Editing Talk:Snake (Yoshi's Story)

==Air snake==
I'd say move this to "Air snake", the species notation is more than a bit misleading. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 18:17, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:I see no reason ''not'' to move it. {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 18:24, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::I'll probably draw up a proposal within the next few days. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 18:35, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:::I don't think that's necessary. There is no reason to use a less specific, more generic name that requires an identifier over one that doesn't, especially since they're from the same source. {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 18:46, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::That's my rationale as well. Still, the proposal process exists for a reason, so I may as well. There's always that nonzero chance someone makes a compelling argument, as much as I may think otherwise. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 18:49, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::::I agree with moving it, '''but''' am curious over their exact textual descriptions from the Player's Guide. Especially since [[Snake (Mario Clash)|two]] [[Snake (Wario Land 3)|other]] "snake" species exist, being enemies notwithstanding. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 18:50, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:::::Agreed, "Generic name (identifier)" should be avoided if there's a better name. Though "Snake" is in-game, if I'm remembering correctly. {{User:TheDarkStar/sig}} 18:52, September 5, 2019 (EDT)

You should not may a proposal. Proposals are only for when there is a '''large''' disagreement or potential for one, however in this case moving the page is the objectively best option. Given the '''tiny''' chance for disagreement, a proposal would be a waste of time. Also, I agree with moving. {{User:Doomhiker/sig}} 18:53, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:"Snake" is in-game. Source priority dictates that in-game names trump website names. {{User:TheDarkStar/sig}} 18:54, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::Is it capitalized or lowercase? (Context would also be nice.) Also, don't forget that a lot ''Super Mario 64'' mission names used similar generic terms. {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 19:03, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:::[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0No4wuVuM&t=33s Here it is]. "Snake" isn't capitalized, but it's still in-game. {{User:TheDarkStar/sig}} 19:09, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::::It could be generically referring to it as a snake without a proper name. {{User:Obsessive Mario Fan/sig}} 19:23, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:::::My thoughts exactly. Reminds me of how [[Dorrie]] is called a "sea dragon" by a sign in Hazy Maze Cave, and even that is less generic than "snake." {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 19:27, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::::::Exactly, it's what I based my proposal to move [[Chill Bully]] back from "Bully (Snowman's Land)." Things like "[[Klepto|big bird]]" and "[[Ukiki|monkey]]" are in-game, but that alone doesn't make them names. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 19:33, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
:::::::I forgot about the Message Block, so here's the [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njE9UHNBCSA&t=1m44s Japanese equivalent] - and you can see that they use the name 「ヘビリン」 in its place. Seems it's snake. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 12:53, September 6, 2019 (EDT)
::And there's the legit grounds for disagreement, thus justifying my instinct to go with a proposal. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 20:36, September 5, 2019 (EDT)
::I'm not sure. It's also not a proper name, but i don't necessarily disagree with it. --{{User:FanOfYoshi/sig}} 06:43, September 6, 2019 (EDT)

I'm for moving it. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 10:56, September 6, 2019 (EDT)

==Rename this page to a more descriptive term==
{{TPP}}
As indicated above, I consider '''Snake (species)''' to be a generic and unhelpfully vague identifier, specifically one that reads like it's most appropriate for a disambiguation, considering the amount of snakes and snake-like creatures that appear in the series. I proposed moving this page to '''"air snake"''' on the basis that it was the "next-closest" name that came from an official source, and one that sounded a bit more 'memorable' to the average reader than just "snake".

However, I am also aware that the wiki has a rule regarding source priority - specifically, that names used in-game are preferred over other sources such as official websites. In light of that, I considered a third option: "Snake (platform)", which at least still solves the "name is too vague" problem I intended to address, while not sounding nearly as snappy in my honest opinion. This is not to say that I would object at all to this name being selected - merely that I like the first option ''slightly'' more. I am, of course, still curious to see how other people weigh in on this matter. With that all in mind, I may as well make the matter official, for lack of a better word.

'''UPDATE''': After being made aware of a third potentially good name and the fact that I could still edit this (which shows you how often I've done this, ahaha), I've added '''Snake (Yoshi's Story)''' to the list of options per Seven and Doc's suggestions, so if anyone wanted to change their votes, then here you go. Hopefully this'll be the last such blunder from me and we can get this resolved!

'''Proposer''': {{User|Lord Grammaticus}}<br>
'''Deadline''': September 22, 2019, 23:59 GMT

===Move to "{{fake link|Air snake}}"===
#{{User|Lord Grammaticus}} Per the proposal.
#{{User|Niiue}} Per proposal.
#{{user|7feetunder}} Snake = generic term, not a name. "Air snake" is more descriptive and removes the need for an identifier. The usage of similar generic terms in-game as described in many of the comments above this proposal further supports this.
#{{User|Obsessive Mario Fan}} Per all, especially 7feetunder.
<s>#{{User|FanOfYoshi}} Second option, even though it's still not a proper name.</s>

===Move to "{{fake link|Snake (platform)}}"===
#{{User|Lord Grammaticus}} Also per the proposal.
#{{User|FanOfYoshi}} Best option.
#{{User|LinkTheLefty}} As mentioned above, the English name is [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0No4wuVuM&t=33s in-game] and it has a [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njE9UHNBCSA&t=1m44s Japanese equivalent] - showing that the translators consciously went with the generic snake name when the text opted for a unique ''Hebirin'' one. Therefore, air snake seems to be a fluke of the [https://web.archive.org/web/19991115034511/http://www.yoshisstory.com/3-1.html website] (note that it first refers to them as air snakes but then switches to snakes).
#{{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} The website is like Shakespeare; it makes things up as it goes so it will fit in with its rhyme rhythm, and as such isn't a better source than the guide by any means.
#{{User|TheDarkStar}} Per all.

