Editing Talk:Dr. Mario World

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==Early Release==
I'm not autoconfirmed at the moment, so I can't edit the page, but as seen [https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/9/20687499/dr-mario-world-ios-released-android-nintendo-smartphone-game here] and [https://www.engadget.com/2019/07/09/dr-mario-world-ios-early-nintendo-android-mobile-game/?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAELYLMVWkjmiPfVOmFccupQdeStX16LXta4iKTcfCuWBWojcvHqYrGbILCsT_IzWPD7wLKaB-IVTzraqzjHbvHzRJjGN-ga5CpNKK5UZmbgC9cOYZ0OPyopfNSK0YJ-Pb-XTM1_jlORbTG4lem6HuInI5NXV9VblIIv6iawcSY4L here]. There's levels and assistants to be added as well. [[User:Iceblock715|Iceblock715]] ([[User talk:Iceblock715|talk]]) 14:52, July 9, 2019 (EDT)
:Updated the release before I even saw this talk page :P {{User:Alex95/sig}} 16:31, July 9, 2019 (EDT)

==Dr characters==
Considering that this game has a bunch of doctor characters not strictly limited to only Mario or Nurse Peach any more, I feel like the ones introduced in this game shouldn't warrant articles separate from one other, as it will cause a huge mess of navigation. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 22:01, July 9, 2019 (EDT)
:I don't really think that each character requires two separate pages depending on whether they're wearing a doctor costume or not. They still have the same lore and they aren't different characters in the same vain that Baby Mario is different from Mario, who is different from Paper Mario. I think the only thing that warrants Dr. Mario having his own page is the major differences between him and Mario in ''Smash''. {{unsigned|Iceblock715}}
::I've wrote [[MarioWiki:Proposals#Merge_all_doctor_versions_of_characters_into_their_respective_article_.28excluding_Dr._Mario.29|a proposal]] concerning this shortly after. You can vote in it if you want. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 15:50, July 10, 2019 (EDT)
:::I'm wondering if [[Dr. Luigi]] should be kept as a separate article because he appeared in other games, but that's the only reason for it. [[Dr. Mario]] should definitely stay separate. {{User:Obsessive Mario Fan/sig}} 15:57, July 10, 2019 (EDT)
::::I have a feeling that's not a strong enough reason to keep him separate because in the future, these doctors may also appear in future games. Not even Nurse Toadstool has her own article and she has more than one appearance. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 16:34, July 10, 2019 (EDT)

== Unused assistants ==

This really goes for all the unused assistants' articles: I think their pictures in the infoboxes shouldn't be their artwork from this game ''just'' yet, because they haven't been implemented in the game yet. {{User:Obsessive Mario Fan/sig}} 22:22, July 16, 2019 (EDT)

== King Bob-omb Level 2 ==

Can't edit the protected page myself, but I just unlocked this:

Stage Mode:
"Grants 10% chance viruses (2) will be eliminated on stage start."

Versus Mode:
"If you send viruses to your opponent, grants 8% chance of sending an extra row."
{{unsigned|24.62.250.138}}
:got it thanks {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 18:25, July 25, 2019 (EDT)

==All unreleased doctors should get a mention in their articles==
Data relating to those characters can be found in the game, and especially with their assets done and all, coinciding with other mined aspects of the game such as the world maps designating a particular theme and [https://drmarioworld.miraheze.org/wiki/Doctors their unique abilities have been mined.] I fail to see that just because it wasn't officially released doesn't mean it's data not at least worth mentioning. I do agree that we should rewrite loaded language such as "intending to be playable at some point" and I got a bit cocky myself when writing the babies' sections on terms of playable plausbility (and I still subjectively stand by my speculation) but there's no good reason to remove valid information just because Nintendo didn't give the greenlight and presentation on their reveal despite that their data exists and that's something MarioWiki should do. The fact that Mario Tennis Aces was used as an analogy (though I'm not versed with how its mined data was presented but iirc it didn't have completed assets like Dr. Mario World did) means that we shouldn't have deleted datamined character info from Mario Tennis Aces from the first place and rather rewrote information to be less speculative. {{User:Baby Luigi/sig}} 19:49, August 15, 2019 (EDT)
:I agree that content retrieved from the game's files should be covered when we cover pre-release and unused content. What comes to mind specifically are the unused CSS icons for Petey Piranha and Hammer Bro from ''Mario Kart Wii''. These were extracted from the game files, not unlike the Doctor assets from this game, and so when we cover those, we should cover these. Not to mention we've been using internal game files for confirmation of many enemy names and even planet names from the ''Galaxy'' games, so this is all valid. [[User:MarioComix|MarioComix]] ([[User talk:MarioComix|talk]]) 21:40, August 15, 2019 (EDT)

