game titles only by there full name in mainspace or still refer them by their abbreviations?


:Wrong. That's an imperative sentence. We can't use imperative sentences. Imperative sentences have the hidden "you". {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Zero777}}<br>
::And you say you're bad at english. I don't even know what imperative MEANS! {{User|Booderdash}}
'''Voting start''': September 28, 2010, 21:30<br>
::: I didn't say I was bad at English. I just said that I don't know how to write the language. Imperative sentences are orders, such as "make Wario lose!" or "destroy Wario!" They have a hidden you. The actual sentence is supposed to be "You make Wario lose!" but we can omit it in English. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
'''Deadline''': October 4, 2010, 21:30
:::: On my talk page, you said your english teacher gave you a C or something. Your teacher must be on crack. {{User|Booderdash}}


'Leave them alone' and 'Keep Using Both' are ultimately the same thing. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
====Use Full Names====
}}
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! It won't be that much work, it will just be every time you see one just change it to its full name, no problem. And it will avoid confusion to visitors who are '''very''' new to the Mario series. Zero signing out.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Not everyone knows what those abbreviations mean. It's always better to write it out the long way.
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Per LGM.
#{{User|Mechayoshi}} Per Zero
#{{User|Supershroom}} Abbreviations aren't their real names. It's like calling Luigi 'Weegee'. Mabye.
#{{User|WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135}} Per Marioguy1 (In comments)
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per all.
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per all.
#{{user|Mario jc}} Per Zero777. Using abbreviations is just plain laziness.
#{{User|Photo4}} Per Zero777 and LGM. Plus if it isn't the thing's real name, what's the point of informing people about the false thing?
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|Cosmic Blue Toad}} per all
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} IMO using abbreviations will make the writing unprofessional and less encyclopedic. Sometimes I don't even know what the abbreviations stand for. Also, look at "M&SOWG" (Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games). If you're not sure what game the article is talking about, you might not be sure what that stands for right away (I find it a little confusing myself at times).
#{{User|Cosmic Red Toad}} per Fawfulfury65
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.


===Create articles for the Game Boy Advance ports of Donkey Kong Country series===
====Keep Using Abbreviations====
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Don't Create 1-7</span>
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} It would be a lot of work to track down and remove all abbreviations, and it would be alright if they were kept, but only if the article states the abbreviation first. Such as "''Super Smash Bros. Brawl'', often abbreviated ''SSBB''..." at the beginning of the article.
#{{User|Nerfman2227}} Oh man. It would just be too much work to keep listing the entire name for every time it is referenced. A few titles like SSBM, SSBB, and some of the Mario vs Donkey Kong games come to mind.
#[[User:Lu-igi board|Lu-igi board]] per bowser luma
#{{User|Tomz123}} Per Bowser Luma.
#{{User|DaisyRox02}} Per Bowser's Luma. Who wants to make a link that says "Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games" all the time?
#{{User|Superboo922}} Per all.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, it would take a long time to remove all of the abbreviations, and some games have rather long names to type out, it would be hard to write the name over and over. It would also be very repetitive to write, which, as an encyclopedia, would make us look bad to people coming here from other wikis.


You may have noticed how lately I've been making some changes related to the Donkey Kong Country series. While checking the games' articles, I noticed how they have a quite lengthy section describing MOST of the changes of the Game Boy Advance ports. In the case of the third game, there wasn't even one. I think we should create articles for the ports (including the Game Boy Color port for the first game. This way, we could a more well-explained article that won't be a stub. A link to the article should be put in the original games' article.
====Comments====
{{scroll box|content=
Full names in articles, abbreviations on talk pages. {{User|Marioguy1}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Supermariofan14}}<br>
:We already have a rule on this. Full names go in articles. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
'''Voting start''': 17 July, 2010, 21:00 UTC<br>
::Well then, this proposal is proposing something that has been proposed and passed previous to this proposal. {{User|Marioguy1}}
'''Deadline''': 24 July, 2010, 23:59 UTC


====Support====
I won't be voting in this because my view is that something should only be shorted/abbrieviated if it's already been mentioned. {{User|Commander Code-8}}
#{{User|Supermariofan14}} As explained above.


====Oppose====
*{{User|M&SG}} - Abbreviations should only be used when the game's full name is shown BEFORE the abbreviation is used. That way, people won't get too confused.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Per comments below
:I believe that things should never be abbreviated, it will not kill you to write the entire title and improve clarification and understanding within the article. And @ all those opposing because it's "too much work", this is an easy task, it will probably be done in under a month after this proposal passes (maybe even a week if people work dilligently). {{User|Marioguy1}}
#{{User|4DJONG}} Well, if we give the GBA ports articles, we would produce multiple stubs or clone articles. Also, they work fine as sections in the original game articles.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Yeah, they'd make clone articles, just like [[Super Mario Advance 2: Super Mario World]] and [[Super Mario World]].
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all. Merging the GBA games with the originals would be a better way to make our coverage of these ports uniform.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} I've never played any of these GBA games but I've heard Fawfulfury65 that they're fairly similar to the originals.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all.
#{{User|KS3}} Per all.


====Comments====
[[MarioWiki:Manual of Style#Naming an Article]] - look at the last paragraph. So now shouldn't we all be using full names to begin with? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
Many of those listed changes are minor. Other than that, the game are too similar to have an article. {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
:That applies only to article titles...this proposal will close all loopholes. {{User|Marioguy1}}
:I agree with BluePikminKong. They really aren't ''that'' different, and the changes can easily fit right into one article. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


I concur, they are two versions of the same game with the same plot, and few changes. If they were given articles, they would be clones of their root articles. {{User|4DJONG}}
I am Zero! @ChillGuy Writing down the game's name is your own personal thing to do but nothing will change on the search, you can still type down "SSBB" and still be redirected to the Super Smash Bros. Brawl article if this proposal pass, so your vote is invalid. Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}


Also, if we split them all, I'm sure they'd turn out like [[Yoshi's Island: Super Mario Advance 3|this]]. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
Who cares if it's been a propsosal before. Maybe the outcome will be different. Like I said above, who the heck wants to make an incredibly long link every time they create the link?{{User|DaisyRox02}}


I agree, the lack of major differences means that those ported versions do not deserve articles, that is why this proposal is useless. {{User|4DJONG}}
:If someone doesn't know what the abreviation means, they can just roll-over the link and the roll-over text'll show what the link is.(direct comment to LGM){{User|DaisyRox02}}
::DaisyRox: Wave over this link ([[SSBB]]) - what does it say? "Super Smash Bros. Brawl"? No, it says "SSBB". And now, wave over this word (''SSBB''), what did that say? Nothing? See there, two examples of when an abbreviation would not be understanded unless you know what "SSBB" means. {{User|Marioguy1}}


:Then how about a separate article for the changes on each game? {{User|Supermariofan14}}
It's a ''redirect''. Okay, fine then. I lose. End of story.{{User|DaisyRox02}}
::Automatic stubs, we should keep them in the article itself. {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
:::Well, if we put the differences in the articles they wouldn't be stubs, but I think the game articles with the GBA ports merged into them is be just fine as it is now. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


Seeing how the ''Super Mario Advance'' articles ended up, I'd actually prefer to merge those again rather than even separating the handheld versions of ''Donkey Kong Country''. --{{User|Grandy02}}
----


I put up 3 proposals to merge the SMA remake articles back into their respective original game articles. {{unsigned|KS3}}
===The prefix "List of"===
:Good idea, though the better thing to do would have made ''one'' proposal concerning all four ''SMA'' games, like how the ''[[New Super Mario Bros. Wii]]'' Toads were dealt with: with the proposal on [[Talk:Yellow_Toad_(New_Super_Mario_Bros._Wii)#Split and Merge Article|only one page]], and [[Talk:Blue_Toad_(New_Super_Mario_Bros._Wii)#Split and Merge Article|the other linking to it]]. Having one voting arena for all the pages ensures uniformity, avoiding a situation where people vote differently for different pages (or simply not vote for one page). I could fix it for you tomorrow, if you want. - {{User|Walkazo}}
{{Proposal outcome|passed|3-11-0|add "list of" to all lists}}
::Only thing, the first 3 articles should be merged, because they are stubs/clones, but the fourth one is long enough to be a separate article. {{User|KS3}}
There are 166 lists on the wiki. 105 have the prefix "List of". The rest don't. We need concistency. Either we remove List of, or we add list of. I prefer removing it, because list of is unnecessary. While some of you might argue that people wouldn't know what is a list and what isn't, most of the articles that have list of are articles that people would expect to be lists.
:::But that would be inconsistent. The fourth game may have a longer page and more things to write about, but it's still just another ''Super Mario Advance'' game, and if we merge the other three, we must merge the fourth: "all or nothing" is basic Super Mario Wiki policy. - {{User|Walkazo}}
::::But if that's inconsisent, then we should merge all the remakes into their original articles, like Super Mario 64 DS. {{User|KS3}}
:::::I see your point, but ''SM64DS'' isn't quite the same thing as the ''Super Mario Advance'' titles - for one thing, it's not part of the ''SMA'' series (this connection alone is why I say those four games must be treated equally), nor is it even for the same console as them and the ''Donkey Kong'' ports. It also adds three new playable characters and the plot points to go with them, making covering both games in one page is a bit more of a juggling act than the GBA titles. - {{User|Walkazo}}
}}


===Set a day for the DYK section to be updated===
'''Proposer''': {{User|Reversinator}}<br>
<span style="color:blue;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">DELETED &mdash; Proposer was banned</span>
'''Voting start''': October 1, 13:04 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': October 7, 23:59 GMT


The DYK section is being updated randomly, sometimes not even upgraded at all for months in a row. I propose that we set a day (I don't know yet) that the DYK is going to be updated, like the FA and the "soon to be ending" FI. If you support, vote underneath the date which you want the DYK to be updated.
====Remove "List of" from all lists====
{{scroll box|content=
#{{User|Reversinator}} Per me.
'''Proposer''': {{User|KS3}}<br>
#{{User|SWFlash}} Per Reversinator.
'''Voting start''': 17:22, 22 July 2010 (UTC)<br>
#{{User|DaisyRox02}} - Well, it's a no-brainer that they're lists. If it's got a bunch of links on one page, it's a list. In other words, per proposal.
'''Deadline''': 24:00, 29 July 2010 (UTC)


====Set day for DYK section to be updated====
====Add "List of" to all lists====
=====Monday=====
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per Vellidragon's comment below. Also, if 105 list pages have "List of" in their name, then surely it would be easier to add that to the remaining few list pages instead of taking it off the page title?
#{{User|BluePikminKong497}} Tuesday seems pretty random to me. Per MCD.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per vellidragon
#<s>{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per MCD as well.</s>
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} The easiest way to be productive is what we want, so per Vellidragon.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Per comments
#{{User|Vellidragon}} - Per my comment.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} This wouldn't work that well. Example: The List of Implied characters would just be called Implied Characters. Per all
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, the list of implied locations' name, if this were to happen, would be not self explanatory, and people that have came here after this proposal will not know what the page is at first look which is a bad thing, we need people to be able to look at the page name and know what the page is about.
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per all,especially Vellidragon.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per Vellidragon's comment below and all.
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}} Per everyone in this header.
#{{User|Sgt.Boo}} Per Commander Code-8.


=====Tuesday=====
====Leave the list titles alone====  
#{{User|Ratfink43}} Any day is good for me (Im just picking the day with the most voters
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! I change my mind, though Monday is a beginning of a new week, mostly everybody don't have their mind straighten up and things a rocky at first. On Tuesday they know what to do now and their minds are straighten up; that's why I'm changing it to Tuesday. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Superboo922}} Per Zero777.
#{{User|Toadex}} Per Zero 777, although any day would be good as long as we do have a set day to change the DYK section.
#{{User|Booderdash}} I'm not allowed to use the computer on weekends so I vote Tuesday. Besides DYK isn't that big of a deal...
#{{User|Super Mario Bros.}} &ndash; To tell you the truth, I think we shouldn't overwhelm ourselves with having to update two things on one day. A Tuesday-Thursday-Saturday Main Page rotation seems pretty good, in my opinion.
#{{User|Marwikedor}} -Per all


=====Wednesday=====
====Comments====
Imo, the "list of" parts make sense as a means of justifying the use of the plural in the article title, which is not normally allowed. It also makes it clear that the article doesn't just explain the concept of something; e.g. a "List of Games" lists games instead of just describing what games are; if it didn't have the "list of" part, a logical assumption would be that it does the latter.--{{User|Vellidragon}}
:I agree with Vellidragon, if the article is an article entitled (following his example) "Games", it is expected that the article will contain information on what games are, different gaming systems, etc.


=====Thursday=====
:However if the article is entitled "List of Games", it is expected that there will be a large list of all games which is what will actually be shown in the article. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::Then what about pages like the Bestaries we have for the PM series and SMRPG? I mean, I do like the idea of being all the same, but still, it will be hard with some names to move. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
:::DaisyRox: Of course! It's definitely a no-brainer to know what's a list and what isn't '''without looking at the article'''! How could I possible have overlooked the powers of psychometry :) {{User|Marioguy1}}


=====Friday=====
----


=====Saturday=====
===Character Pages Extras===
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Weekdays are too busy with school, Saturday would be the best day to edit it every week.
{{Proposal outcome|failed|3-13|don't split other media from character pages}}
#{{User|Tomz123}} Per to Fawfulfury`s comment.
Alright, you can even look at the articles of [[Mario]], [[Luigi]], [[Peach]], and so on, to see that the pages are HUGE! In all, that is a very good thing that should be with all the info they have, but then you see the small sections known as the cartoons and comics area. Do we really need them to be on the main characters pages? I mean, we can't just toss it aside, but really...
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per FF65, and it is also FA rotation day.
#{{user|Iamthedude}} - Per Fawfulfury65. I would have said the same thing had he not already done so.
#{{User|4DJONG}} Well, since weekdays have school, and most of our users are children, we should should use a day where they have the most time available to them.
#{{User|BobombFuses}} I am BobombFuses, and I say since I'm usually busy with something on another site, I'd go for Saturday.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Okay, I'm changing my vote. Per all.
#{{User|Alexfusco5}} Makes sense to keep all rotations on the same day
#{{User|Red Mario}} Agreed, Saturday seems the best.
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Changing vote. Per 4D.


=====Sunday=====
My proposal is not entirely deleting that info about the comics, cartoons, stories, and that stuff, but to move it to a different page. To show an example, for the comics that Mario has been in, we could make a page {{fake link|Mario (comics)}} and be able to view all the comics Mario has been in and what his comic-counterpart is like. That will help with all the information from the animated stuff that differs greatly from the character's video game background.


====Keep upgrading DYK section randomly====
It might sound troubling at first, but think of it as just making another page for the character. We have [[Baby Mario]], [[Baby Luigi]], [[Baby Peach]], and so on, and they are just a younger form of the adult counterparts we have known for awhile. And on that topic, we even had a proposal before that wanted to separate some of the baby info from the video game since the cartoon made it seem like they appeared a lot earlier.


====Comments====
Alright, I think I talked quite enough for the proposal statement, so just vote on what you think would be best for this wiki. I'm just saying though, that the pros are more pleasant and outnumbering than the cons for the benefits to the wiki.
I was actually thinking about that today... {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}


Whats DYK? {{User|Booderdash}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}<br>
:I am Zero! It stands for "Did You Know?". Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
'''Voting start''': October 3, 2010, 0:43 GMT<br>
:: Abbreviations... does it hurt to type out the whole thing? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
'''Deadline''': October 9, 2010, 23:59 GMT<br>
:::Thanks! Who updates or edits the "did you know" though? {{User|Booderdash}}


@Zero777: Well, usually people are refreshed after a weekend and they have to go to work/school on Monday so wouldn't be in the right frame of mind on Tuesday. Also doing it on Monday would get them in the right mood for work or school as well. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
====Support====
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Per all the statements I have written above and below. :D
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per proposal, I think that the comics, etc. are too off of the actual games (especially the movie) to be included in the same article.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} There are very big differences between the comics, cartoons and video games. They should be seperate.


What? Sunday is the start of the week. SMTWTFS. {{User|General bob-omb}}
====Oppose====
:Well, most people see it as Monday, it's the start of the work/school week and the end of the weekend, so it must loop back to the start. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} It's easier for them to all be together. If someone doesn't want to see them, they can easily skip those parts. We'd, as a result, have many useless stubs and also less FAs.
:: In France and other European countries, Monday is also the start of the week. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
#{{User|Cosmic Blue Toad}} per MrConcreteDonkey
:::Yeah, like the UK, where I live. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! There will come a limit where it needs to split into separate sub-articles, but I don't think we reached that point yet. Zero signing out.
::::According to the Wikipedia article, 'Sunday is the last day of the week but, in Jewish law, Sunday is the first day of the Hebrew calendar week. The official ISO 8601 Calendar Standard states that Monday is the first day of the week, but in the Judaeo-Christian tradition Sunday has been considered as the first day'. So whichever one you agree with, I still think it's Monday. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
#{{User|Superboo922}} Hey Baby Mario Bloops, there's this thing called the content box. I suggest that you use it. Per MrCD.
:I'd just like to say that it seems you guys are just voting for your favorite day. Just want to know if any of the voters here have payed attention to the Main Page rotation process? I'd advise everyone to check it out: Featured Articles rotate every Saturday. Featured Images (soon to be replaced by Polls) rotate every Thursday (Polls, which are replacing Featured Images, will rotate every other Thursday once they're up). Everything else is more dependent on wiki, Nintendo, and community factors (specifically, the Mario & Nintendo News box, Community box, and Proposals box don't have a set date). Make of this what you will. {{User|Super Mario Bros.}}
#{{User|Walkazo}} - This is like saying the dictionary is to wordy and then proposing they put all the nouns, verbs, adverbs and adjectives into separate books. Sure, the individual volumes may be smaller, but you still need all four to get around, and between them, there'd be even ''more'' pages when you take into account the quadrupled set of introductory and explanatory sections, publishing info, cover pages, and whatnot (one per "dictionary"). Granted, a lot of the larger pages ''do'' need work, but rather than hacking away at them with quick-fix solutions like this, we should shorten them by streamlining the text and cutting out little snippets of superfluous writing here and there (like how they shorten the definitions and remove the most obscure words to make pocket dictionaries), while at the same time developing the sections that need ''more'' info. Rewrites may take a lot of time and effort, but they make the wiki look much better and are well worth the work. Plus, as Glowsquid alluded to in the comments, the whole "canon" debate has become nothing more than a recurring little migraine for our wiki and the less we go poking at it, the better. Long story short, until Nintendo says the games, cartoons, comics, movies and books (and anything else they have or will throw at us) are all separate timelines or whatever, we have no choice but to treat them as one big mess of equal and truthful continuity, lest we delve into the realm of slippery-sloped speculation, which has no place on our (ideally) hard-facts-only database. It's not an ideal way to organize all our content, but it's the best we can do with what we've been given to work with.
#{{User|DaisyRox02}} Per Walkazo's really long comment right above. Of course they have to be on the same page as the characters! Why would you need to make a completely different link? It'll just create more stubs, and that's boring. Other than that, it's still information about the character.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Per Walkazo.
#{{User|Cosmic Red Toad}} per Walkazo
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per Walkazo.
#{{User|Stooben Rooben}} Per Walkazo.
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per Walkazo.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I've put a buttload of cartoon information in the Mario article since there is none. I thought it would be nice to have information for all episodes since we are supposed to cover everything. Anyway, this proposal might be a good idea since the Mario page takes forever to load. However, we do not know if the cartoons are canon. Why can't we place the games in a separate article? What if the cartoons are what the Mario story is really about? No. The Mario movie thing is a different story, but I'm not willing to separate the Mario comics and cartoons just because they are not Nintendo games. Per all.
#{{User|Koopalmier}} While I do think games and other medias shouldn't be considered the same, they shouldn't be on different pages. However, I think informations from games and informations from animations and comics shouldn't be mixed - at least the elements regarding the games should be put prior to anything else.


I vote against Saturday since my dad doesn't allow me on the internet when hes home. Which is on weekends, I can only play during weekdays. {{User|Booderdash}}
====Comments====
Has anyone else here seen the DC wiki? They have a similar thing that this proposal's talking about. There's one article for the mainstream comics character, and another for that character in a TV Show, Parallel universe etc. and it works pretty well. It wouldn't hurt to have the same thng happen here, Especially since we don't have much on the comics/cartoons. {{User|Commander Code-8}}


@Bowser's luma, BluePikminKong497: Could you rethink or remove your votes because I have changed mine. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
One other thing is that we might have to create some disambiguation pages so that these new articles can actually be found. Eg: The Mario disambiguation might have about 5, which could include the Cartoon, the comics and a seperate one for each film. My point is that we need to be able to make disambiguation pages. But it shouldn't be to much of a problem. {{User|Commander Code-8}}


@Booderdash: Don't vote against Ssturday because ''you'' can't edit on weekends, you should support it because most users can edit on that day. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
The DC Wiki may do this, but at the same time, DC comics are much heavier on continuity than Mario, and some "alternate universe" versions are considered characters in their own right. It's not rare for Superman to meet one of his alternate-univere self, for  one. And the reason we have separate pages for the babies is that they're often seen at the same time as their adult counterparts (ex: The sport games, M&L: Pit) and thus are different characters.
:Yeah, and you could check it on Monday. Anyway, it's only the DYK section. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}}}


===Revamp [[MarioWiki:PAIR|PAIR]] system===
The proposer says the character pages are huge, and while our amount of content certainly plays a part in that, the main reason is that they're honestly [http://a.imageshack.us/img717/1142/mario1c.jpg terribly] [http://a.imageshack.us/img525/9676/mario2x.jpg written], filled to the brim with wordcruft, tangents about the IRL impact of the games and summarising entire plot including the parts that aren't relevant to the character. Even the cartoon sections have that problem, describing damn near every episodes Mario appeared in, even though most of it is not relevant.
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Don't Create 7-21</span>
Not really sure where to put this... Anyways, some of you old users might know that we used to have a way to review articles known as PAIR. However, it was put on hiatus for some reason. It was a really great way to review articles for FA, and, due to the lack of ''good'' FA nominees latley, I am proposing we restart the PAIR system with a whole new team of users.


'''Proposer:''' {{User|BluePikminKong497}}<br>
And though that's a silly reason, I'd like to avoid the inevitable headache ''if'' either [[User:Stumpers|Stumpers]] or [[User:Son of Suns|Son of Suns]] come back, both of which were senior sysops really, really opposed to separating the cartoons and comics from the games. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] 12:22, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
'''Voting Start:''' 21:36, 29 July 2010<br>
::Well, my point sort of came from looking at all the pages that Bulbapedia has. View it from that, as they have many characters their comics and cartoon counterparts. You could reason with them also about they could be the same person and so on and so forth. But see how sucessful that is with theirs, and we could do the same thing. We have a lot of agruements with the comics/cartoon and it deals greatly on this wiki, and this proposal is meant to be an alternative that will solve that problem. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
'''Deadline:''' 23:59, August 5, 2010
:::I think the Mario article is too long but I don't think this is the way to go...we want our viewers to be able to find information on Mario by typing "Mario" into the search box. We don't want them to go looking through a whole bunch of Marios to find the Mario they want. It is our job to give them what they want with the least amount of work on their part, no matter how much work it is on ours. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::::Hey superboo! That's called the table of contents, I suggest you get your facts straight next time you try to make someone feel bad or it'll jump back at you :) {{User|Marioguy1}}


====Support====
Geez, Superboo. You don't have to be so harsh about Baby Mario Bloops' proposal. At least he tried.{{User|DaisyRox02}}
#{{user|BluePikminKong497}} Per proposal.
#{{User|New Super Mario}} Sounds great even though I haven't done it before.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per New Super Mario. Revamping the PAIR system would ensure that only the best articles (quality-wise) get nominated, resulting in fewer objections.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Per all.


