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| ==Split and Merge Article== | | ==Split and Merge Article== |
| {{Settled TPP}} | | {{SettledTPP}} |
| {{Proposal outcome|passed|0-9-1|split off information about generic yellow and blue Toads and merge them with [[Toad (species)]]}}
| | <span style="color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">SPLIT 9-1</span> |
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| {{Proposal outcome|failed|1-8|Yellow Toad (''New Super Mario Bros. Wii'')}}
| | <span style="color:red;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">YELLOW TOAD (NSMBW) 1-8</span> |
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| It cannot be assumed that just because a particular Toad is wearing yellow, that ''every'' Toad wearing yellow is the same individual. Prior to NSMBW, yellow Toads were simply generic background characters and had no real personality. Even the only personality-trait of the ''Super Mario Galaxy'' Yellow Toad, of being sleepy, is not found in this new Toad. This all suggests that they are different Toads that simply share a choice in clothing color. As it stands now, this article covers ''every'' appearance of a yellow Toad, regardless of whether they may be the same Toad or not. The article also covers yellow Toads "as a species", which is far too distinct a subject to cover on the same page; not to mention the different-colored Yoshi aren't considered different species, just variety. | | It cannot be assumed that just because a particular Toad is wearing yellow, that ''every'' Toad wearing yellow is the same individual. Prior to NSMBW, yellow Toads were simply generic background characters and had no real personality. Even the only personality-trait of the ''Super Mario Galaxy'' Yellow Toad, of being sleepy, is not found in this new Toad. This all suggests that they are different Toads that simply share a choice in clothing color. As it stands now, this article covers ''every'' appearance of a yellow Toad, regardless of whether they may be the same Toad or not. The article also covers yellow Toads "as a species", which is far too distinct a subject to cover on the same page; not to mention the different-colored Yoshi aren't considered different species, just variety. |
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| *The yellow Toad of NSMBW into a new article, covering only that particular Toad. His singular nature, differing personality, and lack of a group suggests he is a new character. Suggested article names are his development name, "Ala Gold", or simply "Yellow Toad (New Super Mario Bros. Wii)". | | *The yellow Toad of NSMBW into a new article, covering only that particular Toad. His singular nature, differing personality, and lack of a group suggests he is a new character. Suggested article names are his development name, "Ala Gold", or simply "Yellow Toad (New Super Mario Bros. Wii)". |
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| ''The outcome of this proposal will affect both this page and [[Blue Toad]], as the two concern nearly identical subject matter. As outlined [[Talk:Blue Toad#Split and Merge Article|here]], Blue Toad will be dealt with the same way as this article, with the information pertaining to the generic Blue Toads going on [[Toad (species)]] and [[Toad Brigade]], and info on the ''New Super Mario Bros. Wii'' character going on {{fake link|Blue Toad (New Super Mario Bros. Wii)}} or {{fake link|Bucken-Berry}} (its equivalent of "Ala-Gold").'' | | ''The outcome of this proposal will affect both this page and [[Blue Toad]], as the two concern nearly identical subject matter. As outlined [[Talk:Blue Toad#Split and Merge Article|here]], Blue Toad will be dealt with the same way as this article, with the information pertaining to the generic Blue Toads going on [[Toad (species)]] and [[Toad Brigade]], and info on the ''New Super Mario Bros. Wii'' character going on {{fakelink|Blue Toad (New Super Mario Bros. Wii)}} or {{fakelink|Bucken-Berry}} (its equivalent of "Ala-Gold").'' |
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| '''Proposer''': {{User|Redstar}}<br> | | '''Proposer''': {{User|Redstar}}<br> |
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| '''Three''' more days to vote. I'll be around then to close the proposal and make the appropriate changes per majority decision. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 16:21, 11 February 2010 (EST) | | '''Three''' more days to vote. I'll be around then to close the proposal and make the appropriate changes per majority decision. [[User:Redstar|Redstar]] 16:21, 11 February 2010 (EST) |
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| | EAT. I think that all of a Yellow Toad's individual appearances should be put in the Yellow Toad (character) page, and merge Yellow Toad from Super Mario Galaxy into Yellow Toad (character). Him from Super Mario Galaxy fled from Mushroom Kingdom into space, and came back, so he probably is the same Toad. As in Mario vs. Donkey Kong, too. And Super Mario 3D Land. And Super Mario Sunshine. By combining all these appearances, we get a very major character of the Mario Franchise. As for Blue Toad, his Super Mario Galaxy page should be merged with the New Super Mario Bros. Wii one, and add all the other appearances of a Blue Toad, like Sticker Star, Luigi's Mansion Dark Moon, etc and you have him as a very major character, too. We should make this proposal. Wed. Dec. 24th, 2014 |
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| ==Yellow Toad (NSMBW) or Ala-Gold???== | | ==Yellow Toad (NSMBW) or Ala-Gold???== |
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| They are the same Toads, every time. Maybe we should make a list of the appearances of Yellow Toad and Blue Toad. | | They are the same Toads, every time. Maybe we should make a list of the appearances of Yellow Toad and Blue Toad. |