== There is new informations about the "Pre-release and unused content". ==

Some informations about this section are obsoletes. Some other new informations are found in the in-game data. This section need to be updated. Can I be autorise to change these informations. I also have to change Birdo's Biography due to her/it appearance in Super Mario Strikers and Mario Strikers Charged as a playable character that aren't considerate by the page relate to Birdo. The "list of appearance by date" need to be updated too. {{unsigned|Ouimet}}
:To be able to edit this page, you'll need to be [[MarioWiki:Autoconfirmed users|autoconfirmed]], which means you need to be a user for at least a week, which you are, and have made ten edits, so you'll need another eight. Though if you have some information, you could bring it up here with a source and we can take a look at it and see if it can be added, as well as saying which, if any, of the information is incorrect. [[User:BBQ Turtle|BBQ Turtle]] ([[User talk:BBQ Turtle|talk]]) 09:37, March 29, 2020 (EDT)
::I would like to rectify what I said. Informations found in-game data deconfirmed certains affirmation here. Apparently, since a august updates, there is no more information about Kamek and King Kaliente texts. Also, for the Fuzzy-Like creatures and the Boo Medals, it look like they doesn't appear anymore. At least we can refer to them like we do, but we need to specify these informations aren't sourced anymore. For myself, it will be difficult to prove they aren't in the game anymore, cause how to prove something doesn't exist? But, I refer myself to the observation of 2 dataminers. Do you want to talk with them to confirmed what I said?

::Finally, I saved Boo Medals and we can add all Assistants unused here. I got all the pictures, so I can add them to their respective section. [[User:Ouimet|Ouimet]] ([[User talk:Ouimet|talk]]) ,1:46 April 11, 2020 (HNP)
:::If you've got some images that you can upload (or have uploaded the already), then those should be fine to add. If you've got a source for those things no longer being included in the game, like if there's somewhere where those two dataminers have publicly explained that fact, then we can amend the section to reflect it, it doesn't have to be your observation specifically if you can find a good source for it elsewhere. [[User:BBQ Turtle|BBQ Turtle]] ([[User talk:BBQ Turtle|talk]]) 02:39, April 11, 2020 (EDT)
::::Yes I got the Boo Medals and Assistants images. For the 2 dataminers, only one still datamine this game, let's call him "Dragon Face", cause he want us call him by a emoji only available in discord. These informations that aren't on the Dr. Mario World server anymore come from the actual "Dragon Face" since I ask him in private on discord. He confirm me in private than Super Mario Galaxy Medals and Golden Ticket are still in the usual Dr. Mario World server. He also confirm me than Boo Clinic Event Medals aren't, at least, on the same server anymore. So we have nothing to change about Super Mario Galaxy Medals and Golden Ticket, but he just can confirm he can't see Boo Clinic Event anymore. Also, because it's very difficult for dataminer to check all servers from Dr. Mario World developpers, cause they simply doesn't know where to check, we only know for the usual server. Even if we ask "Dragon Face" to confirm that, that doesn't mean another dataminer will found another time these informations again. So to me, that's not interesting to source we can't find Boo Clinic Event since that deconfirm nothing even if we refer to a official post. My propose is this Dr. Mario World page refer to these 2 dataminers plus or less directly and both of them can't confirm these source anymore. On one side, this page refer to MarioJoe11's twitter posts, the other dataminer that is not a dataminer for Dr. Mario World anymore. On his posts, he confirm the existence of Magikoopa and King Kaliente texts, Fuzzy-like Creature and others things, but since he doesn't have access anymore he can't confirm they are still there. On the other side, you got "Dragon Face" that we refer indirectly by mentioning the standalone Dr. Mario World Wiki and this site is mostly based on "Dragon Face" datamining. I ask to "Dragon Face" if he can find all the unused contents we mention that are in the game, just to confirm or falsify what we said in this Dr. Mario World page, but he can't see informations about Magikoopa and King Kaliente texts and Fuzzy-like creature. Precisely, "Dragon Face" never notice about Magikoopa and King Kaliente texts and Fuzzy-like creature before, like MarioJoe11 does. So all the informations we got can't confirm the existence of these informations. What we can still confirm is Super Mario Galaxy Medals and Golden Ticket are still in the server. For the rest, all is unknown.

