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| | {{partofpipe|image=[[Image:Ssbemblem.png|32px]]|type=article|name=Super Smash Bros.|goal=improve upon the articles about the [[Super Smash Bros. (series)|Super Smash Bros. Series]]}} |
| | {{partofpipe|image=[[Image:MKDS_art small.jpg]]|type=article|name=Mario Kart|goal=create race & battle course articles and expand on the [[Mario Kart Series]] game pages}} |
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| Why are these MK-related items (Red Homing Shell, Green Shell, Blue Shell) under a section of Koopa Troopa? Those are items that should have their own pages. <span style="font-family:Kunstler Script; color:#006633;"><font size="5">'''[[User:Wayoshi|W]]'''ayoshi</font></span><small> ( [[User talk:Wayoshi|T]]<tt>·</tt>[[Special:Contributions/Wayoshi|C]]<tt>·</tt>[[Special:Emailuser/Wayoshi|@]] )</small> 15:25, 31 August 2006 (EDT) | | Why are these MK-related items (Red Homing Shell, Green Shell, Blue Shell) under a section of Koopa Troopa? Those are items that should have their own pages. <span style="font-family:Kunstler Script; color:#006633;"><font size="5">'''[[User:Wayoshi|W]]'''ayoshi</font></span><small> ( [[User talk:Wayoshi|T]]<tt>·</tt>[[Special:Contributions/Wayoshi|C]]<tt>·</tt>[[Special:Emailuser/Wayoshi|@]] )</small> 15:25, 31 August 2006 (EDT) |
| :Long ago, in the early days of this Wiki, some users decided that it would be better to place info of items related to species in the articles. Those days should end now. I think we should seperate the items from the species page. They are related, but both are distinct enough to have their own pages. -- [[User: Son of Suns|Son of Suns]] | | :Long ago, in the early days of this Wiki, some users decided that it would be better to place info of items related to species in the articles. Those days should end now. I think we should seperate the items from the species page. They are related, but both are distinct enough to have their own pages. -- [[User: Son of Suns|Son of Suns]] |
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| ==Koopa redirect== | | ==Koopa redirect== |
| I've noticed that a lot of members of the koopa troop, Magikoopas, Hammer Bros, Spiny, and even Bowser are referred to as Koopas which in this wiki redirects to Koopa Troopa. Now Bowser and Spiny are definitely not Koopa Troopas. Should we have a separate article about all "koopa" species, or is that unnecessary since [["Bowser's Minions|Koopa Troop]] and [[Koopa Troopa]] both provide a lot of information? Either that, or could [[Koopa]] redirect to Koopa Troop instead? Sorry if I am being nitpicky :( | | I've noticed that a lot of members of the koopa troop, Magikoopas, Hammer Bros, Spiny, and even Bowser are referred to as Koopas which in this wiki redirects to Koopa Troopa. Now Bowser and Spiny are definitely not Koopa Troopas. Should we have a separate article about all "koopa" species, or is that unnecessary since [[Koopa Troop]] and [[Koopa Troopa]] both provide a lot of information? Either that, or could [[Koopa]] redirect to Koopa Troop instead? Sorry if I am being nitpicky :( |
| {{User:Goomb-omb/sig}} | | {{User:Goomb-omb/sig}} |
| :Personally, I'd like to see "Koopa" be an article in its own right too. A while ago, I actually separated {{tem|Koopas}} and {{tem|Koopa Troopas}} for this very idea - as you said, Bowser is not a Koopa Troopa. But the problem is that Nintendo is absolutely horrendous at providing specific terms for us to cling to (i.e. Bowser has no official species name, so we have nowhere to put him), so we're stuck using the quintessential Koopa Troopa as a proxy for a page dedicated to "Koopas" as a whole. Putting the general information on the Koopa Troop page wouldn't do because it's a military organization, and thus, does not represent all Koopas; it also includes non-Koopas, and many species some would consider Koopas while others wouldn't (i.e. [[Clubba]]s). Also, creating a stand-alone "Koopa" page runs the risk of turning out like the horrendous {{fake link|Alien}} page: it smashes together snippets of information from various sources and tries to make it seem like one big unit, but fails miserably. Similarly a "Koopa" page would be expected to have notes on Koopa culture and Koopa history, which, given what we have to work on, will turn out as fragmented as the Alien page. The only thing we could do is lists of notable Koopas and of the species, though like I said before, stating what is and isn't a Koopa may not be as black an white as one would hope. Lists are disappointing to most readers, but anything more would be more original research than hard facts, which is frowned upon here; we'll have to cite everything to make it credible, and that's something most users don't seem to be up for. It'd be a huge undertaking, but if it's done right, I think it'd be worth it. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 01:37, 29 June 2009 (EDT) | | :Personally, I'd like to see "Koopa" be an article in its own right too. A while ago, I actually separated {{tem|Koopas}} and {{tem|Koopa Troopas}} for this very idea - as you said, Bowser is not a Koopa Troopa. But the problem is that Nintendo is absolutely horrendous at providing specific terms for us to cling to (i.e. Bowser has no official species name, so we have nowhere to put him), so we're stuck using the quintessential Koopa Troopa as a proxy for a page dedicated to "Koopas" as a whole. Putting the general information on the Koopa Troop page wouldn't do because it's a military organization, and thus, does not represent all Koopas; it also includes non-Koopas, and many species some would consider Koopas while others wouldn't (i.e. [[Clubba]]s). Also, creating a stand-alone "Koopa" page runs the risk of turning out like the horrendous {{Fakelink|Alien}} page: it smashes together snippets of information from various sources and tries to make it seem like one big unit, but fails miserably. Similarly a "Koopa" page would be expected to have notes on Koopa culture and Koopa history, which, given what we have to work on, will turn out as fragmented as the Alien page. The only thing we could do is lists of notable Koopas and of the species, though like I said before, stating what is and isn't a Koopa may not be as black an white as one would hope. Lists are disappointing to most readers, but anything more would be more original research than hard facts, which is frowned upon here; we'll have to cite everything to make it credible, and that's something most users don't seem to be up for. It'd be a huge undertaking, but if it's done right, I think it'd be worth it. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 01:37, 29 June 2009 (EDT) |
| ::i think it would be worthwhile too! i would sure make it a priority of mine, at least :) {{User:Goomb-omb/sig}} | | ::i think it would be worthwhile too! i would sure make it a priority of mine, at least :) {{User:Goomb-omb/sig}} |
| :::It's on my to-do list as well... But my list is rather long and I like procrastinating, so it might be a while before I get down there... If you do tackle it, make sure you create a sub-page (<nowiki>"[[User:YourName/SubpageTitle]]"</nowiki>) of what you plan to make the Koopa page about, and then [[MarioWiki:Proposals|Propose is]], before taking any Mainspace action. Big changes need community approval, and this would be a big change. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 19:14, 29 June 2009 (EDT) | | :::It's on my to-do list as well... But my list is rather long and I like procrastinating, so it might be a while before I get down there... If you do tackle it, make sure you create a sub-page (<nowiki>"[[User:YourName/SubpageTitle]]"</nowiki>) of what you plan to make the Koopa page about, and then [[MarioWiki:Proposals|Propose is]], before taking any Mainspace action. Big changes need community approval, and this would be a big change. - {{User:Walkazo/sig}} 19:14, 29 June 2009 (EDT) |
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| Bowser isn't a Koopa, but that is his last name, which confuses people and makes them think he is a Koopa.{{User|M&L}} | | Bowser isn't a Koopa, but that is his last name, which confuses people and makes them think he is a Koopa.{{User|M&L}} |
| No, that's speculation. [[User:Kelton2|Kelton2 Supermariofan I GOTTA PEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! User: Kelton2!!!]] 18:18, 8 February 2012 (EST) 18:18, 8 February 2012 (EST) | | No, that's speculation. [[User:Kelton2|Kelton2 Supermariofan I GOTTA PEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! User: Kelton2!!!]] 18:18, 8 February 2012 (EST) 18:18, 8 February 2012 (EST) |
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| Technically Bowser ''is'' a Koopa, but he's not a Koopa ''Troopa''. There's a number of different varieties of Koopa. (And important to note that the "Koopa Tribe" is called the "Turtle Tribe" in Japan. If Bowser is a turtle, then that technically makes him a Koopa in English.) [[User:Vent|Vent]] ([[User talk:Vent|talk]]) 17:34, 23 February 2013 (EST)
