Editing Talk:Koopa Cruiser crew
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:::::: I don't think this article really needs to exist. It's just describing what's effectively a sub-faction in the Koopa Troop and the only difference is that they wear aviator clothes in the original version. [[User:PrincessPeachFan|PrincessPeachFan]] ([[User talk:PrincessPeachFan|talk]]) 13:12, November 27, 2023 (EST) | :::::: I don't think this article really needs to exist. It's just describing what's effectively a sub-faction in the Koopa Troop and the only difference is that they wear aviator clothes in the original version. [[User:PrincessPeachFan|PrincessPeachFan]] ([[User talk:PrincessPeachFan|talk]]) 13:12, November 27, 2023 (EST) | ||
::::::: I agree, anything worth saying here can easily be said instead in the Koopa Cruiser, Koopa Troopa, Goomba articles. [[User:Blinker|Blinker]] ([[User talk:Blinker|talk]]) 13:20, November 27, 2023 (EST) | ::::::: I agree, anything worth saying here can easily be said instead in the Koopa Cruiser, Koopa Troopa, Goomba articles. [[User:Blinker|Blinker]] ([[User talk:Blinker|talk]]) 13:20, November 27, 2023 (EST) | ||
::::::::Can what's said in [[Deep Cuts Toad]] or [[ | ::::::::Can what's said in [[Deep Cuts Toad]] or [[Mushroom Shop Clerk]] be easily said in the general [[Toad (species)|Toad]] article as well? I thought [[:Category:Articles with conjectural titles|conjecture articles]] exist for officially described content that do not (yet) have proper names with capitalization. The crew has more notability through recurrence, story, and gameplay, than those two aforementioned Toad conjectures. [[User:Boddle|Boddle]] ([[User talk:Boddle|talk]]) 13:28, November 27, 2023 (EST) | ||
:::::::They're in Partners in Time too. If the recurring sub-faction is described in official material, why can't it stand? It has more reference than other [[:Category:Articles with conjectural titles|conjecture articles]] such as [[Deep Cuts Toad]], a purple Toad. Or [[ | :::::::They're in Partners in Time too. If the recurring sub-faction is described in official material, why can't it stand? It has more reference than other [[:Category:Articles with conjectural titles|conjecture articles]] such as [[Deep Cuts Toad]], a purple Toad. Or [[Mushroom Shop Clerk]], a tall Toad with a orange-striped vest and black shirt. [[User:Boddle|Boddle]] ([[User talk:Boddle|talk]]) 13:28, November 27, 2023 (EST) | ||
==Merge back to [[Koopa Troopa]]== | ==Merge back to [[Koopa Troopa]]== | ||
{{ | {{TPP}} | ||
This conjecturally titled page was created without a proposal, and marginally defies a previous proposal that merged "Bowser Baddies" into the page that is now called [[Bowser's Minions]], and is about Koopa Troopas as they appear in the first two ''Mario & Luigi'' games. The motivation for this split was because of the aviator gear, though there are no "generic" Koopa Troopas in those games to lack said gear - the only other Koopa Troopas in those games are variations ([[Dry Bones]] in both, [[Troopea]]s and allies as well as [[Ankoopa]]s in the former) or specific named characters ([[Kylie Koopa]] in the latter). ''Superstar Saga'', with its extra-goofy, whimsical artstyle, wasn't exactly a model for design consistency with other games. And of course, the remake nixes said gear entirely to portray them as bog-standard-design Troopas (as the other BIS-onward M&L games portrayed nonspecific, nonvariant Troopas) in every sense to better segue into the "Minion Quest" campaign. | This conjecturally titled page was created without a proposal, and marginally defies a previous proposal that merged "Bowser Baddies" into the page that is now called [[Bowser's Minions]], and is about Koopa Troopas as they appear in the first two ''Mario & Luigi'' games. The motivation for this split was because of the aviator gear, though there are no "generic" Koopa Troopas in those games to lack said gear - the only other Koopa Troopas in those games are variations ([[Dry Bones]] in both, [[Troopea]]s and allies as well as [[Ankoopa]]s in the former) or specific named characters ([[Kylie Koopa]] in the latter). ''Superstar Saga'', with its extra-goofy, whimsical artstyle, wasn't exactly a model for design consistency with other games. And of course, the remake nixes said gear entirely to portray them as bog-standard-design Troopas (as the other BIS-onward M&L games portrayed nonspecific, nonvariant Troopas) in every sense to better segue into the "Minion Quest" campaign. | ||
'''Proposer''': {{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}}<br> | '''Proposer''': {{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} | ||
'''Deadline''': August 14, 2024 | <br> | ||
