Editing Template talk:Not-unused

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:::::Sure, that works too. --{{User:Henry Tucayo Clay/sig}} 16:45, 20 January 2016 (EST)
:::::Sure, that works too. --{{User:Henry Tucayo Clay/sig}} 16:45, 20 January 2016 (EST)


==Allow Additional Parameter to Specify Where the File is Linked==
== Proposal ==
{{Settled TPP}}
 
{{Proposal outcome|failed|3-4}}
===Allow Additional Parameter to Specify Where the File is Linked===
Specifically, I came across [[:File:Shiver Snowfield Mirrored.png]]. It has both {{tem|personal-file}} and {{tem|not-unused}} as tags. I couldn't find where the file was linked to. It looked abandoned. I tagged it with {{tem|delete}} anyways. {{user|Henry Tucayo Clay}} disagreed with my tag and promptly removed it. It got me thinking about having an additional parameter specifying where exactly the image is being used. Any image with {{tem|not-unused}} without specifying where the file is linked to is subject to an investigation where the file is being linked to. If nothing is found, the image <s>is subject to deletion</s> needs its last known owner to be alerted that the image needs action taken. Additionally, this parameter can be used to check if the image is still being URL-linked periodically. This should help people digging through [[Special:UnusedFiles]].
{{TPP}}
Specifically, I came across [[:File:Shiver Snowfield Mirrored.png]]. It has both {{tem|personal-image}} and {{tem|not-unused}} as tags. I couldn't find where the file was linked to. It looked abandoned. I tagged it with {{tem|delete}} anyways. {{user|Henry Tucayo Clay}} disagreed with my tag and promptly removed it. It got me thinking about having an additional parameter specifying where exactly the image is being used. Any image with {{tem|not-unused}} without specifying where the file is linked to is subject to an investigation where the file is being linked to. If nothing is found, the image <s>is subject to deletion</s> needs its last known owner to be alerted that the image needs action taken. Additionally, this parameter can be used to check if the image is still being URL-linked periodically. This should help people digging through [[Special:UnusedFiles]].


'''Proposer''': {{User|Wildgoosespeeder}}<br>
'''Proposer''': {{User|Wildgoosespeeder}}<br>
'''Deadline''': February 3, 2016, 23:59 GMT
'''Deadline''': February 3, 2016, 23:59 GMT


===Support===
====Support====
#{{User|Wildgoosespeeder}} Creator supports.
#{{User|Wildgoosespeeder}} Creator supports.
#{{User|Tucayo}} - Given the change of wording so that images with this template '''cannot''' and should '''never''' be deleted, I will support. We don't need to retroactively add this to every single, unused image but having a parameter for specifications (as most other image templates do) makes sense and could potentially make some maintenance tasks simpler.
#{{User|Tucayo}} - Given the change of wording so that images with this template '''cannot''' and should '''never''' be deleted, I will support. We don't need to retroactively add this to every single, unused image but having a parameter for specifications (as most other image templates do) makes sense and could potentially make some maintenance tasks simpler.
#{{User|Reboot}}. Daft NOT to have such a variable.


===Oppose===
====Oppose====
#{{User|Megadardery}} This is a too extreme approach to such a simple subject, especially considering that most if not all the Not-unused images are Userspace/Help/Policy/Shroom images, not related to the mainspace at all. The solution is far simpler, ''ignore'' the file and move on if you are clearing the [[Special:UnusedImages]].
#{{User|Megadardery}} This is a too extreme approach to such a simple subject, especially considering that most if not all the Not-unused images are Userspace/Help/Policy/Shroom images, not related to the mainspace at all. The solution is far simpler, ''ignore'' the file and move on if you are clearing the [[Special:UnusedImages]].
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per Megadardery, and per myself and Tucayo in the comments. This is unnecessary at best, detrimental at worst.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - Per Megadardery, and per myself and Tucayo in the comments. This is unnecessary at best, detrimental at worst.
#{{User|LudwigVon}} Per Megadardery and Walkazo.
#{{User|Roy Koopa}} Paer Walkazo and Dardery.