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| Super Mario 3D Land, | | Super Mario 3D Land |
| Super Mario Sunshine, | | Super Mario Sunshine |
| Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon, | | Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon |
| Mario vs. Donkey Kong, | | Mario vs. Donkey Kong |
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| And probably even more! | | And probably even more! |
| {{unsigned|135.23.108.101}}
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| == Breaking the Fourth Wall? == | | == Breaking the Fourth Wall? == |
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| In Mario Party 9's Section of the Page [[Fourth wall]], It says that Yellow Toad talks to the player. Is it really Yellow Toad from NSMBW, that breaks the fourth wall? I may been late, but better late than never. [[Special:Contributions/180.254.185.30|180.254.185.30]] 21:16, 6 September 2014 (EDT) | | In Mario Party 9's Section of the Page [[Fourth wall]], It says that Yellow Toad talks to the player. Is it really Yellow Toad from NSMBW, that breaks the fourth wall? I may been late, but better late than never. [[Special:Contributions/180.254.185.30|180.254.185.30]] 21:16, 6 September 2014 (EDT) |
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| ==Yellow Toad (character)==
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| This is a bad identifier, as the other Yellow Toad is also a character. Also, this talk page is broken from it. See? It says just "Yellow Toad," which the talk button for "Yellow Toad (character)" redirects here. I'm saying this is a fine mess all around. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 01:40, 11 December 2017 (EST)
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| :I also ''highly'' doubt that "Ala-Gold" was a production name ''at all'', as that's just a [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XziLNeFm1ok mangled translation of Anakin Skywalker's name from English to Chinese and back]. (note some dialog is....vulgar. Ah, the beauty of nonsenically-bad translations!) [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 00:34, 19 February 2018 (EST)
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| :It is a bad identifier. The issue is what to change it to. I would suggest "(''New Super Mario Bros.'' series)" if it weren't for his ''[[Mario Party (series)|Mario Party]]'' appearances. A possible solution is to kill the identifier altogether (and Blue Toad's, for that matter). The current identifier already seems to imply that this Yellow Toad is more important, and he ''is'' a recurring playable character in the ''NSMB'' games while the [[Toad Brigade]] member is only ever a supporter. That's my excuse, anyway, since I can't think of an identifier that would work. {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 01:18, 19 February 2018 (EST)
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| To bring this back up, now that we have Super Mario Bros. Wonder, I'm in support of killing the identifier. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 06:21, August 20, 2023 (EDT)
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| :I also support killing the idenfier for here and Blue Toad's article. {{User:Ray Trace/sig}} 16:13, August 22, 2023 (EDT)
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| ==Voice==
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| This bit on the Pesonality-Section says the following:<br>
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| ''"In comparison to Blue Toad, Yellow Toad has a much higher pitched voice that is very much like the voice that the Yellow Toad of the Toad Brigade had in Super Mario Galaxy, who also sounded higher pitched in comparison to the other Toads in the game. '''However, the voices of Yellow Toad and Blue Toad were changed,''' with Blue Toad having a higher pitched voice while Yellow Toad has a lower pitched voice."''<br>
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| When were their pitches swapped? With NSMBU? With NSMBUDX?
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| -Definitely not Sascha
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| : Yeah, if both Toads are Samantha Kelley, you'd think they'd have the same voice. [[User:PrincessPeachFan|PrincessPeachFan]] ([[User talk:PrincessPeachFan|talk]]) 10:02, August 27, 2023 (EDT)
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| == Change or remove the identifier? ==
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| Continuing what Hewer and Ray Trace mentioned two sections above, but with its own section. This guy now appears in ''Wonder'' which is not part of the ''New Super Mario Bros.'' series, so him having that identifier doesn't really make much sense anymore. The problem is ''which'' identifier should he use now, if any. "Yellow Toad (character)" is an option, just as with [[Blue Toad (character)]]. This page was actually named like that before, but as you can see in the discussion above, it was changed because [[Yellow Toad (Toad Brigade)]] is also a character sharing the same name, so it kinda clashed. However, [[Yellow Toad (character)]] does redirect to this page, which makes me question why the page isn't named like that now. This page was also briefly named [[Yellow Toad (Super Mario series)]] once, which would actually include ''Wonder'' in it, but the Toad Brigade one is also a character in the ''Super Mario'' series, so it would still clash. "Yellow Toad (playable)" comes to my mind, but the Toad Brigade one is also playable in the Switch version of ''3D World''. Another option would be "Yellow Toad (main character)" which would probably fit, but I am not so sure.