====Oppose====
MarioGuy1:You're acting as though we would have about 25 Mario articles if this proposal passes. All you need is a disambiguation page and it shouldn't be too hard finding them all. {{User|Commander Code-8}}
#{{User|Booderdash}} Old, not needed, fas are doing fine without it, and its too complicated to get it up and going. Way too hard to do, mainly only sysops will be working on this
:::Alright, just to clear up some confusion if any, it will not be like '''Mario (Character), Mario (SMBSS), Mario (ASMB3), Mario (comic #1)...''' but like '''Mario, Mario (cartoon), Mario (comics)'''. And probably add the Mario Movie into the cartoon page (which would then be changed to '''Mario (anime)'''). [[User:Baby Mario Bloops/Test|Here]] and [[User:Baby Mario Bloops/Test 2|here]] will show you an example, and some changes that would be made. I got a little lazy with Test 2, so I didn't feel like adding a made-up intro, description, or personality as of this moment. I hope that will help show you a better idea of my proposal. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
#{{User|Super Mario Bros.}} &ndash; You say that you're going to revamp the system. How, exactly? Also, it didn't really work the first time, and we had editors just as dedicated to the wiki as the current ones. I just don't see it working.
:I still disagree with this proposal but I think you may be on to something BMB, maybe if we made a sub-page of the Mario article (i.e. Mario/Episodes) we could have a description of Mario's role in the (i.e.) Super Mario Bros. Super Show! and then we'd have a link leading to "a complete list of the episodes Mario has appeared in". It would definitely allow us to have more information and it wouldn't treat it as different timelines or different Marios which seems to be a main reason for opposing. I support my idea and when I feel like it, I'll get around to proposing it if nobody (*wink wink*) else (*wink*) does (*wink wink wink*) ;) {{User|Marioguy1}}
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - May I just ask why we would need them right now? I have not seen many FA's that were not meant to be an FA. Sure a user is going left and right and nomination pages as if they were bunnies, but that is not a reason for PAIR reviews. And Booderdash is correct that it is way to sophisticated to do. BTW - It is very opininated, meaning it doesn't fully represent an article.
::That sounds like a good idea. I was even considering putting all the episodes Mario appeared in somewhere else and put a main summary on another page. There are plentiful episodes, so I don't know why we have to give details on the games, but not on the cartoon episodes. (*blinks*) agghhh too much winking (*explodes*) {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Per all.
:::'''@MG1''': I think I understand what you are saying. So it is to have sub-articles of Mario - which was the main goal of the proposal - to put the comics/movie/cartoons on. Then, on the Mario Page, we could just summarize the series into a well-written paragraph, deleting both the stubby sections, yet not making an entire new Mario Page. I like you're thinking btw. It is beyond 3 days, so I can't change it now, but I think I might (*wink*) follow your advice and see if another proposal later will deal with that. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
#[[User:Lu-igi board|Lu-igi board]] per all
::::OK, I have filled [[User:Marioguy1/Test]] with all the examples you need. I suggest you just get on with the second proposal and ask an admin to delete this one but if you want to see how this one ends off and then propose the second one, I'm fine with that too. In your proposal, you can use my test page as an example (unless that's not what you want). Make sure to stress that this will apply to all characters ''at the user's judgement'' (i.e. if the character makes a cameo in one episode, we don't need to split it off but if they appear in several, well, the user editing the article sets the limit. As long as people use common sense, they won't get it wrong). {{User|Marioguy1}}
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Your proposal about revamping that system is much too vague. What are your plans about it? How will you revamp it? How will you expell it of the flaws that caused it to collapse originally? As long as you don't have solutions for these issues drafted out and presentable, the systemn will not be revamped.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Per Edo.
#{{user|Tucayo}} - Per Edo.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Though it does sound a lot like fun, there's a reason the PAIR went on hiatus and I don't know exactly. If we are going to bring it back without making any major changes, chances are, it will go on hiatus again.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I basically said, "What are we going to revamp?" and I don't have any answers yet.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} It is pointless. Per all.
#{{User|Blue Toad}} per all


====Comments====
----
What are we going to revamp? (P.S. If this proposal passes, make sure the list thingy follows the No-signature  policy. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:We're revamping PAIR. {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
:: I know we are revamping it, but WHAT part of PAIR is needing a revamp? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:::Pretty much all of it. You guys know how many articles KS# nominated.... {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
...This is incredibly old. Saudy is there and hes been banned for more than 2 years. {{User|Booderdash}}
:Thats cause its OLD. If you will do something as big as this, then you have to say what you will do to improve it. {{user|Tucayo}}
What about new users like me? What is the PAIR system? {{User|New Super Mario}}
:Read [[MarioWiki:PAIR|this]] to find out. {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
@Booderdash: Too complicated? I said i would start it all up myself. {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
::No offense BPK, but you're 11, you were complaining that you didn't know the rules on Tucayo's page that you were just 11, yet you can all of a sudden want to do this huge task? {{User|Booderdash}}
:::It's not ''that'' huge, and besides, your only 12, and age doesnt matter. i'm very smart for my age. {{User|BluePikminKong497}}
:::: I'm sure you are and as am I, but since you were complaining on how young you were on his page, I thought you wouldn't be up for this. -_-. {{User|Booderdash}}
Um, try not to pass judgements on people based upon their ages. It's not nice to say "You're too young" - if he's up for the task, let him do it. {{User|Marioguy1}}


I know, I'm not stopping him, just wondering. {{User|Booderdash}}
===Showing only passed proposals on the Main Page===
{{Proposal outcome|failed|1-17|don't show only passed proposals on the main page}}
I've sometimes gone to the wiki and looked at the proposal and seen that the idea looks really weird. I then go onto the Proposals page and find that the proposal only has about 3 supporters and maybe 10 opposers. Seeing something that won't be taken action about on the Main Page seems to make the wiki look bad.


I think this is like the third time there's a proposal to ressurect PAIR: Our current policy is "Do it if you want" - but you just can't force people to do it. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] 14:54, 31 July 2010 (UTC)
I am proposing that only proposals that have successfully passed be Featured on the Main Page, so that people can log in on the wiki. See what the proposal is and possibly start helping out with it


Didn't it go on hiatus because nobody was interested in it? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Commander Code-8}}<br>
'''Voting start''': October 5, 2010, 5:17 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': October 12, 2010, 23:59 GMT


And it isn't needed. Our Fas are fine as it is. This is just like Narce's make Fa rules stricter thing. We'll have to unfeature most of our fas. {{User|Booderdash}}
====Only Feature passed Proposals on the main page====
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} Per my proposal
====Keep on showing Proposals that are still in voting time====
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per Reversinator's comment. Zero signing out.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per Reversinator's comment.
#{{User|Smasher_101}} Per Revesinator's comment.
#{{User|WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135}} Per all comments.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Showing active proposals on the main page draws attention to the current changes that are suggested to be made. It convinces people to see what changes are going to be made and what side they should take. Featuring passed proposals seems like a waste of space. There are no functions to a passed proposal and it doesn't look too glamorous, after all. Passed proposals belong in the archive, not in the front page.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I think that the proposal on the front page is supposed to stir up attention, not say, "Hey look, it passed! Make these changes!"
#{{User|Sgt.Boo}}Per LeftyGreenMario.
#{{User|Garlic Stapler}} Per LGM and Reversinator. Also showing only passed proposals doesn't motivate anyone to try getting involved and they will likely assume that the proposal is already being taken care of.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all, including Reversinator.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per all.
#{{User|M&SG}} - Active proposals draw more attention to current changes.  If only the winning proposals are displayed, that won't give the active proposals a good look.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, if passed proposals are shown on the main page, it would draw attention away from current proposals, and also make us look unprofessional, also the people that come after something like this proposal were to pass would think that the proposal shown was still active, and they would vote on that proposal, and would mostly stay clear of the other ones.
#{{User|JF}} Per all.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} I approve these words! Hahahaha per all.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Per all.


:Or we can just fix them so they don't ''need'' to be unfeatured. {{User|Blue Toad}}
====Comments====
::'''@Blue Toad''': Or we can't do it just like Wikipedia since we don't have millions of people viewing it everyday, thousands upon thousands of users, and that anyone can edit!!!!! Also, not all nom's are bad, yes the KS3 (no offense KS3) nominated are not prepared, but not ALL of them. NARCE was just used to Wikipedia, and if we followed NARCE, then we would be all blocked for a year. I just saying, you can't call all nom's bad. {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
The main page shows the most recent proposal. It doesn't matter if the proposal in question is failing. And besides, someone could make a vote-shattering comment that causes everyone to support. {{User|Reversinator}}


::: I'm not calling all nom's bad, I'd just like a chance to try it. I think it's worth a shot, and it doesn't seem too sophisticated or complicated to me. But then again, it's only my opinion. {{User|Blue Toad}}
I don't really know what's the point in this. I thought the proposal on the main page is there to attract attention to the proposal. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:I think Commander Code-8's point is that passed proposal frequently require a lot of work to actually realise after they have passed, and that this may get people to help with that. Personally though, I sort of doubt anyone is going to help with these things just because they saw that a proposal passed on the main page. The way it's currently handled, the main page directs attention to proposals still in the voting phase, and people are a lot more likely to participate in a proposal by voting than by adjusting articles after it has passed simply because takes much less time and effort.--{{User|Vellidragon}}


Guys, the PAIR system isn't here to criticize the FAs, nor is it to make stricter rules. It's here for people to review how they are before they are nominated. Then we wouldn't have so many terrible nominations. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
Wow, a proposal about proposals. Per all commenting. {{User|WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135}}
::I still don't see the need for this. For instance, if we had had this, many articles like Dry Bones, Sir grodus, and Shadow Queen wouldn't be nomianted in the first place,  but since its already featured, when someone nominates it for unfeaturing people would say there's no need for unfeaturing, there's problems but it can be fixed, but when its in the PROCESS of nominating, people would oppose it for problems that can be fixed. Besides most votes are fan votes anyways. {{User|Booderdash}}


I don't understand your reasoning. I don't know why... This is just a way to review articles, and the review is optional for articles. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
----
:I think this proposal is to make it nonoptional. {{User|Booderdash}}
::No, the proposal is simply revamping it, bringing it back as it was before. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


===New Video Page===
===Image Gallery or Gallery===
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Don't Create 7-21</span>
{{Proposal outcome|passed|0-13|simply "gallery"}}
On some articles, the header that leads to the article subject's gallery either says Image Gallery or Gallery. This doesn't look professional to have one header on one page that says Image Gallery and another header on another page that says Gallery. We need to fix this.


I don't know if this is really a proposal (it is more like an idea) but why not make a page where Users can post videos of gameplay etc. I think it would be cool to show people new skills, action, and ideas.
'''Proposer''': {{User|Mileycyrussoulja}}<br>
{{scroll box|content=
'''Voting start''': October 6, 2010, 8:08 UTC<br>
'''Proposer''':{{User|New Super Mario}}<br>
'''Deadline''': October 13, 2010, 23:59 UTC
'''Voting start''':12:15, 28 July 2010 (UTC) <br>
'''Deadline''': 24:00, 4 August 2010 (UTC)


====I like it====
====Put Image Gallery on articles====
#{{User|New Super Mario}} I think this is a great idea. It may be a lot like youtube but, some people don't go on youtube.
#{{User|Mukumukuluma}} Per all.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} The channel will be called MarioWiki:Videos and per all.
#{{User|Iramatak}} Per all.
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} I'd use it a bunch. Cool idea, but we need people to post videos. If they will, let's do it!
#{{User|Nerfman2227}} Per all.


====I dislike it====
====Put Gallery on articles====
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} This idea has been suggested before and opposed to. We have YouTube for this. Go to YouTube and upload videos there. If people also want to view videos, they shouldn't be here.
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}} I think it should just be Gallery. Image Gallery just sounds too... i don't know. Doesn't sound right.
#{{User|Marwikedor}} Horrible idea to have Youtube videos on our wiki per BLOF.
#{{User|Garlic Stapler}} Gallery, Image Gallery? Let's just leave it at gallery, short and to the point of where it links to.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I hate Youtube, though. Per all.
#{{User|Sgt.Boo}} I don't really think it matters too much, but it should stick to one thing. Gallery is short and simple and hits the nail on the head in terms of what to put.
#{{User|Booderdash}} We had this before. Stupid idea. Mariowiki isn't as famous so it NEEDS a youtube page anyways. People can just create individual accounts.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} The "Image" part is ''pointless'' and a waste of space. Gallery is best.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! That is a horrible idea, why do we need that; the SMW is not a chat/forum to share stuff on large scales. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - It would be like saying large big, they literally mean the same thing here. Don't go be like Mario Mario, as we only need 1. Also, it is already Gallery, so lets keep it from being POINTLESS.
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Basically per BLOF. Though the OTHER one had 3 users vote for to have it, that (I think) was outmatched by 16. And my comment as well goes for a matter... (The LOADING TIME! Videos would more or likely slow to a browser time-out.)
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Same thing as the term "the reason why...is because...". Too much unnecessary words.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} If we do this, I will probably not be able to browse the wiki as much on my DSi Browser (it can't load videos very well). And per all.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! What else will you be thinking on a website that says "gallery". Zero signing out.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per All. Apart from LGM, because I love YouTube. If people want to learn new skills, it's much more fair that they can find them out for themselves
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} "Image" is kind of obvious. Just "gallery" is good, in this case "Image Gallery" is rather redundant. Per all.
#{{User|4DJONG}} Well, we do not need a page of YouTube videos, we are not a social website, we are an encyclopedia. If we were to make a page like that, it would be decremental to our quality as an encyclopedia.
#{{User|Yoshi's Island}} Per 4DJONG.
#{{User|MeritC}} Per all.
#{{User|Tomz123}} You could just have another window.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per all.
#{{User|Blue Toad}}Per LuigiMania, Marwikedor, 4DJONG, Booderdash, BabyLuigiOnFire, Gamefreak75, and Zero777!
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; This is a factual Wiki.  Link to your YouTube profile on your userpage, but don't create a page for this stuff.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} That would basically kill the whole purpose of this wiki.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per all.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all.
#{{User|WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135}} Per all.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Per all.
#{{User|Smasher 101}} Per all.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} Per all those with the word "pointless" on their minds...
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.


====Comments====
====Comments====
I don't actually dislike the idea, but the idea of the video is not needed here. You should change the headers. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
Guys just a reminder, i'm talking about the headers on articles that link to the subject's gallery, not the actual gallery itself.{{user|Mileycyrussoulja}}
:Or delete this proposal and put the youtube videos onto your userpage. {{User|KS3}}
::@KS3: What makes you think those places allow youtube videos? I know ZW and youtube do and IDK about WK but I know UP doesn't. {{User|Marioguy1}}
I am Zero! Would this be considered a joke proposal? Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}


Seems pointless...and if we even HAD one, the loading time would go haywire...{{User|LuigiMania}}
Will this have to be done manually, or can it be done with DPL text replace? {{User|Ralphfan}}
:The text replace function has no DPL in it, and this wiki does not have it so, yes, manually would be a good choice. {{User|Marioguy1}}


Why just youtube though? Youtube is a worse source than wikipedia, and admins call wikipedia a bad source for things like release dates and the such. {{User|Booderdash}}
I am Zero! Can somone please archive this. Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
:That's the only video site I know. There are tons of others out there. The internet is not only limited to YouTube. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}


No, this is a horrible idea because there are A MILLION videos of Mario out there, and people will try to post a million different videos on the page; its just not worth it. Go on youtube itself and search it up. {{User|Booderdash}}
----
}}


===Set a day for the DYK section to be updated===
===Move Episodes from Article to Subpage===
<span style="color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Set Saturday for the DYK to be updated 5-0-0-0-0-9-0-0</span>
{{Proposal outcome|passed|8-4|put episodes on subpages}}
This proposal is kind of like BMB's last proposal, except it is proposing to move the episodes of appearance of a character, as long as the character has many of these appearances, into a subpage of the article. I'm not going to go in depth in the description but this will save loading time on longer articles for those people who don't want to see every appearance of Character X in Series Y. For the people who do, there will be a link :)


The original proposer got his account banned and his proposal deleted because of that privilege. However, this proposal brings up a good point, that's why I'm reproposing this. It's just as exactly the same as the last one, just that I'm proposing this. What day shall we update the DYK?
If you don't get it, [[User:Marioguy1/Test]] is my awesome example page :P
{{scroll box|content=
 
'''Proposer''': {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}<br>
'''Proposer:''' {{User|Marioguy1}}<br>
'''Voting start''': 23:29, 29 July 2010 (UTC)<br>
'''Voting Start:''' October 12, 2010, 22:00 EST<br>
'''Deadline''': 24:00, 4 August 2010 (UTC)
'''Deadline:''' October 18, 2010, 23:59


====Set day for DYK section to be updated====
====Seperate====
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - This can reduce loading time on many articles without making too many subpages like BMB's former proposal would have.
#{{User|Cosmic Red Toad}} - per BMB's old proposal and this one. i dont care about... episodes or whatever?
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Well, same as before, yet his is more logical I guess. Also, do realize that the Gallery Proposal is much like this, as it is a sub-page of the character, and we do have to best guess whether it should be a sub-page for some characters.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per proposal.
#{{user|Tucayo}} -Per all.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} I was thinking about this when I typed up the Mario episodes. I thought we have to cover every single appearance of Mario, so there, a billion episode descriptions. The making of the subpages will help the loading time greatly.
#{{User|New Super Mario}} Per proposal
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! There are high chances that they're not going to make a new Mario cartoon so putting it in a sub-page will'nt be a bad idea. It can give more room to upcoming game info. Zero signing out.


=====Monday=====
====Remain in Articles====
#{{User|Booderdash}} Start of the week, perfect. Besides whats so "groggy" about it? Its just a DYK.
# {{User|Bowser's luma}} If we were to do that, why not make a subpage for game appearances as well? The point of an article is to have a lot of info in one place, not to be a map of subpages. I can understand a subpage for the likes of images, but written information belongs in the article.
#{{User|GalacticPetey}} per Booderdash. it just seems right.
#{{User|Arend}} Do we need of ''every'' page a subpage? Galleries were enough for me. Besides, some featured articles have much info ''because'' of the length and inclusion of important sections - Game appearances, personality etc, relations, other info, misc. I bet that those might be unfeatured after this proposal passes. Also, per Bowser's luma.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per Booderdash, I was going to say Tuesday because of the same reason as the other proposal but your right it's just DYK, just a small section, it's not like the whole main page. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Basurao Pokabu Waribiaru Zeburaika Zuruguu A}} You've got to think of things from a reader's viewpoint. This ruins a reader's ease in reading pages. Let's say they want to read the whole Mario article. Now, they'd have to go to a separate page to see his episode appearances? Not to mention the test page basically shows episode summaries.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|Reversinator}} Per all
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} How long does it take to do it anyway? Per all.


=====Tuesday=====
====Comments====
Well, if we did something like this to Mario, wouldn't it be consistent to do it with every other character from the cartoons? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:Yes, pretty much. As long as they appear in multiple episodes, or something like that. It's basically up to the user's best judgement to determine whether or not a sub-page is required. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::@Bowser's luma: Did I ever say anything about a subpage for games? This proposal is an alternative to the recently failed proposal about making subpages to games. Please don't extend the content of my proposal beyong what I put there, I am opposed and always will be opposed to subpages for games. Yes, articles are meant to cover the content of a character, but we do not need a complete listing of the episodes that the character appeared in, rather a general statement of their overall role in the episodes will suffice and if anyone cares to delve deeper, we have a link for them. It shortens the page for all those who don't want to see every single time '''Mario''' has appeared in a series entitled the Super '''Mario''' Bros. Super Show. Chances are that he appeared in more than a lot of episodes. For those who want to read the article as a whole, we have a paragraph describing how he was the hero in the shows and he fought against Bowser and yadayadayada, we list the abnormal episodes and say how they were abnormal and then the reader moves on, knowing what Mario did in that series. If they want to read about his appearances there and they specifically target that section, we have a link for the odd reader who does want that kind of thing. But for the other two types or readers, who are much more common, we have a general overview. {{User|Marioguy1}}
:::@Arend: Fed up with subpages? Why? Do you just find them annoying? Personally, I find that subpages help move some of the content that people may not want to see which will take up a very extensive portion of the article, away so that only those who want to see it will see it. And if any FAs were featured because of any good qualities, I would like a list of them so I can create unfeature noms for them all. Perfection is not a representation of how many good things an article has, perfection is a representation of how many bad things it does not. If any articles were featured because they have a "long, descriptive section in the middle" then they should be unfeatured. They are not perfect (or as close to perfect as possible) if they have a big section in the middle and many errors everywhere else. If they have no errors anywhere and a big section in the middle, taking away the section won't do anything bad to them. {{User|Marioguy1}}


=====Wednesday=====
I don't like the idea of only doing this to the main characters' articles. It's much more consistent to do this with all character articles from the cartoons, no matter how minor. Deciding what characters are main and what characters are minor is mostly based on opinions if you ask me. I always thought of [[Oogtar]] as an important and major character, but I'm sure not everyone can agree on that because he doesn't appear in many episodes as far as I know. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:What I mean by that is for characters like [[Mario]], [[Luigi]], etc. there would be a subpage. Maybe for characters with multiple appearances like [[Mouser]] but for a character like [[Pine]], there is no need to split it into a subpage so it won't be split. Whether there is need or not is up to the user editing the article but I would personally never do it for someone who appeared in only one episode and never anything else. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::@The guy with the long name: I ''am'' thinking from the typical reader's viewpoint. What you just described was an atypical and less common type of reader. Someone who wants to read the entire Mario article will have to click one link, and all the others who ''don't'' won't have to scroll through 11 paragraphs of text just to skip one section. And if someone wants to know what Mario's appearance in that series is, there is a paragraph describing what he does. {{User|Marioguy1}}


=====Thursday=====
----


=====Friday=====
===Categories on Boss Articles===
{{Proposal outcome|passed|8-3|use new category system}}
OK, this proposal, obviously, has to do with the categories on the boss articles, something like this was recently stated on the talk of the main page however I think that to be an official policy, it must be proposed and passed by the community. So, currently, ~all (or so I am told) boss articles have three categories in them, Enemies, Bosses and Characters. I propose that we use those categories much more strictly, AKA for the following reasons:
*[[:Category:Enemies|Enemies]] - This category will only be used on characters that are unnamed individually and are simply known as members of a certain species. Like Goombas, not [[Goomboss]], not [[Red and Blue Goomba]], just the members of the species that are generic and anonymous. Examples include [[Goomba]], [[Koopa Troopa]], [[Spiny]] and [[Nitpicker]].
*[[:Category:Bosses|Bosses]] - This category would only contain enemies with different variants, like different music, different size, solo text where they state they are "superior" or "notable", different coloration, etc. Examples include [[Goomboss]], [[Baron Brrr]], [[Lakilester]] and [[Bowser]].
*[[:Category:Characters|Characters]] - This category will only contain named characters. If the being in question is named and not just a generic member of a species then it would be considered a character. Examples include [[Mario]], [[Yoshi (Paper Mario: The Thousand-Year Door)|Yoshi]], [[Bowser]] and [[Goompapa]].