::::I can understand there is a lot of information to takes in consideration. If there is one or more things you don't understand, cause I don't express myself correctly (I'm a French Canadian), just tell me.

::::To resume my message, I can add these new Assitants's images and I would like to adjust what we say about unused contents since some of these affirmation aren't available anymore. I will still mention it, but now as unfindable contents without changing any sources. The informations I will like to change is precisely about Magikoopa and King Kaliente texts, Fuzzy-like creature and Boo Clinic Event Medals. [[User:Ouimet|Ouimet]] ([[User talk:Ouimet|talk]]) ,14:35 April 11, 2020 (HNP)

== New World ==

Someone needs to add World 24.
{{unsigned|8.2.10.149}}

== When will this game have a World 36?? ==

The worlds of this game with numbers greater than 8 are titled [[World 28]] (with no dis-ambiguation suffix.) Thus, World 36's article would have to be [[World 36]], which is simply a re-direct to the famous [[Minus World]] glitch. Which of these things is better:

# Have the article for this game's world at [[World 36]] with a dis-ambiguation header pointing to [[Minus World]], or
# Have the article be at [[World 36 (Dr. Mario World)]] with [[World 36]] a dis-ambiguation page?? [[Special:Contributions/99.101.66.106|99.101.66.106]] 13:21, July 18, 2021 (EDT)
:I think the first option would be what we normally do, basically turn the redirect into the World 36 article for this game. {{User:Keyblade Master/sig}} 13:35, July 18, 2021 (EDT)

== Enemy renders as main images should only be the last resort ==

Why are many main images on enemy pages from this game when they don't have to be? Even though they are the most recent appearance for some enemies, the "artwork" used for them consists of low-resolution sprites (as in not artwork) that have coloring issues within those very sprites (e.g. the Spiny Cheep-Cheep render in this game appears to have a color issue around the shadow of the eyelids). I say that if there is a much more high-quality render for an assistant in this game that comes from an earlier game (e.g. New Super Mario Bros. U in Spiny Cheep-Cheep's case), that previous render should be used as the main image. No one should have to avoid the main image on a page like Spiny Cheep-Cheep's or King Bob-omb's to find higher-resolution art. [[User:TomAndTheCats|TomAndTheCats]] ([[User talk:TomAndTheCats|talk]]) 20:08, November 19, 2023 (EST)

== Only use in-game artwork in infoboxes as a last resort ==

{{TPP}}
(Here we go, first proposal...)
So, I've noticed that there are some articles that use the ''[[Dr. Mario World]]'' in-game artwork in the infobox, such as [[Mechakoopa]], [[Clampy]], [[Cooligan]], [[Spiny Cheep Cheep]] and [[Sledge Bro]]. I've also noticed the quality of this artwork is not the best in infoboxes, as seen from both a phone and a computer. I believe that using different, higher quality artwork for these subjects in the infoboxes would improve the articles. Take a look at this example...
{{species infobox
|image=[[File:DMW-SpinyCheepCheep.png|229px]][[File:NSMBU Spiny Cheep Artwork.png|229px]]<br>Artwork from ''[[Dr. Mario World]]'' and ''[[New Super Mario Bros. U]]'' respectively
}}
The infobox I've included here uses two pieces of artwork; the in-game ''Dr. Mario World'' artwork above, and the ''[[New Super Mario Bros. U]]'' artwork below. The quality difference is quite easy to see when both are present in the same infobox. This is why I propose we replace the ''Dr. Mario World'' artwork in infoboxes with higher quality artwork from other sources. This would mean that non-DMW artwork and high-quality renders using models that reflect the subject's current design would have priority over this artwork, but this would have priority over sprites and screenshots. Of course, this takes priority if the subject does not have other pieces of artwork ([[Cooligan]], [[Sushi]]) or had gotten a redesign only showed by the ''Dr. Mario World'' artwork ([[Amp]]).<br>