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| ==DDR:Mario Mix== | | ==DDR:Mario Mix== |
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| What kind of info is needed? I have the game. {{User:Tails777/sig}} | | What kind of info is needed? I have the game. {{User:Tails777/sig}} |
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| == Comparisons of other characters ==
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| I'm pretty sure Koopa Troopas do seem to look fragglish to me. Those ones are different but they may not have the same things on them. I compared them by myself but they look like something else.--[[User:CozmicAlienMickey|Mickey]] 20:03, 29 February 2012 (EST)
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| == Shellcreepers ==
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| Why are shellcreepers here if they aren't actually koopa troopas? I get that thay share a strong resemblance, but they should have their own page right? {{unsigned|Luma4Ever}}
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| :They do [[Shellcreeper]]. {{User|Raven Effect}}
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| But why do they have their own page AND are on the koopa troopa page? {{unsigned|Luma4Ever}}
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| :Because it's a point of reference because Shellcreepers were the inspiration for Koopa Troopas. {{User|Raven Effect}}
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| Thanks for clearing it up! ;D {{user|Luma4Ever}}
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| In [[nintendo]] seiries. :)
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| It's less that they were the "inspiration" for them so much as they directly led to their creation. [[User:Vent|Vent]] ([[User talk:Vent|talk]]) 17:32, 23 February 2013 (EST)
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| == SML2 koopas ==
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| It says that it is unknown what color the koopa troopas in SML2 are due to the game being in black and white, but the answer should be obvious-ones that wall off ledges are green and ones that turn around are red (I haven't played SML2 in a long time and can't remember if it has both kinds.)[[Special:Contributions/198.228.201.168|198.228.201.168]]
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| :They're most likely green anyway. If there are different colored Koopas, the red-shelled ones would be darker (or the green-shelled ones lighter) to accommodate the lack of color in the games. <br>{{User:LeftyGreenMario/sig}} 03:01, 3 December 2013 (EST)
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| ==Split Red Koopa Troopa and Green Koopa Troopa==
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| {{Settled TPP}}
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| {{Proposal outcome|red|don't split 2-0-11}}
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| Red and Green Koopa Troopa have been distinctly different throughout the entire history of the ''Mario'' series, the shell governing if they would turn around or not. They even have different stats in the sports games (e.g. Mario Super Sluggers). This alone is already a big difference, and isn't a matter of Toad color. It would stay consistent with having a [[Gold Goomba]], [[Goombrat]], etc. where the differences were enough to have its own article. Also, the ongoing Pokey proposal [[Talk:Pokey#Split Green Pokey enemy from the Yellow one|here]] would lead me to believe this is a good idea.
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| The only question left would be where this article would go. I say we do what we did with ''[[Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS / Wii U]]'', and have the general page and two specific ones. That way, the information in this page doesn't get lost, and if someone wants to learn about a Koopa Troopa in general, they still can. If that idea isn't popular, I've given an alternative choice as well.
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| '''Proposer''': {{User|Andymii}}<br>
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| '''Deadline''': April 8, 2015, at 23:59 GMT.
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| ===Support (Keeping original article)===
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| #{{User|Andymii}} Per everything I said above.
