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| ==Move the page to "List of Cancelled Games and Vaporware"== | | ==Move the page to "List of Cancelled Games and Vaporware"== |
| {{Settled TPP}} | | {{SettledTPP}} |
| {{Proposal outcome|passed|11-0|move page}} | | {{ProposalOutcome|passed|11-0|move page}} |
| The page lists all sorts of cancelled or unreleased projects, which doesn't synch with the name. "Vaporware" has a specific definition, it refers to projects that were never released but not officially cancelled, or products with long and bloated developpement cycles and no concrete release in sight. Futhermore, not all vapoware projects are cancelled - games such as Duke Nukem Forever and Team Fortress 2 eventually ended up being released despite being vaporware for most of their production. With this in mind, the wiki's usage of "Vaporware" as a catch-all umbrella term for any cancelled or unreleased game is inaccurate and rather abusive. | | The page lists all sorts of cancelled or unreleased projects, which doesn't synch with the name. "Vaporware" has a specific definition, it refers to projects that were never released but not officially cancelled, or products with long and bloated developpement cycles and no concrete release in sight. Futhermore, not all vapoware projects are cancelled - games such as Duke Nukem Forever and Team Fortress 2 eventually ended up being released despite being vaporware for most of their production. With this in mind, the wiki's usage of "Vaporware" as a catch-all umbrella term for any cancelled or unreleased game is inaccurate and rather abusive. |
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| == Cancelled TV shows / Unreleased episodes == | | == Cancelled TV shows / Unreleased episodes == |
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| I have outlines of unreleased episodes for [[The Super Mario Bros. Super Show!]] and [[The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3]]. I even have a script for a proposed but ultimately cancelled Super Mario TV show that would have preceded the Super Show (the Super Show integrated some of its concepts, such as the [[Ratigator]]). Where should I post about this content? It comes from the original DiC Writer's Bible, production outlines, scripts, and a rejected TV proof-of-concept proposal that I own, all never-before-seen. There are no articles on this Wiki or even online about them. (I also own the heavily revised Super Mario Bros. film script with many cut scenes.) Please advise. --[[User:The Ultimate Mario Fan|The Ultimate Mario Fan]] ([[User talk:The Ultimate Mario Fan|talk]]) 18:00, September 13, 2020 (EDT) | | I have outlines of unreleased episodes for [[The Super Mario Bros. Super Show!]] and [[The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3]]. I even have a script for a proposed but ultimately cancelled Super Mario TV show that would have preceded the Super Show (the Super Show integrated some of its concepts, such as the [[Ratigator]]). Where should I post about this content? It comes from the original DiC Writer's Bible, production outlines, scripts, and a rejected TV proof-of-concept proposal that I own, all never-before-seen. There are no articles on this Wiki or even online about them. (I also own the heavily revised Super Mario Bros. film script with many cut scenes.) Please advise. --[[User:The Ultimate Mario Fan|The Ultimate Mario Fan]] ([[User talk:The Ultimate Mario Fan|talk]]) 18:00, September 13, 2020 (EDT) |
| :You can publish the material you have in the General Discussion or Marioverse boards on the [https://www.marioboards.com/ Mario Boards] if you have an account. It's better to expose it in a fan forum and discuss it with others in there before anything else. {{User:Bye Guy/Sig}} 12:41, September 14, 2020 (EDT) | | :You can publish the material you have in the General Discussion or Marioverse boards on the [https://www.marioboards.com/ Mario Boards] if you have an account. It's better to expose it in a fan forum and discuss it with others in there before anything else. {{User:Bye Guy/Sig}} 12:41, September 14, 2020 (EDT) |
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| ==Super Mario 64DD Split== | | ==Super Mario 64DD Split== |
| {{Settled TPP}} | | {{SettledTPP}} |
| {{Proposal outcome|failed|2-7}} | | {{ProposalOutcome|failed|2-7}} |
| Super Mario 64DD has many differences from the original game including different textures, a completely different title screen,different Peach's Castle music and some other edited sound effects,plus an oddly glitched wiggler boss fight. Super Mario 64DD also has enough info to support it's own article. For these reasons Super Mario 64DD should get it's own article. | | Super Mario 64DD has many differences from the original game including different textures, a completely different title screen,different Peach's Castle music and some other edited sound effects,plus an oddly glitched wiggler boss fight. Super Mario 64DD also has enough info to support it's own article. For these reasons Super Mario 64DD should get it's own article. |
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| == Decide how canceled games and vaporware are organized == | | == Decide how canceled games and vaporware are organized == |
| {{Settled TPP}} | | {{SettledTPP}} |
| {{Proposal outcome|failed|0-0-5|leave as-is}} | | {{ProposalOutcome|failed|0-0-5|leave as-is}} |