'''Deadline''': August 14, 2024 (GMT) | |||
===Support=== | ===Support=== | ||
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===Oppose=== | ===Oppose=== | ||
#{{user|Boddle}} The reasoning is not about design as incorrectly described in the proposal, it exists as they are officially described as "crew" and "personnel" in their respective games like other [[:Category:Articles with conjectural titles|conjecture articles]]. The Superstar Saga remake further distinguishes "Minions" as Bowser's overall forces and "crew" pertaining to the Koopa Cruiser within those forces. If merged back, we would have to merge [[Deep Cuts Toad]] back to [[Toad (species)]] and [[ | #{{user|Boddle}} The reasoning is not about design as incorrectly described in the proposal, it exists as they are officially described as "crew" and "personnel" in their respective games like other [[:Category:Articles with conjectural titles|conjecture articles]]. The Superstar Saga remake further distinguishes "Minions" as Bowser's overall forces and "crew" pertaining to the Koopa Cruiser within those forces. If merged back, we would have to merge [[Deep Cuts Toad]] back to [[Toad (species)]] and [[Mushroom Shop Clerk]] back to [[Toad (species)]] for the same reasoning. It also raises the question of why [[sailor]] existed as '''"S.S. Chuckola crew member"'''. | ||
===Comments=== | ===Comments=== | ||
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::::In that case, there's "normal" ones to compare him to in role. In this case, there isn't - they're the only normal Troopas in the game(s). This has less reason to be split than the punk-wearing enemy Troopas in the first three ''Paper Mario'' games. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 15:46, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | ::::In that case, there's "normal" ones to compare him to in role. In this case, there isn't - they're the only normal Troopas in the game(s). This has less reason to be split than the punk-wearing enemy Troopas in the first three ''Paper Mario'' games. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 15:46, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | ||
:::::Deep Cuts Toad is a normal Toad though, except he just wears purple clothes and has purple spots. I'm struggling to see the difference. [[User:Boddle|Boddle]] ([[User talk:Boddle|talk]]) 16:43, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | :::::Deep Cuts Toad is a normal Toad though, except he just wears purple clothes and has purple spots. I'm struggling to see the difference. [[User:Boddle|Boddle]] ([[User talk:Boddle|talk]]) 16:43, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | ||
Also, I hate the notion of saying certain articles would have to be merged with another because one proposal passed which didn't even have that topic in it. This sort of thing is a case-by-case basis and if somebody wanted to merge Deep Cuts Toad with Toad (species), that would be its own discussion/proposal. {{User:Nightwicked Bowser/sig}} 15:56, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | Also, I hate the notion of saying certain articles would have to be merged with another because one proposal passed which didn't even have that topic in it. This sort of thing is a case-by-case basis and if somebody wanted to merge Deep Cuts Toad with Toad (species), that would be its own discussion/proposal. {{User:Nightwicked Bowser/sig}} 15:56, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | ||
:I thought there was a consistent guideline for what constitutes an article? [[MarioWiki:Conjectural names]] states "if the subject is notable enough" and [[MarioWiki:Naming#Conjectural_names]] states "If the only available indication of a subject's name is a generic term or phrase rather than a clear name, then that description may be used", this page seemed to meet that standard. If it doesn't, figuring out why one article passes while another fails, seems relevant to finding clarity to what the policy guideline actually | :I thought there was a consistent guideline for what constitutes an article? [[MarioWiki:Conjectural names]] states "if the subject is notable enough" and [[MarioWiki:Naming#Conjectural_names]] states "If the only available indication of a subject's name is a generic term or phrase rather than a clear name, then that description may be used", this page seemed to meet that standard. If it doesn't, figuring out why one article passes while another fails, seems relevant to finding clarity to what the policy guideline actually is. Without a consistent policy guideline, wouldn't articles would be just determined on if users subjectively like or dislike it? [[User:Boddle|Boddle]] ([[User talk:Boddle|talk]]) 16:43, August 10, 2024 (EDT) | ||