=====Saturday=====
'''Proposer:''' {{User|Marioguy1}}<br>
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} Weekdays are too busy with school, most users can edit more on this day.
'''Voting Starts:''' October 12, 2010, 21:00 EST<br>
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} i agree with fawfulfury65. That or sunday is good.
'''Deadline:''' October 18, 2010, 23:59
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, since weekdays have school, and most of our users are children, we should should use a day where they have the most time available to them.
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Per EY.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Easiest day as it is the day we are mostly free on.
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Per all.
#{{User|Blue Toad}} per BMB
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Yay! No edit conflict by <cough>Fuzzipede27,</cough>! Anyway, per all!


=====Sunday=====
====Use this Category System====
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - When looking for enemies, people want to see enemies, i.e. the different species that bosses fall into, not bosses in general.
#{{User|Supershroom}} - I completly agree. What's the point of having a bosses category if they are all found in other categories. However, you suggest that Bowser would be in the Bosses category, when he is a character as well. I mean, if someone was asked to name some major Mario characters, I'm sure they would mention Bowser. So, if they then came here, and wanted to see some Mario characters, they would think that there would be a mistake in the category if they didn't find Bowser there. For most of the other bosses, like those who have been seen once, would be fine in their own Bosses Category. On the other hand, some people might lke to see a page with all the named characters (the lazy blobs could jus click links to other pages though), so this might be why there is so much disagreement about this topic. Oh and what Marioguy1 says. I only really disagree about Bowser, and other important characters like the Koopalings and Kamek (and so on and so forth) only being in the bosses category, when they are charcters too. Take [[Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story]], for example. You fight Bowser (three times, if you count Bowser X as the third), which makes him a boss, yet you also play as him, mking him a character. I could go on for ages, (I aready have XD) but I can't be bothered to type any more. I broke my finger a few days ago, and I think I'm making it worse. Finally, per proposal.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|Cosmic Blue Toad}} &ndash; Per proposal and myself in the comments.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Bosses are not enemies, and to be honest I expected that common sense would make that obvious. Both of these terms are distinct roles in video game jargon, and in the usual case they are exclusive to one another. These two categories should never appear on the same article, except in the very specific case that something is encountered as a boss AND a regular enemy. Do not mix this up.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} I agree with Edo's comment.
#{{User|Rise Up Above It}} Finally, a comment that helped me decide my vote. Thanks, Edo! Per Edo.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Took me a while to decide, but per all.


====Keep upgrading DYK section randomly====
====Continue Using Current One====
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Bosses are characters as well as enemies. All current categories apply, some of which are just more specific than others. It is like so: Characters>Enemies>Bosses. Bowser is a boss, but that doesn't remove him from the categories of "Enemies" or "Characters."
#{{User|GalacticPetey}} Per Bowsers Luma
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per Bowser's Luma.


====Comments====
====Comments====
BLOF, you still have to describe it in the descriptions, so people who haven't read the old one can understand this. {{User|Booderdash}}
So you are saying Bosses =/= Characters? I would think that characters may be like a "mother category", with many other ones branching out, like Bosses, Enemies, Allies, etc. {{user|Tucayo}}
:Actually, I think most (if not all) boss articles would also be character articles. What I'm saying is that not all character articles would also be boss articles. I'm just trying to set category standards in this small area of the category tree. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::The boss category is a specific sub-category of "enemies". It applies to those enemies that are fought in a "boss battle", bosses are defined as enemies but you don't meet up with a Bowser on the road and (forgive the Pokemon reference) have "A wild Bowser appeared!" flash onto the screen. He's slightly more sinister than a casual, oh look, it's ''another'' one of those things. And if Bowser is a character AND a boss, he will be categorized as a character AND a boss, I don't see the dilemma with having two categories. {{User|Marioguy1}}


Saturday, the school-free day. Definitely the best choice for most users when summer is over. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
Look, the branch of "being" categories are kinda like this in my eyes:
*Species - Races of different beings. Some are usually nice (Allies), some are usually evil (Enemies).
*Characters - (Important) members of different species, which usually have a name.
*Heroes - The good guys, who usually save worlds, characters and important items. Mario (a Character) is a Hero, Yoshis (a species) are too.
*Allies - Nice characters or species which help heroes on their way, and are against enemies. The character Toad is an ally, and so are his species. Mario is sometimes an ally too.
*Villains - Usually the bad guys. They usually kidnap certain characters, steal important items and take over worlds. Villains are usually characters, not species. Bowser is a villain
*Bosses - The term "Boss" is used on characters who are need to be fought, or are leaded by a villain, or eventually ARE the leaders of a branch of enemies. Villains can be bosses as well. Bowser is not only a villain, but also a boss. Hammer Bros. (a species) are (mini)bosses too.
*Enemies - This could be anything that is bad. Evil species, villains AND bosses. So Hammer Bros. are also enemies, and Bowser thus too. And so are Goombas.
A little complicated, and maybe a little hard to understand. {{User|Arend}}


Not for everyone, I heard alot of people have school on Saturday too. How about Sunday? Or do people go to church too much on that day? {{User|Booderdash}}
:Well, I think of them like this:
*Species - '''All''' different '''races''', ''good or evil'' (such as [[Goomba]]s, [[Bub-ulb]]s,  [[Lakitu]]s,and [[Yoshi (species)|Yoshi]]s)
*Enemies - '''Evil''' or mean '''species''' ''that can'' usually ''be fought'' (such as [[Koopa Troopa|Koopa]]s, [[Bombshell Bill]]s, [[Magikoopa]]s, and [[Mawful Mole]]s)
*Allies - '''Good''', supporting, or helpful '''species or''' minor '''characters''' ''that'' usually ''assist you or you'' need to ''rescue'' (such as [[Toad]], [[Toad (species)|Toad]]s, [[Luma (species)|Luma]]s, and [[Luma (character)|Luma]])
*Characters - '''Anyone''', ''good or bad'', who has been '''specifically named''' (such as [[Fawful]], [[Toadette]], [[Bowser]], and [[Waluigi]])
*Bosses - '''Evil characters''' who ''you fight in a'' '''boss battle''' (such as [[Red Ninjakoopa]], [[Bowser Jr.]], [[Dark Fawful]], and [[Tatanga]])
*Heroes - '''Good''', major '''characters''', not allies, ''who'' usually do their best to ''help save the day'' (such as [[Mario]], [[Yoshi]], [[Lakilester]], and [[Rosalina]])
*Villains - '''Major bosses''', ''usually the final boss''es, which the entire game leads to their defeat (such as [[Dark Fawful Bug]]/[[Dark Bowser]], [[Shadow Queen|The Shadow Queen]], [[Smithy]], and [[Bowser]]


I'm usually busy on Sundays. Also, I've never heard of anyone who goes to school on weekends. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
<small>Recap:<br>
'''Species''':''All races'', good or evil ([[Dryite]]s)<br>
'''Enemies''':''Evil species'' that can be fought ([[Octoomba]]s)<br>
'''Allies''':''Good species or characters'' that assist you or you rescue ([[Tayce T.]])<br>
'''Characters''':''Anyone specifically named'', good or bad ([[Starlow]])<br>
'''Bosses''':''Evil characters'' you fight in a ''boss battle'' ([[Kammy Koopa]])<br>
'''Heroes''':''Good characters'' who help save the day ([[Luigi]])<br>
'''Villains''':''Major bosses'', usually the final boss ([[Super Dimentio]])</small>


Are you serious? Most european people do, and asian people do too. Plus American people who want to be really successful in life do too, but those are like 4% of America. {{User|Booderdash}}
Well, that's what I think. {{User|Cosmic Blue Toad}}
:In America, you don't even get a choice as to what days you go to school until after high school (12th grade), so you cannot assume that Americans are unsuccessful just because they do not go on weekends. It also depends on how you define successful.{{User|Mario4Ever}}
::To go in a top 10 college is my definition. But alot of americans are successful, I never mentioned that they weren't. {{User|Booderdash}}
:::Ok, sorry, but you did imply that 96% of Americans have no desire to be successful. Even if one does end up going to a top 10 college, there's not much one can do with a degree if factoring in the present state of the economy. I'm just saying that it's incorrect to classify a mere 4% of America of wanting to be really successful. I'm done being off-topic now. {{User|Mario4Ever}}
:Here in England no-one goes to school on Saturday/Sunday. In France they definitely do, but only for half a day. Not sure about the rest of the UK and the rest of Europe. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}


I've never heard of that, I'm not European or Asian. But I did hear of very few schools that have classes on weekends. Most of the users here are from North America, though, so most of us don't have school on weekends. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
A boss is an opponent, usually one of a kind, who is fought under special conditions. In action games a boss is usually introduced somehow, commonly with a cutscene, and you fight it in an arena of some sorts. In an RPG those often have their own separate battle theme or something else that sets them appart from the enemies. An enemy on the other hand is one of the many common nuisances you encounter in a level. They are usually not unique or specially introduced, and you often encounter more than one of them in one level. These are set roles in video game jargon, keep that in mind.


Still, though its a international wiki and some of our own sysops came from places other than North America. (Grandy02} {{User|Booderdash}}
So apparently there are people saying the Bowser article should have the Enemy category on it. Now let me ask you a question: Where, even in one single game, has Bowser ever been encountered as a common enemy? In which game did he roam a level like a Goomba, or Koopa, or any other enemy? That's right, never! This is why the Enemy category has no place on the Bowser article, and neither does it have one on any other boss article.


:Yeah, I heard Europeans don't go to school on Wednesdays or Sundays, but go there every other day, but then again, I could be wrong. People that have school on Saturday (in USA) are usually (not ALWAYS!) failing students. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
This whole Enemies-Bosses constellation has been formed because of the assumption that most bosses hold a grudge against Mario (read: They are his enemies). However, this is not what the Enemy category is for. It is for common enemies '''only'''! We can't just stretch the scope of a category because of semantics like "You can use the word 'enemy' in a sentence with them, so they have to be enemies". We don't put Category:Bosses on [[Princess Peach]] because she is the ruler (read: the boss) of the Toads. The example sounds ridiculous? Well, the whole argument is the same if you think about it long enough.


Not those people who are "nerdy" and work their buttocks off 7 hours a day. {{User|Booderdash}}
The scope of a category needs to be clear and precise. Don't dilute it with semantics that contradict logic and the fundaments of video game principles. - {{User|Edofenrir}}


Why do we care who edits more? This is the DYK. As far as I know, its Steve who does it.Anyways, for Monday we get the pleasure if looking at it for a real week, Saturday is awkward and new users might get confused. {{User|Booderdash}}
----


:"''Not those people who are "nerdy" and work their buttocks off 7 hours a day.''" -_-' ReallY?
===Take out Community Polls and Bring back Featured Images===
Saturday school is for those people who failed classes and are trying to earn credits in order to not have to retake the class again. Anyways, let's get back on topic, please. {{User|Gamefreak75}}
{{Proposal outcome|vetoed|This is not up to the userbase. The main page is crucial in making a first impression on guests and so we need to make it as impressive as we can.}}
Ok I kind of liked these at the start but now that it has been a while, they get kind of boring. One thing is that there are polls on the forum. If people want to do the polls so bad they can just go on the forum and create polls themseleves or answer polls other people have created. A second reason is that the polls are there too long. I get on and the poll that I vote on is still there. My last reason is that with Featured Images every user can do it and not just people on the poll commitee. With the polls all you do is vote and it is done, nothing else happens. With the FI you can go on time to time more frequently and put images on/vote on them.


What about those ace people who do extra work on weekends for extra credit to get a good scholorship to get into harvard or one of the top 10 colleges? But I think we can go back on topic. I mean its just a DYK.{{User|Booderdash}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|New Super Mario}}<br>
}}
'''Voting Start''': October 18, 2010, 6:20 UTC<br>
'''Proposed deadline''': October 25, 2010, 6:20 UTC<br>
'''Date Withdrawn:''' October 19, 2010, 01:30 GMT


===Merge all sport moves for each character to their respective articles.===
====Bring back FI====
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Don't Merge all Sport Moves 9-11 </span>
#{{User|New Super Mario}} Per Proposal


People have been asking this for a long time so I'll just put it here. All individual sport moves each character has like [[Iron Hammer]] should be merged into their respective article that the sport move is, which in this case is [[Offensive Power Shot]]. This will help make navigating alot easier.
====Keep Polls====
{{scroll box|content=
'''Proposer''': {{User|Booderdash}}<br>
'''Voting start''': : 7/30/2010 1:00 GMT<br>
'''Deadline''': 8/6/2010 23:59 GMT
====Support====
#{{User|Booderdash}} Per proposal
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, the sport moves do not deserve pages because they are not notable enough.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} Duh, I made a talk page proposal about this.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Per proposal and per all. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per all.
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Per all exept Emperor Yoshi.
#{{User|Iamthedude}} per Booderdash.
#{{User|Blue Toad}} &ndash; per Zero777, and Booderdash
 
====Oppose====
#{{User|BluePikminKong497}} Per Knife in the TPP. It would affect much too many articles. also, if we already have a TPP, can this be deleted? I don't see any reason to merge them since none are stubs.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} A great deal can be added to those articles. What does the character do when using it? What does it do? How do you use it? All that can be added to not make a stub and also make it long enough to have its own article. They work absolutely fine how they are now, in fact, hardly any one of them seem to be stubs at all.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all. Besides, if a stub can't be expanded, the way I see it, it's not really a stub - just a short article that says everything it possibly can about a minor subject, and there's no shame in that. The recent push to merge what seems like every last stub is getting out of hand: as long as the page has a picture and some information that was worth the click of the mouse, I say there's nothing ''wrong'' with it at all: stubs are not evil! Also, while I'm not a fan of having to read many articles for only a little information, I prefer that over having my poor old computer crash every time I try to view the sort of large pages these merges will create.
#{{User|Tucayo}} - Per all
#{{User|RAP}} - Per all.
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} Per all.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - Per Walkazo.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} Per all.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Horrible idea, we haven't merged any other sports moves so merging these would break the trend and hurt the professionality of the Wiki. In other words that probably exist, it would be a damaging step to the improvement. Per all.
#{{User|FireBabyLuigi11}} Per All
#{{User|Knife}} The sports moves have three things that make them unique enough to have their own article; character, appearance, and ability. Sure they may be short, but that's unavoidable since they don't have much information to cover. A lot of those sports articles have the three important pieces of info anyway, so some stub tags should be removed. Stubs are not defined by lack of text but rather lack of information. I would like everyone to remember that.


====Comments====
====Comments====
BPK, yes, it affects too many articles hence why its now a MAIN PAGE PROPOSAL! It was bad in a talk page proposal because it affected too many but its perfectly fine for a main page proposal. {{User|Booderdash}}
The Featured Image process does not work, no matter how many rules we add, the physical impossibility of that system prevents it from working. {{User|Marioguy1}}


It can make navigating alot easier. {{User|Booderdash}}
----


65: It's not only the matter of stubs; it's also the matter of how convenient this is. I find it very inconvenient because I have to keep on clicking on links. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
===Merge [[Mario Tennis]] Characters===
{{Proposal outcome|failed|2-11|don't merge mario tennis characters}}
I've been checking the Project Unstubify page and quite a few of the character pages and notice that almost all of them have only one or two setences and a stub template put onto them. I think that they should all be merged as one page since there is literally no one to expand those stubs at all.


LGM: Oh yeah? Well I like clicking on links!!! <small>Or do I?</small> {{User|Frostyfireyoshi}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Garlic Stapler}}<br>
'''Voting start''': October 13, 2010, 9:15 EST<br>
'''Deadline''': October 20, 2010, 23:59


LGM: Yes, but I find some of them to be long enough to have their own article. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
====Support====
#{{User|Garlic Stapler}} - Per proposal.
#{{User|Beecanoe}} - You know, this could be the start of something new.  Not only could we merge the Mario Tennis character articles, but merge articles about other really minor elements, too (such as the Mario & Sonic Olympic events, sure they're not as short as the Mario Tennis characters, but they're stubs, nonetheless).  I pity the foos who think that idea is a bad one.


:Those articles aren't very long, though. Frostyfireyoshi, you might like clicking on links, but it's very inconvenient to click constantly through related articles. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
====Oppose====
::Walkazo has a great point. Some computers can't handle long pages very well. I'm sure that page would take a while to load up on my DSi brower if all those abilities were merged into it. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}} I oppose because this is the MARIOWIKI and each character is supposed to have their own article.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} I have both Mario Tennis games for the Game Boy systems and each of those character have a slightly different role and personality (from what I remember). Per all.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - We are the mariowiki, we do not limit our content based on our writing capabilities, we wait for someone with better experience with the game and character to come along and do it. We do our best, even if that's not the best. We cannot give up because of a minor impass, take te easy road and limit our content. We must challenge ourselves to make it better and only then can we call ourselves an encyclopedia. For the wiki!
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} This is a foo who thinks this idea is a bad idea. Pity her. Per all.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} Per all.
#{{User|Mariomaster228}} Per all. Even if an article is a stub, it still has the potential to grow. Mario and Luigi each have their own articles, so same thing here.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! Specify on who do you mean by "Mario Tennis characters" and I might change my mind. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, we should not limit our content on our experience with the game, it would make us look like a amateur encyclopedia, thus, we should wait until someone with more experience with the games to add to the pages.
#{{User|Rise Up Above It}} Per all. I pity the foos who think that idea is a good one.


@LGM: Yeah, I know it's inconvenient. That comment was just a piece of crazy sarcasm that I think failed. Seriously though, FF65 & Walkazo have very great points. {{User|Frostyfireyoshi}}
====Comments====
If you don't like the fact that they are stub articles, why not write more? {{User|Bowser's luma}}
:To be honest I've played the games a couple of times, really isn't much more you can write about them to be honest. =[ {{User|Garlic Stapler}}
How about we just don't have those articles at all? No one cares about those characters anyway. {{User|Beecanoe}}
:We are the MarioWiki, we have articles on all characters, major or minor from the Mario series. ESPECIALLY if they are playable. {{User|Marioguy1}}


I don't think putting all sports moves for a certain game in one article would really make navigating easier. It would just turn it into that old glitch page we had, where all the glitches were put into one article. The article was so long, it took forever to find the right thing. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
Beecanoe: Please don't call other people "foos" just because they have a different opinion than you. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
:Yea, even though I can't expand and I support my own idea, don't call people "foos", kind of demeaning. {{User|Garlic Stapler}}
:::Foos. Is that like foosball? {{User|Bowser's luma}}
::::To be honest, I didn't really call anyone a foo. I just thought my idea was good and that it might work.  But if anyone was offended, I apologize. Working with Dry Bowser, his rudeness kind of rubs on to you. 
Oh yeah, and "foo" is how Mr. T. says "fool".  Hope that clears things up for you Bowser's Luma. {{User|Beecanoe}}


The [[Mega Strike]] article isn't ''that'' long...  Is it?
----
And if this proposal fails, will we need to split up the [[Mega Strike]] Page?
It is sorta inconvenient to have to click all those links...
When I have so many links open, my computer takes a very long time to load, and those links just annoy me to be split!
The [[Mega Strike]] page is fine, I think, and to have another page like it wouldn't be so long as ''the old glitches page'', would it?
I don't understand how it would be worse merged...
It seems it would be less links to have to click on, easier access, and simply convenient.
[[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]]


:It will take longer to load if there is one large page than many small pages, actually. If you have a horrible connection, it takes FOREVER to load up a large page. Besides, these special moves are unique. They aren't similar to each other at all. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
=== The Lists on the Left Side Below Mario Knowledge ===
{{Proposal outcome|failed|7-11|leave lists as they are}}
Pretty simple proposal. You know those lists about [[List of characters|Characters]], [[List of locations|Places]], [[List of items|Items]], etc.? These lists are split into two: game stuff and non-game stuff. Why are they separate? Due to those canon proposals, shouldn't they be one list? I'm proposing that we merge the non-game stuff with the game stuff in those lists.


Guys, you know this proposal already failed. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}<br>
'''Voting start''': October 6, 2010, 21:23 UTC<br>
'''Deadline''': <s>October 13, 2010 23:59 UTC</s> '''Extended:''' October 20, 2010 23:59 UTC


}}
====DO MERGE====
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} This isn't a matter of organization. We're supposed to update the list according to the previous proposal of merging game with non-game stuff. Besides, A-Z is enough organization we need. If you want to separate things as much as possible, fine, split the character articles into more articles.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per LeftyGreenMario: it's policy to list games and alternate media side-by-side, and anything that doesn't do this is merely outdated, with the exception of certain Navigation Templates (i.e. {{tem|Human}}), which ''need'' the differentiate between series and whatnot. The lists don't need to be separated to show what media they are from, however, because the sources are listed right there on the pages.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - I usually refrain from voting but here I must vote as it seems my cause will lose (plus Walkazo made me rebuke my idea of "not being able to make a difference"). Per me in the comments I guess but to sum it up, there is no reason for characters, all confirmed as Mario characters, to be seperate on a list of Mario characters.
#{{User|JF}} Per all.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Per all.
#{{User|Mathew10}} Per all.
#{{User|Dry Paratroopa}} It would shorten the pages, and if we really need an indicator, we can add a footnote shape like we did for the Yoshi series in the enemies section.


===New Logo===
====DON'T MERGE====
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Don't Make New Logo 2-16 </span>
#{{user|Tucayo}} - I am a firm supporter of separating games and non-games as much as possible, so, naturally, I oppose this proposal. Why? Well, they are different media, and that is enough reason for me. But if it isn't for you, well, then, most of the other media is not even fully made by Nintendo, and most of the characters have completely different roles, appearances, etc.
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! It will be easier and more organized if we didn't merge them. Zero signing out.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} I'm not sure that merging them would help. Per all.
#{{User|Wayoshi}} - Parsing out stuff into divisions is the best organization.
#{{User|Fuzzipede27}} - Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} In my mind I try to keep things as seperate as possible, and for some things I do, that would impose a major hassle for myself, and others as well. Per all.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Per all.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; Per all.
#{{User|New Super Mario}} Per all. It's just more work for people to find something in the list
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per Tucayo.
#{{User|Cosmic Red Toad}} Per Tucayo


This proposal has came up every now and then, but why no change? I believe that our new logo shouldn't be Mario but mushrooms. There would be several pictures of different types of mushrooms,(this includes bee mushroom,green mushrooms,etc)through out the ages of Mario games. Each picture would be randomly picked for each page every time users visit the page. That way seeing the same old picture, every time you visit the homepage and any other page, is the thing of the past.Its the mushrooms the fans want and without it,Mario will be like any other platformer.
====Important Neutral Stuff====
I'll say something that is on everybody's mind right now. Huh?!?!? {{User|Marioguy1}}


{{scroll box|content=
Well, if you see [[List of characters|here]], the characters are divided to two groups: game and nongame. I want to merge the two since, well, because of one question: canon or not? Sorry for presenting an opinion unclearly; I'm notorious for doing that '-_- {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Hyper1025595}}<br>
'''Voting start''':  19:00, August 1, 2010 <br>
'''Deadline''': 19:00, August 8, 2010


====I agree====
Otherwise, tell me, why are they separate? Shouldn't the list be one big list? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
#{{User|BobombFuses}} I like the cutesy-eyed mushrooms. Oh, and Booderdash, mushrooms sound PERFECT.
#{{User|Shadow1567}} BobombFuses sorry your idea is not that good but we need a new logo i'm sick of this logo. Oh and all you guys saying it's bad idea YOU ARE WRONG this is a great idea.


====I disagree====
: Ah, now I see :) In my personal opinion, the current format is horrible. They should either be split into two lists or merged into one, not semi-merged, semi-split as they currently are. {{User|Marioguy1}}
#{{User|Booderdash}} Absolutely not! That is the dumbest thing I ever heard! Seriously, ''mushrooms''? The logo is fine as is. Plus, there was already 3 of these awhile ago, they all failed and I think this proposal should be deleted.
 
