Editing Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl

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! align="center" | '''[[Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl|Super Smash Bros. Brawl Talk]]'''
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*'''[[Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Archive 1|Archive 1 (1-20)]]'''
*'''[[Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Archive 2|Archive 2 (21-56)]]'''
*'''[[Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Archive 3|Archive 3 (57-97)]]'''
*'''[[Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Archive 4|Archive 4 (98-144)]]'''
*'''[[Talk:Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Archive 5|Archive 5 (145-181)]]'''
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==Wat==
Why the heck is this article so huge?! It lags like a WIKIA page! Are all of those images necessary? [[User:HavocReaper48|HavocReaper48]] 23:22, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

This article needs to be huge because it is a Featured Article, and this article follows everything the Featured Articles needs, huge articles need to stay that way, etc. {{User:Ultramariologan/sig}}

:No, it's huge because there's a lot of info that needs to be covered. Being large isn't actually an FA requirement: as long as the article's not ''tiny'', it's the quality that matters, not the quantity. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 16:09, 18 April 2011 (EDT)

==Split==
{{SettledTPP}}
<span style="color:gray;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">DELETED</span>

I say we split the music staff and voice cast sections into separate, respectful sub-articles, just like the staff and soundtracks. One reason, this article is ENORMOUS and we need to down size it a bit.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Zero777}}<br>
'''Deadline''': April 17, 2011, 23:59 GMT

===Support===
#{{User|Zero777}} Per proposal
#{{User|Reddragon19k}} Per Zero! A great proposal and a nice one too so, split and per him!
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per proposal.
#{{User|Nicke8}} Per Zero.
#{{User|Iggykoopa}} Per Zero
#{{User|Pokémon Trainer Mario}} It's large and the article can make peoples browsers refresh.
#{{User|SWFlash}} It's how every page made.
#{{User|UltraMario3000}} Per the seven-hundred seventy seven number zeros.

===Oppose===
#{{User|Kaptain K. Rool}} - They are both a part of the cast.

===Comment===
:That will be awesome if we split this article, let's do it![[User:Reddragon19k|Reddragon19k]] 10:31, 3 April 2011 (EDT)
::There is already a main article with everything. Let's just delete that section. {{User:Bowser's luma/sig}}
:::Are you crazy. That is part of the information of SSBB, not only the game play. {{User|Zero777}}

The deadline was wrong: this was proposed on April 3rd GMT, so it ends on the 17th at 23:59 GMT. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 23:02, 4 April 2011 (EDT)
:This scheduling is too confusing. {{User|Zero777}}
::Really? All you need to do is find the time in GMT (which for you I heard you mention is +8 hours for you) then check the date. Go forward two weeks from that date and end at 23:59 or 24:00 GMT. Rule 2 on the proposal page can be a little confusing, I had to read it a few times before I got what it was saying.  {{User:Bop1996/sig}} 10:34, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
:::I just have my date and time preferences set to the server default and look at RecentChanges to keep track of what time it is in GMT. For the deadline, I just look at a calendar and go straight down the day column two weeks; adding 14 days to the date also works if you're not crossing into another month (in this case, 3 + 14 = 17). The only potentially confusing part of Rule 2 (imho) is the stuff about rounding the voting start time, which doesn't apply to TPPs. I added specific dates to the Rule 2 example to try and make it a bit better, and I added a deadline example to TPP Rule 3 too. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 11:13, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
::::That works too, my point with Rule 2 is that people seem to have a hard time applying the differences between their time and GMT. Most of the incorrect end times seem to be because people forget to convert to GMT... I think I saw a place on the wiki that listed the differences between GMT and other time zones, maybe a link to that page would help. {{User:Bop1996/sig}} 13:09, 7 April 2011 (EDT)
:::::I think that would be a good idea, though I have one question: Why does the wiki use GMT in the first place? {{User:Mario4Ever/Sig}} 03:23, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
::::::I think it's because of the time facility in Greenwich, England. They count the Earth's rotation and it's supposed to be extremely accurate. I'm not really the person to ask this, as I never cared until I came to the wiki and ''had'' to care. {{User:Bop1996/sig}} 09:12, 8 April 2011 (EDT)
:::::::No, it's because we're an International wiki, and GMT is the standard one used all over the world (hence it's the server default); we used to use EST/EDT, but that was considered too America-centric (and daylight savings time muddled the issue pretty badly). [[MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive_19#Use_GMT_for_all_events.2C_deadlines.2C_and_dates|Here's the proposal that had is start using GMT.]] We use one time zone to regulate when voting ends so proposals don't randomly disappear all the time and confuse people; [http://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=MarioWiki:Proposals&oldid=176679 that's how it's always been done]. As for people having trouble converting to GMT, it's not complicated ''at all'': just memorize how many hours are added or removed for your time zone. For me, EST is GMT-5; the only confusing bit is when we switch to EDT, which is GMT-4, but that's why I've got my preferences set to GMT - to double-check times if I'm ever a bit unsure of myself. Daylight savings time issues aside, asking people to memorize ''one'' addition or subtraction equation is ''not'' unreasonable, and folks can just Google search "GMT" to find out their time zone's offset (the first website is a conversion page, the first image result is a map, etc.), so we shouldn't even need a page of conversions here. We ''could'' always link to one of the many Wikipedia articles dealing with time zones, tho; [[wikipedia:List_of_time_zone_abbreviations|this one]] has a nice chart, for example, and [[wikipedia:List_of_time_zones_by_UTC_offset|this]] has a map, although you need to view it at full resolution in order to read it. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 10:12, 8 April 2011 (EDT)

