Editing Talk:Red POW Block

== Would POW Blocks in ''Mario + Rabbids Sparks of Hope'' count as Red POW Blocks? ==

[[POW Block]]s in ''[[Mario + Rabbids Sparks of Hope]]'' have small explosions just like Red POW Blocks. The icon of it looks red as well! [[File:POW Block icon MRSOH.png|70px]]

Should coverage of the POW Blocks in the game be moved onto this page? {{User:Sparks/sig}} 19:04 (EST), October 14, 2023

== Consider the POW Block item in ''Mario + Rabbids Sparks of Hope'' to be a Red POW Block ==
{{TPP}}
In ''Mario + Rabbids Sparks of Hope'', there is a POW Block item. It allows a hero to carry it and throw it in front of them, dealing damage to enemies and cover in a small radius around it upon impact. Additionally, the item also resembles a Red POW Block! Have a look!
[[File:POW Block icon MRSOH.png|25px|left]]

The issue though, is that the game simply describes it as a POW Block, not a red one. It looks and functions exactly like a Red POW Block, so I'm creating this proposal to have the information for the item here instead of the POW Block article.

'''UPDATE:''' Here is a GIF of the POW Block item.
[[File:MRSOH POW Block item.gif|thumb|left]]
{{br}}

'''Proposer''': {{User|Sparks}}<br>
'''Deadline''': March 12, 2025, 23:59 GMT

===Merge! (Support)===
#{{User|Sparks}} Per POWposal!
#{{User|Camwoodstock}} For us, the use animation really seals it. A visible shockwave in a small, circular radius bursting out before visibly tapering off on-screen, with a shake effect concentrated on the impact, rather than jostling the entire screen evenly. While yes, the ordinary POW Block functions differently based on game, the "fixed area of effect based on radius, rather than what's on screen" is a distinctly Red POW Block mechanism.
#{{User|PopitTart}} The designs of POW Blocks and Red POW Blocks had certainly been standardized by the time M+R came out, yet they chose to use a red and yellow design that happens to correspond with its short-range function.
#{{User|Rykitu}} Per all
#{{User|Kirby the Formling}} It looks and function's like a Red POW Block. It should be merged with Red POW Block page.
#{{User|EvieMaybe}} it's red and it has a limited range. i think that matters more than its name, especially since M+R doesn't really have a reason to specifically call it a Red POW Block cuz it doesn't have blue POWs
#{{User|Pizza Master}} Per all

===Oppose===
#{{User|Hewer}} If it's both the only POW Block in the game and is named simply "POW Block", I lean towards no. As the Red POW Block page explains, "there have been instances of regular POW Blocks being colored red in some games". For example, fellow RPG series [[POW Block#Paper Mario series|Paper Mario]] also has POW Blocks that are red and damage multiple enemies. I'm also not sure what you mean when you say it "functions exactly like a Red POW Block", considering all the Red POW Block appearances currently on the page are in platformers.
#{{User|PrincessPeachFan}}: I'm with Hewer. Why should we consider it a Red POW Block if it's explicitly called POW Block?
===Comments===
In the discussion from before the proposal, when you say the POW Block in ''SoH'' has a "small explosion", do you mean it happens in a visibly finite radius a-la the Red POW blocks in the 2D platformers, and are there weapons/items in ''SoH'' that happen board-wide to contrast this with? We're not very familiar with the ''+ Rabbids'' games. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 19:24, February 26, 2025 (EST)
:The POW Blocks have a visible range and are very comparable to Red POW blocks. Normal POW Blocks usually affect the entire screen. Let me upload a GIF to showcase this. {{User:Sparks/sig}} 19:36, February 26, 2025 (EST)
:I've admittedly only played the first Mario + Rabbids game, but I personally feel like the explosion thing is more of a translation of the standard POW Block function of POWing into a completely different genre. I'm not sure how a weapon affecting the whole screen would work in these games, especially since what's on the screen would depend on the camera angle, which is a factor that doesn't need to be considered in a 2D platformer. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 03:03, February 27, 2025 (EST)
::With what we know of the ''& Rabbids'' games, we assume a "full screen" weapon would likely be translated into a "full board" effect, rather than being made into a very finite radius; after all, a finite radius is moreso a Red POW Block thing. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 03:09, February 27, 2025 (EST)
:::''Mario Kart Wii'' previously adapted the blue POW Block to a game with a freeform camera angle by making it a full course effect. I think they certainly could have done the same here.--[[User:PopitTart|PopitTart]] ([[User talk:PopitTart|talk]]) 03:27, February 27, 2025 (EST)
::::I mean, that game is still also a totally different genre (and made by different developers who came up with different ideas). Anyway, the most convincing point to me is it not being called a Red POW Block. Why didn't they call it that if that's what it was meant to be? NSMB2 also only featured the Red variety, and that game called it by its name. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 03:35, February 27, 2025 (EST)