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} What? Are we going to die if we don't have a new logo or something (not to be mean)? This is completely unneeded, and you can just change it for yourself on the monobook thing (however you do that X_x).
:: Yes, these lists should be one, according to this proposal. Remember those canon debates? I think these lists haven't been modified yet. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
#{{User|Zero777}} I am Zero! NO! Even though I agree we should change the logo, I had a better idea then this, Per all. Zero signing out.
 
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} I agree with changing the logo, but this changing-mushroom idea is overkill.
::: Yeah, a lot of things regrettably fall through the cracks each time we change the organization standards... - {{User|Walkazo}}
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, the current logo is only a  year or two old, and Mushrooms do not describe this wiki very well. Also, mushrooms are not major enough to be used as the logo of the wiki, we also were not made by Nintendo.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} I voted on this when I first saw it two days ago, and my vote must have gotten deleted, so I'll just repeat what I said. This is the Super Mario Wiki, not the Super Mushroom Wiki. Therefore, the logo should have Mario in it. Besides, mushrooms are not what make the games memorable, and even if they did, we're here to provide information, not create logos just to appeal to a supposed fan-base. Per all, specifically Booderdash.
#{{User|Morgomir96}} I'm okay changing the logo to anything but mushrooms *-*. Per all.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} If you really hate the boring square, use a monobook. It's simpler than it looks.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Unless someone comes up with something absolutely stupendous, I'm fine with the current logo. Also, per LeftyGreenMario.
#[[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]] - MONOBOOK! There have been so many proposals to change the logo recently... Just use your Monobook, if you have a problem with the current logo!
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} May I refer you to the Super Mushroom Wiki? Per all. This deserves a place in BJAODN. Even more than [[User:Ghost Jam/PIE|pie]].
#{{User|Frostyfireyoshi}} That is not fail. That is EPIC FAIL! Per all.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all.
#{{User|Commander Code-8}} This proposal has been repeated far too much and I'm sick of it. Per all.
#{{User|Marwikedor}} NO that's a lie without substanansiation!  Logo's fine.  Your idea belongs in Loggo from Banjo-Kazooie!
#{{User|Mr bones}} Fawfulfury's right! We're not gonna die if we don't change the logo! Please guys! Focus on making important proposals then making these logo ones.(No offense).


====Comments====
Tucayo: Well, they are different media, but I don't see why the two lists are split, yet the [[MarioWiki:Manual of Style#Sections of an Article|Manual of Style]] wants articles to include both game information and other media information in the same section. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
Well, wasn't there a proposal like this one, two, or three weeks ago, so if I am correct in my assumptions, this proposal can not exist yet. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
:Didn't someone propose changing the logo to Mario's head, and it resembled Starship Mario and was made out of puzzle pieces? {{User|Mario4Ever}}
::{{User|Baby Mario Bloops}} - Did you guys know that there is a code for your monobooks that allows you to change the logo on the top left? We also can't start copying everyone's logos even if they look cool, that is not right.
::: You want a new logo, then make one and change it yourself. Mario4Ever: Yes. I proposed it too, but using a monobook instead was a much better idea. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}


''Its the mushrooms the fans want and without it,Mario will be like any other platformer.'' Any proof? I like Mario more than mushrooms. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
Zero777: The list is organized well enough. What, alphabetically isn't enough? It's slightly harder to navigate because the list is split. Again, this proposal deals mostly with the grouping of game and non-game stuff. The lists are outdated, and we need to change it to the standards. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:I don't recall ever wanting to play a Mario game based on the mushrooms it had, even Galaxy 2. If mushrooms were what defined the series, I don't think this wiki would exist. Mario tops mushrooms any day. :D {{User|Mario4Ever}}


::If I got to pick a logo, I would pick the Paper Mario TTYD Super shroom. Once I make my monobook, that's what it's gonna be. The monobook page is great because you get to choose! It can stay the same and still be changed, you know. LGM was right.[[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]]
Luigi-board: Your vote is invalid. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}


}}
I'm neutral for this. This proposal is balanced in advantages (organization) and disadvantages (tons of moved internal links). {{User|Mathew10}}


===Translator===
: It shouldn't be that hard to move the links. It might be tedious, but it isn't hard. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
<span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Don't Implant Anything 1-0-14 </span>


Back when we knew nothing english about M&L:BIS, we had japanese names. Now, this kind of thing should be implanted: a Translator. Namely, a copy of the wiki in another language. Also, I'm proposing that if the user got the welcome message the user who sent it is from the same country. This way, the user would understand everything about the wiki without learning english. Also arn't we an INTERNATIONAL wiki?
:: I really hope nobody opposes anything because it is too "hard", obviously the creator is volunteering to do the work themselves so it won't be hard at all for the person opposing. {{User|Marioguy1}}
{{scroll box|content=
'''Proposer''': {{User|LuigiMania}}<br>
'''Voting Start''': 6:00, 3 August, 2010<br>
'''Deadline''':  24:00, 10 August, 2010


====Implant Translator & Country-only Welcomes====
Again, it's not like alphabetized isn't organized enough. I can live with only 1 list. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
#{{User|LuigiMania}} Per....above and ME!


====Implant Country-only Welcomes====
I don't understand why we should merge the game and non-game things TBH. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


====Implant Translator====
: Previous proposals. We are supposed to place game and non-game things in the same spot so we don't go in this canon debate. I thought we agreed to place non-game things and game things in the same spot, so I don't know why people oppose. This seems logical to me. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}


====Don't implant anything====
:: Can you at least provide a link for evidence of such? {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} Most of our users are English or speak it, and if someone doesn't understand something then they can look it up in a dictionary, or look at it on a website of their own language.
#{{User|Edofenrir}} - See my comment.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per Edofenrir. I draw the line at "Mario is the Mario series...."
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} There are mostly native English speakers. Per the comments below.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} If someone who doesn't speak English (I originally wrote that speek inglish by accident) were to visit the site and want to translate it that badly, they could translate the specific articles they want to with something like Google Translator, not us doing it.
#{{User|Emperor Yoshi}} Well, if we were to implant a translator, most versions of this Wiki's grammar would be incorrect. That could cause some countries to think we are a Wiki that is run by Trolls, and a few might think we are mocking them.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per all (except for MrConcreteDonkey's opinion on the welcome template: I'm against that as well as the overall wiki translation thing).
#{{User|Glowsquid}} - Automatic translations are complete gibberish and useless, and I doubt there'd be anyone dedicated enough to translate our entire content in another language. This is really short-sighted.
#{{User|Fawfulfury65}} The wiki is written in English, and if you don't know it, you can't edit it. This may be an international wiki, but most users here are from English speaking countries. And anyway, those translations are sometimes so messed up that you can hardly understand them. Per all.
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} I don't trust automatic translators anyway. Sure I don't speak fluently any other language, but I've heard that a stupid automatic thing does a worse job than a person who speaks the language.
#{{User|Morgomir96}} Websites who use this method are really bad. Trust me, things like Google Translator are horrible. But if someone who actually speaks the language want to rewrite all the wiki, then I'm okay.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all, computer translators do not have the capacity to translate well at all.
#{{User|Marwikedor}} Internet translators are absolutely abysmal and the primary language of Mario is English, even in Japan!
#{{User|Homestar Runner}} What, like someone who doesn't speak English would've found this anyways?


====Comments====
Check [[MarioWiki:Coverage#No Canon|the coverage policy]] and [[MarioWiki:Canonicity|canon policy]]. The split of the lists seems like the games are "more" canon than the nongames. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
:OK, I don't get the welcome-country thing but I really think you should talk this over with [[User:Porplemontage|Porple]]... {{User|Marioguy1}}


Hello, can someone change the time into GMT instead of AM? {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
----
:"AM" was indicating that it was 5 in the morning, not what timezone the time pertained to. Anyway, the times were still wrong, so I fixed them. - {{User|Walkazo}}
::Er...what I had was -10 hours from my time zone (+10:00, if that wasn't obvious) but I MAY have thought wrong...but I need it at 4 PM my time...as 3 PM is when I'm on....but my perspective of time is...backfiring... {{User|LuigiMania}}


<blockquote>Mario ist die Hauptfigur der Serie Mario und der legendäre Maskottchen von Nintendo. Mario ist in der Regel einen Klempner, aber in Spielen, nutzt er seine legendären Sprung und Kampffähigkeiten, um die Bewohner des Mushroom meist friedliche Welt von machthungrigen Schurken verteidigen wie Bowser. Wenn nicht Abenteuern, nimmt Mario in einer Vielzahl von sportlichen Veranstaltungen und arbeitet sogar als eines seiner Alter-Egos, Dr. Mario.</blockquote>
===Make a Gallery Template===
{{Proposal outcome|passed|5-0|make a gallery template}}
I just thought how easy it would be to have a Gallery template so new users could easily find more galleries when they access one and even editors could easily access their favorite galleries without having to go through the trouble. We could make a template for Character galleries and a template for Game galleries. Anyone think this is a good idea? I am thinking about making sections for Characters, Species, Bosses, and Games.


This is what an automatic translator throws at me when I attempt to translate the first paragraph of the Mario article into German. This is also what would make me leave the site if I found this text anywhere. The translation is totally inaccurate and ridden with grammar errors. Translators just cannot handle complex material, especially when fictional names are involved. I'd much rather have an english-only wiki with readable texts, instead of that soulless piece of auto-translated nonsense that will get native speakers of a language to laugh at us. - {{user|Edofenrir}}
'''Proposer''': {{User|Mileycyrussoulja}}<br>
:I translated it back into English with Google Translate, for everyone who doesn't speak German - it reads:
'''Voting start''': October 11, 2010, 7:54 UTC<br>
'''Deadline''': <s>October 18, 2010, 23:59 UTC</s> '''Extended:''' October 25, 2010, 23:59 UTC


<blockquote>Mario is the protagonist of the series and the legendary Mario mascot of Nintendo. Mario is usually a plumber, but in games, he uses his legendary jump and combat skills to defend the inhabitants of the Mushroom usually peaceful world of power-hungry villains like Bowser. If not adventure, Mario takes in a variety of sporting events and works even when one of his alter ego, Dr. Mario. </blockquote>
====Make a Gallery Template====
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}} Per myself. If this proposal passes, then I will truly make a gallery template.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Hey! Here's a good idea! Per Mileycyrussoulja.
#{{User|Marioguy1}} - A navbox sounds like a good idea! It can help navigation around the galleries and it can't hurt, for examples see the staff articles (i.e. [[Super Mario Galaxy/Staff]])
#{{User|Beecanoe}} Nice idea.  It got me thinking of when I was a noob to the wiki. Anything to make things easier, I say.
#{{User|Propeller Toad}} This is a great idea! The galleries really look clustered in the way they are now and if there was a template, I'm sure more people would actually take a chance to look at the galleries rather than having these images just there and having looked like wasted potential.


This proves it indeed was inaccurate. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}
====Don't make a Gallery Template====


::As opposed to...
====Comments====
Although we already have links to Galleries within most articles, I notice a few have galleries but don't link to them such as [[Waluigi]] and a few other characters that appear to have no link to their galleries. Although while back on subject, a gallery template on gallery pages would be nice. A segment of the template, for humans, species, bosses.{{User|Garlic Stapler}}
:Do you have any example of this? Examples are commonly needed on this proposals. {{user|Tucayo}}
::This could be difficult...I'll work on something :) {{User|Marioguy1}}


<blockquote>Mario is the main protagonist of the Mario series and the legendary mascot of Nintendo. Mario is normally a plumber, but in games, he uses his legendary jump and combat abilities to defend the inhabitants of the usually peaceful Mushroom World from power-hungry villains such as Bowser. When not adventuring, Mario participates in a variety of sporting events and even works as one of his alter-egos, Dr. Mario. </blockquote>
Is this proposing to make something like a navigation template for galleries? {{User|Fawfulfury65}}
:From what I understand, yes. Like a big list of galleries. {{User|Marioguy1}}
::OK. I'd really like to see an example of this, though it sounds pretty good. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


This![[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]]
Remember, supporters, saying any variation of "I like this idea!" is not a valid reason to support. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
:I really want to see an example of this, I don't feel comfortable allowing something this difficult to pass. This is something that could actually be pretty hard... {{User|marioguy1}}
::OK, [[User:Marioguy1/Test#Ignore this|is this]] what you're thinking of? I think it looks good...granted it's not in a template but if you want it in a template, I could try that. {{User|Marioguy1}}
:::I think what he means is one of those little boxes at the bottom of the page. It could group galleries of characters like Bowser, Bowser Jr., etc. or Mario, Luigi, etc. {{User|Bowser's luma}}
::::yes, i do, Bowser's luma. {{User|Mileycyrussoulja}}
They're called navboxes. {{User|Marioguy1}}
:@Propeller Toad: Do you understand what he is proposing? {{User|Marioguy1}}


<blockquote>Mario is the main protagonist of the Mario series and the legendary mascot of Nintendo. Mario is a plumber normally, but in games, he uses his legendary jump and combat capabilities to defend the inhabitants of the peaceful world of fungi usually power-hungry villains such as Bowser. When not in the adventure, Mario is involved in a variety of sporting events and even works as one of his alter ego, Dr. Mario. </blockquote>
----


And ''that'' is it translated into French and back. [[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]]
===Grammar Team===
{{Proposal outcome|failed|2-16|don't form a grammar team}}
Many people have different ways of typing things, most of the time mixing up grammar. I propose that we have a team who will check and edit any grammar mistakes. This may be changing words, adding letters, etc.  


<blockquote>Mario is the mascot of Nintendo and the legendary hero of the Mario series. Mario is a plumber, but usually in the game, his ability to fight and use his legendary jump to protect the inhabitants of a peaceful world of fungi usually villainous Bowser power. When not in the adventure, even one's ego involvement in various Mario sports events, operates as an alter ego Dr. Mario. </blockquote>
Example:


That's Japanese...
THIS is A ExAMpLE LINE oF TexT Four thiS.


and ''this'' is Greek! "...?"
Edit -: This is a example line of text for this.


<blockquote>Mario is the main protagonist of the series of Mario and the legendary mascot of Nintendo. Mario is usually a plumber, but in games, using the legendary jump and capabilities to defend the residents of the usually peaceful Mushroom World from power-hungry villains such as Bowser. When not adventuring, Mario participating in various sporting events and still works as one, alter egos, Dr. Mario. </blockquote>
'''Propser:''' {{User|LuigiMania}} <br>
'''Voting Start''' October 18, 2010, 12:00<br>
'''Deadline''' October 25, 2010, 12:00


[[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]]
====Make a Grammar Group====
#{{User|LuigiMania}}: Per my idea.
#{{User|Mileycyrussoulja}}: I love correcting grammar errors and would never get tired of it! Unfortunately, i think we all know which sides gonna win. :(


<blockquote>Mario is the main protagonist of the Mario series and the legendary mascot of Nintendo. Mario is a plumber normally, but in games, it uses a legendary jump and combat abilities to protect the residents of the normally peaceful Mushroom World of Villains power-hungry like Bowser. When not adventuring, Mario participated in a variety of sporting events and even as one of the works to alter-egos, Dr. Mario. </blockquote>
====Don't make it.====
#{{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}} Per comments below. I think that such a group is unnecessary for grammar errors.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per comments below.
#{{User|Rise Up Above It}} Per comments below.
#{{User|Garlic Stapler}} Not a good idea to make a group about something users correct anyways.
#{{User|Bowser's luma}} Per all. We don't need a group for something as simple as that.
#{{User|LeftyGreenMario}} If I see a grammar error, I'd correct it immediately. If I were forced to search for grammar errors, I would get mighty bored very quickly. I don't think we need a group JUST to correct grammar errors.
#{{User|Beecanoe}} The problem isn't official enough to make a change.  It's kind of an amateur thing to fix errors you see while browsing the wiki.  If there were a lot of errors on the pages I would say of course.  Go for it. But like I said, not a major problem.
#{{User|Count Bonsula}} I don't think that's really needed, editing the wiki is team work, everyone and anyone participate to correct those mistakes. And per LGM.
#{{User|Ralphfan}} &ndash; It's unnecessary.  Anyone can fix these mistakes.
#{{User|Gamefreak75}} - Per all.
#{{User|SmileyMiley5001}} - I fix them if I find them, but if I search for them I'd just get bored. Anyway, grammar is not to important, so long as you can understand what the person is saying.
#{{User|Mario Fan 123}} - Per all. Also, YOU need a grammar correction. Use 'an' instead of 'a' there.
#{{User|MrConcreteDonkey}} - Per all.
#{{User|M&SG}} - A grammar group isn't exactly necessary.  Not all people follow the same grammar rules anyway.
#{{User|T.c.w7468}} Per all, I do not think a group is necessary for this.
#{{User|JF}} Ahaha no.


The above quote is Irish... It calls "Mario" an "it"![[User:Blue Toad|Blue Toad]] [[User talk:Blue Toad|(<small>Talk</small>)]]
====Comments====
:Okay, we get it! Now stop spamming the comments, please. {{User|Gamefreak75}}
While this seems to be a great policy to have, I have a slight feeling that there may be arguements caused by this over Americanized spellings and non-Americanised spellings. For example, one of my earliest edits was edited, without my knowledge, shortly afterwards to change my English spellings to Americanized spellings: "colour" to "color". And that, frankly, is pointless. {{User|Rise Up Above It}} 13:04, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
:There are a lot of many ways, such as form and forme, colour and color, and so on and so forth. But the proposal is stating that we have just one group of users do all the grammar issues. I don't approve of this idea as there are over 3,000 users that have the job of editing and improving the page, and just limiting the grammar stuff is like taking away nearly all the work needed on this wiki. We can't just have a group of people be in charge of it, as it is too much for just that. If you really want this, I say you should make this a Pipeproject (if there isn't one about this kind of issue). {{User|Baby Mario Bloops}}
::I see your point BMB, and I agree with it; however my point was about the possibility of disagreements and edit wars(maybe) over what spelling scheme ought to be used. Because if this proposal did pass, then wouldn't every article have to adhere to one uniform spelling and grammar scheme? {{User|Rise Up Above It}}
::I agree with BMB, we don't need to limit this to certain users, all users should be allowed, and encouraged, to fix grammar mistakes. If you wish to change a policy, do that, but making a specific team won't stop bickering throughout the team. If this proposal does pass, it won't make anything in addition to what we currently have. {{User|Marioguy1}}
:::Per. This is pointless. Anyone is welcome to fix the grammar mistakes they find. We don't need a team for it. {{User|Fawfulfury65}}


:Did we really need all of these examples? {{User|Mario4Ever}}
People who care about grammar will fix it on their own accord. Creating a silly group monicker that has no pratical tool for the job won't do snuff. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] 11:59, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
::Well I for one thought they were hilarious. {{User|Homestar Runner}}
:::I found them similar and annoying. {{User|MrConcreteDonkey}}


Well, we do not need all these examples to prove a point. {{User|Emperor Yoshi}}
For the record, anyone changing a British spelling to American or vice-versa is in the wrong, as both are allowed on the wiki to reflect the international nature of the wiki. (In fact, if I catch someone changing a word, I revert it, even if they were changing it to my country's spelling; if the change was part of an overall rewrite, it's fine, imho.) - {{User|Walkazo}}
:Gamefreak75 just told that person to stop spamming the comments with examples. Now please don't continue to spam the comments with a further discussion about their notability. - {{User|Edofenrir}} 18:04, 4 August 2010 (UTC)


Not only are automatic translations ridden with grammar mistakes, but it won't localize names as well (it will get directly translated). It may cause confusion for some people. English is not my first language, I speak Dutch. Sadly, only manuals get translated to Dutch and the game remains UK English (except Mario & Sonic at the Winter Games). So I am more used to an English Mario and English names. Translators will only mess it up. However, when I translated the name クッパ (Kuppa, Bowser’s Japanese name) to English, I was a bit surprised the result was not Kuppa or Koopa, but Bowser. {{User|Arend}}
This could make a good BJAODN bad proposal section, aside from that this is probably one of the worst and poorly done proposals so far. Also per all above and what they have said. {{User|Garlic Stapler}}


:As far as I'm aware, Google Translator has a feature to suggest better translations nowadays; that has probably been used to suggest "Bowser" as a translation for "クッパ". Various other names of fictional character or works are also "translated" by now, but obviously, it's far from recognising every name.--{{User|Vellidragon}}
:You don't really have to belittle people, you know. Ideas are ideas, and we appreciate ideas. Anyway, although we can have both British and American spelling in articles, I think we should to one type of spelling in one article (if an article has mainly British spelling, then it should be British spelling, e.g.). Not that I'm right, but I do love consistency. {{User|LeftyGreenMario}}
::I didn't use the Google Translator, so multiple translators know how to translate Bowser's name. But I guess your right about those translators can't recognize every name. {{User|Arend}}
::We should the British spelling only for articles where the stuff gets released in Europe first, and American if it gets released in North American first. {{User|BabyLuigiOnFire}}
:::Yeah, I've found that the translators get the Japanese enemy names wrong a lot (even the basic romanizations get screwed up sometimes). - {{User|Walkazo}}
:::I am Zero! Then that will confuse the visitor when jumping from article to article and great grammar LGM. Zero signing out. {{User|Zero777}}
::::I concur, BLOF sounds like he has a nice idea going on. D: {{User|Garlic Stapler}}
:::::But that's a pain to keep track of. I also like the mix inside the articles; just think of them as synonyms giving the pages variety, rather than inconsistencies in spelling. - {{User|Walkazo}}


}}
*Proper grammar can vary between people.  For one instance, you may see people use the term "colour" instead of "color".  Likewise, comma usage can vary as well.<br><br>Example 1: Apple and Banana (no commas used)<br>Example 2: Apple, Banana, and Grape (two comma used)<br>Example 3: Apple, Banana and Grape (a comma is missing after Banana)<br><br>Basically, various countries are different in their ways of proper grammar. {{User|M&SG}}

Latest revision as of 12:17, November 19, 2024

All past proposals are archived here. This page is protected to preserve the discussions as they were.
Previous proposals

Remove Fake Bans/Warnings

remove fake bans/warnings 30-0
OK, now that I royally screwed up my last proposal, let's try this again:
On more than a few userpages, I have seen ban notices saying a user has been blocked by ruling of Wario's Butt or something of that sort. These are immature, a waste of space, and can cause you to do a double-take before reading on and finding out that the user wasn't banned, they are just being extremely immature. So now that I've done this properly, let's get rid of this crap.