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| #{{User|Toadbrigade5}} Per Proposal, although I am writing one for roughly (and more purposes) the same purpose currently exceeding 60 pages. I doubt it will be done by the time this proposal is due, but I'll just help anyway.
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| ===Support (Discarding original article)===
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| ===Oppose===
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| #{{User|Binarystep}} As I've said before, there's a difference between a species and a variant. And the thing is, where does this end? Do we split two-legged and four-legged Koopas? Different colored Goombas? Every single Pokey redesign throughout the series? Do we split Spookum and Snifit because one has a black robe? Or Spike Top (Paper Mario) from Spike Top because of the shell color? It's sloppy and confusing, and overall, unnecessary.
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| #{{User|Walkazo}} - Every grey area split or merge is a case-by-case thing, and in this case, it's too much: they're completely interchangeable in a number of appearances (i.e. ''Strikers'' and the ''PM'' games iirc), while others (i.e. ''Sluggers'') are likely individuals having different stats rather than the colour morphs as a whole. Besides, splitting them based on shell colour is starting down a very slippery slope: shell colours is variable in ''many'' Koopas, and if we split this, then we'll be splitting the yellow and blue ones based on the ''SMW'', and then every other colour too for consistency, and then all the other species with multiple shell colours: forget making one Dragon-Koopa page, clearly all the Kooaplings are their own unique species. Plus, it's also a lot clearer to have all the information in one central location, rather than basically repeating most of it two or more times, and forcing people to look around at multiple pages to get the full story is a hassle for readers and writers alike.
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| #{{User|Magikrazy}} Per Walky. No offense, but I legitimately thought this was either ironic or a joke proposal before I clicked on it.
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| #{{User|Boo4761}} Per Walky.
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| #{{User|SmokedChili}} First, per all. Second, is this a joke?
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| #{{User|LudwigVon}} Per all.
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| #{{User|Baby Luigi}} Per all
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| #{{User|Mario}} I don't appreciate the dismissive attitude because you ''can'' technically make a point that two enemies that look different and behave differently should be given separate articles. After all, Mario RPGs aren't shy of the recolored enemy RPG trope. If you look at just the platformers and the Baseball games, you could make a case for a split (although the Baseball is an extremely weak case since stat changes associated with color swaps are common). But no, they appear in several interchangeable roles in spinoffs, nonvideo game media, and other things, as Walkazo said. Despite this, one could argue that we also have colored Yoshis that are given separate articles, but they have different, distinct roles in Yoshi's Story mainly. Walkazo's Koopalings sounds like a strawman because we don't even know what specific species they are, and since they are apparently siblings, it's assumed that they're the same species anyway, so it's more clear-cut here. Anyway, if you're considering splitting the Koopa colors, you might as well split the [[Snifit]] and [[Birdo (species)|Birdo]](!) colors too. Minor behavior differences tied to color variants aren't limited to Koopa Troopas, you know?
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| #{{User|Burningdragon25}} This stays here so, per everyone.
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| #{{User|Yoshi876}} Per all.
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| #{{User|Stonehill}} The only thing '''''<ins>different</ins>''''' about them is that Green Koopas walk off platforms, while Red Koopas don't.
