Editing Talk:Big Fire Piranha Plant

== help ==
{{talk}}
I want to move this to big venus fire trap but I'm not sure how.
someone move to BVFT???
the Yoshi co.
:Well, a discussion should take place first. That said, there is not currently any citation for "Big Fire Piranha Plant", so unless one can be found, I'd support the move. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 17:31, 7 August 2017 (EDT)
::I think it was named Big Fire Piranha Plant in the New Super Mario Bros. 2 Prima guide. I'll check once I get the chance. &ndash; [[User:Owencrazyboy9|Owencrazyboy9]] ([[User talk:Owencrazyboy9|talk]]) 17:32, 7 August 2017 (EDT)
:::That's where the citation for "Big Venus Fire Trap" comes from. {{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} 16:33, 7 August 2017 (CT)
::::Well, if it's not NSMB2, maybe it's named Big Fire Piranha Plant in the New Super Mario Bros. U Prima guide. If it ''is'' named that, then I guess this page doesn't need to be moved. &ndash; [[User:Owencrazyboy9|Owencrazyboy9]] ([[User talk:Owencrazyboy9|talk]]) 21:48, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::Nope. It's not named in the New Super Mario Bros Wii or U Prima guides, and obviously, the NSMB2 name is already there. Technically, policy says that the name "Piranha FLower" should take precedence as it's from a game, but frankly it's an unhelpfully undescriptive name and the Prima name is much better. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 22:08, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
::::::Latest Game: ''Super Mario Maker for Nintendo 3DS''. What does that game do? Calls everything given a Super Mushroom Big. Big Fire Piranha Plant is it's latest name. {{User:Yoshi the Space Station Manager/sig}} 22:13, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::::It does not. They don't tack on "Big" to the names vocally there last time I checked. And "Piranha Flower" is the same situation as with Klepto being "The Big Bird," Whomp King being "Whomp," and Dorrie being "Swimming Beast in the Cavern." {{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} 21:16, 8 August 2017 (CT)
::::::::There's also the Player's Guide, which also takes priority over the Prima guide, but again, it's not a good name. I'm willing to make [[Talk:Scorchit#Decide_on_this_enemy.27s_name|another proposal]] to decide this, if it comes to that. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 22:33, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::::::I don't think this needs a proposal. We just need to agree on either Big Venus Fire Trap or Piranha Flower. It's not uncommon for use to use a name outside of the official games if the name in guides makes more sense.I think Big Venus Fire Trap is a better name than Piranha Flower, imo. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 22:36, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:Barring Scorchit (whose proposal was made at Walkazo's suggestion), I can't think of a single example of that besides [[Klamber]]/[[Scuttlebug]] (and even then, Walkazo explained why that situation was complicated. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 22:40, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
::According to [[MarioWiki:Naming]], an article should be named as "the '''most commonly used English name''' of the subject". However, since the "most common" name is currently unsourced and we have sources for the other names. In game names take priority, so Piranha Flower would be the option to go with, I guess. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 22:44, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::Which is then why I suggested making a proposal to have the name be "Big Venus Fire Trap", since "Piranha Flower" is an unhelpfully vague name (and why I brought up Scorchit, in which this same situation occurred). {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 22:47, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::Nah, most common would be Big Venus Fire Trap. Who even likes the name "Fire Piranha Plant," anyway? Nobody uses it unless they have to, ergo, not commonly used. {{User|Doc von Schmeltwick}} 21:49, 8 August 2017 (CT)
::::"The newest name will have priority over older names when mentioned in articles." So... there you go. <small><small>I should really read pages completely before I say something next time...</small></small> {{User:Alex95/sig}} 22:50, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::[[Crowber|This is not always the case]], which is why we have that totem pole of importance for name sources. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 22:51, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
::::::...Okay, then, I don't know. This doesn't seem like something that we need to wait two weeks for, but if you think a proposal is necessary, then feel free. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 22:56, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::::If there isn't any disagreement then just move it. Not everything requires Bureaucracy. {{User|Chester Alan Arthur}}
::::::::I'm concerned about someone immediately moving it back due to religiously sticking to the rules, but if nobody objects I'll move it without one. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 23:05, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::::::We can always move it back if that's the case. I think we're (that is, those of us that said something here) in agreement for Big Venus Fire Trap. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 23:07, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
::::::::::Actually, Yoshi the Space Station Manager has a point. If you play through Yamamura's lessons, both he and Mary O. refer to any of the supersized enemies with Big before their actual name. Like Big Goomba, Big Blooper or Big Piranha Plant for example. It's been a while since I last looked, but I recall the two of them naming each big enemy as a Big something. &ndash; [[User:Owencrazyboy9|Owencrazyboy9]] ([[User talk:Owencrazyboy9|talk]]) 23:09, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
:::::::::::It would be very helpful if that could be confirmed, at which point it could be used as a citation for the article. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 23:13, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
::::::::::::I can confirm that large Goombas are referred to as "Big Goomba" (as shown [https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7Lesf9b_IWA here]) but I'm not sure about any other large enemies. --{{User:TheFlameChomp/sig}} 07:13, 9 August 2017 (EDT)

What's the plan here? {{User:Alex95/sig}} 18:52, 2 September 2017 (EDT)

I don't know. TYC

:Big Fire Piranha Plant seems like the logical choice, but until there's a proper source to back it up (unless it's been overlooked in ''Super Mario Maker''), I'd support a move back to Big Venus Fire Trap. The problem with Piranha Flower is that it already has a [[Piranha Flower|disambiguation page]] that refers to at least five total subjects, so it's more of a catch-all term than a real name. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 10:55, 3 September 2017 (EDT)
::"Piranha Flower" kinda seems like an old term for any Piranha Plant that wasn't exactly like a regular Piranha Plant, so I don't particularly support that name. In the absence of anything better, I'll go for Big Venus Fire Trap. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 10:59, 3 September 2017 (EDT)
:::Another thing - we know ''Super Mario Odyssey'' will have Fire Piranha Plants and a form of Big Piranha Plants. Should we just wait until it's out to see if Big Fire Piranha Plants are in, since it'll likely be under that name? There's a chance it'd only be changed right back to the current article title, which would make this discussion moot if that's the case. [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 11:50, 3 September 2017 (EDT)
::::Ah, good point. We'll put this discussion on hold until then. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 11:53, 3 September 2017 (EDT)
:::::Sounds good. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 12:06, 3 September 2017 (EDT)

Coming back to this, I haven't played ''Odyssey'' yet, so does anyone know if Big Fire Piranha Plants appear? {{User:Alex95/sig}} 12:59, 29 October 2017 (EDT)
:The Prima guide doesn't mention anything. {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 13:19, 29 October 2017 (EDT)
::So...to Big Venus Fire Trap? [[User:LinkTheLefty|LinkTheLefty]] ([[User talk:LinkTheLefty|talk]]) 15:25, 30 October 2017 (EDT)
:::I guess so. {{User:Alex95/sig}} 15:26, 30 October 2017 (EDT)
::::Big Venus Fire Trap it is! {{User:Time Turner/sig}} 15:29, 30 October 2017 (EDT)