===Move to "{{fake link|Snake (Yoshi's Story)}}"===
#{{User|Lord Grammaticus}} As with the previous two.

===Do Nothing===

===Comments===
"Snake (platform)" makes it sounds like an inanimate object. In the absence of anything better, we could just use "Yoshi's Story" as an identifier since it only appears in that game. Though I'm voting for "air snake" anyway. {{User:7feetunder/sig}} 03:20, September 8, 2019 (EDT)

:I'm thoroughly irritated that didn't occur to me before I made this. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 12:46, September 8, 2019 (EDT)
::You can do that now...? 'sides, the Wario Land 3 one also acts as a platform, 'course. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 13:24, September 9, 2019 (EDT)
:::I honestly had no idea. I'll talk to an admin about it. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 23:29, September 9, 2019 (EDT)

There, the proposal has been updated, and all voters will be informed shortly. --{{User:Lord Grammaticus/sig}} 00:00, September 10, 2019 (EDT)
@@ Line 22: / Line 22: @@
 ==Rename this page to a more descriptive term==
-{{settled TPP}}
+{{TPP}}
-{{proposal outcome|passed|4-2-9-0|Rename to Snake (''Yoshi's Story'')}}
 As indicated above, I consider '''Snake (species)''' to be a generic and unhelpfully vague identifier, specifically one that reads like it's most appropriate for a disambiguation, considering the amount of snakes and snake-like creatures that appear in the series. I proposed moving this page to '''"air snake"''' on the basis that it was the "next-closest" name that came from an official source, and one that sounded a bit more 'memorable' to the average reader than just "snake".
-However, I am also aware that the wiki has a rule regarding source priority - specifically, that names used in-game are preferred over other sources such as official websites. In light of that, I considered a third option: "'''Snake (platform)'''", which at least still solves the "name is too vague" problem I intended to address, while not sounding nearly as snappy in my honest opinion. This is not to say that I would object at all to this name being selected - merely that I like the first option ''slightly'' more. I am, of course, still curious to see how other people weigh in on this matter. With that all in mind, I may as well make the matter official, for lack of a better word.
+However, I am also aware that the wiki has a rule regarding source priority - specifically, that names used in-game are preferred over other sources such as official websites. In light of that, I considered a third option: "Snake (platform)", which at least still solves the "name is too vague" problem I intended to address, while not sounding nearly as snappy in my honest opinion. This is not to say that I would object at all to this name being selected - merely that I like the first option ''slightly'' more. I am, of course, still curious to see how other people weigh in on this matter. With that all in mind, I may as well make the matter official, for lack of a better word.
 '''UPDATE''': After being made aware of a third potentially good name and the fact that I could still edit this (which shows you how often I've done this, ahaha), I've added '''Snake (Yoshi's Story)''' to the list of options per Seven and Doc's suggestions, so if anyone wanted to change their votes, then here you go. Hopefully this'll be the last such blunder from me and we can get this resolved!
@@ Line 43: / Line 42: @@
 #{{User|Lord Grammaticus}} Also per the proposal.
 #{{User|FanOfYoshi}} Best option.
-<s>#{{User|LinkTheLefty}} As mentioned above, the English name is [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0No4wuVuM&t=33s in-game] and it has a [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njE9UHNBCSA&t=1m44s Japanese equivalent] - showing that the translators consciously went with the generic snake name when the text opted for a unique ''Hebirin'' one. Therefore, air snake seems to be a fluke of the [https://web.archive.org/web/19991115034511/http://www.yoshisstory.com/3-1.html website] (note that it first refers to them as air snakes but then switches to snakes).</s><br>
+#{{User|LinkTheLefty}} As mentioned above, the English name is [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bv0No4wuVuM&t=33s in-game] and it has a [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njE9UHNBCSA&t=1m44s Japanese equivalent] - showing that the translators consciously went with the generic snake name when the text opted for a unique ''Hebirin'' one. Therefore, air snake seems to be a fluke of the [https://web.archive.org/web/19991115034511/http://www.yoshisstory.com/3-1.html website] (note that it first refers to them as air snakes but then switches to snakes).
-<s>#{{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} The website is like Shakespeare; it makes things up as it goes so it will fit in with its rhyme rhythm, and as such isn't a better source than the guide by any means.</s><br>
+#{{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} The website is like Shakespeare; it makes things up as it goes so it will fit in with its rhyme rhythm, and as such isn't a better source than the guide by any means.
-<s>#{{User|TheDarkStar}} Per all.</s>
+#{{User|TheDarkStar}} Per all.
 ===Move to "{{fake link|Snake (Yoshi's Story)}}"===
 #{{User|Lord Grammaticus}} As with the previous two.
-#{{User|TheDarkStar}} - Seems like the best name out of all of them.
-#[[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) Honestly, what you ''should'' have done is just changed the identifier in the last option, especially since, as I said, ''the Wario Land 3 snakes are also platforms''. It truly boggles the mind how many people haven't played that.
-#{{User|FanOfYoshi}} An alternative.
-#{{User|LinkTheLefty}} Per my previous vote but taking ''Wario Land 3'' into account (last I checked, the article was still called "Giant Snake" with an identifier).
-#{{User|Power Flotzo}} Per all.
-#{{User|MarioManiac1981}} This seems like the best way to go about it. Per all.
-#{{User|Toadette the Achiever}} Clearly the best option available, per all.
-#{{User|Tails777}} Per all.
 ===Do Nothing===