'''Proposer''': {{User|DryBonesBandit}}<br>
'''Deadline''': September 11, 2024, 23:59 GMT

====Support====
#{{User|DryBonesBandit}} As the proposer.
#{{User|Nightwicked Bowser}} Was never too fond of the quality of the artwork.
#{{User|Ray Trace}} These images are too low res to be used for infobox images.
#{{User|Nintendo101}} I agree we should mitigate integration of the ''Dr. Mario World'' assets, but in general I think changes like those desired can be integrated at one's discretion. I could be wrong, but I do not think we have strict policies about what images go in the infoboxes - it is up to what the editor chooses to put there. I think folks will sometimes integrate images from the most recent game appearances of subjects uncritically, not because they seriously like them over other pieces. Switching these to something older that (1) looks nice and (2) still provides a neutral, earnest view of the subject is not a very big deal.
#{{user|Arend}} Per all. Most of the assistant art (and some of the doctor art too) is based on higher quality artwork anyway.
#{{User|PrincessPeachFan}} Per all.
#{{User|Sparks}} Per all.
#{{User|ThePowerPlayer}} There are alternative images at an objectively higher resolution, so those should be used instead.
#{{User|Sdman213}} Yes.
#{{User|Jdtendo}} Per all.

====Oppose====
#{{User|TheUndescribableGhost}} I feel we're opening a can of worms here. Yes, the artwork is not the best, but it's still the latest, official artwork.

====Comments====
I think you should word the goal of this better. This sounds like it would be below normal sprites/models and screenshots in priority, not just below out-of-game art. [[User:Doc von Schmeltwick|Doc von Schmeltwick]] ([[User talk:Doc von Schmeltwick|talk]]) 13:40, August 28, 2024 (EDT)
:You have a point. I'll update it. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 13:43, August 28, 2024 (EDT)

{{@|DryBonesBandit}} did you receive some sort of pushback from trying to change these yourself? While I agree they should be replaced with artwork or clearer models, I am not really sure a proposal is necessary. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 15:36, August 28, 2024 (EDT)
:{{@|Nintendo101}} Regarding your question, no, I received no pushback from trying to change them, mainly because I didn't try to. I thought a proposal would be necessary based on the amount of pages affected, and the fact that this artwork is more recent than the higher quality artwork/models used for quality renders. {{unsigned|DryBonesBandit}}

I'm supporting because the Penguin artwork is pretty clearly just a high-quality version of its Super Mario Galaxy artwork. To me, if they had good artwork anyways, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. [[User:PrincessPeachFan|PrincessPeachFan]] ([[User talk:PrincessPeachFan|talk]]) 11:23, August 29, 2024 (EDT)
:This is tangential to the proposal, but it looks to me that the artists that worked on ''Dr. Mario World'' posed a lot of their renders off of previously produced artwork, and I find that a little interesting. Doing that allows one to see how proportions have changed for certain characters over time, or at least how they were adapted for ''Dr. Mario World'' specifically. Kinda neat. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 11:39, August 29, 2024 (EDT)

