Editing Talk:Klump

==(First topic)==
He has been confirmed to be Klump. So do we just move this artvile there, or what? {{User:Lanky kong/sig}}

Klump from DKC? --[[User:Taj The Genie|Taj The Genie]] 19:15, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

Yeah, the fat army guy. Paon gave him a new look. {{User:Lanky kong/sig}}

Then yeah yeah we should move it there. --[[User:Taj The Genie|Taj The Genie]] 21:33, 3 October 2007 (EDT)

== Individual Character? ==

A seriously doubt there is only one Klump, I mean, c'mon, multiple Klumps can be seen on-screen in the games. -- [[User:Sir Grodus|Sir Grodus]] 18:56, 16 December 2007 (EST)

I'm pretty sure that quashes the whole single Klump thing. -- [[User:Sir Grodus|Sir Grodus]] 20:14, 16 December 2007 (EST)

I haven't used this type of talking before so sorry if I mess up. Anyway in the manual he is referred to as "Klump the Kremling" which mean Klump is a name rather then a type of kremling. If Klump was a species of Kremlings it would say "a Klump" instead. It wouldn't be the first time a character is used as a type of enemy in a game. Sorry if I confused anyone. Here is where the part of the story that describes Klump(connect the n with the g). [http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b20/shadowmario8/Klumpstory.png] ~shadowexe

I kno this disscusion is really old now, but i really do believe that klump are a species. the manual could be refering to a single klump in general. Similar to how the super mario bros manual talks about lakitu as 1 character, but we all know that there are multiple lakitus.--[[User:16-Volt|&#91;User:16-Volt]] 14:20, 26 October 2011 (EDT)

I believe they are a species as well. Does anyone in charge think we should rewrite this article?--[[User:Ladies-Man1|Ladies-Man1]] ([[User talk:Ladies-Man1|talk]]) 18:04, 7 May 2014 (EDT)
:Old game manuals refer to enemies in the singular all the time. Should be rewritten. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 18:32, 7 May 2014 (EDT)
::Exactly.--[[User:Ladies-Man1|Ladies-Man1]] ([[User talk:Ladies-Man1|talk]]) 19:58, 7 May 2014 (EDT)

== Boss Status? ==

Is this guy a boss? [[User:Jdrawer|Jdrawer]] 09:21, 28 April 2012 (EDT)

== Rewrite into a species article ==
{{Settled TPP}}
{{Proposal outcome|cancelled}}
Right now the page is written like there is only one Klump. This is clearly false as multiple Klumps/Kannons can be seen at the same time in DKC, DKC2 and DK64. There's simply no questioning it.

Per Glowsquid in the comments, there doesn't seem to be enough evidence to suggest the existence of an individual Klump, so I suggest simply rewriting this into a species article.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Aokage}}<br>
'''Deadline''': September 16, 2015, 23:59 GMT

===Rewrite===
#{{User|Aokage}} Per proposal.

===Don't rewrite===
#{{User|Glowsquid}} see below.
===Comments===
Unless you can clearly define what would go in the species article and what would go in the character article, I'm going to be rather hesitant to support this. {{User:Time Turner/sig}}

1: dkc manual isn't proof of anything. old game manuals like to write about the enemies as if they were individual characters (see super mario bros for example).

2: the klump in dk64 has no distinguishing feature and no appearance after the intro cutscene. if we made a page for every generic enemies in the mario rpgs that are given dialogue and characterization, it would be hell.

3: that would leave the dkc novel as the one time where "klump" is unambiguously an individual character, but as said above, the novel does that for every generic enemies.

--[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 08:27, 2 September 2015 (EDT)

Then should we just rewrite this into a species article? I'd be up for that as well, I was just under the impression that people thought there was an individual Klump. [[User:Aokage|Aokage]] ([[User talk:Aokage|talk]]) 08:35, 2 September 2015 (EDT)
: sure. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 08:46, 2 September 2015 (EDT)
::fyi  I didnt mean doing this by going through the proposal system. This article is an anomaly, lol. --[[User:Glowsquid|Glowsquid]] ([[User talk:Glowsquid|talk]]) 08:59, 2 September 2015 (EDT)
:::Alright. [[User:Aokage|Aokage]] ([[User talk:Aokage|talk]]) 09:06, 2 September 2015 (EDT)

==Evidence==
Klump is no species, but yes character, second commander of Kremling Krew, Kannon is his alias and K. Rool's right-hand. I find various evidences.