Might be worth noting that the [[:File:MRKB sd chest13.jpg|giant decorative POW Block]] in ''Kingdom Battle'' is also red. Nintendo otherwise has mostly stuck to blue POW Blocks since the Wii era. --{{User:Waluigi Time/sig}} 21:57, February 26, 2025 (EST)

I'm with Hewer. Why think it's a Red POW Block if 1. It's just called POW Block '''in-game''' and 2. Pow Blocks have been colored red without featuring their unique effects? [[User:PrincessPeachFan|PrincessPeachFan]] ([[User talk:PrincessPeachFan|talk]]) 11:08, February 27, 2025 (EST)
:The last time an ordinary POW Block has been colored red without being a Red POW Block (sans remakes, of course, since otherwise the ''TTYD'' remake would qualify) would be... ''[[Mario Clock]]'', which was back in ''2009''. They've been AWOL for long enough, their absence would be allowed to drive. And in that time was the release of ''[[New Super Mario Bros. 2]]'', which was the first game to even make the distinction between Blue and Red POW Blocks. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 11:46, February 27, 2025 (EST)
::They're red in Kingdom Battle from 2017, so it was only an eight-year absence. Either way, I would find the return of regular POW Blocks that are red to be much less unusual than the decision to call a Red POW Block simply "POW Block" while still intending it to be the variant. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 18:42, February 27, 2025 (EST)
@@ Line 27: / Line 27: @@
 #{{User|EvieMaybe}} it's red and it has a limited range. i think that matters more than its name, especially since M+R doesn't really have a reason to specifically call it a Red POW Block cuz it doesn't have blue POWs
 #{{User|Pizza Master}} Per all
-#{{User|Blinker}} Per all
 ===Oppose===
 #{{User|Hewer}} If it's both the only POW Block in the game and is named simply "POW Block", I lean towards no. As the Red POW Block page explains, "there have been instances of regular POW Blocks being colored red in some games". For example, fellow RPG series [[POW Block#Paper Mario series|Paper Mario]] also has POW Blocks that are red and damage multiple enemies. I'm also not sure what you mean when you say it "functions exactly like a Red POW Block", considering all the Red POW Block appearances currently on the page are in platformers.
 #{{User|PrincessPeachFan}}: I'm with Hewer. Why should we consider it a Red POW Block if it's explicitly called POW Block?
-#{{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}} - The main distinguishing functional trait of "Red POW Blocks" is that that they cause chain reactions and <s>do not affect enemies, only blocks</s> (correction:) primarily affect blocks rather than enemies. The M+R block has neither criterion, instead acting more like SMB2's POW Blocks - which were also red.
 ===Comments===
 In the discussion from before the proposal, when you say the POW Block in ''SoH'' has a "small explosion", do you mean it happens in a visibly finite radius a-la the Red POW blocks in the 2D platformers, and are there weapons/items in ''SoH'' that happen board-wide to contrast this with? We're not very familiar with the ''+ Rabbids'' games. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 19:24, February 26, 2025 (EST)
@@ Line 47: / Line 44: @@
 :The last time an ordinary POW Block has been colored red without being a Red POW Block (sans remakes, of course, since otherwise the ''TTYD'' remake would qualify) would be... ''[[Mario Clock]]'', which was back in ''2009''. They've been AWOL for long enough, their absence would be allowed to drive. And in that time was the release of ''[[New Super Mario Bros. 2]]'', which was the first game to even make the distinction between Blue and Red POW Blocks. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 11:46, February 27, 2025 (EST)