Proposer: Ralphfan (talk)
Voting start: September 1, 2010, 24:00 GMT
Voting closes: September 8, 2010, 24:00 GMT

Support

  1. Ralphfan (talk) – Per proposal.
  2. Marioguy1 (talk) - *sigh*, here we go again. Anyways, those templates are annoying. They are warnings and are not to be toyed with.
  3. Tucayo (talk) - These make sysops job much more difficult.
  4. Fuzzipede27 (talk) - Per all
  5. New Super Mario (talk) get in my way. Per Proposal
  6. Turtwig A (talk) I agree. They are official templates and even if the wording and terms are changed, it could still easily confuse new users if they get one of those templates.
  7. CosmicBlueToad (talk) – Per Tucayo, and Marioguy1.
  8. Mr bones (talk) Well, if it's about warnings and bans, then per all!
  9. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Per all.
  10. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well; reminders, warnings, and bans are not playthings, if you play with them, it could result in several users thinking they are Banned. Some people simply look, they do not always read the content of the template. Also, they are very immature due to the problems I said previously, and that their content contains utter gibberish in templates that are supposed to be very serious.
  11. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Per all.
  12. Bowser's luma (talk) I say per all.
  13. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk) Per all and I recommend MCD to stop assuming.
  14. LeftyGreenMario (talk) I disagree on your definition of "immature", but I'm still supporting. SYSOPs do not need to spend unnecessary amounts of time searching for warnings.
  15. Mario jc (talk) No more Wario's butt nonsense. Per all.
  16. Young Master Luma (talk) Per everybody. Yes, everybody.
  17. MATEOELBACAN (talk) - Per all.
  18. M&SG (talk) - Ditto here.
  19. GalacticPetey (talk) Per all.
  20. CosmicRedToad (talk) Per Lefty Green Mario.
  21. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per all.
  22. Gamefreak75 (talk) - Per all.
  23. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - Per all, let's try not to make life miserable for the Sysops.
  24. Sgt.Boo (talk) - Per all.
  25. Papermario97 (talk) I agree.
  26. Sacorguy79 (talk) Per all. Stupid people spamming with templates. I really agree with the immature part, obviously, too.
  27. Walkazo (talk) - Per all.
  28. DaisyRox02 (talk) - Those are annoying and when you actually do have a block template up it confuses you.
  29. Beecanoe (talk) - I agree, I feel all bad for that user that they were blocked, and then I read and think, ohhhh... jerks.
  30. Smasher 101 (talk)People that do that are jerks.Per all.

Oppose

Comments

Now that I've realized the full effects of my other one, let's just get on with this. Ralphfan (talk)

I'm not sure navboxes are covered under this either, since they aren't an imitation of any real template. Actually, what exactly is the definition of a fake template? That doesn't seem to be clarified anywhere in this proposal. Twentytwofiftyseven (talk)

This only covers ban notices and warning notices. Navboxes are OK. Ralphfan (talk)

Yeah, I tried to write that in the original version of this and it didn't work right >_> Twentytwofiftyseven (talk)

So, will the other one get deleted? Tucayo (talk)

Once enough admins agree, I guess. Ralphfan (talk)

@2257: To answer your question, a fake template is when a user uses the HTML code for the template rather than the template itself. That way, you don't see the list of pages that links to it on the bottom. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

Can this include fake maintenance templates too? Booderdash (talk)

Except the Under Construction, because users usually don't finish everything at once. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

@MrConcreteDonkey: {{construction}} isn't allowed in userpace. Ralphfan (talk)

BLOF: No, nothing uses HTML code on a wiki, it all uses wikicode. HTML code is kind of the same yet very different. Anyways, yes, that is a fake template. No, that does not include userboxes due to {{Userbox}} which is a real template with parameters. However it does include all fake construction templates, fake infobox templates and fake warnings. Marioguy1 (talk)
Oh, and I thought this wiki uses HTML the ENTIRE time x_X BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

@MG1: Construction templates aren't fake, they just aren't allowed in userspace. Ralphfan (talk)

"However it does include all fake construction templates". *sigh* Marioguy1 (talk)

@Ralphfan: I'll support if you add fake maintenance templates on since they have as much significanse as the fake warnings and tal pages. Also, can fake talk page proposals on user talks be banned too? Booderdash (talk)

@MrConcreteDonkey: Yes, yes they are. :) Bowser's luma (talk)

Sorry for being a little harsh, but I get irritated REALLY easily. I can't help it. Please, STOP IT. It makes us look bad. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)
Agreed, putting people down isn't nice. Anyways, I don't really think the fake maintenance templates are that much of a bad thing. They're immature but they don't hurt anyone. Marioguy1 (talk)
I hope MrConcreteDonkey changes his vote. He's the one that look bad right now :P LeftyGreenMario (talk)

I don't know what's the big issue on fake construction templates. They are on user pages. What makes you think a USERpage needs rewrite or more images uploaded? I think the people who put fake templates on their page just have some sense of humor, not a sense of immaturity. Of course, opinions differ for each person. Bottom-line: fake rewrites do no harm at all. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Mainly because new users tend to place real templates into their pages when they see we had done it and we have to go through the issue of notifying them or removing them. Other than that, there is no harm done. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

Alright, sorry LGM and BLOF. I guessed since you opposed the last one immediately, but I guessed wrong and forgot that the 1st one was for all fake templates. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

It's ok. I first started shouting at you, but then, I removed my comment because I got over it. I accept your apology. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

Do you think anyone will fall for this???:

(Removed, due to its contents altering the scrollbox template)

CosmicRedToad (talk)

No, but it does take up space and ultimately is pointless. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

OH, PLEASE! Who in the right mind would agree with that hacked template? Also, Per MrConcreteDonkey. Takes up space and is worthless. Sacorguy79 (talk)

Me, in my left, evil mind, cuz I created them :(. It is pointless, but it does show a little of your personality. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)
Next time, make your own template or ask the person before putting it on comments. Thank you. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Papermario97 (talk) I feel stupid but, what does "per all" mean?

It basically means "I agree with everyone supporting/opposing" (whichever applies), but it's much less effort/time to type. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) 18:58, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

Making Paper Mario Badge Attack Articles

do not create paper mario badge attack articles 9-14
I think we should make articles on attacks in the first two Paper Marios that you can only use by the use of a badge (i.e. Quake Hammer, Multibounce). It would be necessary to the wiki, since these ARE attacks of Mario's, and even if he needs a badge to use them they still are attacks of his.

Proposer: Mileycyrussoulja (talk)
Voting start: September 2, 2010, 12:00.
Deadline: September 9, 2010, 23:59 GMT.

Support

  1. Mileycyrussoulja (talk) I support this proposal and I agree that these attacks should get their own articles.
  2. Booderdash (talk) They're ATTACKS. The partner's attacks like Multibonk has seperate articles. So we're saying Mario is LESS important than his allies that appear in one game? Also the other badges aren't needed because they only have effects which will be stubs. This is an ATTACK, and will definitly have more info.
  3. LuigiMania (talk) Per Booderdash.
  4. Mr bones (talk) I taught you meant badges. If it's about attacks, then per booderdash.
  5. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per all.
  6. Yoshi986 (talk) Per all.
  7. Waluigi Guy (talk) Per all.
  8. Morgomir96 (talk) Per all.
  9. Tomz123 (talk)Per Booderdash.

Oppose

  1. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Oppose to the reasoning of that will be an unprofessional idea to only make all the attack-type badges into articles and not the other badges into articles. Zero signing out.
  2. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Too minor to have an article, belong in the badge's article.
  3. Tucayo (talk) - Per all
  4. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, most of the attack badges would not warrant a description longer than a few sentences, they are not more notable than the other badges, just because they are attacks does not mean they have long descriptions. Not to mention, most of the badge attacks are alterations of Mario's pre-badge attacks, thus the do not deserve articles.
  5. Gamefreak75 (talk) Badges =/= Attacks. Many short and crappy articles will be created with this. No, just no.
  6. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Badge attacks are not permanent attacks, unlike the partner attacks. When you get them (if you get them, that is), you can unequip them. Anyway, almost all of them are just souped up versions of Mario's regular attacks, with maybe a different side-effect here and there. Per all.
  7. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - I mean with a few of them you could, but this proposal is all of them, and not all of them will be necessary articles. Rather have the badge page longer than have like 30+ stubs.
  8. Commander Code-8 (talk) Per all.
  9. Edofenrir (talk) - Per GF75.
  10. Castle Toad (talk) - You can't make a long-worthy article for just a badge, It'll be a lot of space and people could get a harder/complex navigation over the site
  11. Walkazo (talk) - Per all.
  12. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) Per all.
  13. Garlic Stapler (talk) Imagine all the stubs there would be. Also not enough info to give each badge specific attack an article.
  14. Smasher 101 (talk)Per all.

Comments

Wouldn't this be better as a Pipe Project? MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

Agreed. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Couldn't this be done by making an article that contains all the Badge Effects (if such an article doesn't exist already)? Frostyfireyoshi (talk)

Its already done in the Badge article. But the MOVES need seperate articles because they're MOVES. Booderdash (talk)

What, so an article describing what happens when you use Move Badges? Frostyfireyoshi (talk)

@Booderdash: Do you realize how many stubs we're gonna have here? Fawfulfury65 (talk)

@Frosty, no like how Multibonk has an article, we make articles for Tornado Jump, Power Jump, Power Smash, Ice Smash etc. @FF65, I don't see how we're going to have that many stubs. I mean they're as important as the special moves for Mario Power Tennis. And the moves can be explained in detail. They're also better than Plane Mario. Booderdash (talk)

Well, if all attack badges are given their own articles, shouldn't ALL badges have separate articles? Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Why? All other badges only give effects that can be explained with one line. In attacks, many sentences can be written, and it won't be a stub All the other badges will be stubs. Booderdash (talk)

Well, you can not always "write many sentences" for every attack badge, most of them do things that warrant only a sentence or two. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Not the attack BADGE, but the ATTACK. Like Power Bounce. I don't see how thats less of an importance than Multibonk. Booderdash (talk)

Well, I fail to see how that would work with any positive affects. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Then explain why Multibonk, Kiss Thief, Power Lift etc. has articles, because they're just attacks too. Booderdash (talk)

Um..., Gamefreak, I think you're misunderstanding us. We DON'T want to create articles for BADGES, we want to create articles for ATTACKS like Tornado Jump, Ice Smash, and Power Bounce. Booderdash (talk)

Well, two of those three you said should not have articles, If a certain type of badge has an article, they all must, it is one of are policies. Making an article on a badge attack but not the badge itself, that would simply not work. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Look, you probablt don't even have the game. The badge only ALLOWS you to use the attack, but we want to make an article ON the attack. Like Kiss Thief, and Power Lift. So that is ok. Booderdash (talk)

Well, me having the game has nothing to do with this wiki, the badge is functionally what you need to use the attack, thus if the attack deserves a page, the Badge does too. What I mean is, the badge page is created, with the attack in it, if it is created at all, wich it should not. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

No, the BADGE name is the EXACT same as the attack so Tornado Jump the badge would be the same thing as the attack. You would need the game to understand, thats why I mentioned it. Booderdash (talk)

Well, I can not under stand you reasoning, what I meant to say was to make a page of the BADGE not the ATTACK, if make the pages at all. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

The proposal is about making the attack! Not the badge! Badges only invoke the attacks.Mr bones (talk)

Well, I know that, the pages badge or Attack should not be created, they would cause many stubs, just because they are attacks does not mean they are notable enough for a page. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Any badge attack is notable like any other one. That's why Booderdash said that you should have the game!Mr bones (talk)

Well, any badge is as important as it's own attack are each other. Also, The fact about me not having has no say in the matter. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Yes it does. It means you don't understand the concept of the attack. You NEED the game to understand or maybe just the original Paper Mario. And the badge isn't important, which you'll clearly know if you have the game, its the ATTACK that is. Booderdash (talk)

Well, the badge and the attack it causes have functionally the same notability, the attacks are are slightly altered versions of Mario's normal attacks. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Is it? Multibonk is the exact same as Headbonk, but repeated alot of times, and Power Bounce is a jump repeated alot of times. Booderdash (talk)

Booderdash, It sounds like you are agreeing with me, the pages you want to be made should not be made because they are not notable enough. The attack badges attacks simply alter Mario's (or his partner's) by adding an effect. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Aha! But you see thing thing is they DO have articles, and for THIS consistency to work, we need to make articles for this, since I doubt many people will agree on deleting those articles anways. Booderdash (talk)

Booderdash, the badges nor their effects do not have articles, they are not notable enough for their own articles. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

All, the badges are merged together, so why on earth can't we just merge all the attacks? Fawfulfury65 (talk)

Agreed, but the badge attacks are already merged. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

I guess we could just merge them all. But I just have a feeling not man people would agree on it. I don't know, I guess we can try. (We need to mae a proposal about it first though.) But another thing to note, none of the moves like Multibonk are stubs, so I don't see how Power Bounce will be a stub either. Booderdash (talk)

Baby Mario Bloops, there are only 10ish attacks in Ttyd, and I doubt all of them are going to be stubs. Booderdash (talk)

Well, there is not sufficient proof that the pages would be long enough not to be stubs, not to mention, the badges(and/or their effects) are not notable enough anyway for pages. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

They wouldn't be stubs because Multibonk isn't a stub, and Power Bounce is practically the same thing. Plus things like Ice Smash has even MORE detail (like Freezeing) to be put into the article. Booderdash (talk)

Well, Multibonk is not a badge attack, and powerbounce equals Multibonk, Ice smash has little information that could be produced about it. The badge attacks are only the effects the badge has on Mario's (or his partner's) attacks. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Thats my POINT. How comes MULTIBONK gets an article, while Power Bounce doesn't? Its basically just Partner's attacks VS Mario's attacks. Booderdash (talk)

Why does everyone keep on thinking we're making the article about the badge? We're making it about the ATTACK. Booderdash (talk)

Well, how many time do I have to tell you; the badge causes the "attack," and the "attacks" are simply effects on Mario's (or his partner's) attacks, nothing more nothing less. This is why the do well as a list, they do not have that much information about them that is different from the normal attacks. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

I don't care about that, I mean practically everyone else thinks that we're making it ON the badge. Booderdash (talk)

Well, You do not care, not they do not, they think (hopefully) that the badge is equal to the attack, neither of them deserves an article. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

Well, if they have the game, they would know that it wasn't. Btw, I think MCS made the description rather misleading and I bet is confusing people... Booderdash (talk)

You are getting of topic, enough about having the game, it does not always matter, in terms of what you are trying to do. I do not have the game and I understand completely what you are trying to do. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

No, you don't understand. Its because you don't have the game. I mean so according to your logic, if FPS fanboys say Mario is for kiddy wimps and that they understand that, that means they're right. Its because they never played the game! You always need to either watch the movie, read the book, or play the game before you understand things about it. Booderdash (talk)

I can understand giving a few of the badge specific attack their own articles but there probably won't be enough there to make a good article. A couple probably might if they appeared in more than just one of the Paper Mario games. Garlic Stapler (talk)

Well Booderdash, lets get back on topic, what do you mean "It's because they never played the game," you can understand the game if you read it's own article on this wiki. Also Stapler, we can not give just give a few of them pages, we have to give all of them pages or none of them, it is one of our policies. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

All your doing is nitpicking an issue if your going to create seperat articles for attacks then you need to make seperate articles for everything mrblob1012 (talk)

Well, Read what I said again, you obviously do not know what I mean, and it is one of our policies, not a guideline. Read our policies again and come back after you do so. Also, please speak more clearly. Emperor Yoshi (talk)


Make a "No Spam" Usertalk Page Policy

make a no spam usertalk page policy 22-0
Recently, a bunch of friends of mine (you know who you are) placed a lot of images in my talk page. Though it was funny at first, it considerably stretched my userpage and extended it, so it gave me really bad loading times. Same goes for copying text from certain articles and placing them into my talk page, which also extends it until the loading server lags extensively just to load up my talk page in case it has new messages.

What I'm proposing is a new policy to prevent "spamming" user talk pages with images or text (this also includes friendly encounters). "Spamming" the talk pages with a load of images and text not only gives it a big deal to load up a page and stretches it horizontally, it also gives users like me a hard time to navigate through them to find any new messages a user might put. Plus, we are forced to make another archive as soon as this occurs. I know I can just remove them myself, but it is much easier if the "spamming" is prevented in the first place. Any "spamming" of the past will be kept, but any future "spamming" will get immediately deleted in user talk pages. I do not think that spamming" improves talk pages in any way. Talk pages are supposed to be used for chatting with other users, rather than fill it up with useless content. It also makes it harder for the administration and others to work through the pages if they want to drop a comment or something.

I'm also proposing this to be enforced, just in case it happens to any unwary user, ignorant user, or a user who just wants to play around with his/her friends.

Proposer: BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)
Voting start: September 6, 2010, 20:33 GMT
Deadline: September 12, 2010, 23:59 GMT

Support

  1. DaisyRox02 (talk) - It was really annoying how you had to scroll to the side in order to read the messages and it did take more time to load with all that crap on it.
  2. Fawfulfury65 (talk) No more giant user talkpages.
  3. Fuzzipede27 (talk) When I look at my comment, it streched longer than my screen.
  4. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - I mean it looks nice at first, but then you scroll down forever! Per all.
  5. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! I don't even need to read the proposal, spam on the talk page, no, support, per all. Zero signing out.
  6. CosmicRedToad (talk) - When I first saw all that Wario Spam, I decided that the spamming users were "Wario Weirdos". I then tried to avoid their talkpages as much as possible; not because they love Wario, but because those giant talkpages are annoying nuisances.
  7. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per all.
  8. Sgt.Boo (talk) Yeah, everyone's completely right, and specifically Wario spam covers up talk pages. One or two images? Whatever. Enough to make the server lag and stretch a talk page? No.
  9. Marioguy1 (talk) - SPAM is defined as Stupid Pointless Annoying Messages; what is going on the talk pages is stupid, pointless and annoying so I think it falls under that category.
  10. Edofenrir (talk) - Per proposal.
  11. Mr bones (talk) Goodbye spammed FF65 and BLOF's pages, good bye good old wario, good...ahem, per alll.
  12. LeftyGreenMario (talk) I have to say per all. Takes forever to load a talk page on my netbook and a while to load on my PC. Wonder what would happen if something like Walkazo's computer or a DSi had to load up a 60,000 bytes+ page. It probably would explode. It's not annoying (in the "spammers" perspective) because the people "spamming" the pages were doing this to each other for fun. Why would ANY computer would want to load a page full of disgusting Warios anyway?
  13. Booderdash (talk) BLOF's talk page literally broke my cell phone.
  14. Mechayoshi (talk) I agree. Not everyone uses high speed internet ya know!
  15. Garlic Stapler (talk) Because spam is usually not good.
  16. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) Imagine this scenario: You're going to reply to a friend's comment. You click the link to their talkpage that has a dubious fluorescent green background. For some reason it takes over 10 minutes to load. When it finally loads, you are confronted with literally thousands of giant Wario images repeated over and over and over... Eventually you scroll away from that hideous monstrosity into the comfort of your section. Oh dear, Wario spam has stretched the page all the way across the Atlantic. And then the damn advertisement to the right blocks the Edit tab. Then your computer promptly gives up and explodes before you can lose the will to live due to Wario spam. End Scenario. Per all.
  17. Bowser's luma (talk) Yup. Good idea - Per y'all (did I actually just say that?)
  18. Beecanoe (talk) I don't get a whole lotta messages, but I don't want it to happen to me later. Ever.
  19. Young Master Luma (talk)Yup, it gets annoying to try to read those pages. Per all, except Marioguy1. It originally came from a Monty Python sketch about spam, Spiced ham.
  20. Homestar Runner (talk) Per all.
  21. Smasher 101 (talk) Per all.
  22. Cosmic Blue Toad (talk) (Ah, I finally received permission to create a new account, due to my lost password. I can vote again! This is just in time, too...) Oops! err...ahem: Per CosmicRedToad, Mr bones, Booderdash, Marioguy1, DaisyRox02, Zero777, Frostyfireyoshi, Beecanoe, Mechayoshi, Sgt. Boo, and especially CosmicRedToad.

Oppose

Comments

Wouldn't it be much easier if you just added a rule about this in your talk page? LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Yes, that's betterMr bones (talk)
I concur. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

The problem is, people tend to ignore rules. I want to enforce that specific rule about spamming. Besides, when people do that anyway, it just takes up server stress and it's harder for other users to leave a message, or the owner of the talk page to find his/her message BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

If people ignore your rules, then notify it in their talk page. LeftyGreenMario (talk)
No, I'm going to ENFORCE the rule, so it can be prevented. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)
Aww you don't like my beautiful gifts of Wario? I can't oppose then. Fawfulfury65 (talk)
Yeah, I do like them, but after a while, I was forced to archive, and forced to view my talk page using "last change" instead of viewing it. It also caused a lot of hassle to load everything up. I do like it when you do that, but sometimes, fun does screw things up :( That's why I'm proposing this. Yes, I do regret it, but I'm doing it for what's good. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

IMO this classifies as common sense, do not spam. If people don't follow it, they should get warned. Tucayo (talk)

That's what I thought too, but some people also want to play around with their friends by adding a horrendous amount of pictures. This also causes server stress and huge loading times. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)
I do think that all those Wario pics were annoying(even though I pasted some on), but why would they be considered spam?DaisyRox02 (talk)
They're not spam as long someone who receives them likes them. I said "spamming", it's not actual spamming :D BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

Expand Main Page to contain all content

oppose 1-24
What I liked about the main page was I could discuss featured images and vote on polls and all that stuff. The polls left, I was disapointed. However, they brought the polls back, but my other spot the featured images, was gone. It seems that, for stuff to come in, others must go. The way to solve that problem, expand the main page! We want to fit all the stuff everyone loves onto the first page they see when they enter the wiki.

Alright, so that idea sucked hard, but would anyone be against adding content that wasn't put on their before? We could have character of the week, user of the week, and new pages on the main page. Plus, we could improve the polls a little bit, I think it changes less often than it used to, as well as not including past polls from the last time they did the polls thing.

Proposer: Beecanoe (talk)
Voting start: September 9, 2010, 00:00 GMT
Voting closes: September 16, 2010, 00:00 GMT

Support

  1. Morgomir96 (talk) Per proposal.

Oppose

  1. LuigiMania (talk) The reason the FI was gone was gone was because IT WAS USELESS. We replaced it with the polls for more of a participation feel! FI's was a waste of space!
  2. Marioguy1 (talk) - The main page is meant to be a quick introduction to the wiki. There's some general information, links, important announcements, a place showing our best content, a place showing the important changes to the wiki, a place for recent news, a place for interesting additions, a poll to make it more interactive, a box for the 'shroom because the 'shroom is awesome like that and a NIWA box. We don't need the quote of the day, it's just a random quote, 5% of the time it's actually funny and the other 95% it's stupid. The FI process was also shut down so I don't see how anyone could add a box for that considering it doesn't exist but, assuming you're planning to restart the system, there are enough images on the main page as is. Granted once in a blue moon the FIs actually produce an image that looks good but there's a very small chance of that happening (as was demonstrated before we shut it down) so the pictures in the FA and Nintendo news sections pretty much represent the image quality of the wiki. The main page is supposed to be brief and have only the most important things, let's keep it that way.
  3. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Woah...Per MG1's gargantaun lecture...
  4. Walkazo (talk) - Per MG1.
  5. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) Per The One & Only MG1.
  6. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per MG1.
  7. Fawfulfury65 (talk) FIs are worthless, the main page is fine as it is.
  8. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Per MG1, MCD, and my comments below. Zero signing out.
  9. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, the FIs were rather bad, and their voting system was absolutely terrible. No to mention, the Quote of the day was a pointless process, as the quotes that made it there were not always good, because The Mario series does not have many excellent quotes that could go there.
  10. Mr bones (talk) Per all!
  11. Smasher 101 (talk) Per all.
  12. Bowser's luma (talk) Per MG1. Also, LuigiMania: LUMA <3 the FI.
  13. LeftyGreenMario (talk) Although the main page looks a little plain to me, I do not want the Featured Images to return. Plenty of crap got featured due to fan voting. The quote of the day was just a filler. If you want more stuff on the main page, what do you want to add?
  14. DaisyRox02 (talk) I disagree with everything that is on the propsal exept the FI part. I was extremely upset when they were taken off. Poll of the day should'nt be there. Neither should "Did You Know?" That's my opinion.
  15. GalacticPetey (talk) Per Marioguy1, FF65, and Emperor Yoshi
  16. Ralphfan (talk) – Per all.
  17. Gamefreak75 (talk) Main page overload and computer crashes galore. Per all.
  18. Supershroom (talk) While FIs could be occasionaly good, there are only so many quality pics that Nintendo have produced- sure, they make new games, but not as often as we uploaded new images. I like the polls, per all.
  19. M&SG (talk) - There aren't a lot of images that deserve the feature image status, which is likely the reason why featured images were discontinued.
  20. Mechayoshi (talk) I don't miss what ever's gone- per oh so all!
  21. Commander Code-8 (talk) I miss FIs HEAPS, but this proposal doesn't sound like a good idea. Per all
  22. Paper Yoshi (talk) - Per MG1.
  23. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per all.
  24. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - All information = overload = more failures to get to sight = problems for all of us.