'''@Kaptain K. Rool:''' Yeah, I know they are part of the cast. What is the point you're trying to make. {{User|Zero777}}
:That they are both a part of he cast and we don't need two separate articles about the cast. {{User|Kaptain K. Rool}}
::He's referring to [[List of Super Smash Bros. Brawl staff|Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Staff]] and your proposed new article I think. {{User:Bowser's luma/sig}}

I was trying to make a point but his idea is better.

Is it possible for me to make changes to the proposal and to strike out everybody's vote until they revert their's for fairness? {{User|Zero777}}
:I'm not sure, the three day period where you are allowed to edit your proposal is up. You could ask for the proposal to be cancelled and then relist it according to how you want to change it, or you could ask a sysop what you should do... {{User|Bop1996}}
::Alright, '''may a staff delete this.''' {{User|Zero777}}
:::Done. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 18:10, 15 April 2011 (EDT)

==Merge==
{{SettledTPP}}
<span style="color:green;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">Split from Super Smash Bros. Brawl/Merge into staff sub-articles 7-0</span>

I say we split the music staff and voice cast sections and merge them into the staff sub-articles. One reason, this article is ENORMOUS and we need to down size it a bit, and also it seems like the proposal to merge the Subspace Emissary back into the article looks like it is going to succeed and it will make the article enormous-er.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Zero777}}<br>
'''Deadline''': May 1, 2011, 23:59 GMT

===Support===
#{{User|Zero777}} Per proposal
#{{User|Reddragon19k}} Zero is right ! Let's per him and merge!
#{{User|SWFlash}} Per propser.
#{{User|Nicke8}} Per proposer.
#{{User|UltraMario3000}} Per 0777.
#{{User|Walkazo}} - It would make the most sense to have the staff all in one place.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per Walkazo.

===Oppose===

===Comment===
Wouldn't it be better to put the music staff with the rest of the staff? The article's current segregation and placement of those folks seems rather silly to begin with... - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 14:26, 17 April 2011 (EDT)
:@Zero: You'd better change the proposal now, unless you want the proposal removed '''again''' and to re-list it... By April 32, did you mean May 2? I must've missed the universal calendar changes... {{User:Bop1996/sig}} 14:56, 17 April 2011 (EDT)
::I actually changed the deadline to May 1. Using 24:00 [[wikipedia:24-hour_clock#Midnight_00:00_and_24:00|''should'' be perfectly fine]], but if folks are going to keep changing it to 0:00 the next day (which is NOT allowed, as it messes up the nice +14 days motif), it's best to simply use 23:59. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 15:48, 18 April 2011 (EDT)

I say we merge all of the subspace emissary levels into one article kirby9612

== I'm upset with the way the merge was handled. ==

I've been gone from this wiki for quite a while, and I was surprised at what I found on the SSBB staff list page when I got back. I am disappointed by how the merge happened, specifically with how [[User:Walkazo|Walkazo]] handled it. This is not a "merge". This is basically just overwriting all of the work I did in compiling a list of the game's arrangers. You practically copied from the official Dojo website, which leaves out a lot of the arrangement credits. The only things you added to my original list (which is still in the page history) was the names of performers. But you also added in arrangers who were already covered in the "Music and Sound" section of the credits as they actually appear in the game on your TV screen.