===Comments===
====Comments====
"''Any image with {{tem|not-unused}} without specifying where the file is linked to is subject to an investigation where the file is being linked to. If nothing is found, the image is subject to deletion.''" I can't agree with this part, sorry. I'd rather err on the safe side and keep the files than delete them just because we're not sure where they're being used. --{{User:Henry Tucayo Clay/sig}} 18:12, 20 January 2016 (EST)
"''Any image with {{tem|not-unused}} without specifying where the file is linked to is subject to an investigation where the file is being linked to. If nothing is found, the image is subject to deletion.''" I can't agree with this part, sorry. I'd rather err on the safe side and keep the files than delete them just because we're not sure where they're being used. --{{User:Henry Tucayo Clay/sig}} 18:12, 20 January 2016 (EST)
:It was inappropriate to mark someone's PI for deletion anyway: if {{tem|not-unused}} is being used in conjugation with ''any'' other image designation tag (Shroom, Awards, PI, MaroWiki, BJAODN, Template), then there's absolutely no reason to assume it's not legit (while ''actually'' suspect images should be dealt with on a case by case basis). The vast majority of the relatively small handful of images with the template are clearly Shroom backgrounds anyway, and so are found in the css rather than a given page, while others are awards images and will only be linked to externally on the forums. If the Shroom folks or whoever want to specify what issues special edition backgrounds are used for (for example), they can use {{tem|aboutfile}} or just type it into the Summary - either way, no need for an input in this template. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 18:36, 20 January 2016 (EST)
:It was inappropriate to mark someone's PI for deletion anyway: if {{tem|not-unused}} is being used in conjugation with ''any'' other image designation tag (Shroom, Awards, PI, MaroWiki, BJAODN, Template), then there's absolutely no reason to assume it's not legit (while ''actually'' suspect images should be dealt with on a case by case basis). The vast majority of the relatively small handful of images with the template are clearly Shroom backgrounds anyway, and so are found in the css rather than a given page, while others are awards images and will only be linked to externally on the forums. If the Shroom folks or whoever want to specify what issues special edition backgrounds are used for (for example), they can use {{tem|aboutfile}} or just type it into the Summary - either way, no need for an input in this template. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 18:36, 20 January 2016 (EST)
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So. As another ops who regularly deletes images, I don't think we really need a parameter or whatever. In the past, I've asked folks to please simply leave in the image description what or where the image is being used so I can check, if needs be, years down the road to see if the image is actually abandoned or not. This was the result of a some user a bunch of years ago bullshitting some CSS sheets together just so his images were linked on the wiki, when the actual goal was to use our image storage as his personal photobucket account for off-wiki things. We probably wouldn't have even noticed it if it wasn't for the fact that this users CSS sheet existed, but was unused. Since then, I ask for the courtesy of knowing what you plan to do with an image. -- [[User:Ghost Jam|Ghost Jam]][[Image:Shyghost.PNG]] 21:19, 21 January 2016 (EST)
So. As another ops who regularly deletes images, I don't think we really need a parameter or whatever. In the past, I've asked folks to please simply leave in the image description what or where the image is being used so I can check, if needs be, years down the road to see if the image is actually abandoned or not. This was the result of a some user a bunch of years ago bullshitting some CSS sheets together just so his images were linked on the wiki, when the actual goal was to use our image storage as his personal photobucket account for off-wiki things. We probably wouldn't have even noticed it if it wasn't for the fact that this users CSS sheet existed, but was unused. Since then, I ask for the courtesy of knowing what you plan to do with an image. -- [[User:Ghost Jam|Ghost Jam]][[Image:Shyghost.PNG]] 21:19, 21 January 2016 (EST)
:The power of templates and MediaWiki scripting, I think it is possible to place a category, such as a category with the name [[:Category:URL-linked files with unknown usage]] (maybe), kind of like how {{tem|aboutfile}} has [[:Category:Files with broken Aboutfile template]] if something is astray. --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 23:18, 21 January 2016 (EST)
:The power of templates and MediaWiki scripting, I think it is possible to place a category, such as a category with the name [[:Category:URL-linked images with unknown usage]] (maybe), kind of like how {{tem|aboutfile}} has [[:Category:Files with broken Aboutfile template]] if something is astray. --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 23:18, 21 January 2016 (EST)