Comments

The problem is not space, the problem is the system behind the FI's, it was a total fail. Tucayo (talk)

Yeah, although we could bring back the community template, we'd have to also bring back FIs to balance the main page. The FIs should stay gone, since the whole voting system was terrible. Fawfulfury65 (talk)
I am Zero! ....For some reason I would sort of consider this a joke proposal since it's just what he wants. He's not really thinking of the space and memory it will take up and download time. Zero signing out. Zero777 (talk)

Well, maybe this should just be for the 'Projects Seeking Contributors' and maybe a 'Quote of the Day'. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

Quote of the Day was stupid, it was just a random quote chosen. And Projects Seeking Contributors is a section of the Pipe Plaza. Read that instead. Marioguy1 (talk)

yeah and the polls are useless to since they really dont do anything by take up space mrblob1012 (talk)

The polls are a good extra to the main page. They are as pointful as the DYK, and a bit of fun.. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)
The polls take up space, yes, but what do you want to replace it with? Sometimes, taking up space is a good thing. <sarcasm>video games are pointless and take up space; let's prohibit them.</sarcasm> LeftyGreenMario (talk)
I am Zero! You're just thinking for yourself, what about the people who can't access the main page as quick as you. Zero signing out. Zero777 (talk)
I'm not selfish, it's just that empty space sometimes needs to be filled in with something. I'm not saying that taking space is always a good thing. Unnecessary space leads to server slowdown, but we won't allow a main page with blank gaps. Besides, I use a Netbook, which is a very lightweight laptop, which means it's not as fast as most PCs. The page might load quite quickly, but that's because my Firefox blocked the ads. LeftyGreenMario (talk)
Character of the week? Seriously? That's practically what FA is just narrowed down onto the characters! Who needs that? They can just go on the Charcter's page and look at it there, and what if the "Chatacter of the Week" is a stub?DaisyRox02 (talk)
Why don't we just leave it as is? Nobody will ever agree on one thing, if we did, what would this page be for? The sysops and such have decided on the way the page currently is. We should respect their decisions. Bowser's luma (talk)

Gargantuan lecture...sorry, I'm not accusing you of anything but should I make my future arguments shorter? I don't know if you prefer a more detailed version which will be very long or a short simple overview of my points...I personally like the longer paragraphs because they cover every (or almost every) objection that anyone could make but more people are likely to read something short and sweet...anyways, which do you (in general) like better? Marioguy1 (talk)

I, personally, prefer the long ones. Long votes are the best; they make me want to consider all the possibilities and vote (whether I vote for or against, it makes me want to vote.)Cosmic Blue Toad (talk)

Personally, would like a page or two just visible to users. I may not be edited as frequently, but that would matter. It would just be people who can change it. I'm not saying bring back featured images, but we could have things like progress on things like pipe projects or something. Maybe even come up with a better way to show good pictures. Some stuff that we as users need/want to see and doesn't concern others. And if that stuff belongs on the forum, I certainly can't find anything. (You can discuss this bunny trail more on my talk page.) Back to the point. I am fine with the main page as it is. Just suggesting a different approach to add more content. Geniusguy445 (talk)

Pages not visible to the general public is a bad idea. All of our pages should be viewable by everyone. If it's even possible to do that, it's still a bad idea. Other than that, we don't need to show people "good" pictures - aesthetics is a matter of opinion. We have no standards of what makes a "good" image as seen by the old FI process where you did not require a reason to vote. Some people like pictures, some don't, we can't classify pictures as good and bad. And "progress on PipeProjects" can be noted in an article for the Pipe Project. If the creator of the project does not wish to do that, it's no big deal. Marioguy1 (talk)

Main Page Dilemma

canceled by proposer
Lately, we have gotten many proposals dealing with none other than the main page. "Remove FI's.", "Bring back the Polls.", "Fit all content on Main Page." and so on and so forth. Why can't we just settle that and try to please all of them?

FI's and the calendar that told of interesting facts of that month was personally one of my favorite MP templates, but now they are deleted. We have Polls and now the 'Shroom template, which is also good, yet I really missed some of them that have faded into obscurity. What I propose is that we feature all those templates we all love and enjoy their presence on the main page! Before you go thinking that I am the fit all content on MP proposal, well read on.

We don't need to have all of them on all at once, or else an overload of data would constantly cause a big list of problems. My proposal here is to make a schedule and trade places with the Main Page! To help you understand what I am aiming at, let me describe it for you.

Week 1 -

  • FA template
  • Did You Know
  • 'Shroom
  • Latest Proposals
  • M/Nin News
  • Polls

Week 2 - This is just an example of what we could change. Not saying this would be the exact change.

  • FA - to - FI template
  • Did You Know - to - Quotes (Hand-written into seperate template like the DYK.)
  • 'Shroom
  • Latest Proposals
  • M/Nin News
  • Polls - to - Monthly Calendar

Week 3 - Back to Week 1.

It would be a MAJOR change for us all, and I wouldn't doubt that it would be hard, but at least picture of such quality and awesomeness we would have for the main page! If we just timed each template correctly, from my calculations, then it should work out perfectly! I know that you all have your opinions about this, so I think I will wrap up this proposal. Just remember that even though it would be some difficult work getting everything started, we could be able to make an outstanding Main Page to satify all!!!

Proposer: Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
Voting start: September 17, 2010, 24:00 GMT
Proposed voting close: September 24, 2010, 24:00 GMT
Date Withdrawn: September 18, 2010, 01:31 GMT

Support

  1. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - Per MY proposal.

Oppose

Comments

No. Having a differentiating main page is a bad idea. When someone comes to look for FAs, they'll find FIs. When someone looks for the calendar, they will find the polls. The calendar has to be a month-long thing if it is there at all, stuff doesn't just stop because we remove it from the main page. Furthermore, the FI template was removed from the main page because the process was shut down for a reason. Not to clear up the main page; the FI process is not good enough. And quotes will have the same problems. This proposal is just too inconsistent, we need to have some of those things for a month-long period or not at all. Other things will have bad nomination processes because they are matters of opinions. Sorry but this proposal is not a good idea in my opinion. Marioguy1 (talk)

It is just an idea, and let me see if I can reason with your logic. The Quotes would be made in the same format as the Did You Know? so that we don't have that problem. The calendar we could make it for weekly so that we could show what happens for two weeks (the week it being on and the week it won't be on). FI's did have so trouble with the process and all, so I decide that we should re-cycle the ones we have for the FI if this passes of pure luck. Also, what I have shown above was just a random example of what could be, just to help better image the idea I am creating. I need to make a test page and show everyone what I plan could work out, so give me time to do that and then I will post the links for you to further see my plans. Also, it was just an idea for solving the dilemma of "I want this" and "I want that", so it will either be a win or lose, majority wise. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
Well, if the idea is destined to become a reality and I object the idea, I must show why. Now let me explain further. Quotes would be updated once weekly but what would be considered a good quote? We just find a random quote and post it? How is that any different than the quote of the day from a while ago? Nobody cares enough to want to see a quote and if they want to, the old template is much more useful. The did you know is actually entertaining to read. The calendar can not be there half the time and not there the other half, a calendar has to be there 24/7. Recycling FIs will also get boring, it is much better to just have a constantly shifting article on the main page. I don't think a test page could really show the theory behind the disorganization of a temporary calendar or the redundancy of reusing Featured Images. A test page can't show all of those things, it'll look good, I'm sure, but it won't be a good concept for the above reasons. Marioguy1 (talk)

This will just end in a chaotic mess. The inconsistency will reflect badly on our website. Sorry, but no. - Edofenrir (talk)

Maybe creating this proposal was not such a good idea, but I still want to see what people think of this. I don't think I will delete it, as I really do want to see the outcome (even if 1-30). It is an idea that is possible, and if done correctly and organized just right would be amazing. But of course, all that there is in need is the inconsistency to fix. I understand that, and I need to figure out how to overcome that, but with some time and previews, I will try to find a way to make my proposal worth it. All we really need is users willing to keep track of all that and be able to consistently swap templates. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
Okay, Test 1 and Test 2 are given right here in those links. Test 2 will be edited a lot to tinker with what should and shouldn't be where. The Quote shall now be updated every day (and I can easily help keep track of that) if this passes. Of course we still have to deal with the dilemma about the Calendar, as that is the main problem I need to figure out, but I think with time I can come up with something. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
It's just plain crazy how you did it. I don't understand how you just copied the entire Main Page. But...wasn't the Mario Calender mainly useless, and was that why it was deleted? LuigiMania (talk)
I never really found out the reason, but whatever it is we would have to change it so that it wouldn't be like that. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
I agree with Edo, the site will have to have the same front page, with the same content, instead of changing it "randomly" (of course, it's not randomly, but it will seem so). Don't remove the stuff that's already there, I find the DYK interesting, the FAs are (of course) interesting, the poll is awesome, the news are mandatory, the 'Shroom news are great and the latest proposal is important for the members of the site. It's good as it currently is. Young Master Luma (talk)
Yes, but I was simply throwing out the idea of trying to resolve a lot of problems with the Main Page. I'm not saying removing things like the DYK and the FA, but interchanging them would be possible. I mean, polls are for 2 weeks, so that could work out. All I will say now is that it has a lot of pros and a lot of cons. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
No, DYK is better than quote of the day, month, week, whatever, it's better than a quote period. Featured Articles are better than featured images; featured articles show our content, featured image just show a picture that 50% of the people that actually voted on them deem "pretty". Polls and the Calendar both have to be there for ever or not at all. Sorry, this just won't work. Marioguy1 (talk)
Here, why don't I just figure out some other stuff and see if I can make a way for people to like it. I have a feeling that a lot of tests are going to be made... Baby Mario Bloops (talk)

Well it's obvious this one isn't working so would you consider it deleting? Marioguy1 (talk)

....I guess you're right, maybe I should not embarrass myself any further. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)

Making Articles for Keys

don't make articles for keys 0-15
I think we should make articles on different keys in the Mario series. The reason this came to me is because I found an article, Station Key, on a key in Paper Mario: TTYD. Then I thought that if this key article can be made, then we can make a whole bunch of key articles, for example, Pit Key (found in the Pit of 100 Trials) and Dimension Key (found in the Whoa Zone) from Super Paper Mario. I made those redirects to Key for now.

There are 27 key articles.

Proposer: Mileycyrussoulja (talk)
Voting start: September 19, 2010, 9:00 GMT
Deadline: September 26, 2010, 23:59 GMT

Support

Oppose

  1. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) This will result in many un-needed stubs which will take up space. I don't even know why the Station Key article is there. The information is definitely covered somewhere else. Why else do you think your previous Paper Mario proposal failed?
  2. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Yet again, unneeded articles which will end up as stubs. Zero signing out.
  3. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, the keys do not have sufficient information about them to make good articles, also they are not notable enough for it.
  4. JF (talk) They're just the same thing with a different name.
  5. Bowser's luma (talk) "List of Keys" would be a good article. The "Station Key" should be merged into "Key".
  6. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Keys are keys, why give them all their own articles? They are too minor and simply belong in the Key article.
  7. YourBuddyBill (talk) List of keys should be made, or better yet, just put it all in the keys article. Make sure to merge in all the pics as well, though, as otherwise it's somewhat pointless.
  8. Smasher 101 (talk)List of Keys is a good idea.Seperate Key articles?Absolutely not.We don't need a lot of useless stubs.
  9. Mechayoshi (talk) They would just be stubs. Okay idea but not for that.
  10. Mileycyrussoulja (talk) Changed my mind. Will make list of keys.
  11. Walkazo (talk) - Per all. I'd even like to merge some of the existing key articles into a list (that's been proposed at least once before, though it didn't pass).
  12. WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135 (talk) Per all.
  13. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per all.
  14. Commander Code-8 (talk) There should just be an article containing a list of keys.
  15. Mathew10 (talk) Per all.

Comments

Shouldn't this be a TPP on Talk:Key?Knife (talk)

Another Paper Mario pointless item page creation proposal? Why don't we just make a List of Keys or something? MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

I concur, this proposal should be a Talk Page Proposal, as this obviously does not involve the the Wiki itself. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

A TPP on Station Key would be concerning the Key article itself, this one is about creating articles that are keys. The badge one is very similar, it would have been a TPP on Badges if we went by what you were saying. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

@Mileycyrussoulja: You oppose your own proposal? Surely this is eligible for deletion. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)

No. Just because he doesn't support doesn't mean the idea no longer has merit; someone, somewhere might think it's a good idea. Lack of support isn't a good enough reason to delete a proposal, and it's actually better if proposals reach the deadline whenever possible - it gives us solid decisions to refer back to if policies or articles are called into question later on. Plus, the archives look better if they're mostly pass/fails, and not a bunch of cancellations. - Walkazo (talk)

The Science of Video Games

don't make such user subpages 2-15
I believe that user sub-pages relating to theories and the like should be exempt from the Userspace 'guidelines', as they ought to be put somewhere. If not on sub-pages, then maybe in the talk page or the article itself. See my example on Talk:Ztar. PLEASE LIST WHERE THEY SHOULD GO!

Proposer: YourBuddyBill (talk)
Voting start: 22 September 22, 2010, 17:11
Deadline: 29 September 29, 2010 , 23:59

Support

  1. YourBuddyBill (talk) Please say which space this stuff ought to go in. I think that the science of video games is very underappreciated, and could start much thought-provoking discussion over matters.
  2. Mechayoshi (talk) Okay now that I can vote. per all.

Oppose

  1. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) It's opinion and speculation so doesn't belong on the Wiki. Plus, do you think people will read all of that on Talk:Ztar, especially when it's just speculation?
  2. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Speculation. If you can't share it on the forums, just keep it to yourself. We don't need theories cluttering up talkpages.
  3. Smasher 101 (talk) Per Fawfulfury and MCD.
  4. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, speculation does not belong on this wiki, this wiki tells factual information about the Mario series, thus we can not have wild theories about Mario, I advise you to go to the Mario fanon wiki to make pages about your theories
  5. T.c.w7468 (talk) I like science and all, but it is speculation and it doesn't fit this wiki.
  6. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Per all. Zero signing out.
  7. Walkazo (talk) - Per all.
  8. Tucayo (talk) - Per 22's comment
  9. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk) Mario lives in a different universe from us, so it would be nearly impossible to explain what is happening. All physics, all elements, all matter, everything is different. Per all.
  10. Gamefreak75 (talk) - Anyone can pull a theory out of their butt and place it on the page, making us look really unprofessional. Per all.
  11. Reversinator (talk) Per all.
  12. LeftyGreenMario (talk) I could say that Luigi isn't a human at all! The nose could be a mysterious appendage used to generate electricity and sense where Mario is! No. Most of this would be speculation.
  13. Booderdash (talk) Mario has NO science in it. WHat are you talking about? Its a game series about MUSHROOMS making people grow larger. You want science, look in a chemistry book. You want fun, play Mario. Also, if you really want sciencecal video games, Resident Evil has it the most, and so does those "virus" games.
  14. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per all.
  15. Mr bones (talk) BLOF, Mario isn't real...anyways, the point is, you can't explain how a maple leaf turns mario into a raccoon. In other words, if we does that, everyone will say his theory is the best and it will be a wikitastrophy. Per all.

Comments

Well, you need to give a time for the voting to start and end. Emperor Yoshi (talk)

See Mariology, one of our affiliates. It is expressly dedicated to this sort of content. Twentytwofiftyseven (talk)

Or go to the forums and make a topic called "The Theory of Mario"; that would actually be a pretty funny topic :P Marioguy1 (talk)

Forums tend to glitch up for me, not showing dates of topics or posts, so I usually get in lots of trouble for necroposting. YourBuddyBill (talk)

Votes that were made before the voting period started remain invalid even after it starts. If we allowed anything else, it would defeat the entire purpose of having a "voting period". Twentytwofiftyseven (talk)


Making a Power Glove article

don't make power glove article 2-12
I think we should make a article for the failed accessorie, the power glove. We have a article for the Atari 2600 and the Virtual boy, so why not make a power glove article. I will put in codes the players need to use to play the games.

Proposer: Fuzzipede27 (talk)
Voting start: September 25, 2010, 10:00 GMT
Deadline: October 2, 2010, 10:00 GMT

Support

  1. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per proposal
  2. Tomz123 (talk) What would a Super Mario Wiki without those kinds of stuff?

Oppose

  1. Reversinator (talk) Atari 2600 and Virtual Boy are consoles that had Mario titles. The Power Glove is an accessory that didn't have any Mario games specifically made for it.
  2. LeftyGreenMario (talk) Unless the power glove have any sort of Mario stuff on it, we are supposed to cover Mario-related content, not Nintendo content in general.
  3. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Per all.
  4. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Per all. Zero signing out.
  5. Basurao Pokabu Waribiaru Zeburaika Zuruguu A (talk) At Tomz123, it would be the Super Mario Wiki. Not making an appearance in any Mario game (besides cameo) or Super Smash Bros. game makes it not notable.
  6. Smasher 101 (talk)Per all.
  7. Booderdash (talk) Per all
  8. JF (talk) Mario has, like, nothing to do with the Power Glove.
  9. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) "I LOVE THE POWER GLOVE!! IT'S SO ...totally non-Mario." The only connections are Nintendo & that awesome film, The Wizard.
  10. Mechayoshi (talk)per all. It's not mario at all.
  11. Bowser's luma (talk) About as Mario-related as Snooki. Per all.
  12. Nerfman2227 (talk) Per all.

Comments

Did the Power Glove have any Mario games made for it period? I don't care about new ones, were any games made for the power glove that featured Mario or one of the Mario characters? Marioguy1 (talk)

The Wikipedia article doesn't say anything about Mario at all, so no. Reversinator (talk)
Were there any Mario games that had used the power glove as an item/feature/cameo/etc? LeftyGreenMario (talk)
No. MrConcreteDonkey (talk)
I am Zero! @LGM Fail. Zero signing out. Zero777 (talk)
@LGM I think there's a cameo of it in a WarioWare game, but that alone doesn't merit an article. Reversinator (talk)

I don't even know hat a Power Glove is. Can someone explain it to me? Commander Code-8 (talk)

@CC-8: I'm sure that nobody here can explain better than wikipedia does. Marioguy1 (talk)

And You are.....?

use full names 16-7
I just notice in some sections of articles, they refer to the game by an abbreviation (SSBB is an example) or by another name usually just a shorten version of the game title (Brawl another example). So we should have this settled once and for all, should we refer to Video game titles only by there full name in mainspace or still refer them by their abbreviations?

Proposer: Zero777 (talk)
Voting start: September 28, 2010, 21:30
Deadline: October 4, 2010, 21:30

Use Full Names

  1. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! It won't be that much work, it will just be every time you see one just change it to its full name, no problem. And it will avoid confusion to visitors who are very new to the Mario series. Zero signing out.
  2. LeftyGreenMario (talk) Not everyone knows what those abbreviations mean. It's always better to write it out the long way.
  3. LuigiMania (talk) Per LGM.
  4. Mechayoshi (talk) Per Zero
  5. Supershroom (talk) Abbreviations aren't their real names. It's like calling Luigi 'Weegee'. Mabye.
  6. WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135 (talk) Per Marioguy1 (In comments)
  7. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per all.
  8. Smasher 101 (talk) Per all.
  9. Mario jc (talk) Per Zero777. Using abbreviations is just plain laziness.
  10. Photo4 (talk) Per Zero777 and LGM. Plus if it isn't the thing's real name, what's the point of informing people about the false thing?
  11. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per all.
  12. Cosmic Blue Toad (talk) per all
  13. Fawfulfury65 (talk) IMO using abbreviations will make the writing unprofessional and less encyclopedic. Sometimes I don't even know what the abbreviations stand for. Also, look at "M&SOWG" (Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games). If you're not sure what game the article is talking about, you might not be sure what that stands for right away (I find it a little confusing myself at times).
  14. Cosmic Red Toad (talk) per Fawfulfury65
  15. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Per all.
  16. Walkazo (talk) - Per all.

Keep Using Abbreviations

  1. Bowser's luma (talk) It would be a lot of work to track down and remove all abbreviations, and it would be alright if they were kept, but only if the article states the abbreviation first. Such as "Super Smash Bros. Brawl, often abbreviated SSBB..." at the beginning of the article.
  2. Nerfman2227 (talk) Oh man. It would just be too much work to keep listing the entire name for every time it is referenced. A few titles like SSBM, SSBB, and some of the Mario vs Donkey Kong games come to mind.
  3. Lu-igi board per bowser luma
  4. Tomz123 (talk) Per Bowser Luma.
  5. DaisyRox02 (talk) Per Bowser's Luma. Who wants to make a link that says "Mario and Sonic at the Olympic Winter Games" all the time?
  6. Superboo922 (talk) Per all.
  7. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, it would take a long time to remove all of the abbreviations, and some games have rather long names to type out, it would be hard to write the name over and over. It would also be very repetitive to write, which, as an encyclopedia, would make us look bad to people coming here from other wikis.

Comments

Full names in articles, abbreviations on talk pages. Marioguy1 (talk)

We already have a rule on this. Full names go in articles. Fawfulfury65 (talk)
Well then, this proposal is proposing something that has been proposed and passed previous to this proposal. Marioguy1 (talk)

I won't be voting in this because my view is that something should only be shorted/abbrieviated if it's already been mentioned. Commander Code-8 (talk)

  • M&SG (talk) - Abbreviations should only be used when the game's full name is shown BEFORE the abbreviation is used. That way, people won't get too confused.
I believe that things should never be abbreviated, it will not kill you to write the entire title and improve clarification and understanding within the article. And @ all those opposing because it's "too much work", this is an easy task, it will probably be done in under a month after this proposal passes (maybe even a week if people work dilligently). Marioguy1 (talk)

MarioWiki:Manual of Style#Naming an Article - look at the last paragraph. So now shouldn't we all be using full names to begin with? Fawfulfury65 (talk)

That applies only to article titles...this proposal will close all loopholes. Marioguy1 (talk)

I am Zero! @ChillGuy Writing down the game's name is your own personal thing to do but nothing will change on the search, you can still type down "SSBB" and still be redirected to the Super Smash Bros. Brawl article if this proposal pass, so your vote is invalid. Zero signing out. Zero777 (talk)

Who cares if it's been a propsosal before. Maybe the outcome will be different. Like I said above, who the heck wants to make an incredibly long link every time they create the link?DaisyRox02 (talk)

If someone doesn't know what the abreviation means, they can just roll-over the link and the roll-over text'll show what the link is.(direct comment to LGM)DaisyRox02 (talk)
DaisyRox: Wave over this link (SSBB) - what does it say? "Super Smash Bros. Brawl"? No, it says "SSBB". And now, wave over this word (SSBB), what did that say? Nothing? See there, two examples of when an abbreviation would not be understanded unless you know what "SSBB" means. Marioguy1 (talk)

It's a redirect. Okay, fine then. I lose. End of story.DaisyRox02 (talk)


The prefix "List of"

add "list of" to all lists 3-11-0
There are 166 lists on the wiki. 105 have the prefix "List of". The rest don't. We need concistency. Either we remove List of, or we add list of. I prefer removing it, because list of is unnecessary. While some of you might argue that people wouldn't know what is a list and what isn't, most of the articles that have list of are articles that people would expect to be lists.