I thought I'd detail what would happen with each page affected by this proposal here:
* [[Amp]]: Nothing, due to a redesign
* [[Blooper]]: Image would be changed to <s>BlooperMK8.png</s> Blooper_-_MarioPartyStarRush.png
* [[Bomb Boo]]: Nothing, as the other artwork is of even lower quality
* [[Boom Boom]]: Image would be changed to Boom Boom SMR.png or SSBU Boom Boom Spirit.png
* [[Broozer]]: Nothing would change as the artwork used currently is external rather than internal
* [[Chain Chomp]]: Image would be changed to ChainChompMP8.png
* [[Clampy]]: Image would be changed to NSMBW Clampy Artwork.png
* [[Crowber]]: Nothing, as it is the only artwork
* [[Dolphin]]: Nothing, as it is the only recent artwork
* [[Dry Bones]]: Image would be changed to <s>MP8 DryBones.png</s> MPSR Dry Bones.png
* [[Honey Queen]]: Image would be changed to QueenBee.png
* [[Huckit Crab]]: Image would be changed to NSMBU Huckit Crab Artwork.png
* [[King Bob-omb]]: Image would be changed to SMP - King Bob-omb.png
* [[Mechakoopa]]: Image would be changed to NewMechaKoopa.jpg
* [[Octoomba]]: Nothing, as the other artwork is of even lower quality
* [[Para-Beetle]]: Nothing, as it is the only recent artwork
* [[Penguin]]: Image would be changed to SMG Penguin Artwork.png
* [[Scaredy Rat]]: Image would be changed to Scaredy Rat SMR.png
* [[Scuttlebug]]: Image would be changed to SMR Art - Scuttlebug.png
* [[Sledge Bro]]: Image would be changed to SledgebrosNSMBW.png
* [[Spiny Cheep Cheep]]: Image would be changed to NSMBU Spiny Cheep Artwork.png
* [[Stingby]]: Image would be changed to SMM2 Stingby Solo.png
* [[Sushi]]: Nothing, as it is the only artwork
* [[Whomp King]]: Nothing, due to a redesign
* [[Wiggler]]: Image would be changed to WigglerDS.png
Suggest any changes if you want to. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 17:15, August 29, 2024 (EDT)
:*[[:File:NSMBW Clampy Artwork.png]] is actually an in-game render that's been officially released, it's not of higher quality than the Dr. Mario World artwork. It's like using [[:File:Octoomba SM3DW Prima.jpg|this]] for the Octoomba infobox.
:*[[:File:SMG Penguin Artwork.png]] comes from the exact same source as [[:File:SMG Bomb Boo Model.png|the only other artwork we have for Bomb Boo]], which is the Enterplay trading cards (same goes for [[:File:Electrogoomba.png]] to which [[:File:SMG Asset Model Octooomba.png|a model]] is being opted for instead?). Why is that Bomb Boo artwork considered "of even lower quality" but NOT the suggested Penguin artwork? Hell, BOTH of the files have an {{tem|image-quality}} tag, suggesting they're BOTH of low quality.
:*Dry Bones and Blooper's latest artworks appear to be from [[:File:MPSR Dry Bones.png|Star]] [[:File:Blooper - MarioPartyStarRush.png|Rush]]. Sure, these were initially used for their Mega variants, but ''Super Mario Party'' appears to reuse these artworks for their regular selves (I also have no idea why the Dry Bones artwork isn't even in the Dry Bones gallery page yet).
:{{User:Arend/sig}} 18:40, August 29, 2024 (EDT)
::My understanding of the proposal is that for instances where the ''Dr. Mario World'' asset legitimately is better than all other available material, such as (maybe) with Bomb Boo, it would be used. Though I disagree about Clampy. The NSMBW artwork looks to be of higher fidelity at a 200x200px resolution than the ''Dr. Mario World'' asset. It's less about where it comes from, and more so about how it actually appears in-display. - [[User:Nintendo101|Nintendo101]] ([[User talk:Nintendo101|talk]]) 19:42, August 29, 2024 (EDT)
:::Allow me to address Arend:
:::* I agree with Nintendo101 on Clampy, and it is exactly why I chose the card render over the DMW sprite.
:::* The Bomb Boo artwork is cut off a small bit on the left hand, which is why I didn't choose the trading card artwork for it. However, the penguin artwork looked perfectly fine to me.
:::* For Octoomba, I chose the model because it looked higher quality than the card artwork. The card artwork has pixelated edges, and I'd rather not use the PRIMA render because it ALSO has pixelated edges. It was between choosing the DMW artwork or the SMG model, and I think I chose wrong, so I'm updating it to say it won't change for quality reasons. 
:::* Last, for Dry Bones and Blooper, I wasn't aware of the artwork change, so I'll go ahead and update my list.
:::Thanks for the response. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 07:53, August 30, 2024 (EDT)