:"when the actual goal was to use our image storage as his personal photobucket account for off-wiki things."
:"when the actual goal was to use our image storage as his personal photobucket account for off-wiki things."
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::To go off-topic, Photobucket, TinyPic, and ImageShack suck now. I prefer to use Imgur now. :P --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 01:05, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::To go off-topic, Photobucket, TinyPic, and ImageShack suck now. I prefer to use Imgur now. :P --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 01:05, 22 January 2016 (EST)


:::A specific "Category:URL-linked files with unknown usage" would be ''completely'' unnecessary: there are ''only 36 images'' in [[:Category:URL-linked files]], and just looking at them and/or their names (and in one case, looking at the summary on the file page) makes it painfully obvious that 30 of them are for the 'Shroom (mostly background images), with two more for the Awards, two more for the ex-subpage navigation templates, and then, ''only two mystery ones'', [[:File:Shiver Snowfield Mirrored.png|one of which is tagged as a PI]], so actually, that only leaves ''[[:File:Play Nintendo site.PNG|one unknown-usage image]]''. That does ''not'' require a category, just common sense and a pair of eyes. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 01:57, 22 January 2016 (EST)
:::A specific "Category:URL-linked images with unknown usage" would be ''completely'' unnecessary: there are ''only 36 images'' in [[:Category:URL-linked images]], and just looking at them and/or their names (and in one case, looking at the summary on the file page) makes it painfully obvious that 30 of them are for the 'Shroom (mostly background images), with two more for the Awards, two more for the ex-subpage navigation templates, and then, ''only two mystery ones'', [[:File:Shiver Snowfield Mirrored.png|one of which is tagged as a PI]], so actually, that only leaves ''[[:File:Play Nintendo site.PNG|one unknown-usage image]]''. That does ''not'' require a category, just common sense and a pair of eyes. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 01:57, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::::30/36 images 'Shroom images, and {{tem|shroom-image}} already has a warning that is also contained in {{tem|not-unused}}. That means only six images truly need {{tem|not-unused}}. It also possibly means that MarioWiki outgrew or never really needed {{tem|not-unused}}. Is it time to retire {{tem|not-unused}}? --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 02:03, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::::30/36 images 'Shroom images, and {{tem|shroom-image}} already has a warning that is also contained in {{tem|not-unused}}. That means only six images truly need {{tem|not-unused}}. It also possibly means that MarioWiki outgrew or never really needed {{tem|not-unused}}. Is it time to retire {{tem|not-unused}}? --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 02:03, 22 January 2016 (EST)
:::::Why? The shroom-image does not add the category of URL-linked files, and adding it is an overshot because not all shroom-images are unused, some are used in actual articles, and actually, that one unknown-usage image was recently added to the category by Wildgoosespeeder, so he probably knows where it is used. That leaves a whopping zero unknown-usage images--{{User:Megadardery/sig}} 04:32, 22 January 2016 (EST)
:::::Why? The shroom-image does not add the category of URL-linked images, and adding it is an overshot because not all shroom-images are unused, some are used in actual articles, and actually, that one unknown-usage image was recently added to the category by Wildgoosespeeder, so he probably knows where it is used. That leaves a whopping zero unknown-usage images--{{User:Megadardery/sig}} 04:32, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::::::I've been thinking about [[:Category:Shroom images]] and [[:Category:URL-linked files]] in relation to how [[Special:UnusedFiles]] works, which is even simpler than my archive page idea, but I am unsure if it would be appropriate to continue discussing it on {{user|Henry Tucayo Clay}}'s talk page because {{user|Walkazo}} is growing uneasy with my persistence with that subject. --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 04:43, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::::::I've been thinking about [[:Category:Shroom images]] and [[:Category:URL-linked images]] in relation to how [[Special:UnusedFiles]] works, which is even simpler than my archive page idea, but I am unsure if it would be appropriate to continue discussing it on {{user|Henry Tucayo Clay}}'s talk page because {{user|Walkazo}} is growing uneasy with my persistence with that subject. --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 04:43, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::::Just for reference, that unknown image is from [[Talk:Pluck Mole]]. [[User:Niiue|Niiue]] ([[User talk:Niiue|talk]]) 04:49, 22 January 2016 (EST)
:::::Okay, so it's being used as a ref, good to know, thanks (I was too pressed for time last night to check WhatLinksHere for it) - I added a summary to that effect on the image. Problem solved, yay. Which is exactly why this entire proposal is a waste of time: it's a non-issue that can easily be dealt with manually in the rare circumstance where the file names themselves don't tell you everything you need to know. This template has a specific purpose (to label and categorize all not-unused images, regardless of their specific usage, so they don't get deleted), and the Shroom template has a different specific purpose (to label and tag all Shroom images, regardless of ''their'' specific usage within the paper, so they don't get altered or deleted). While the latter has an extra line specifically addressing not-unused cases, that little bit of overlap is ''fine'' - there is nothing wrong with the Shroom folks wanting to emphasize that they don't want their images deleted: it's their right to put whatever they want on their template, and ''not your concern'', especially since the Shroom staff has specifically told you to butt out of their business on the whole matter already. Furthermore, there is nothing wrong with those images having both templates: the not-unused one adds the category (and don't even think of suggesting the Shroom template be given an optional function of adding the category itself - that's complicating a perfectly functional system), and it's used on non-Shroom images too, so it's not redundant (6 images is still not 0, and more may happen in the future, who knows). Nothing ''needs'' to be changed. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 12:55, 22 January 2016 (EST)
::::::As I continue to flag images for deletion, admins approve deletion, and the cache refreshes itself every 24-hours, I think 'Shroom images in [[Special:UnusedFiles]] are not ~40 but rather in the hundreds; my estimation is ~100-200. The idea I now have is to tell [[Special:UnusedFiles]] explicitly to skip images in [[:Category:Shroom images]] and [[:Category:URL-linked files]]. That way no archive pages need to be created and there is no interference with The 'Shroom Staff wishes and inner workings. Only problem is I don't know if that is possible. --{{User:Wildgoosespeeder/sig}} 15:26, 22 January 2016 (EST)
 