Proposer: Reversinator (talk)
Voting start: October 1, 13:04 GMT
Deadline: October 7, 23:59 GMT

Remove "List of" from all lists

  1. Reversinator (talk) Per me.
  2. SWFlash (talk) Per Reversinator.
  3. DaisyRox02 (talk) - Well, it's a no-brainer that they're lists. If it's got a bunch of links on one page, it's a list. In other words, per proposal.

Add "List of" to all lists

  1. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) Per Vellidragon's comment below. Also, if 105 list pages have "List of" in their name, then surely it would be easier to add that to the remaining few list pages instead of taking it off the page title?
  2. Tucayo (talk) - Per vellidragon
  3. Bowser's luma (talk) The easiest way to be productive is what we want, so per Vellidragon.
  4. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Per comments
  5. Vellidragon (talk) - Per my comment.
  6. Commander Code-8 (talk) This wouldn't work that well. Example: The List of Implied characters would just be called Implied Characters. Per all
  7. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, the list of implied locations' name, if this were to happen, would be not self explanatory, and people that have came here after this proposal will not know what the page is at first look which is a bad thing, we need people to be able to look at the page name and know what the page is about.
  8. Smasher 101 (talk) Per all,especially Vellidragon.
  9. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per Vellidragon's comment below and all.
  10. Mileycyrussoulja (talk) Per everyone in this header.
  11. Sgt.Boo (talk) Per Commander Code-8.

Leave the list titles alone

Comments

Imo, the "list of" parts make sense as a means of justifying the use of the plural in the article title, which is not normally allowed. It also makes it clear that the article doesn't just explain the concept of something; e.g. a "List of Games" lists games instead of just describing what games are; if it didn't have the "list of" part, a logical assumption would be that it does the latter.--Vellidragon (talk)

I agree with Vellidragon, if the article is an article entitled (following his example) "Games", it is expected that the article will contain information on what games are, different gaming systems, etc.
However if the article is entitled "List of Games", it is expected that there will be a large list of all games which is what will actually be shown in the article. Marioguy1 (talk)
Then what about pages like the Bestaries we have for the PM series and SMRPG? I mean, I do like the idea of being all the same, but still, it will be hard with some names to move. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
DaisyRox: Of course! It's definitely a no-brainer to know what's a list and what isn't without looking at the article! How could I possible have overlooked the powers of psychometry :) Marioguy1 (talk)

Character Pages Extras

don't split other media from character pages 3-13
Alright, you can even look at the articles of Mario, Luigi, Peach, and so on, to see that the pages are HUGE! In all, that is a very good thing that should be with all the info they have, but then you see the small sections known as the cartoons and comics area. Do we really need them to be on the main characters pages? I mean, we can't just toss it aside, but really...

My proposal is not entirely deleting that info about the comics, cartoons, stories, and that stuff, but to move it to a different page. To show an example, for the comics that Mario has been in, we could make a page Mario (comics) and be able to view all the comics Mario has been in and what his comic-counterpart is like. That will help with all the information from the animated stuff that differs greatly from the character's video game background.

It might sound troubling at first, but think of it as just making another page for the character. We have Baby Mario, Baby Luigi, Baby Peach, and so on, and they are just a younger form of the adult counterparts we have known for awhile. And on that topic, we even had a proposal before that wanted to separate some of the baby info from the video game since the cartoon made it seem like they appeared a lot earlier.

Alright, I think I talked quite enough for the proposal statement, so just vote on what you think would be best for this wiki. I'm just saying though, that the pros are more pleasant and outnumbering than the cons for the benefits to the wiki.

Proposer: Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
Voting start: October 3, 2010, 0:43 GMT
Deadline: October 9, 2010, 23:59 GMT

Support

  1. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - Per all the statements I have written above and below. :D
  2. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per proposal, I think that the comics, etc. are too off of the actual games (especially the movie) to be included in the same article.
  3. Commander Code-8 (talk) There are very big differences between the comics, cartoons and video games. They should be seperate.

Oppose

  1. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) It's easier for them to all be together. If someone doesn't want to see them, they can easily skip those parts. We'd, as a result, have many useless stubs and also less FAs.
  2. Cosmic Blue Toad (talk) per MrConcreteDonkey
  3. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! There will come a limit where it needs to split into separate sub-articles, but I don't think we reached that point yet. Zero signing out.
  4. Superboo922 (talk) Hey Baby Mario Bloops, there's this thing called the content box. I suggest that you use it. Per MrCD.
  5. Walkazo (talk) - This is like saying the dictionary is to wordy and then proposing they put all the nouns, verbs, adverbs and adjectives into separate books. Sure, the individual volumes may be smaller, but you still need all four to get around, and between them, there'd be even more pages when you take into account the quadrupled set of introductory and explanatory sections, publishing info, cover pages, and whatnot (one per "dictionary"). Granted, a lot of the larger pages do need work, but rather than hacking away at them with quick-fix solutions like this, we should shorten them by streamlining the text and cutting out little snippets of superfluous writing here and there (like how they shorten the definitions and remove the most obscure words to make pocket dictionaries), while at the same time developing the sections that need more info. Rewrites may take a lot of time and effort, but they make the wiki look much better and are well worth the work. Plus, as Glowsquid alluded to in the comments, the whole "canon" debate has become nothing more than a recurring little migraine for our wiki and the less we go poking at it, the better. Long story short, until Nintendo says the games, cartoons, comics, movies and books (and anything else they have or will throw at us) are all separate timelines or whatever, we have no choice but to treat them as one big mess of equal and truthful continuity, lest we delve into the realm of slippery-sloped speculation, which has no place on our (ideally) hard-facts-only database. It's not an ideal way to organize all our content, but it's the best we can do with what we've been given to work with.
  6. DaisyRox02 (talk) Per Walkazo's really long comment right above. Of course they have to be on the same page as the characters! Why would you need to make a completely different link? It'll just create more stubs, and that's boring. Other than that, it's still information about the character.
  7. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Per Walkazo.
  8. Cosmic Red Toad (talk) per Walkazo
  9. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) Per Walkazo.
  10. Stooben Rooben (talk) Per Walkazo.
  11. Smasher 101 (talk) Per Walkazo.
  12. LeftyGreenMario (talk) I've put a buttload of cartoon information in the Mario article since there is none. I thought it would be nice to have information for all episodes since we are supposed to cover everything. Anyway, this proposal might be a good idea since the Mario page takes forever to load. However, we do not know if the cartoons are canon. Why can't we place the games in a separate article? What if the cartoons are what the Mario story is really about? No. The Mario movie thing is a different story, but I'm not willing to separate the Mario comics and cartoons just because they are not Nintendo games. Per all.
  13. Koopalmier (talk) While I do think games and other medias shouldn't be considered the same, they shouldn't be on different pages. However, I think informations from games and informations from animations and comics shouldn't be mixed - at least the elements regarding the games should be put prior to anything else.

Comments

Has anyone else here seen the DC wiki? They have a similar thing that this proposal's talking about. There's one article for the mainstream comics character, and another for that character in a TV Show, Parallel universe etc. and it works pretty well. It wouldn't hurt to have the same thng happen here, Especially since we don't have much on the comics/cartoons. Commander Code-8 (talk)

One other thing is that we might have to create some disambiguation pages so that these new articles can actually be found. Eg: The Mario disambiguation might have about 5, which could include the Cartoon, the comics and a seperate one for each film. My point is that we need to be able to make disambiguation pages. But it shouldn't be to much of a problem. Commander Code-8 (talk)

The DC Wiki may do this, but at the same time, DC comics are much heavier on continuity than Mario, and some "alternate universe" versions are considered characters in their own right. It's not rare for Superman to meet one of his alternate-univere self, for one. And the reason we have separate pages for the babies is that they're often seen at the same time as their adult counterparts (ex: The sport games, M&L: Pit) and thus are different characters.

The proposer says the character pages are huge, and while our amount of content certainly plays a part in that, the main reason is that they're honestly terribly written, filled to the brim with wordcruft, tangents about the IRL impact of the games and summarising entire plot including the parts that aren't relevant to the character. Even the cartoon sections have that problem, describing damn near every episodes Mario appeared in, even though most of it is not relevant.

And though that's a silly reason, I'd like to avoid the inevitable headache if either Stumpers or Son of Suns come back, both of which were senior sysops really, really opposed to separating the cartoons and comics from the games. --Glowsquid 12:22, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Well, my point sort of came from looking at all the pages that Bulbapedia has. View it from that, as they have many characters their comics and cartoon counterparts. You could reason with them also about they could be the same person and so on and so forth. But see how sucessful that is with theirs, and we could do the same thing. We have a lot of agruements with the comics/cartoon and it deals greatly on this wiki, and this proposal is meant to be an alternative that will solve that problem. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
I think the Mario article is too long but I don't think this is the way to go...we want our viewers to be able to find information on Mario by typing "Mario" into the search box. We don't want them to go looking through a whole bunch of Marios to find the Mario they want. It is our job to give them what they want with the least amount of work on their part, no matter how much work it is on ours. Marioguy1 (talk)
Hey superboo! That's called the table of contents, I suggest you get your facts straight next time you try to make someone feel bad or it'll jump back at you :) Marioguy1 (talk)

Geez, Superboo. You don't have to be so harsh about Baby Mario Bloops' proposal. At least he tried.DaisyRox02 (talk)

MarioGuy1:You're acting as though we would have about 25 Mario articles if this proposal passes. All you need is a disambiguation page and it shouldn't be too hard finding them all. Commander Code-8 (talk)

Alright, just to clear up some confusion if any, it will not be like Mario (Character), Mario (SMBSS), Mario (ASMB3), Mario (comic #1)... but like Mario, Mario (cartoon), Mario (comics). And probably add the Mario Movie into the cartoon page (which would then be changed to Mario (anime)). Here and here will show you an example, and some changes that would be made. I got a little lazy with Test 2, so I didn't feel like adding a made-up intro, description, or personality as of this moment. I hope that will help show you a better idea of my proposal. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
I still disagree with this proposal but I think you may be on to something BMB, maybe if we made a sub-page of the Mario article (i.e. Mario/Episodes) we could have a description of Mario's role in the (i.e.) Super Mario Bros. Super Show! and then we'd have a link leading to "a complete list of the episodes Mario has appeared in". It would definitely allow us to have more information and it wouldn't treat it as different timelines or different Marios which seems to be a main reason for opposing. I support my idea and when I feel like it, I'll get around to proposing it if nobody (*wink wink*) else (*wink*) does (*wink wink wink*) ;) Marioguy1 (talk)
That sounds like a good idea. I was even considering putting all the episodes Mario appeared in somewhere else and put a main summary on another page. There are plentiful episodes, so I don't know why we have to give details on the games, but not on the cartoon episodes. (*blinks*) agghhh too much winking (*explodes*) LeftyGreenMario (talk)
@MG1: I think I understand what you are saying. So it is to have sub-articles of Mario - which was the main goal of the proposal - to put the comics/movie/cartoons on. Then, on the Mario Page, we could just summarize the series into a well-written paragraph, deleting both the stubby sections, yet not making an entire new Mario Page. I like you're thinking btw. It is beyond 3 days, so I can't change it now, but I think I might (*wink*) follow your advice and see if another proposal later will deal with that. Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
OK, I have filled User:Marioguy1/Test with all the examples you need. I suggest you just get on with the second proposal and ask an admin to delete this one but if you want to see how this one ends off and then propose the second one, I'm fine with that too. In your proposal, you can use my test page as an example (unless that's not what you want). Make sure to stress that this will apply to all characters at the user's judgement (i.e. if the character makes a cameo in one episode, we don't need to split it off but if they appear in several, well, the user editing the article sets the limit. As long as people use common sense, they won't get it wrong). Marioguy1 (talk)

Showing only passed proposals on the Main Page

don't show only passed proposals on the main page 1-17
I've sometimes gone to the wiki and looked at the proposal and seen that the idea looks really weird. I then go onto the Proposals page and find that the proposal only has about 3 supporters and maybe 10 opposers. Seeing something that won't be taken action about on the Main Page seems to make the wiki look bad.

I am proposing that only proposals that have successfully passed be Featured on the Main Page, so that people can log in on the wiki. See what the proposal is and possibly start helping out with it

Proposer: Commander Code-8 (talk)
Voting start: October 5, 2010, 5:17 GMT
Deadline: October 12, 2010, 23:59 GMT

Only Feature passed Proposals on the main page

  1. Commander Code-8 (talk) Per my proposal

Keep on showing Proposals that are still in voting time

  1. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Per Reversinator's comment. Zero signing out.
  2. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per Reversinator's comment.
  3. Smasher_101 (talk) Per Revesinator's comment.
  4. WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135 (talk) Per all comments.
  5. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk) Showing active proposals on the main page draws attention to the current changes that are suggested to be made. It convinces people to see what changes are going to be made and what side they should take. Featuring passed proposals seems like a waste of space. There are no functions to a passed proposal and it doesn't look too glamorous, after all. Passed proposals belong in the archive, not in the front page.
  6. LeftyGreenMario (talk) I think that the proposal on the front page is supposed to stir up attention, not say, "Hey look, it passed! Make these changes!"
  7. Sgt.Boo (talk)Per LeftyGreenMario.
  8. Garlic Stapler (talk) Per LGM and Reversinator. Also showing only passed proposals doesn't motivate anyone to try getting involved and they will likely assume that the proposal is already being taken care of.
  9. Walkazo (talk) - Per all, including Reversinator.
  10. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Per all.
  11. Frostyfireyoshi (talk) Per all.
  12. M&SG (talk) - Active proposals draw more attention to current changes. If only the winning proposals are displayed, that won't give the active proposals a good look.
  13. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, if passed proposals are shown on the main page, it would draw attention away from current proposals, and also make us look unprofessional, also the people that come after something like this proposal were to pass would think that the proposal shown was still active, and they would vote on that proposal, and would mostly stay clear of the other ones.
  14. JF (talk) Per all.
  15. Ralphfan (talk) – Per all.
  16. Bowser's luma (talk) I approve these words! Hahahaha per all.
  17. Fawfulfury65 (talk) Per all.

Comments

The main page shows the most recent proposal. It doesn't matter if the proposal in question is failing. And besides, someone could make a vote-shattering comment that causes everyone to support. Reversinator (talk)

I don't really know what's the point in this. I thought the proposal on the main page is there to attract attention to the proposal. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

I think Commander Code-8's point is that passed proposal frequently require a lot of work to actually realise after they have passed, and that this may get people to help with that. Personally though, I sort of doubt anyone is going to help with these things just because they saw that a proposal passed on the main page. The way it's currently handled, the main page directs attention to proposals still in the voting phase, and people are a lot more likely to participate in a proposal by voting than by adjusting articles after it has passed simply because takes much less time and effort.--Vellidragon (talk)

Wow, a proposal about proposals. Per all commenting. WigglerWhoopin'Warrior135 (talk)


Image Gallery or Gallery

simply "gallery" 0-13
On some articles, the header that leads to the article subject's gallery either says Image Gallery or Gallery. This doesn't look professional to have one header on one page that says Image Gallery and another header on another page that says Gallery. We need to fix this.

Proposer: Mileycyrussoulja (talk)
Voting start: October 6, 2010, 8:08 UTC
Deadline: October 13, 2010, 23:59 UTC

Put Image Gallery on articles

Put Gallery on articles

  1. Mileycyrussoulja (talk) I think it should just be Gallery. Image Gallery just sounds too... i don't know. Doesn't sound right.
  2. Garlic Stapler (talk) Gallery, Image Gallery? Let's just leave it at gallery, short and to the point of where it links to.
  3. Sgt.Boo (talk) I don't really think it matters too much, but it should stick to one thing. Gallery is short and simple and hits the nail on the head in terms of what to put.
  4. Fawfulfury65 (talk) The "Image" part is pointless and a waste of space. Gallery is best.
  5. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - It would be like saying large big, they literally mean the same thing here. Don't go be like Mario Mario, as we only need 1. Also, it is already Gallery, so lets keep it from being POINTLESS.
  6. LeftyGreenMario (talk) Same thing as the term "the reason why...is because...". Too much unnecessary words.
  7. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! What else will you be thinking on a website that says "gallery". Zero signing out.
  8. T.c.w7468 (talk) "Image" is kind of obvious. Just "gallery" is good, in this case "Image Gallery" is rather redundant. Per all.
  9. Walkazo (talk) - Per all.
  10. Smasher 101 (talk) Per all.
  11. Marioguy1 (talk) Per all those with the word "pointless" on their minds...
  12. Bowser's luma (talk) Per all.
  13. Ralphfan (talk) – Per all.

Comments

Guys just a reminder, i'm talking about the headers on articles that link to the subject's gallery, not the actual gallery itself.Mileycyrussoulja (talk)

Will this have to be done manually, or can it be done with DPL text replace? Ralphfan (talk)

The text replace function has no DPL in it, and this wiki does not have it so, yes, manually would be a good choice. Marioguy1 (talk)

I am Zero! Can somone please archive this. Zero signing out. Zero777 (talk)


Move Episodes from Article to Subpage

put episodes on subpages 8-4
This proposal is kind of like BMB's last proposal, except it is proposing to move the episodes of appearance of a character, as long as the character has many of these appearances, into a subpage of the article. I'm not going to go in depth in the description but this will save loading time on longer articles for those people who don't want to see every appearance of Character X in Series Y. For the people who do, there will be a link :)

If you don't get it, User:Marioguy1/Test is my awesome example page :P

Proposer: Marioguy1 (talk)
Voting Start: October 12, 2010, 22:00 EST
Deadline: October 18, 2010, 23:59

Seperate

  1. Marioguy1 (talk) - This can reduce loading time on many articles without making too many subpages like BMB's former proposal would have.
  2. Cosmic Red Toad (talk) - per BMB's old proposal and this one. i dont care about... episodes or whatever?
  3. Baby Mario Bloops (talk) - Well, same as before, yet his is more logical I guess. Also, do realize that the Gallery Proposal is much like this, as it is a sub-page of the character, and we do have to best guess whether it should be a sub-page for some characters.
  4. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per proposal.
  5. Tucayo (talk) -Per all.
  6. LeftyGreenMario (talk) I was thinking about this when I typed up the Mario episodes. I thought we have to cover every single appearance of Mario, so there, a billion episode descriptions. The making of the subpages will help the loading time greatly.
  7. New Super Mario (talk) Per proposal
  8. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! There are high chances that they're not going to make a new Mario cartoon so putting it in a sub-page will'nt be a bad idea. It can give more room to upcoming game info. Zero signing out.

Remain in Articles

  1. Bowser's luma (talk) If we were to do that, why not make a subpage for game appearances as well? The point of an article is to have a lot of info in one place, not to be a map of subpages. I can understand a subpage for the likes of images, but written information belongs in the article.
  2. Arend (talk) Do we need of every page a subpage? Galleries were enough for me. Besides, some featured articles have much info because of the length and inclusion of important sections - Game appearances, personality etc, relations, other info, misc. I bet that those might be unfeatured after this proposal passes. Also, per Bowser's luma.
  3. Basurao Pokabu Waribiaru Zeburaika Zuruguu A (talk) You've got to think of things from a reader's viewpoint. This ruins a reader's ease in reading pages. Let's say they want to read the whole Mario article. Now, they'd have to go to a separate page to see his episode appearances? Not to mention the test page basically shows episode summaries.
  4. Reversinator (talk) Per all

Comments

Well, if we did something like this to Mario, wouldn't it be consistent to do it with every other character from the cartoons? Fawfulfury65 (talk)

Yes, pretty much. As long as they appear in multiple episodes, or something like that. It's basically up to the user's best judgement to determine whether or not a sub-page is required. Marioguy1 (talk)
@Bowser's luma: Did I ever say anything about a subpage for games? This proposal is an alternative to the recently failed proposal about making subpages to games. Please don't extend the content of my proposal beyong what I put there, I am opposed and always will be opposed to subpages for games. Yes, articles are meant to cover the content of a character, but we do not need a complete listing of the episodes that the character appeared in, rather a general statement of their overall role in the episodes will suffice and if anyone cares to delve deeper, we have a link for them. It shortens the page for all those who don't want to see every single time Mario has appeared in a series entitled the Super Mario Bros. Super Show. Chances are that he appeared in more than a lot of episodes. For those who want to read the article as a whole, we have a paragraph describing how he was the hero in the shows and he fought against Bowser and yadayadayada, we list the abnormal episodes and say how they were abnormal and then the reader moves on, knowing what Mario did in that series. If they want to read about his appearances there and they specifically target that section, we have a link for the odd reader who does want that kind of thing. But for the other two types or readers, who are much more common, we have a general overview. Marioguy1 (talk)
@Arend: Fed up with subpages? Why? Do you just find them annoying? Personally, I find that subpages help move some of the content that people may not want to see which will take up a very extensive portion of the article, away so that only those who want to see it will see it. And if any FAs were featured because of any good qualities, I would like a list of them so I can create unfeature noms for them all. Perfection is not a representation of how many good things an article has, perfection is a representation of how many bad things it does not. If any articles were featured because they have a "long, descriptive section in the middle" then they should be unfeatured. They are not perfect (or as close to perfect as possible) if they have a big section in the middle and many errors everywhere else. If they have no errors anywhere and a big section in the middle, taking away the section won't do anything bad to them. Marioguy1 (talk)

I don't like the idea of only doing this to the main characters' articles. It's much more consistent to do this with all character articles from the cartoons, no matter how minor. Deciding what characters are main and what characters are minor is mostly based on opinions if you ask me. I always thought of Oogtar as an important and major character, but I'm sure not everyone can agree on that because he doesn't appear in many episodes as far as I know. Fawfulfury65 (talk)

What I mean by that is for characters like Mario, Luigi, etc. there would be a subpage. Maybe for characters with multiple appearances like Mouser but for a character like Pine, there is no need to split it into a subpage so it won't be split. Whether there is need or not is up to the user editing the article but I would personally never do it for someone who appeared in only one episode and never anything else. Marioguy1 (talk)
@The guy with the long name: I am thinking from the typical reader's viewpoint. What you just described was an atypical and less common type of reader. Someone who wants to read the entire Mario article will have to click one link, and all the others who don't won't have to scroll through 11 paragraphs of text just to skip one section. And if someone wants to know what Mario's appearance in that series is, there is a paragraph describing what he does. Marioguy1 (talk)

Categories on Boss Articles

use new category system 8-3
OK, this proposal, obviously, has to do with the categories on the boss articles, something like this was recently stated on the talk of the main page however I think that to be an official policy, it must be proposed and passed by the community. So, currently, ~all (or so I am told) boss articles have three categories in them, Enemies, Bosses and Characters. I propose that we use those categories much more strictly, AKA for the following reasons:

  • Enemies - This category will only be used on characters that are unnamed individually and are simply known as members of a certain species. Like Goombas, not Goomboss, not Red and Blue Goomba, just the members of the species that are generic and anonymous. Examples include Goomba, Koopa Troopa, Spiny and Nitpicker.
  • Bosses - This category would only contain enemies with different variants, like different music, different size, solo text where they state they are "superior" or "notable", different coloration, etc. Examples include Goomboss, Baron Brrr, Lakilester and Bowser.
  • Characters - This category will only contain named characters. If the being in question is named and not just a generic member of a species then it would be considered a character. Examples include Mario, Yoshi, Bowser and Goompapa.