{{quote2|The enormous bulk of Klump the Kremling landed on top of Diddy, knocking him senseless.|''Donkey Kong Country'' SNES instruction booklet, page 5}}
{{quote2|Klump is quite a character. He's like a big, overweight drill sergeant.|''Donkey Kong Country'' Player's Guide, page 13}}
{{quote2|It looks like Klump can shoot.|''Donkey Kong Country 2: Diddy's Kong Quest'' SNES instruction booklet, page 29}}
{{quote2|Batten down the hatches—looks like Klump’s been taking shooting lessons!|''Donkey Kong Country 2'' GBA instruction booklet, page 23}}
{{quote2|Klump waddled over and put a consoling arm around his distraught leader.|''Donkey Kong 64'' Nintendo 64 instruction booklet, page 29}}
[[User:ChristopherPAraujo|ChristopherPAraujo]] ([[User talk:ChristopherPAraujo|talk]]) 22:54, 18 July 2018 (EDT)
:The short version is that if we were strict about ''every'' time a generic enemy was referred to with singular pronouns, it would make a '''very''' convoluted mess. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 22:05, 18 July 2018 (EDT)

== Merge [[General Klump]] here (and [[Krusha (character)]] to [[Krusha]]) ==
{{Settled TPP}}
{{Proposal outcome|failed|3-9}}
Similar reasoning behind the Birdo and Boom-Boom proposals, but here, the lines are even less concrete, with bios commonly considering the standard enemies individuals. Either way, the "character" articles only cover the cartoon, where they are the only examples (barring debatably Skurvy). Also, other adaptations, like ''[[Donkey Kong Country: Rumble in the Jungle]]'', also use them as characters. The Klump in the ''Donkey Kong Pilot'' demo featuring him even uses a clear imitation of the cartoon character's voice.

'''Proposer''': {{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}}<br>
'''Deadline''': September 18, 2021, 23:59 GMT

===Support===
#{{user|Doc von Schmeltwick}} - Per
#{{User|Koopa con Carne}} Per my comment.
#{{User|LinkTheLefty}} One way to look at it is like a typical [[wikipedia:beat 'em up|beat 'em up]]: sure, the enemy types are often written and accepted as [[List of Mario references on the Internet#Abobo's Big Adventure|"individuals"]], but it wouldn't be much of a game if they weren't [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qGZALUfznyc&t=4710s "countless"].
<s>#{{user|Somethingone}} I guess that makes sense. Per proposal.</s>

===Oppose===
#{{User|Waluigi Time}} These are distinct recurring characters from the cartoon, and I don't see this comparable to the Birdo and Boom Boom proposals at all. In the case of Birdo, there was so little to say about the species outside of the main character that it was merged into the character article, and Boom Boom was merged because it's just too difficult to discern when it's the character or not, and again, not much to say about either one of them independently. (Technically neither merge has actually happened yet, but you get my point) I don't really get the point of this merge.
#{{User|Swallow}} Not so sure about this one.
#{{User|Hewer}} These seem to be specific characters from the cartoon based on these enemies, which is nothing like how Birdo and Boom Boom reappear frequently with however much individuality the developers want. Per all.
#{{User|Somethingone}} This does seem different from  the Birdo and Boom Boom situations the more that I look at it. Per all.
#{{User|WildWario}} They definitely should have their own articles. Per all.
#{{User|Archivist Toadette}} Per all.
#{{User|TheFlameChomp}} Per all.
#{{User|Chester Alan Arthur}} Per all.
#{{User|Sdman213}} Per all.

===Comments===
@Waluigi Time How about Mouser in SMBSS? [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 22:06, September 3, 2021 (EDT)
:It seems like we already consider Mouser an individual in all of his appearances. --{{User:Waluigi Time/sig}} 22:08, September 3, 2021 (EDT)
::Multiple Mousers appear at once in Nintendo Comics System ("[[The Buddy System]]" comes to mind), to say nothing of their varying strengths and colors in their 8-bit appearances. Either way, we have other examples of Klump and Krusha as definite characters (DK64 for Krusha, Barrel Blast for Klump). Considering the DKC manuals ''also'' consistently consider them characters despite gameplay showing otherwise, they were pretty much definitely going off that. Either way, the title of "General Klump" is used in both "Rumble in the Jungle" and DK64's manual. It's clearly the adaptation's interpretation of the same concept, regardless. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 22:15, September 3, 2021 (EDT)
I don't find it out of question that the people who wrote print media for the Rareware DKCs received a general directive regarding enemy portrayal. It's a recurring thing across manuals and official guides to describe enemies such as Klump, [[Kruncha]], [[Klampon]] etc. in the singular, one possible exception being [[Klomp]] which is described as a "type" of Kremling, implying an intended plurality. I'm personally leaning towards supporting the proposal since the intent of portraying these enemies as individuals "out-prioritises" the games' practice of copy-pasting them for gameplay purposes, and the cartoon's General Klump hearkens back to the former. {{User:Koopa con Carne/Sig}} 09:14, September 5, 2021 (EDT)

So, to the opposition, I ask: should the other instances of Klump and Krusha being depicted as individuals be moved to the character pages? Why or why not? [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 02:23, September 16, 2021 (EDT)