==Useless template?==
On the NIWA staff chat, I was advised that prefixing an image with Media: instead of File: will make it count as an use, and indeed, that trick works (see [[:File:Ko takeuchi twitter qa.png]]). While the URL-linked image category is worth keeping, doesn't this trick make the template itself useless? --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 13:51, 18 June 2016 (EDT)
:What about images only used in the css? Can they be prefixed with Media:? (like 'Shroom backgrounds) - {{User:Henry Tucayo Clay/sig}} 15:22, 18 June 2016 (EDT)
::Can you link me to one? --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 15:25, 18 June 2016 (EDT)
:::Pretty much all currently marked images, notable example being [[Media:Shiver Snowfield Mirrored.png]], for it is used on a user's monobook.<br>It is not possible to Media: CSS images, so this template doesn't get any less useless at all. {{User:Lakituthequick/sig}} 16:15, 18 June 2016 (EDT)
:::[[:File:Shroomflag.png]]. --{{User:Henry Tucayo Clay/sig}} 17:20, 18 June 2016 (EDT)
 
The simplest way of force-linking CSS images is just having a page ({{fake link|MarioWiki:CSS images}}?) with a <nowiki><gallery></nowiki> of all the CSS images on it... - [[User:Reboot|Reboot]] ([[User talk:Reboot|talk]]) 16:58, 18 June 2016 (EDT)
:I think that would be an additional thing to maintain. More troublesome than just having this template.--[[User:Megadardery|Megadardery]] ([[User talk:Megadardery|talk]]) 17:46, 18 June 2016 (EDT)

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