For example: Kentaro Ishizaka, who was credited as one of the "Music and Sound" individuals in the credits, also arranged twelve songs, if one searches through the sound test. In the big honkin' table that was dropped on this page, Ishizaka is only listed as the "arrangement supervisor" (a term I disfavor to "arranger" or "arranged by") of two songs: "Waluigi Pinball" and "Famicon Grand Prix II: 3D Hot Rally - Title". That leaves out all his work on songs like "Corneria" and "You Call This a Utopia?!"! Then again, Ishizaka's arrangement credits were already listed by me in the "Music and Sound" section.

The original intent of the "Music Arrangement" section was to list things exactly as they were in the original, on-your-TV credits. Isn't that the point of any "/Staff" article? List the credits as they appear on screen in the same order? That's what I was trying to do with this page when I created it six months ago (with help from someone's YouTube copy of the credits). I just added in more information by my own research that made the page more useful.

In the end, I think a "merge" could be completed much better if we were to leave the "Music and Sound" section alone, and list the names in the "Music Arrangement" section in the same order that they appear in the game. List only those names, plus the performers (like James Cowan and Emily McIntosh, for example), and leave the "Music and Sound" names out of the "Music Arrangement" names. That's just my <strike>two</strike> fifty cents.

Oh! Just thought of something. The people who performed vocally on the songs should be listed under the voices, not the music arrangement credits, following the example set here: http://www.ssbwiki.com/List_of_voice_actors -[[User:Dogman15|Dogman15]] 20:19, 1 July 2011 (EDT)

== wtf ==

My PC displays erroneously the images with some wacky and funny effects such as:
#The pic of Groudon is a Trampoline.
#The entire Subspace map is a soccerball, (BJAODN forward) '''suggesting that upon a time the entire Subspace was a soccerball'''. Pretty interesting.
#The Kongs' emblem is Bowser. '''IT'S SO FREAKIN' GENIUS'''.
#The SSBB Battlefield is Sonic. '''From today everyone can now battle over Sonic'''!
#The Halberd is the Mushroomy Kingdom. '''Did there was a fatal merge error somewhere?!'''
#Barrels are Wii Remotes. '''How can I throw my Wii Remote on the screen and assisting its transformation'''?
#The Super Mushroom is now a Stock Ball. '''Wow, now I can get both an extra life and more power!'''
#The Samurai Goroh is smoke. '''BREAKING NEWS!!! The Samurai Goroh has now the power to turn into colored smoke!!!'''
And more! The text in bold is sarcastic opinion.
--[[User:Super Famicom 64|Super Famicom 64]] 16:59, 25 February 2012 (EST)

== View, copy, re-elaborate… ==

[http://www.mariocastle.it/wiki/Super_Smash_Bros._Brawl This page from the italian MarioWiki] has copied our table design. It has even copied our way to represent a character's series origin! --{{User:MarioSmasher/sig}} 10:22, 19 April 2012 (EDT)

== Early Game Over Music ==

About 1 out of 4 times when I get a Game Over in Subspace Emissionary, the music plays ''before'' the trophies hit the ground. Could anyone explain why this is? Please?

{{User:Electrical Bowser jr./sig}}

== Remove/Change website link? ==

The link to the dojo now directs you to the Smash Bros. 4 website. I think this should either be removed, or changed to one of the existing site pages. --<big>'''{{color|-|blue}}[[User:Skittles|{{color|Sk|red}}]][[User talk:Skittles|{{color|it|darkorange}}]][[Special:Random|{{color|tl|green}}]][[Special:MyPage|{{color|es|purple}}]]'''</big>
:Since it no longer covers Brawl, I recommend removing the link and adding a section about it to the article itself. [[User:Tacopill|Tacopill]] ([[User talk:Tacopill|talk]]) 18:47, 25 June 2013 (EDT)

== Fun Fact: DELETE!!!!!! ==

When you want to delete ALL of your data, the game will ask you 3 times if you are sure.

First Time: Are you sure your want to erase data? (Erased data cannot be recovered.)

Second Time: Absoluetly sure? (No erased date can be recovered.)

Final Time: Really? (You will lose it FOREVER!)