| The sorting of the text that says "[[Game Boy Advance]] / [[Nintendo GameCube]]" makes no sense. I was wondering if there's a possibility to decide how canceled games and vaporware can be organized. Here are three options: | | The sorting of the text that says "[[Game Boy Advance]] / [[Nintendo GameCube]]" makes no sense. I was wondering if there's a possibility to decide how canceled games and vaporware can be organized. Here are three options: |
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| <big>'''''Donkey Kong Plus'''''</big> | | <big>'''''Donkey Kong Plus'''''</big> |
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| {{main|Mario vs. Donkey Kong#Development}} | | {{main|Mario vs. Donkey Kong#Development{{!}}Mario vs. Donkey Kong § Development}} |
| ''Donkey Kong Plus'' was a remake of the [[Donkey Kong (Game Boy)|Game Boy version of ''Donkey Kong'']]. Although the game was shown at E3 2002 as a proof-of-concept for connectivity between Game Boy Advance and Nintendo GameCube systems, its intended system—either the Game Boy Advance or the GameCube—is unclear. However, both versions were replaced by ''[[Mario vs. Donkey Kong]]'', an original game based on the classic ''Donkey Kong'' gameplay. | | ''Donkey Kong Plus'' was a remake of the [[Donkey Kong (Game Boy)|Game Boy version of ''Donkey Kong'']]. Although the game was shown at E3 2002 as a proof-of-concept for connectivity between Game Boy Advance and Nintendo GameCube systems, its intended system—either the Game Boy Advance or the GameCube—is unclear. However, both versions were replaced by ''[[Mario vs. Donkey Kong]]'', an original game based on the classic ''Donkey Kong'' gameplay. |
| </div> | | </div> |
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| ::Development began in late 1999 or early 2000, immediately after ''Donkey Kong 64'' was released. According to [https://donkeykong.fandom.com/wiki/Donkey_Kong_(GameCube) DK fandom and its comments], there is no information other than that it was in development. The name ''[[Donkey Kong Racing]]'' existed in the newspaper in February 2000. [[User:Windy|Windy]] ([[User talk:Windy|talk]]) 11:10, April 11, 2024 (EDT) | | ::Development began in late 1999 or early 2000, immediately after ''Donkey Kong 64'' was released. According to [https://donkeykong.fandom.com/wiki/Donkey_Kong_(GameCube) DK fandom and its comments], there is no information other than that it was in development. The name ''[[Donkey Kong Racing]]'' existed in the newspaper in February 2000. [[User:Windy|Windy]] ([[User talk:Windy|talk]]) 11:10, April 11, 2024 (EDT) |
| :::Another wiki is not a reliable source. We need something concrete from Rare at the very ''least''. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 11:38, April 11, 2024 (EDT) | | :::Another wiki is not a reliable source. We need something concrete from Rare at the very ''least''. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 11:38, April 11, 2024 (EDT) |
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| == More info about the cancelled games ==
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| https://youtu.be/A7II7Xns3No?si=nAD-IFfuLP9xmNap --[[User:Lucoshi|Lucoshi]] ([[User talk:Lucoshi|talk]]) 15:21, May 12, 2024 (EDT)
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| == [[Yoshi (game)|Yossy]] ==
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| [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfSLPTWu1jA] {{unsigned|Perfection}}
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| :It's already there. See [[List of unreleased media#Super Yoshi no Tamago]].--[[User:Platform|Platform]] ([[User talk:Platform|talk]]) 05:23, November 16, 2024 (EST)
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| ==Split rejected pitches and titles that never began development into a {{fake link|List of proposed media}}==
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| {{settled TPP}}
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| {{proposal outcome|passed|5-2|Split}}
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| Technically, if a piece of media never went into development (i.e. Elon Musk's proposed {{wp|Tesla}}-based ''[[Mario Kart (series)|Mario Kart]]'' game, then it only counts as unreleased due to the fact that it was planned to enter development at one point. However, I believe that projects such as the aforementioned Telsa-based ''Mario Kart'' game differ from unreleased media, as unreleased media did go through a period of active development with intent to release the final product, while rejected pitches were simply proposed to [[Nintendo]], with the product never undergoing any official development at all. Occasionally, Nintendo would also have rejected ideas that also underwent little to no official development (such as ''Dance Dance Revolution: Mario Mix 2''). Because of this, I believe the rejected pitches listed in this article, alongside any media that was proposed to or by Nintendo yet never underwent any official development, should be split from this article into a {{fake link|list of proposed media}}. This proposal would affect the following sections:
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Tesla_Mario_Kart_game|Elon Musk's Tesla-based ''Mario Kart'' game]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Wario%20Pool|''Wario Pool'']]
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| *''[[List_of_unreleased_media#Yoshi%20Racing|Yoshi Racing]]''