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| ===Comments===
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| For years I've said some variant of "next time someone will suggest to split red koopa from green koopa" on proposal comments as a joke about ever loosening article standards and now it's actually happening --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 13:23, 25 March 2015 (EDT)
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| :I'm pretty sure this is actually a joke referencing my Gritty Goomba TPP. [[User:Binarystep|Binarystep]] ([[User talk:Binarystep|talk]]) 17:59, 25 March 2015 (EDT)
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| ::On the bright side, we'll have something clear-cut to point to if this is ever brought up again. {{User:Time Turner/sig}}
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| Guys, I get that this isn't very popular, but ''why does everyone think this is a joke?'' [[User:Andymii|Andymii]] ([[User talk:Andymii|talk]]) 18:43, 25 March 2015 (EDT)
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| :The premise was just so odd when I first saw it. My first thought was that Binarystep made it and it was gonna say something like "Since the Gritty Goombas are different enough, we might as well split these too". Again, no offense to anyone here. {{User|Magikrazy}}
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| ::Why would I do that...? I don't make sarcastic proposals to spite people [[User:Binarystep|Binarystep]] ([[User talk:Binarystep|talk]]) 21:33, 26 March 2015 (EDT)
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| :::Besides, joke proposals are strictly forbidden. The user seems to be doing this in earnest so I ''highly'' doubt it's a joke proposal. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 22:54, 26 March 2015 (EDT)
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| That was just my first impression. I was probably too hard on Andymii, though. He does have a case. Also, I would like to point out that [[Red Paragoomba]] has its own page. Not sure if that means much, but it's there. Anyway, I'm still opposing, as the different colored Koopas don't have any differences besides color and trivial things like how they react to cliffs. {{User|Magikrazy}}
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| == Dance ==
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| When could they dance in New Super Mario Bros. WII? I dint find --[[Special:Contributions/78.248.232.59|78.248.232.59]] 06:04, 25 April 2016 (EDT)
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| :When they stop and look at the screen at the moment the music "bahs". {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 13:19, 25 April 2016 (EDT)
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| I thougt they did randomly the first time i saw them dance... --[[Special:Contributions/78.248.232.59|78.248.232.59]] 06:08, 27 April 2016 (EDT)
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| ::They technically do (like if you change the music of the game via hacking, they still dance but off sync), but their dance animations purposely sync up with the music. Koopas aren't the only enemies to react like this, Cheep Cheeps, Paratroopas, Yoshi (when idle), Goombas, and Spinies do it too. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 10:18, 27 April 2016 (EDT)
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| == "I have heard" (Wario stealing Koopa's kart and repainting it purple in Mario Kart 64 manual) ==
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| [https://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=Koopa_Troopa&diff=prev&oldid=2476161 The statement means nothing.] I checked the instruction booklet for [http://www.mariomayhem.com/downloads/mario_instruction_booklets/Mario_Kart_64_-_Manual_-_N64.pdf Mario Kart 64] yet there is apparently no mention of this, nor can I find relevant information in [[List of Wario profiles and statistics]]. The character bios have in page 7 nothing in them, and the course description makes no similar mention. When you try to make claims like "I have heard", try verifying it with a simple search and at least be specific. I checked only the instruction booklet, but it ''may'' have made a mention in the player guide or material in other regions. It even may have been mentioned in Nintendo Power. [[Talk:Wario#About_Wario_Stealing_Koopa.27s_Kart_in_MK64|There has been a comment]] in the past discussing it. Either way, once you found the reference even if it exists, take a picture of it, but if you can't, ''at least'' provide a page number, the specific name of the medium, and the complete, direct quote. {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 14:53, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :No mention in Nintendo Power. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 14:56, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| ::I feel this may be some early MarioWiki misinformation that just spread through the Internet. Or, it could've originated earlier. Can anyone find earlier mentions about this, [https://www.mariowiki.com/index.php?title=Wario&diff=prev&oldid=75595 earlier than this]? {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 14:59, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :::I checked the manuals for the American, Australian, and European releases, and found nothing. '''However''', I believe it's possible it came from a guide like a Nintendo Player's guide or a Prima guide, if the game has one. The (ridiculous) situation regarding [[Porcupine]] being called "Spiny" on this wiki for a long time despite what the manual says may also come from this sort of thing. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 15:03, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| ::::Can anyone check the [https://www.mariowiki.com/images/3/3c/Prima_Guide-N64_Secrets.jpg Prima's ''Nintendo 64 Game Secrets'']? {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 15:56, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :::::I know {{user|Time Turner}} had that book, but he seems to have become inactive on here recently. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 17:00, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| ::::::On the Discord, he disconfirmed it. I consider the entire thing bunk. {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 19:20, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :::::::Nintendo Player's Guide remains a potential source, though, if it exists, unless that's the "Nintendo Power" source Alex was talking about. Until all of that is examined, I think we should just not say anything on the subject. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 19:43, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :::@Doc About the Porcupines, they were called "Spinys" in the [https://web.archive.org/web/19980224193815/http://www.nintendo.com:80/n64/mario_kart64/yoshi.html MK64 website].<br>--[[User:PhGuy12|PhGuy12]] ([[User talk:PhGuy12|talk]]) 16:38, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| ::::Hm. Strange. I was a tad peeved at the time as the only source I even knew ''about'' them back in the day was the MK64 instruction manual, which I had read at a cousin's house. Suppose the alternate sourced name should be added to the Porcupine page. EDIT: I see that's already been done. Good. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 16:55, 4 August 2018 (EDT)
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| Well, more than two years later, I inadvertently found the source: [https://datassette.nyc3.cdn.digitaloceanspaces.com/revistas/nintendo_power_094_-_marco_1997.pdf Nintendo Power magazine vol. 94] (page 114), which included detachable cards about each of the eight characters in the game. There is no mention of the kart being painted purple, though.<br>--[[User:PhGuy12|PhGuy12]] ([[User talk:PhGuy12|talk]]) 15:18, November 30, 2020 (EST)
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| :Sounds more like a humorous statement at the lack of Koopa Troopa than something that is actually "canon" to Mario Kart 64. But it works.
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| :Also "Suspected of distributing counterfeit item cubes", Yoshi doesn't just evade taxes, he does forgery! {{User:Alex95/sig}} 15:22, November 30, 2020 (EST)
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| ::Could those be added to the official profiles pages? I can't recall if normal NP was an official subsidiary of NoA or not.... [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 15:34, November 30, 2020 (EST)
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| :::I think the kart being painted purple is an inference. If Wario has stolen its kart, then it's fair to assume he's using the kart he has stolen and, well, the kart is purple. I left it out. In the meantime, I think it should be added to other characters' bios and such, why not. {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 15:42, November 30, 2020 (EST)
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| ==Electro-Koopa==
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| I also think that Electro-Koopas should be delisted as derived species of Koopa Troopas. They're just too different to be considered subspecies. They should be listed under [[Koopa (species)]] derived species instead. Design-wise, electro-koopas are more different from Koopa Troopas than [[Boom Boom]]s are from [[Bowser]] and [[Chargin' Chuck]]. - [[User:Electric-Gecko|Electric-Gecko]] ([[User talk:Electric-Gecko|talk]]) 18:16, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :Well, you have [[Koopeleon]], [[Bombshell Koopa]], and [[Snooza Koopa]] categorized under Koopa Troopa. I think the Electro-Koopas look more similar to Koopa Troopas than the other creatures that have "Koopa" in their name (Spike Koopa). I think the similarity is close enough to be considered a derived species of Koopa Troopa. Finally, [https://www.mariowiki.com/MarioWiki:Proposals/Archive_42#Stop_using_the_term_.22sub-species.22_on_the_wiki we've retired the use of "sub-species" in the wiki], so I recommend against using it. {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 18:23, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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| :They have Nokonoko in their Japanese name. They are a variant of Nokonoko. Nokonoko is Koopa Troopa. Ergo, they are a derivative of Troopa specifically. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 18:23, 31 August 2018 (EDT)
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| == I just added info about how the koopas dance to the music ==
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| If you were wondering when the koopa troopas dance, they dance to the electronic vocal riffs, or as some might call it, "BAHs" in the theme song.