Proposer: Marioguy1 (talk)
Voting Starts: October 12, 2010, 21:00 EST
Deadline: October 18, 2010, 23:59

Use this Category System

  1. Marioguy1 (talk) - When looking for enemies, people want to see enemies, i.e. the different species that bosses fall into, not bosses in general.
  2. Supershroom (talk) - I completly agree. What's the point of having a bosses category if they are all found in other categories. However, you suggest that Bowser would be in the Bosses category, when he is a character as well. I mean, if someone was asked to name some major Mario characters, I'm sure they would mention Bowser. So, if they then came here, and wanted to see some Mario characters, they would think that there would be a mistake in the category if they didn't find Bowser there. For most of the other bosses, like those who have been seen once, would be fine in their own Bosses Category. On the other hand, some people might lke to see a page with all the named characters (the lazy blobs could jus click links to other pages though), so this might be why there is so much disagreement about this topic. Oh and what Marioguy1 says. I only really disagree about Bowser, and other important characters like the Koopalings and Kamek (and so on and so forth) only being in the bosses category, when they are charcters too. Take Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story, for example. You fight Bowser (three times, if you count Bowser X as the third), which makes him a boss, yet you also play as him, mking him a character. I could go on for ages, (I aready have XD) but I can't be bothered to type any more. I broke my finger a few days ago, and I think I'm making it worse. Finally, per proposal.
  3. Ralphfan (talk) – Per all.
  4. Cosmic Blue Toad (talk) – Per proposal and myself in the comments.
  5. Edofenrir (talk) - Bosses are not enemies, and to be honest I expected that common sense would make that obvious. Both of these terms are distinct roles in video game jargon, and in the usual case they are exclusive to one another. These two categories should never appear on the same article, except in the very specific case that something is encountered as a boss AND a regular enemy. Do not mix this up.
  6. Fawfulfury65 (talk) I agree with Edo's comment.
  7. Rise Up Above It (talk) Finally, a comment that helped me decide my vote. Thanks, Edo! Per Edo.
  8. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Took me a while to decide, but per all.

Continue Using Current One

  1. Bowser's luma (talk) Bosses are characters as well as enemies. All current categories apply, some of which are just more specific than others. It is like so: Characters>Enemies>Bosses. Bowser is a boss, but that doesn't remove him from the categories of "Enemies" or "Characters."
  2. GalacticPetey (talk) Per Bowsers Luma
  3. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per Bowser's Luma.

Comments

So you are saying Bosses =/= Characters? I would think that characters may be like a "mother category", with many other ones branching out, like Bosses, Enemies, Allies, etc. Tucayo (talk)

Actually, I think most (if not all) boss articles would also be character articles. What I'm saying is that not all character articles would also be boss articles. I'm just trying to set category standards in this small area of the category tree. Marioguy1 (talk)
The boss category is a specific sub-category of "enemies". It applies to those enemies that are fought in a "boss battle", bosses are defined as enemies but you don't meet up with a Bowser on the road and (forgive the Pokemon reference) have "A wild Bowser appeared!" flash onto the screen. He's slightly more sinister than a casual, oh look, it's another one of those things. And if Bowser is a character AND a boss, he will be categorized as a character AND a boss, I don't see the dilemma with having two categories. Marioguy1 (talk)

Look, the branch of "being" categories are kinda like this in my eyes:

  • Species - Races of different beings. Some are usually nice (Allies), some are usually evil (Enemies).
  • Characters - (Important) members of different species, which usually have a name.
  • Heroes - The good guys, who usually save worlds, characters and important items. Mario (a Character) is a Hero, Yoshis (a species) are too.
  • Allies - Nice characters or species which help heroes on their way, and are against enemies. The character Toad is an ally, and so are his species. Mario is sometimes an ally too.
  • Villains - Usually the bad guys. They usually kidnap certain characters, steal important items and take over worlds. Villains are usually characters, not species. Bowser is a villain
  • Bosses - The term "Boss" is used on characters who are need to be fought, or are leaded by a villain, or eventually ARE the leaders of a branch of enemies. Villains can be bosses as well. Bowser is not only a villain, but also a boss. Hammer Bros. (a species) are (mini)bosses too.
  • Enemies - This could be anything that is bad. Evil species, villains AND bosses. So Hammer Bros. are also enemies, and Bowser thus too. And so are Goombas.

A little complicated, and maybe a little hard to understand. Arend (talk)

Well, I think of them like this:

Recap:
Species:All races, good or evil (Dryites)
Enemies:Evil species that can be fought (Octoombas)
Allies:Good species or characters that assist you or you rescue (Tayce T.)
Characters:Anyone specifically named, good or bad (Starlow)
Bosses:Evil characters you fight in a boss battle (Kammy Koopa)
Heroes:Good characters who help save the day (Luigi)
Villains:Major bosses, usually the final boss (Super Dimentio)

Well, that's what I think. Cosmic Blue Toad (talk)

A boss is an opponent, usually one of a kind, who is fought under special conditions. In action games a boss is usually introduced somehow, commonly with a cutscene, and you fight it in an arena of some sorts. In an RPG those often have their own separate battle theme or something else that sets them appart from the enemies. An enemy on the other hand is one of the many common nuisances you encounter in a level. They are usually not unique or specially introduced, and you often encounter more than one of them in one level. These are set roles in video game jargon, keep that in mind.

So apparently there are people saying the Bowser article should have the Enemy category on it. Now let me ask you a question: Where, even in one single game, has Bowser ever been encountered as a common enemy? In which game did he roam a level like a Goomba, or Koopa, or any other enemy? That's right, never! This is why the Enemy category has no place on the Bowser article, and neither does it have one on any other boss article.

This whole Enemies-Bosses constellation has been formed because of the assumption that most bosses hold a grudge against Mario (read: They are his enemies). However, this is not what the Enemy category is for. It is for common enemies only! We can't just stretch the scope of a category because of semantics like "You can use the word 'enemy' in a sentence with them, so they have to be enemies". We don't put Category:Bosses on Princess Peach because she is the ruler (read: the boss) of the Toads. The example sounds ridiculous? Well, the whole argument is the same if you think about it long enough.

The scope of a category needs to be clear and precise. Don't dilute it with semantics that contradict logic and the fundaments of video game principles. - Edofenrir (talk)


Take out Community Polls and Bring back Featured Images

vetoed by the administrators
This is not up to the userbase. The main page is crucial in making a first impression on guests and so we need to make it as impressive as we can.
Ok I kind of liked these at the start but now that it has been a while, they get kind of boring. One thing is that there are polls on the forum. If people want to do the polls so bad they can just go on the forum and create polls themseleves or answer polls other people have created. A second reason is that the polls are there too long. I get on and the poll that I vote on is still there. My last reason is that with Featured Images every user can do it and not just people on the poll commitee. With the polls all you do is vote and it is done, nothing else happens. With the FI you can go on time to time more frequently and put images on/vote on them.

Proposer: New Super Mario (talk)
Voting Start: October 18, 2010, 6:20 UTC
Proposed deadline: October 25, 2010, 6:20 UTC
Date Withdrawn: October 19, 2010, 01:30 GMT

Bring back FI

  1. New Super Mario (talk) Per Proposal

Keep Polls

Comments

The Featured Image process does not work, no matter how many rules we add, the physical impossibility of that system prevents it from working. Marioguy1 (talk)


Merge Mario Tennis Characters

don't merge mario tennis characters 2-11
I've been checking the Project Unstubify page and quite a few of the character pages and notice that almost all of them have only one or two setences and a stub template put onto them. I think that they should all be merged as one page since there is literally no one to expand those stubs at all.

Proposer: Garlic Stapler (talk)
Voting start: October 13, 2010, 9:15 EST
Deadline: October 20, 2010, 23:59

Support

  1. Garlic Stapler (talk) - Per proposal.
  2. Beecanoe (talk) - You know, this could be the start of something new. Not only could we merge the Mario Tennis character articles, but merge articles about other really minor elements, too (such as the Mario & Sonic Olympic events, sure they're not as short as the Mario Tennis characters, but they're stubs, nonetheless). I pity the foos who think that idea is a bad one.

Oppose

  1. Mileycyrussoulja (talk) I oppose because this is the MARIOWIKI and each character is supposed to have their own article.
  2. Fawfulfury65 (talk) I have both Mario Tennis games for the Game Boy systems and each of those character have a slightly different role and personality (from what I remember). Per all.
  3. Ralphfan (talk) – Per all.
  4. Marioguy1 (talk) - We are the mariowiki, we do not limit our content based on our writing capabilities, we wait for someone with better experience with the game and character to come along and do it. We do our best, even if that's not the best. We cannot give up because of a minor impass, take te easy road and limit our content. We must challenge ourselves to make it better and only then can we call ourselves an encyclopedia. For the wiki!
  5. LeftyGreenMario (talk) This is a foo who thinks this idea is a bad idea. Pity her. Per all.
  6. Fuzzipede27 (talk) Per all.
  7. Mariomaster228 (talk) Per all. Even if an article is a stub, it still has the potential to grow. Mario and Luigi each have their own articles, so same thing here.
  8. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! Specify on who do you mean by "Mario Tennis characters" and I might change my mind. Zero signing out.
  9. Walkazo (talk) - Per all.
  10. Emperor Yoshi (talk) Well, we should not limit our content on our experience with the game, it would make us look like a amateur encyclopedia, thus, we should wait until someone with more experience with the games to add to the pages.
  11. Rise Up Above It (talk) Per all. I pity the foos who think that idea is a good one.

Comments

If you don't like the fact that they are stub articles, why not write more? Bowser's luma (talk)

To be honest I've played the games a couple of times, really isn't much more you can write about them to be honest. =[ Garlic Stapler (talk)

How about we just don't have those articles at all? No one cares about those characters anyway. Beecanoe (talk)

We are the MarioWiki, we have articles on all characters, major or minor from the Mario series. ESPECIALLY if they are playable. Marioguy1 (talk)

Beecanoe: Please don't call other people "foos" just because they have a different opinion than you. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

Yea, even though I can't expand and I support my own idea, don't call people "foos", kind of demeaning. Garlic Stapler (talk)
Foos. Is that like foosball? Bowser's luma (talk)
To be honest, I didn't really call anyone a foo. I just thought my idea was good and that it might work. But if anyone was offended, I apologize. Working with Dry Bowser, his rudeness kind of rubs on to you.

Oh yeah, and "foo" is how Mr. T. says "fool". Hope that clears things up for you Bowser's Luma. Beecanoe (talk)


The Lists on the Left Side Below Mario Knowledge

leave lists as they are 7-11
Pretty simple proposal. You know those lists about Characters, Places, Items, etc.? These lists are split into two: game stuff and non-game stuff. Why are they separate? Due to those canon proposals, shouldn't they be one list? I'm proposing that we merge the non-game stuff with the game stuff in those lists.

Proposer: LeftyGreenMario (talk)
Voting start: October 6, 2010, 21:23 UTC
Deadline: October 13, 2010 23:59 UTC Extended: October 20, 2010 23:59 UTC

DO MERGE

  1. LeftyGreenMario (talk) This isn't a matter of organization. We're supposed to update the list according to the previous proposal of merging game with non-game stuff. Besides, A-Z is enough organization we need. If you want to separate things as much as possible, fine, split the character articles into more articles.
  2. Walkazo (talk) - Per LeftyGreenMario: it's policy to list games and alternate media side-by-side, and anything that doesn't do this is merely outdated, with the exception of certain Navigation Templates (i.e. {{Human}}), which need the differentiate between series and whatnot. The lists don't need to be separated to show what media they are from, however, because the sources are listed right there on the pages.
  3. Marioguy1 (talk) - I usually refrain from voting but here I must vote as it seems my cause will lose (plus Walkazo made me rebuke my idea of "not being able to make a difference"). Per me in the comments I guess but to sum it up, there is no reason for characters, all confirmed as Mario characters, to be seperate on a list of Mario characters.
  4. JF (talk) Per all.
  5. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk) Per all.
  6. Mathew10 (talk) Per all.
  7. Dry Paratroopa (talk) It would shorten the pages, and if we really need an indicator, we can add a footnote shape like we did for the Yoshi series in the enemies section.

DON'T MERGE

  1. Tucayo (talk) - I am a firm supporter of separating games and non-games as much as possible, so, naturally, I oppose this proposal. Why? Well, they are different media, and that is enough reason for me. But if it isn't for you, well, then, most of the other media is not even fully made by Nintendo, and most of the characters have completely different roles, appearances, etc.
  2. Zero777 (talk) I am Zero! It will be easier and more organized if we didn't merge them. Zero signing out.
  3. Commander Code-8 (talk) I'm not sure that merging them would help. Per all.
  4. Wayoshi (talk) - Parsing out stuff into divisions is the best organization.
  5. Fuzzipede27 (talk) - Per all.
  6. Bowser's luma (talk) In my mind I try to keep things as seperate as possible, and for some things I do, that would impose a major hassle for myself, and others as well. Per all.
  7. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) Per all.
  8. Ralphfan (talk) – Per all.
  9. New Super Mario (talk) Per all. It's just more work for people to find something in the list
  10. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per Tucayo.
  11. Cosmic Red Toad (talk) Per Tucayo

Important Neutral Stuff

I'll say something that is on everybody's mind right now. Huh?!?!? Marioguy1 (talk)

Well, if you see here, the characters are divided to two groups: game and nongame. I want to merge the two since, well, because of one question: canon or not? Sorry for presenting an opinion unclearly; I'm notorious for doing that '-_- LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Otherwise, tell me, why are they separate? Shouldn't the list be one big list? LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Ah, now I see :) In my personal opinion, the current format is horrible. They should either be split into two lists or merged into one, not semi-merged, semi-split as they currently are. Marioguy1 (talk)
Yes, these lists should be one, according to this proposal. Remember those canon debates? I think these lists haven't been modified yet. LeftyGreenMario (talk)
Yeah, a lot of things regrettably fall through the cracks each time we change the organization standards... - Walkazo (talk)

Tucayo: Well, they are different media, but I don't see why the two lists are split, yet the Manual of Style wants articles to include both game information and other media information in the same section. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Zero777: The list is organized well enough. What, alphabetically isn't enough? It's slightly harder to navigate because the list is split. Again, this proposal deals mostly with the grouping of game and non-game stuff. The lists are outdated, and we need to change it to the standards. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

Luigi-board: Your vote is invalid. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

I'm neutral for this. This proposal is balanced in advantages (organization) and disadvantages (tons of moved internal links). Mathew10 (talk)

It shouldn't be that hard to move the links. It might be tedious, but it isn't hard. LeftyGreenMario (talk)
I really hope nobody opposes anything because it is too "hard", obviously the creator is volunteering to do the work themselves so it won't be hard at all for the person opposing. Marioguy1 (talk)

Again, it's not like alphabetized isn't organized enough. I can live with only 1 list. LeftyGreenMario (talk)

I don't understand why we should merge the game and non-game things TBH. Fawfulfury65 (talk)

Previous proposals. We are supposed to place game and non-game things in the same spot so we don't go in this canon debate. I thought we agreed to place non-game things and game things in the same spot, so I don't know why people oppose. This seems logical to me. LeftyGreenMario (talk)
Can you at least provide a link for evidence of such? BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

Check the coverage policy and canon policy. The split of the lists seems like the games are "more" canon than the nongames. LeftyGreenMario (talk)


Make a Gallery Template

make a gallery template 5-0
I just thought how easy it would be to have a Gallery template so new users could easily find more galleries when they access one and even editors could easily access their favorite galleries without having to go through the trouble. We could make a template for Character galleries and a template for Game galleries. Anyone think this is a good idea? I am thinking about making sections for Characters, Species, Bosses, and Games.

Proposer: Mileycyrussoulja (talk)
Voting start: October 11, 2010, 7:54 UTC
Deadline: October 18, 2010, 23:59 UTC Extended: October 25, 2010, 23:59 UTC

Make a Gallery Template

  1. Mileycyrussoulja (talk) Per myself. If this proposal passes, then I will truly make a gallery template.
  2. Bowser's luma (talk) Hey! Here's a good idea! Per Mileycyrussoulja.
  3. Marioguy1 (talk) - A navbox sounds like a good idea! It can help navigation around the galleries and it can't hurt, for examples see the staff articles (i.e. Super Mario Galaxy/Staff)
  4. Beecanoe (talk) Nice idea. It got me thinking of when I was a noob to the wiki. Anything to make things easier, I say.
  5. Propeller Toad (talk) This is a great idea! The galleries really look clustered in the way they are now and if there was a template, I'm sure more people would actually take a chance to look at the galleries rather than having these images just there and having looked like wasted potential.

Don't make a Gallery Template

Comments

Although we already have links to Galleries within most articles, I notice a few have galleries but don't link to them such as Waluigi and a few other characters that appear to have no link to their galleries. Although while back on subject, a gallery template on gallery pages would be nice. A segment of the template, for humans, species, bosses.Garlic Stapler (talk)

Do you have any example of this? Examples are commonly needed on this proposals. Tucayo (talk)
This could be difficult...I'll work on something :) Marioguy1 (talk)

Is this proposing to make something like a navigation template for galleries? Fawfulfury65 (talk)

From what I understand, yes. Like a big list of galleries. Marioguy1 (talk)
OK. I'd really like to see an example of this, though it sounds pretty good. Fawfulfury65 (talk)

Remember, supporters, saying any variation of "I like this idea!" is not a valid reason to support. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)

I really want to see an example of this, I don't feel comfortable allowing something this difficult to pass. This is something that could actually be pretty hard... marioguy1 (talk)
OK, is this what you're thinking of? I think it looks good...granted it's not in a template but if you want it in a template, I could try that. Marioguy1 (talk)
I think what he means is one of those little boxes at the bottom of the page. It could group galleries of characters like Bowser, Bowser Jr., etc. or Mario, Luigi, etc. Bowser's luma (talk)
yes, i do, Bowser's luma. Mileycyrussoulja (talk)

They're called navboxes. Marioguy1 (talk)

@Propeller Toad: Do you understand what he is proposing? Marioguy1 (talk)

Grammar Team

don't form a grammar team 2-16
Many people have different ways of typing things, most of the time mixing up grammar. I propose that we have a team who will check and edit any grammar mistakes. This may be changing words, adding letters, etc.

Example:

THIS is A ExAMpLE LINE oF TexT Four thiS.

Edit -: This is a example line of text for this.

Propser: LuigiMania (talk)
Voting Start October 18, 2010, 12:00
Deadline October 25, 2010, 12:00

Make a Grammar Group

  1. LuigiMania (talk): Per my idea.
  2. Mileycyrussoulja (talk): I love correcting grammar errors and would never get tired of it! Unfortunately, i think we all know which sides gonna win. :(

Don't make it.

  1. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk) Per comments below. I think that such a group is unnecessary for grammar errors.
  2. Walkazo (talk) - Per comments below.
  3. Rise Up Above It (talk) Per comments below.
  4. Garlic Stapler (talk) Not a good idea to make a group about something users correct anyways.
  5. Bowser's luma (talk) Per all. We don't need a group for something as simple as that.
  6. LeftyGreenMario (talk) If I see a grammar error, I'd correct it immediately. If I were forced to search for grammar errors, I would get mighty bored very quickly. I don't think we need a group JUST to correct grammar errors.
  7. Beecanoe (talk) The problem isn't official enough to make a change. It's kind of an amateur thing to fix errors you see while browsing the wiki. If there were a lot of errors on the pages I would say of course. Go for it. But like I said, not a major problem.
  8. Count Bonsula (talk) I don't think that's really needed, editing the wiki is team work, everyone and anyone participate to correct those mistakes. And per LGM.
  9. Ralphfan (talk) – It's unnecessary. Anyone can fix these mistakes.
  10. Gamefreak75 (talk) - Per all.
  11. SmileyMiley5001 (talk) - I fix them if I find them, but if I search for them I'd just get bored. Anyway, grammar is not to important, so long as you can understand what the person is saying.
  12. Mario Fan 123 (talk) - Per all. Also, YOU need a grammar correction. Use 'an' instead of 'a' there.
  13. MrConcreteDonkey (talk) - Per all.
  14. M&SG (talk) - A grammar group isn't exactly necessary. Not all people follow the same grammar rules anyway.
  15. T.c.w7468 (talk) Per all, I do not think a group is necessary for this.
  16. JF (talk) Ahaha no.

Comments

While this seems to be a great policy to have, I have a slight feeling that there may be arguements caused by this over Americanized spellings and non-Americanised spellings. For example, one of my earliest edits was edited, without my knowledge, shortly afterwards to change my English spellings to Americanized spellings: "colour" to "color". And that, frankly, is pointless. Rise Up Above It (talk) 13:04, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

There are a lot of many ways, such as form and forme, colour and color, and so on and so forth. But the proposal is stating that we have just one group of users do all the grammar issues. I don't approve of this idea as there are over 3,000 users that have the job of editing and improving the page, and just limiting the grammar stuff is like taking away nearly all the work needed on this wiki. We can't just have a group of people be in charge of it, as it is too much for just that. If you really want this, I say you should make this a Pipeproject (if there isn't one about this kind of issue). Baby Mario Bloops (talk)
I see your point BMB, and I agree with it; however my point was about the possibility of disagreements and edit wars(maybe) over what spelling scheme ought to be used. Because if this proposal did pass, then wouldn't every article have to adhere to one uniform spelling and grammar scheme? Rise Up Above It (talk)
I agree with BMB, we don't need to limit this to certain users, all users should be allowed, and encouraged, to fix grammar mistakes. If you wish to change a policy, do that, but making a specific team won't stop bickering throughout the team. If this proposal does pass, it won't make anything in addition to what we currently have. Marioguy1 (talk)
Per. This is pointless. Anyone is welcome to fix the grammar mistakes they find. We don't need a team for it. Fawfulfury65 (talk)

People who care about grammar will fix it on their own accord. Creating a silly group monicker that has no pratical tool for the job won't do snuff. --Glowsquid 11:59, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

For the record, anyone changing a British spelling to American or vice-versa is in the wrong, as both are allowed on the wiki to reflect the international nature of the wiki. (In fact, if I catch someone changing a word, I revert it, even if they were changing it to my country's spelling; if the change was part of an overall rewrite, it's fine, imho.) - Walkazo (talk)

This could make a good BJAODN bad proposal section, aside from that this is probably one of the worst and poorly done proposals so far. Also per all above and what they have said. Garlic Stapler (talk)

You don't really have to belittle people, you know. Ideas are ideas, and we appreciate ideas. Anyway, although we can have both British and American spelling in articles, I think we should to one type of spelling in one article (if an article has mainly British spelling, then it should be British spelling, e.g.). Not that I'm right, but I do love consistency. LeftyGreenMario (talk)
We should the British spelling only for articles where the stuff gets released in Europe first, and American if it gets released in North American first. BabyLuigiOnFire (talk)
I am Zero! Then that will confuse the visitor when jumping from article to article and great grammar LGM. Zero signing out. Zero777 (talk)
I concur, BLOF sounds like he has a nice idea going on. D: Garlic Stapler (talk)
But that's a pain to keep track of. I also like the mix inside the articles; just think of them as synonyms giving the pages variety, rather than inconsistencies in spelling. - Walkazo (talk)
  • Proper grammar can vary between people. For one instance, you may see people use the term "colour" instead of "color". Likewise, comma usage can vary as well.

    Example 1: Apple and Banana (no commas used)
    Example 2: Apple, Banana, and Grape (two comma used)
    Example 3: Apple, Banana and Grape (a comma is missing after Banana)

    Basically, various countries are different in their ways of proper grammar. M&SG (talk)