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Film_adaptation_of_Super_Paper_Mario|The ''Super Paper Mario'' film]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Archie_Comics_Super_Mario_comic_pitch|The Archie Comics ''Super Mario'' pitch]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Fleetway_Super_Mario_comic_pitch|The Fleetway Publications ''Super Mario'' pitch]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Kinoppe_spin-off_manga|The Kinoppe spin-off manga]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Animated_Super_Mario_project_pitch|The ''Super Mario'' animated pitch brought to attention by Ryan Lang]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Super_Mario.2FSonic_crossover_action_game|The Super Mario/Sonic crossover action game]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Retro_Studios.27_Boo_pitch|Retro Studios' Boo pitch]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#DDR_MARIO_2|''Dance Dance Revolution: Mario Mix 2'']]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Super_Mario_Bros._Firebird_pitch|The Firebird]] and [[List_of_unreleased_media#Super_Mario_Bros._Orpheus_Software_pitch|Orpheus Software]] ''Super Mario Bros.'' pitches
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Donkey_Kong_Arcade1UP_products|Arcade1UP's ''Donkey Kong'' pitch]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Donkey_Kong_for_TRS-80|The rejected ''Donkey Kong'' TRS-80 pitch]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#3DS_version_of_Virtual_Boy_Wario_Land|The 3DS Virtual Boy port(s) pitch]]
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| *[[List_of_unreleased_media#Boss_Game_Studios.27_Super_Mario_game_pitch|Boss Game Studios' ''Super Mario'' pitch]]
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| '''Proposer''': {{User|Nelsonic}}<br/>
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| '''Deadline''': March 16, 2025, 23:59 GMT
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| ===Split===
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| #{{User|Nelsonic}} Per proposal.
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| #{{User|Camwoodstock}} With id Software's ''Mario 3'' excluded, the current list sounds reasonable enough to us. The only possible sticking point we can even think of is ''Wario Pool''; though admittedly, we're a lot less familiar with ''3D Pocket Pool'' than we are the existence of the entire ''Commander Keen'' series.
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| #{{User|Ahemtoday}} Makes sense to me.
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| #{{User|EvieMaybe}} they are two different things, after all
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| #{{User|Power Flotzo}} Per all.
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| ===Don't split===
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| #{{User|Lucoshi}} Why don't add a new list?
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| #{{User|Rykitu}} I would support if this list was too large, but we haven't gotten to that point yet. Also per Lucoshi.
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| ===Comments===
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| We disagree that id's Mario 3 pitch should be included, as it ''did'' actually start development as a tech demo, and that demo even later spiraled into the ''Commander Keen'' series; that's about as far away from "only proposed" as you can get. If that was rectified, we'd be happy to support. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 17:16, March 2, 2025 (EST)
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| Sounds good. I'll modify the proposal accordingly. [[User:Nelsonic|Nelsonic]] ([[User talk:Nelsonic|talk]]) 17:18, March 2, 2025 (EST)
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| == DKC4 ==
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| {{talk}}
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| Is the source referencing Donkey Kong Country 4 reliable? Attempts to find credible information about the existence of Donkey Kong Country 4 have proven extremely difficult, and available references appear scarce or potentially fabricated. [[User:Fox de Quintal|Fox de Quintal]] ([[User talk:Fox de Quintal|talk]]) 21:48, April 11, 2025 (EDT)
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| ==Split Mario Factory and give it its own page==
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| {{TPP}}
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| For awhile now, [[List of unreleased media#Mario Factory|Mario Factory]] has been on this page for unreleased media. It never saw a wide-spread release or nothing, but we know it existed thanks to patents. So, it goes here, right? This is sound reasoning... if not for that load-bearing "wide-spread".
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| As it turns out, Mario Factory ''did'' actually release, and saw limited usage in Japanese schools. Indeed, Mario Factory is actually the main software used by the [[nwiki:Game Processor|Game Processor]], which you might know from [https://youtu.be/h3LpVnKYvkg this video by Akfamilyhome], and we even have a bit of surviving information on titles made with it, including a game that actually meets our coverage requirements; namely, ''[[Easy Racer]]''! Easy Racer is a simplistic racing game featuring [[Mario]] and [[Luigi]], that was distributed via the [[Satellaview]], and was directly created using Mario Factory.