 ::They're red in Kingdom Battle from 2017, so it was only an eight-year absence. Either way, I would find the return of regular POW Blocks that are red to be much less unusual than the decision to call a Red POW Block simply "POW Block" while still intending it to be the variant. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 18:42, February 27, 2025 (EST)
-@EvieMaybe: NSMB2, the first appearance of the Red POW Block (using that name), also didn't have blue ones. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 19:30, February 27, 2025 (EST)
-:and? just cuz NSMB2 decided to be more specific with their naming than M+R, that doesn't make it not a Red POW. if it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, but it's only described as "a bird", is it not a duck? {{User:EvieMaybe/sig}} 17:38, March 1, 2025 (EST)
-::Your argument was "M+R doesn't really have a reason to specifically call it a Red POW Block cuz it doesn't have blue POWs", NSMB2 contradicts that by calling them Red POW Blocks despite them being the only ones. I don't buy that it "looks like a duck" (normal POW Blocks can be red) and "quacks like a duck" (I don't think anyone would bat an eye if a normal POW Block functioned the way this one does). {{User:Hewer/sig}} 03:59, March 3, 2025 (EST)
-:::If the game had a [[Mega Mushroom|big fat yellow-with-red-spots mushroom that makes the player giant and invincible for a limited time]], the wiki shouldn't treat it as a Super Mushroom just because Super Mushrooms [[Super Mario Bros.|have had red spots before]] and that "becoming big" would be intuitive behavior. Yes, red-colored POW Blocks ''have'' existed, but they also ''completely stopped'' existing once Red POW Blocks proper were introduced. <small>(Excluding games that are reissues of titles from before the invention of Red POW Blocks.)</small> It's rather evident that "Red POW with a yellow trim that creates a circular shockwave that defeats enemies and breaks blocks within it" is a well defined item distinct from "Blue POW that causes an earthquake that defeats any enemy standing on the ground", to which this M+R POW fully suits the former.--[[User:PopitTart|PopitTart]] ([[User talk:PopitTart|talk]]) 04:49, March 3, 2025 (EST)
-::::I might have doubts if said Mushroom was called a "Super Mushroom" (especially considering Mega Mushrooms have more visual differences than just the colour, which the POW Blocks don't - I don't know of any Super Mushroom appearance that has had both the colours and distinctive proportions of a Mega Mushroom). {{User:Hewer/sig}} 08:16, March 3, 2025 (EST)
-{{@|Doc von Schmeltwick}} I think you're misremembering, Red POW Blocks most certainly defeat enemies in their blast radius. See [https://youtu.be/RmJyY5Vq-2Q?si=qTYUW0miBC75KmP4 here], [https://youtu.be/ptLBUMQm0Pk?si=-ZG3CZar6nhwGcHn here], and [https://youtu.be/lhnkDcFgtrM?si=BK0TVw4pJgD4Rw-N&t=180 here]. Additionally, the M+R POW Block [https://youtu.be/pCcPp_xO6yc?si=fXOAqzkYFLxPlYtr&t=157 can destroy cover], which sometimes appears as brick blocks.--[[User:PopitTart|PopitTart]] ([[User talk:PopitTart|talk]]) 00:08, February 28, 2025 (EST)
-:My apologies, I forgot they had the radial thing. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 00:22, February 28, 2025 (EST)