== Music Links? ==

Something I noticed was that there were only links for a few of the songs (one or two per stage). Is this simply because the site being linked to only has those songs? If so, we could just edit in links to YouTube videos that have each song. Just seems like something to make the article a bit more user-friendly. [[User:Kathogenia|Kathogenia]] ([[User talk:Kathogenia|talk]]) 02:00, 20 January 2014 (EST)
:Maybe....{{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 02:03, 20 January 2014 (EST)

==Move The Subspace Emissary to a separate page==
{{SettledTPP}}
<span style="color:gray;font-family:Comic Sans MS;font-size:150%">CANCELED BY PROPOSER</span>

[[Super Smash Bros. Brawl#Subspace Emissary|The Subspace Emissary section]] is overly too long. Maybe we need to move that to a separate page and name that [[The Subspace Emissary]].

'''Proposer''': {{User|Pinkie Pie}}<br>
'''Deadline''': March 1, 2014 23:59 GMT.

====Support====
#{{User|Pinkie Pie}} Per proposal
#{{User|Baby Luigi}} I have to agree with this proposal for a variety of reasons. One, unlike other game modes, this is a pretty damn huge game mode. It's practically its own thing and it even gets its own sections of enemies in there. Having the Subspace Emissary, a huge complex deep mode in an article that's already quite extensive enough is overkill for me. It's the same reason I [[Super Duel Mode|made]] the Super Duel Mode article by itself rather than having it cluttered on the Mario Party 5 article. [[Coin Rush]], [[Boost Rush]], and some other modes also have their own articles too because they're quite detailed, deep, and very complex gameplay. This isn't some optional side mode like Battle Mode or Time Trials or Extras mode, it's a full on complex own thing that I feel should deserve its own article. I wouldn't completely move it to its own page, but we could leave a short section for it in the Brawl article. I think making an article focused on the Subspace Emissary is a good move and it should rightfully deserve its own page, unlike Adventure mode from Melee.
#{{User|Yoshi K}} I have to agree with the above, because of all the other game modes that have their own page. I think The Subspace Emissary is in a similar situation as the game modes mentioned above.

====Oppose====
#{{User|Time Turner}} [[Talk:Subspace_Emissary#Merge_to_Super_Smash_Bros._Brawl|This]] is the proposal that originally merged the Subspace with this article, and I agree wholeheartedly with it. The solution really shouldn't be to split the Subspace Emissary simply due to its length. Yes, it is overly long, but if the problem lies in the fact that it's long, then maybe we should try to not make it long? Besides the length, what exactly warrants for this section to be split? It's very distinctly a mode of Super Smash Bros. Brawl, which would mean that splitting it would be inconsistent (as per [[Talk:Adventure_Tours#Merge_to_Mario_.26_Sonic_at_the_Olympic_Winter_Games|other]] proposals who merged modes). Also, the Subspace Emissary section, despite being overwhelmingly and unnecessarily long, is poorly written. There is an excellent reason for why it has that rewrite template, with lines like "On the verge of tears, while all alone," and "As Diddy stares in fear and awe," (are we writing an article or a novel?) really accentuating why it's bad. Simply put, we shouldn't just send the info off to another article; it's like we're just shoving the problem in a corner and saying, "Nope, nothing wrong here." What we ''should'' do is work to shorten, trim, and improve what's already there. Besides, if this did get split, I'd advocate for it to be deleted just because of how badly written it is.
#{{User|Randombob-omb4761}} Per Time Turner
#{{User|SuperYoshiBros}} Per Time Turner. This is like moving the History section of Mario's page to another page because it's too long.
#{{User|SeanWheeler}} Per Time Turner. Crossover games like Super Smash Bros. shouldn't get more special treatment than mainstream Mario games. If you want the Subspace Emissary with its own article, see Smash Wiki.
#{{User|Mario4Ever}} Per Time Turner.

====Comments====
Holy constipated shit god, that plot section! Please, somebody has to reduce the writing; this is just literally too much. Once this is considered, then we can find out if there is enough information to give it a separate article. It does have its own sets of bosses and enemies, plus, a really dumb plot, though. {{User:Mario/sig}} 23:14, 15 February 2014 (EST)

Could I cancel this proposal? {{User|Pinkie Pie}} 20:48, 17 February 2014 (EST)
:The option is always available. {{User|Time Turner}}