TheUndescribableGhost, I saw your vote, and regarding your reasoning, I wanted to point out that there's nothing in the rules (at least, that I've seen, and I just checked) that says newest/latest artwork has to be used. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 08:26, August 30, 2024 (EDT)
@TheUndescribableGhost: Yeah, the point we're making is that the quality of the photos has a tendency to be low-quality and it's pretty obviously just up-scaled previous artwork. Plus, we don't use Dr. Mario World Artwork for all of them like Sumo Bro is still its regular artwork and not Dr. Mario World. {{Unsigned|PrincessPeachFan}}
:@DryBonesBandit, The Whomp King seen in Dr. Mario World actually uses the current design for Whomps, the art you are suggesting is different in design, look at the eyes especially. [[User:Sdman213|Sdman213]] ([[User talk:Sdman213|talk]]) 23:27, September 3, 2024 (EDT)
::Thanks for letting me know, I didn't see that. Changing it now. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 06:31, September 4, 2024 (EDT)
After rereading the character infobox's image rules, I found that characters MUST use the latest game artwork unless specialized for the game (such as adding a kart), and as a result I crossed out the characters in the list of changed. So, Honey Queen, King Whomp (which wasn't changing anyway), and King Bob-omb have to stay the same. Boom Boom wasn't crossed out because I'm not sure if Boom Boom counts as a species ([[Airship Plunder]]), and it uses the species infobox. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 16:35, September 4, 2024 (EDT)
:I'm not sure why the character/species distinction would warrant a difference the infobox image rules. {{User:Hewer/sig}} 11:40, September 5, 2024 (EDT)
::I don't know why the two template have different rules, but they do. Boom Boom uses the species infobox, therefore, the character rules don't apply to that article. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 15:07, September 5, 2024 (EDT)
:::You know, I thought this was going to be prioritizing latest official artwork over Dr. Mario World in-game artwork ''regardless'' of that rule, as I also thought that latest game artwork normally applied to ALL infoboxes in the first place. But if Dr. Mario World in-game artwork STILL takes priority JUST because it's the latest art... then what's the point of this proposal? {{User:Arend/sig}} 03:43, September 7, 2024 (EDT)
::::It only takes priority for characters. The species infobox doesn't prioritize latest artwork (or artwork in general; the exact rule listed there is "An image of the subject."), unlike the character infobox. The point of the proposal is to change the infobox image for as many DMW-using articles as possible to the best quality artwork/renders, while still following the infobox rules. If I was trying to change the character infobox rules, I'd've made a proposal on that page, too. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 08:35, September 7, 2024 (EDT)
:::::It doesn't really make sense for there to be an inconsistency in image rules between character and species infoboxes, I thought species infoboxes also prioritised most recent artwork as a sort of unwritten rule. I feel like you're being a bit too pedantic here about following the exact wording on the template pages rather than logic. Or do you genuinely think that enforcing different standards for these two infoboxes and creating needless inconsistency is better for the wiki? {{User:Hewer/sig}} 11:05, September 7, 2024 (EDT)
::::::Honestly, I'd prefer if the character infoboxes allowed artwork that isn't the most recent too, and I'd be happy to try to make a proposal for that. I created this proposal before I found out about the differing rules, and I'd prefer to see this proposal pass rather than wait longer. I don't think needless inconsistency is better for the wiki, and like I've said, I'd be happy to make a proposal on the character infobox to make it consistant.
::::::Also, I don't think I'm being pedantic here, the species rule simply states that it has to be an image of the subject, and the character rule clearly states that it has to be the latest artwork unless specialized. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 13:00, September 7, 2024 (EDT)
:::::::King Boo has not utilized the Dr. Mario World Sprite for years and there has been no discourse over it, I don't see why that can't apply to the other established characters. [[User:Sdman213|Sdman213]] ([[User talk:Sdman213|talk]]) 21:58, September 7, 2024 (EDT)
::::::::Really? Huh, I didn't know that. Because of that, I'll un-cross out the characters on the list. {{User:DryBonesBandit/sig}} 12:22, September 8, 2024 (EDT)