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| So, uh... Why exactly is Mario Factory in "unreleased media" if it was not only distributed, but a game made using it was even given its ''own'' distribution? Sure, Mario Factory is presently lost media, as no surviving units have surfaced, and even Easy Racer itself is currently lost with only footage to show it existed. But lost doesn't mean unreleased, does it? It's not like ''Easy Racer'' being AWOL means that it just never broadcast in the first place, and it's not like Mario Factory currently being AWOL means it never got used by universities. This entire thing being here feels like quite the misnomer, and we think it's time to reconcile that.
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| There's three paths forward:
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| *'''Split Mario Factory, and remove the mention here:''' It released, however limited its release may be and despite being lost media at the moment, ergo, it's not unreleased, ergo, it should just have its own page. Simple-as.
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| *'''Split Mario Factory, but keep a mention here with a <nowiki>{{Main}}</nowiki> tag:''' Similar to above, but we give a summary of the situation here and link to the actual page.
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| *'''Keep here/do nothing:''' The status quo option; Mario Factory remains on this page. We... Dislike this, as we genuinely cannot see a reason to do this, but a status quo option is mandatory, so we're happy to oblige.
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| '''Proposer''': {{User|Camwoodstock}}<br>
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| '''Deadline''': April 28, 2025, 23:59 GMT
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| ===Split and remove it (build a new plant!)===
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| #{{User|Camwoodstock}} Per proposal. It ain't unreleased; it's so released, it released other games! Lost, yes, absolutely. But unreleased?
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| #{{User|Rykitu}} Per proposal. I would also like to mention that there was an [https://www.marioboards.com/threads/46776/ official Mario-themed arcade] in Japan also called "Mario Factory" that deserves its own article, so if this page gets made, we might need an identifier.
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| #{{User|Pseudo}} Seems like it's not unreleased, so it doesn't belong here. Per proposal!
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| #{{User|EvieMaybe}} per all. why was this here in the first place?
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| #{{User|Jdtendo}} Per Pseudo.
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| #{{User|Nelsonic}} Per proposal. ''[[Nintendo Puzzle Collection]]'' was also once considered for release in the U.S., as both IGN and the ''[[Player's Poll]]'' can tell us, yet the U.S. localization was cancelled. The same thing has happened here.
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| ===Split, but keep a mention here (just in case!)===
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| #{{User|Fox de Quintal}} In case more information is added.
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| ===Keep Here (limited, schlimited.)===
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| ===Comments (Mario Factory split/removal)===
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| {{@|Rykitu}} - That makes sense to us. How's about {{fake link|''Mario Factory'' (game)}} for this, and {{fake link|Mario Factory (arcade)}} for that? {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 21:03, April 14, 2025 (EDT)
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| :Sure! That works! {{User:Rykitu/sig}}
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| Question: Will the change add new information to the article? If so, split the information and add a note indicating where to read the main article. But if it’s just repeating what’s already here, it’s better not to change anything. — [[User:Fox de Quintal|Fox de Quintal]] ([[User talk:Fox de Quintal|talk]]) 21:15, April 15, 2025 (EDT)
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| :Our hope is that the resulting split page will be able to explain the situation with the universities-only release of the Game Processor, discussing what little we know about the ''Mario Factory'' software, and of course, mentioning how it was used to make games that appeared on [[Satellaview]], namely ''[[Easy Racer]]''. {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 18:02, April 16, 2025 (EDT)
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| :: If you can pull it off, it’ll turn out great. One way to find sources is by using the Perplexity AI, though I recommend reviewing each source carefully, as it doesn’t always pick the most reliable ones — and of course, double-check to make sure it hasn’t hallucinated anything. [[User:Fox de Quintal|Fox de Quintal]] ([[User talk:Fox de Quintal|talk]]) 21:45, April 16, 2025 (EDT)
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| Heads up, we've written a draft for an article and it's currently sitting on our userpage [[User:Camwoodstock/Mario Factory|right here, on its own dedicated subpage]], but we do have a few questions for it since this seems on pace to pass in favor of its own article:
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| * Should we handle the Game Processor as though it was its own console/accessory, or should we handle it as just being a ''Super Famicom'' title?
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| * The Game Processor used its own keyboard and microphone, which we only have images for via patent. For the input part of the infobox, should we include these as text, or use images, or what?
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| * How do we put an approximate date into an infobox like this? We don't have a specific ''date'' the Game Processor was first distributed to Japanese universities, but it's as late as 1994.
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| * How the hey do we handle the "format" parameter? It's unclear if Mario Factory was a BIOS, or an individual cartridge, or what. Do we mention the RAM Cassettes there?
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| {{User:Camwoodstock/sig}} 17:25, April 17, 2025 (EDT)
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