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| {{unsigned|174.99.34.216}}
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| :It was already in the relevant ''NSMB'' sections, but thanks for trying :) {{User:Alex95/sig}} 12:28, February 12, 2021 (EST)
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| == Mario Clash ==
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| Can someone please add Koopa Troopa's sprites from Mario Clash. I can't find them anywhere. [[User:I'manumber1|I'manumber1]] ([[User talk:I'manumber1|talk]]) 22:49, November 8, 2021 (EST)
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| == SMW Koopa Troopa speed ==
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| Since 2009, this page has asserted that blue and yellow koopas in ''Super Mario World'' are faster than red and green koopas respectively. However, ''[[Mario Mania]]'' page 102 declares the opposite. It claims they are slower than the reds and greens. These competing claims must be resolved. The [[Beach Koopa]] page also has a similar claim that must be checked. If found erroneous, the main SMW page will also have to be edited.--[[User:Platform|Platform]] ([[User talk:Platform|talk]]) 11:24, July 22, 2022 (EDT)
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| :Is there a level in the game where we can see these multiple colored Koopas at the same time? {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 17:39, July 22, 2022 (EDT)
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| ::One of the (secret?) levels in Donut Plains does IIRC. I also recall blue and yellow indeed being faster. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 22:23, July 22, 2022 (EDT)
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| :::Can you verify with a video of any sort if anyone got some time to spare? {{User:Bazooka Mario/sig}} 23:43, July 25, 2022 (EDT)
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| ::::Here you go, video proof that [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GOXEydMCxo Blue and Yellow Koopas are faster]. {{User:LadySophie17/sig}} 17:11, September 10, 2023 (EDT)
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| == Water creatures ==
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| I know these categories have been going under enemies who have been using these elements in some way, but in this case, this is going too far. Currently, Koopa Troopas have been grouped under "water creatures" for water forming around them in a tennis game, and looking at the Puzzle and Dragons section only the green Koopa Troopas use water element and red Koopa Troopas use fire element, and we are not using a fire creatures category for this article. Bowser uses poison-based attacks in RPG games which to my view holds a lot more credibility than tennis games. It will also be confusing for readers who see that Koopa Troopas are grouped under "water creatures" only because of an obscure tennis move. Therefore, I still strongly think the category should have no place here. {{User:Swallow/sig}} 13:22, September 9, 2023 (EDT)
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| :Bowser to me is just not viewed as a character of poison element, not from general perception of him to his character bios nowhere near his association with fire. Even in Bowser's case, those attacks are still relatively cryptic. The categories in [[:Category:Elemental creatures]], including the whole [[:Category:Fire creatures]] (such as me raising an eyebrow at Magikoopa being classified as a fire creature and not Mario divorced from his Fire form) and these other kind of elemental categories do need to be looked into more. {{User:Mario/sig}} 15:04, September 9, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::Each of those categories are described as "Various species [...] '''that are composed of some sort of element''', or can produce or manipulate such an element." My solution to this would be to enforce the first half of the description for these categories, since those are much more universal aspects of those characters across most of their appearances. We should simply heavily discourage or outright remove the second half of that description. It is vague at best and invites subjective nitpicking as to what is enough to qualify for it, which is what resulted in this recent wave of edits and debates. {{User:LadySophie17/sig}} 16:29, September 9, 2023 (EDT)
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| :::I can agree to such a proposal. It'd deal with those irksome instances of subjects being in the elemental creatures categories because of one-off appearances--e.g. [[Boo]]s and [[Mini Goomba]]s in [[:Category:Electrical creatures]] and [[:Category:Poisonous creatures]] respectively because of ''[[Super Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars]]''. [[User:SolemnStormcloud|SolemnStormcloud]] ([[User talk:SolemnStormcloud|talk]]) 17:18, September 9, 2023 (EDT)
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| ::::I wanna point out that until a proposal from a few years back, habitat also qualified for it (ie, penguins were considered "ice creatures" by default). I think the current system is fine, but may need a bit more scrutiny. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 17:39, September 9, 2023 (EDT)
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