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| And a more radical option, which was suggested above, is just to remove the identifier altogether (and to Blue Toad too). [[Yellow Toad]] and [[Blue Toad]] are disambiguations, but we could move those pages to "Yellow Toad (disambiguation)" and "Blue Toad (disambiguation)" I guess. This may end up making the clash with the yellow Toad Brigade member even bigger, so I am not so sure about that. Either way, both these Yellow and Blue Toads for sure are far more important than any other Toads of their respective colors in the franchise, so there is that argument. There is not another important blue Toad literally named "Blue Toad" it seems, and I don't know in where the yellow Toad Brigade one has been directly referred to as "Yellow Toad" in the first place.
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| This also gives me something to think about the Yoshis. If what makes these Yellow and Blue Toads get a page is them being important and having that proper name, I ''wonder'' if the Red, Yellow and Light-Blue Yoshis in ''Wonder'' are also eligible to have their own pages. I guess that the main difference is that the Toads have been properly established as characters in the franchise, with us ''knowing'' that they appear as main characters in three main series games, and even in at least one spin-off. With the Yoshis, we don't know if these three Yoshis are the same ones of their respective colors in other Yoshi games (unlike [[Yoshi|the main green one]] which we know is the same one in all of them, I think). These Red, Yellow and Light-Blue ones could even easily be the same ones that appear in ''Mario'' games, like ''World'', ''64 DS'', ''NSMBW'', ''NSMBU'' and ''Run'', but we don't know for sure, and they are left unnamed in most of those games anyhow (''Run'' does name them, with the green one being just "Yoshi", just as how ''Wonder'' does it). My main concern is that having the [[Super Mario Bros. Wonder#Playable characters|character list]] link to proper character pages for the Yellow and Blue Toads, but instead link to the Yoshi species page for the latter three Yoshis seems pretty weird, and I don't know if that may cause some problems. Plus, these three Yoshis are arguably more important than any other Yoshi in the franchise just behind the main green one because they are main protagonists in a mainline ''Mario'' game, but if we count this game as their only appearance, their pages would be pretty shallow and most probably pointless.
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| Back to the Toads, the current identifier for the Yellow one needs to be changed. Do we go back to character? Do we move it, probably alongside the Blue one, to another identifier? Or do we just remove the identifier in both? (Which, to be fair, can be compared to what is done with the [[Yoshi]] and [[Toad]] characters to some degree.) Just making this into a proper discussion before anything wild like a proposal or undisscused move happens. -[[User:Kirbeat|Kirbeat]] ([[User talk:Kirbeat|talk]]) 03:33, September 5, 2023 (EDT)
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| : Well, the blue and yellow Toads from the Toad Brigade are still fairly important (SMG, SMG2, CT: TT, SMO) whereas Yellow and Blue Toads just appeared in the NSMB games and the colored Yoshis are currently merged so the latter's a no go. Plus, the Blue and Yellow Toads from the Toad Brigade had distinct personalities, whereas the NSMB/SMBW Yellow and Blue Toads are literally just Toads with no other distinguishing characteristics. [[User:PrincessPeachFan|PrincessPeachFan]] ([[User talk:PrincessPeachFan|talk]]) 08:59, September 5, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::The thing is that the Yellow and Blue Toads from the ''NSMB'' games aren't exclusively part of the ''NSMB'' games anymore, as they appear in ''Wonder'' now, so their scope is bigger. They cannot be referred to as "the ones from ''NSMB''" now, they are more than that thanks to ''Wonder''. -[[User:Kirbeat|Kirbeat]] ([[User talk:Kirbeat|talk]]) 14:03, September 5, 2023 (EDT)
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| :::I don't think the identifier is inaccurate or misleading or too limted in its scope. He appeared in Super Mario Bros. Wonder, sure, but the identifier still gives correct impression that he's the Yellow Toad who originated in the series, but, given his appearance alongside the Blue Toad, is in a 2D Mario platformer that is a continuation of New Super Mario Bros., but without the "new" in the title. {{User:Mario/sig}} 19:43, September 5, 2023 (EDT)
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| :One way we could deal with the issue is to simply merge with Blue Toad and treat them as a duo, like we do with some ''WarioWare'' characters. They always appear together (Blue Toad only gets two extra sections to mention regular Toad using his color scheme, which is unnecessary, since the about template already takes care of that), share the same role in every game they appear in, and have no real distinguishing characteristics outside of their color. As a result, both articles have pretty much the same content (with entire sections being copied almost word-for-word), so we don't really lose anything by merging. Sidestepping the identifier issue is an added bonus. {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 12:10, September 12, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::Well that is an option. -[[User:Kirbeat|Kirbeat]] ([[User talk:Kirbeat|talk]]) 19:46, September 19, 2023 (EDT)
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